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Marquee
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first five of next seaso will be the marker! 

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Blew.2 wrote:

first five of next seaso will be the marker! 

And as Leicester showed closing a season with a run and consistency can be a good way to continue it at the start of the next. Here's hoping.

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We're the best side in the league since Bruno joined. I think we're a CB, DM and RW away from a squad that can challenge for the title but our starting XI is up there with the best sides in the league now - the quality of the second XI is a pressing issue, as we saw against Norwich.

Not sure there's too many questions to ask about OGS in the short term, he's showed the level he can get them playing, he's got Rashford and Martial to the best they've been to date, he's got Pogba toeing the line, he's developed once of the best defences in the league, he's got all 4 signings so far bang on (James is a WIP though), he's freezing out sub-standard players like Jones & Lingard, he's developing United youth, he's playing entertaining football and we have a decent shot silverware this season. Its a process, but he's barely put a foot wrong so far.

Ole's at the wheel and for the first time in a long time, I'm relaxed about who our manager is and what decisions he might make.

WeeNix
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United fans are becoming entitled these days. There is no quick fix; we've already tried and failed at that. Ole is repairing the club culture and it might take another season before we're even close to competing for a title. Welcome to the real world where money doesn't magically fix things.

tradition and history
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20 Legend wrote:

United fans are becoming entitled these days. There is no quick fix; we've already tried and failed at that. Ole is repairing the club culture and it might take another season before we're even close to competing for a title. Welcome to the real world where money doesn't magically fix things.

I sort of agree, but then I look at City and money certainly did fix things.

Legend
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It looks like a very interesting league next season. City and Liverpool will be strong. Leicester could very well still be there or there abouts. Chelsea looks very decent on paper, as does United. That leaves Spurs as unpredictable. Don't think Wolves or anyone is quite in the top bracket, but hey, could be. Pulisic and Werner could be interesting, though often it takes a season to settle in a league. Keen. Happy to see lads like Rashford, Greenwood and Abraham come through and do well.

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Leggy wrote:
20 Legend wrote:

United fans are becoming entitled these days. There is no quick fix; we've already tried and failed at that. Ole is repairing the club culture and it might take another season before we're even close to competing for a title. Welcome to the real world where money doesn't magically fix things.

I sort of agree, but then I look at City and money certainly did fix things.

City's quick fix could help of course but is that sustainable if the owner wants out or gets bored one day and there is no-one to chuck wads of cash to remove any debt through various dodgy channels. 

You want sustainability that leads to the club being financially liquid on its own merits - I know I'm biased but the slow and steady approach has worked for Liverpool it would appear and worked for Arsenal (Arsenal just forgot to do the spending stuff once they had a decent income). 

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Apparently we're the first Premier League team to win 4 games in a row by 3+ goals. Doesn't sound right, but I'll take it.

Not our strongest performance this morning but we got the job done, one step closer to the top 4. Very fortunate with that penalty, think Moss & VAR have had a howler there but otherwise 2 very tidy goals. 

No one should be giving Greenwood that amount of space on the edge, shocking little period of play from Mings and credit to Tony for being physical, winning the ball in midfield and triggering a counter - would love to see more of that from him.

Phoenix Academy
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United can go third with a win tomorrow. 

1-1 draw in coming.....

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Tekkers wrote:

United can go third with a win tomorrow. 

1-1 draw in coming.....

well would you look at that....

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Southampton got dirtier and dirtier... Romeu took it upon himself to hit as many as possible: https://gfycat.com/heartfeltgloriousgrayling. I swear every time we play him he escapes a blatant red card.

As soon as they won a corner against 10-men you knew the writing was on the wall.

Have to accept the highlights since lockdown, and the team needs to back themselves to keep winning.

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Lack of rotation starting to bite us in the ass - Pogba and Bruno both looking off top speed. Shaw impressed me going forward but how VAR doesn't send Romeu in the first half is beyond me.

Well done to Saints well deserved point, we looked our pre-Bruno selves in the second half.

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Another unconvincing half, this time the first one.

Offside is rough on Ayew but what can you do.

2 very good peices of football from Rashford the difference.

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Nelfoos wrote:

Another unconvincing half, this time the first one.

Offside is rough on Ayew but what can you do.

2 very good peices of football from Rashford the difference.

Some poor decisions from Ole.

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Leggy wrote:
Nelfoos wrote:

Another unconvincing half, this time the first one.

Offside is rough on Ayew but what can you do.

2 very good peices of football from Rashford the difference.

Some poor decisions from Ole.

Yeah go on? The team is fudgeing tired and they still scrambled a win.

tradition and history
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20 Legend wrote:
Leggy wrote:
Nelfoos wrote:

Another unconvincing half, this time the first one.

Offside is rough on Ayew but what can you do.

2 very good peices of football from Rashford the difference.

Some poor decisions from Ole.

Yeah go on? The team is fudgeing tired and they still scrambled a win.

No, He should have rested Greenwood after that bad tackle in the previous game. He was a passenger until he got subbed and was clearly not fit. Playing a guy at full back that has never played in that position and last game was years ago.Are you so biased you can't see the wood for the trees?

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Leggy wrote:
20 Legend wrote:
Leggy wrote:
Nelfoos wrote:

Another unconvincing half, this time the first one.

Offside is rough on Ayew but what can you do.

2 very good peices of football from Rashford the difference.

Some poor decisions from Ole.

Yeah go on? The team is fudgeing tired and they still scrambled a win.

No, He should have rested Greenwood after that bad tackle in the previous game. He was a passenger until he got subbed and was clearly not fit. Playing a guy at full back that has never played in that position and last game was years ago.Are you so biased you can't see the wood for the trees?

No I can apply some critical thinking. Don’t play an inform teenager because of a tackle? Who else would you have played at LB?


If Ole rests Greenwood (despite Pogba and Bruno being more desperate for a rest) and we lose you’re the first person to call Ole naive. 

tradition and history
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20 Legend wrote:
Leggy wrote:
20 Legend wrote:
Leggy wrote:
Nelfoos wrote:

Another unconvincing half, this time the first one.

Offside is rough on Ayew but what can you do.

2 very good peices of football from Rashford the difference.

Some poor decisions from Ole.

Yeah go on? The team is fudgeing tired and they still scrambled a win.

No, He should have rested Greenwood after that bad tackle in the previous game. He was a passenger until he got subbed and was clearly not fit. Playing a guy at full back that has never played in that position and last game was years ago.Are you so biased you can't see the wood for the trees?

No I can apply some critical thinking. Don’t play an inform teenager because of a tackle? Who else would you have played at LB?


If Ole rests Greenwood (despite Pogba and Bruno being more desperate for a rest) and we lose you’re the first person to call Ole naive. 

Dalot at left back. Greenwood was injured in that tackle, in fact it could have been a red card. He was clearly unfit and it showed.

Well the fact is he is naive at this level and the most underdone manager in the league.

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Think I'll leave this one to you Leggy.

tradition and history
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20 Legend wrote:

Think I'll leave this one to you Leggy.

I don't dislike the guy and he was one of my favorite players. I guess I take it out on him as he did not have the coaching  credentials to get the job in the first place.He has been put in this job  cause he is a legend and probably came cheap compared to others.The main problem we have is that the owners are bleeding the club along with their puppy Woodward. Every season for the last 6/7 years there have been 4/5 players that were needed but we only got rid of one or two and therefore did not strengthen the squad enough to challenge for the title. Considering the real strength of the squad today Ole has done a reasonable job-- but to really challenge for the title we need at least 3 quality players and I don't think the owners will stump up the money to do this. Jones, Baily, AP and Lingard should all go but I doubt that will happen.  Sanchez is another problem. It comes down to money and if it was City,unfortunately  Pep would be able to get whoever he wanted. Of course if we make the top 4 it might help.

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Pretty farcical. A tired, lethargic United vs Chelsea with almost twice as much rest and not having to travel. I don't think anyone could argue it would have gone the same way if those build-ups were reversed.

Next big challenge for Ole is whether to integrate Henderson this year or next.

tradition and history
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20 Legend wrote:

Pretty farcical. A tired, lethargic United vs Chelsea with almost twice as much rest and not having to travel. I don't think anyone could argue it would have gone the same way if those build-ups were reversed.

Next big challenge for Ole is whether to integrate Henderson this year or next.

5 changes are the reason.- Ole is a clown.

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Leggy wrote:
20 Legend wrote:

Pretty farcical. A tired, lethargic United vs Chelsea with almost twice as much rest and not having to travel. I don't think anyone could argue it would have gone the same way if those build-ups were reversed.

Next big challenge for Ole is whether to integrate Henderson this year or next.

5 changes are the reason.- Ole is a clown.

Greenwood/Martial/everyone is clearly burnt out and having a rest - against a team with almost twice as much rest time - it's exactly what you called for 3 days ago! But sure, the guy who beat Chelsea twice this year is a "clown"

Your logic is moronic. Either the owners are terrible and Ole's team is crap and he's over performing, OR the owners aren't terrible and the players are there and Ole is a clown.

Honestly Leggy

WeeNix
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Form Since Jan 1st All Competitions

LDLWWLWWWWDWDWWDWDWWWDWWWWWDWL

Clown?

Legend
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I reckon there's a hell of a lot of truth in what Leggy is saying about Ole but I'm not sure he's a "clown" or 100% not up to the job. He's doing ok at the moment. Next season might be his litmus test, having had another transfer window and plenty of time to have bedded in his process and playing style. 

De Gea is the big question right now. What happened to this guy? World class keeper, just about the best in the world for a wee bit there even, now he just can't seem to shake the errors out of his game. And they are often really bad errors too. Starting to remind me of Joe Hart's unexpected decline. 

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Leggy wrote:
20 Legend wrote:

Pretty farcical. A tired, lethargic United vs Chelsea with almost twice as much rest and not having to travel. I don't think anyone could argue it would have gone the same way if those build-ups were reversed.

Next big challenge for Ole is whether to integrate Henderson this year or next.

5 changes are the reason.- Ole is a clown.

Worst take possible I think.

Rotation is clearly necessary, that's blindingly obvious. Confirming CL qualification is far more important that the FA Cup. I'm most disappointed we didn't rest Bruno personally, over and above the result of the match. With a fixture list like this and our lack of squad depth you have to prioritise.

tradition and history
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20 Legend wrote:
Leggy wrote:
20 Legend wrote:

Pretty farcical. A tired, lethargic United vs Chelsea with almost twice as much rest and not having to travel. I don't think anyone could argue it would have gone the same way if those build-ups were reversed.

Next big challenge for Ole is whether to integrate Henderson this year or next.

5 changes are the reason.- Ole is a clown.

Greenwood/Martial/everyone is clearly burnt out and having a rest - against a team with almost twice as much rest time - it's exactly what you called for 3 days ago! But sure, the guy who beat Chelsea twice this year is a "clown"

Your logic is moronic. Either the owners are terrible and Ole's team is crap and he's over performing, OR the owners aren't terrible and the players are there and Ole is a clown.

Honestly Leggy

Firstly, it is stupid to change 5 players especially when there was no need. Martial and Pobga should have started.

Secondly, why would you play 5 at the back with no decent midfield to feed the front runners.(outside of Fernandez)

How many games have Fred,James and Bailly played in the last month. Hardly any.

This was his big chance to prove himself and he blew it. He went to defend hoping to catch Chelsea on the break with the pace of James and Rashford, which was the wrong option as we have proved over the last few weeks that we can play good attacking football.

If he was resting players the first one should have been Ge Gea as Romero has played in every FA cup game. (I think).

If you think I am wrong then you should look at what some of the UK pundits had to say.

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I have very little time for what most of them UK pundits say. It isn't genuine opinions, its what's going to get them clicks/plays online - hence why sharkting on United is so popular, fans lap it up.

There is absolutely a massive need to rest players - Martial and Pogba need to be at their best for us to secure 3 points over West Ham and Leicester. I think Bruno and Rashford should also have sat, but we weren't actively trying to lose to Chelsea.

Agree Romero should've played, agree we shouldn't have switched to back 3. But we can't play the same XI 3 times a week and expect them to perform at the standards required, top flight football simply doesn't work like that anymore. Ole isn't perfect but you're attacking him for things that simply aren't fair to attack him on. He has to make changes short term, otherwise he has to make bigger changes medium-term for injuries. Our squad depth is a big problem, but one that OGS has made reasonable progress on so far, considerign what he started with.

Its unfortunate, but the FA Cup is a lesser priority than winning CL qualification at the minute, so the rotation has to come in the FA Cup. It isn't ideal by any means, but neither is our squad and the lack of recovery time between games.

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Nelfoos wrote:

bigger changes medium-term for injuries.

We've been so lucky with injuries too. One injury from this game to any of the normal starting XI and it would've been Ole's fault as well.

tradition and history
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20 Legend wrote:
Nelfoos wrote:

bigger changes medium-term for injuries.

We've been so lucky with injuries too. One injury from this game to any of the normal starting XI and it would've been Ole's fault as well.

Ole was not to blame for Bailly's injury, that is solely down to Maguire's incompetence. But perhaps you could blame Ole for buying this 90 million quid overrated defender.

tradition and history
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Nelfoos wrote:

I have very little time for what most of them UK pundits say. It isn't genuine opinions, its what's going to get them clicks/plays online - hence why sharkting on United is so popular, fans lap it up.

There is absolutely a massive need to rest players - Martial and Pogba need to be at their best for us to secure 3 points over West Ham and Leicester. I think Bruno and Rashford should also have sat, but we weren't actively trying to lose to Chelsea.

Agree Romero should've played, agree we shouldn't have switched to back 3. But we can't play the same XI 3 times a week and expect them to perform at the standards required, top flight football simply doesn't work like that anymore. Ole isn't perfect but you're attacking him for things that simply aren't fair to attack him on. He has to make changes short term, otherwise he has to make bigger changes medium-term for injuries. Our squad depth is a big problem, but one that OGS has made reasonable progress on so far, considerign what he started with.

Its unfortunate, but the FA Cup is a lesser priority than winning CL qualification at the minute, so the rotation has to come in the FA Cup. It isn't ideal by any means, but neither is our squad and the lack of recovery time between games.

The pundits I am talking about are people like Scholes,Shearer etc.who certainly know more football than anyone on this forum.

When you are the manager of Man Utd earning $15000000 a year and are not performing, then you have to expect criticism.I attacked him because he did not pick a team that would beat Chelsea.Easy to say now, but when I saw the line up I said to my wife ' we will lose this game'

Yes he has made some progress --- we have been playing some decent football. The fact remains that unless we win the last two games we will have less points than we did last year. I don't think that is progress.

Agree about the abysmal depth of our squad and that is what will halt any progress than Ole can create. Our best starting X1 might be OK but in general the rest are average at best and some are very poor. 

If Pep and Ole swapped clubs at season end without buying any players Ole would finish above Pep simply because the City squad is far superior to ours.

The sad thing is that our owners will not pay out the big money to get world class players as the City owner will, and that is why they have won 9 trophies in the last 5 years.

Legend
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Hmmm not sure about that re: spending. It's quite public that Man City really wanted both Maguire and Sanchez for example, but could not match the money ManU put forward. 

Sounds crazy but seems like that was actually the case. Not sure if it were due to FFP (lol) or Man City simply refusing to go any higher, but ManU did win those two financial battles.

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paulm wrote:

Hmmm not sure about that re: spending. It's quite public that Man City really wanted both Maguire and Sanchez for example, but could not match the money ManU put forward. 

Sounds crazy but seems like that was actually the case. Not sure if it were due to FFP (lol) or Man City simply refusing to go any higher, but ManU did win those two financial battles.

Leggy doesn't help himself when he posts 2 comments within minutes where in one he complains about us overspending on Maguire and in the same breath whinges about our owners not wanting to open their chequebooks.

We've been throwing money around, just at the wrong players (Di Maria, Falcao, Sanchez, Lukaku, Mkhitaryan etc etc etc). OGS seems to be fixing this, Maguire, AWB and Fernandes have all improved us significantly. James is a work in progress, which we knew when we signed him from the Championship. Hard to have too many qualms about his transfer work so far unless you're going out of your way to be unhappy.

Legend
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It does seem like the transfer decisions have been a lot better since Ole came in. 

Admittedly I enjoy endulging in a bit of banter about Maguire as he can sometimes look a bit ponderous, short video clips are not kind to him at times, but in reality I think he is actually a quality player.

tradition and history
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paulm wrote:

It does seem like the transfer decisions have been a lot better since Ole came in. 

Admittedly I enjoy endulging in a bit of banter about Maguire as he can sometimes look a bit ponderous, short video clips are not kind to him at times, but in reality I think he is actually a quality player.

Just gets nutmegged in the 6 yard box :)

tradition and history
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Nelfoos wrote:
paulm wrote:

Hmmm not sure about that re: spending. It's quite public that Man City really wanted both Maguire and Sanchez for example, but could not match the money ManU put forward. 

Sounds crazy but seems like that was actually the case. Not sure if it were due to FFP (lol) or Man City simply refusing to go any higher, but ManU did win those two financial battles.

Leggy doesn't help himself when he posts 2 comments within minutes where in one he complains about us overspending on Maguire and in the same breath whinges about our owners not wanting to open their chequebooks.

We've been throwing money around, just at the wrong players (Di Maria, Falcao, Sanchez, Lukaku, Mkhitaryan etc etc etc). OGS seems to be fixing this, Maguire, AWB and Fernandes have all improved us significantly. James is a work in progress, which we knew when we signed him from the Championship. Hard to have too many qualms about his transfer work so far unless you're going out of your way to be unhappy.

You obviously did not get my point re Maguire. I never mentioned overspending on the 90 million we spent, I just said he was overrated.

English players are very expensive but that does not necessarily mean they are the best. That fee makes Macguire  the most expensive defender in the world-- but he is hardly the best. I think he is OK as he can go forward and pass well, but his positioning is not that good and he tends to ball watch. Falcao was on loan and unfortunately was recovering  from injury. He was actually a very good striker. Sanchez was a swap deal for Mkhitaryan and although he was poor for us I believe he was a top player and is disappointing it did not work out.

The three players Maguire,AWB and Fernandes have improved us but I am not sure about James and only time will tell..

As for the point about the Utd owners not wanting to open their checkbooks.The 6 Glaziers on the board get paid 2.5 million quid each per year and they don't really care if we are first or fifth.The difference between our owners and Citys is that he does not pull millions of dollars out of the club each year.He has put in 1.3 billion into City with amazing facilities. That is why Pep went there instead of coming to us as we just can't compete with that.

Legend
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Leggy wrote:

That fee makes Macguire  the most expensive defender in the world-- but he is hardly the best. I think he is OK as he can go forward and pass well, but his positioning is not that good and he tends to ball watch. Falcao was on loan and unfortunately was recovering  from injury. He was actually a very good striker. Sanchez was a swap deal for Mkhitaryan and although he was poor for us I believe he was a top player and is disappointing it did not work out.

The three players Maguire,AWB and Fernandes have improved us but I am not sure about James and only time will tell..

Pretty good assessments of those bits of business in my opinion.

Sanchez was an unfortunate one for ManU because he seemed a very safe bet. He'd performed consistently well throughout his career at multiple clubs, and his career-best football had been in the premier league.

Legend
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team culture when they are tired and up against it is important. The rested team was strong. That's not what makes top teams.

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