Marquee
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Does anyone know the process for the appointment of board members and the Chairman?  Employees obviously have a contract with expectations etc but what about those responsible for governance and running the game?  Can they be voted out by the members of the incorporated society?  Because some pressure really should begin to be brought to bear on them


Posting an article from Simon Plumb that starts to make the case for removal of some of those involved.  Personally, I'd start with Van Hattum and I'd look to start involving more ex-players from the 90s and 2000s onwards.  NZF is a cozy club based around the '82 team and that needs to change


http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/9248788/Money-makes-the-ball-go-round-for-NZ-Football


Some more on Van Hattum from Simon Plumb


http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/opinion/8887938/NZFs-CEO-turnover-puts-spotlight-on-chairman

Cock
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You looking at having a crack by proxy JD?


Both very good articles from Simon Plumb. I had not read them before.

Marquee
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No - I'm far from the right person for the job!  But I think NZF needs a broom through it, and a lot more accountability.  Even simple things like publishing proper accounts and explaining how public money is being spent

Legend
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Legend
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Crap copy fail. Was laughing at the first article talking about Fred's appointment 

Marquee
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Feverish wrote:

Crap copy fail. Was laughing at the first article talking about Fred's appointment 


It's pretty damning stuff.

Are the federation heads in charge of appointing board members?
First Team Squad
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No lie. Last two times I've seen Van Hattum I've been with my dad and his partner and Frank tried to pick up my old man's partner both times.
Two season's ago in Dunedin in the Octagon after the Nix match and in Christchurch after All Whites game earlier this year I think it was. The man has no shame.

Starting XI
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james dean wrote:

No - I'm far from the right person for the job! 



i beg to differ
Stage Punch
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I disagree with your suggestion that what we need is ex All Whites.


I'm not sure what governance expertise Declan Edge and Noel Barclay would bring to the table...

Starting XI
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that made me chuckle

i actually think it's important to have a mix and to make sure you don't over-corporatise things

i'm not convinced that new zealand's standard governance structures work well for business and public sector, let alone sports organisations.  i've seen enough to make me very cynical.

i'd be interested to know what the other structural options are at board/senior management level

Still Believin'
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"New Zealand Football is governed by a seven-member board of directors, with extra members co-opted when specific skill sets are needed. Three members are elected from “the game”; nominated and elected by New Zealand Football’s seven member federations at the sport’s annual congress.

The other four members are selected by an independent three-member board appointments panel chaired by the President of New Zealand Football (currently Nicholas Davidson QC), and featuring a representative from SPARC and a third member chosen by NZF’s member federations. NZF board members serve terms of four years. The chair of the commitee of federation chairs is also co-opted to the NZF board.

The current board (as at May, 2013) of New Zealand Football is: Frank van Hattum (Chairman), Bill Moran (Deputy Chairman), Mark Aspden, Paul Cochrane, Martin Fenwick, Paula Kearns, Dougal McGowan, Shelley McMeeken (co-opted) and Mike Anderson (co-opted)".

http://www.nzfootball.co.nz/index.php?id=39


Still Believin'
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I'm not sure who the three current elected members are but Frank van Hattum is definitely one of them. He was elected for a four year term in May 2011 (so not up for re-election until May 2015).


Marquee
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reg22 wrote:

that made me chuckle

i actually think it's important to have a mix and to make sure you don't over-corporatise things

i'm not convinced that new zealand's standard governance structures work well for business and public sector, let alone sports organisations.  i've seen enough to make me very cynical.

i'd be interested to know what the other structural options are at board/senior management level



nice use of understatement.

I seem to remember wailing and gnashing of teeth over the post '82 manangement disaster and how post 2010 it would never happen again.
Still Believin'
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The seven Federations elect the three NZF Board members so it's also relevant to know who is on your local Federation board. These are the people you can most directly influence to get your Federation to vote for a certain candidate or not. Of course, it also helps if there are candidates nominated who are worth voting for.

The elected members of your Federation Board are the ones particularly worth targeting because the clubs within the Federation elect them.

So as a club member you vote for people to be on your club committee. Those people then vote three out of seven people onto your local Federation Board (the other four are appointed). The Federations then vote three out of seven people onto the NZF Board (the other four being appointed).

Still Believin'
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For those of us in Wellington the current Capital Football Board is:

Chairman Chris Canton

Deputy Chairman  Phil Barry      

Dave Trueman                                  

David Taylor                                  

Guy Smith                                  

Helen Mallon                                  

Jess Fraser                                  

Paul Houliston                                  

Steve Stevens

Again, I'm not sure who the elected members are or what clubs they are affiliated with.

http://www.sportingpulse.com/assoc_page.cgi?c=1-4205-0-0-0&sID=233951

Marquee
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Steve Stevens

always woondered what happened to him after Rebel Yell

Legend
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terminator_x wrote:

For those of us in Wellington the current Capital Football Board is:

Chairman Chris Canton

Deputy Chairman  Phil Barry      

Dave Trueman                                  

David Taylor                                  

Guy Smith                                  

Helen Mallon                                  

Jess Fraser                                  

Paul Houliston                                  

Steve Stevens

Again, I'm not sure who the elected members are or what clubs they are affiliated with.

http://www.sportingpulse.com/assoc_page.cgi?c=1-4205-0-0-0&sID=233951

Erase at least Smith and Stevens from that list.
Oh and I giggled that you said you vote for your club committee
Starting XI
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Feverish wrote:
terminator_x wrote:

For those of us in Wellington the current Capital Football Board is:

Chairman Chris Canton

Deputy Chairman  Phil Barry      

Dave Trueman                                  

David Taylor                                  

Guy Smith                                  

Helen Mallon                                  

Jess Fraser                                  

Paul Houliston                                  

Steve Stevens

Again, I'm not sure who the elected members are or what clubs they are affiliated with.

http://www.sportingpulse.com/assoc_page.cgi?c=1-4205-0-0-0&sID=233951

Erase at least Smith and Stevens from that list.

Oh and I giggled that you said you vote for your club committee



is smith no longer on board?
Still Believin'
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Feverish wrote:
terminator_x wrote:

For those of us in Wellington the current Capital Football Board is:

Chairman Chris Canton

Deputy Chairman  Phil Barry      

Dave Trueman                                  

David Taylor                                  

Guy Smith                                  

Helen Mallon                                  

Jess Fraser                                  

Paul Houliston                                  

Steve Stevens

Again, I'm not sure who the elected members are or what clubs they are affiliated with.

http://www.sportingpulse.com/assoc_page.cgi?c=1-4205-0-0-0&sID=233951

Erase at least Smith and Stevens from that list.

Oh and I giggled that you said you vote for your club committee


Yeah OK, it should say "you avoid your club's AGM like the plague so you don't find yourself on the committee".


So who's actually on the CF Board then?


Both the NZF and CF websites should also tell you which members are elected and which are appointed and from when to when.


Marquee
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terminator_x wrote:
Feverish wrote:
terminator_x wrote:

For those of us in Wellington the current Capital Football Board is:

Chairman Chris Canton

Deputy Chairman  Phil Barry      

Dave Trueman                                  

David Taylor                                  

Guy Smith                                  

Helen Mallon                                  

Jess Fraser                                  

Paul Houliston                                  

Steve Stevens

Again, I'm not sure who the elected members are or what clubs they are affiliated with.

http://www.sportingpulse.com/assoc_page.cgi?c=1-4205-0-0-0&sID=233951

Erase at least Smith and Stevens from that list.

Oh and I giggled that you said you vote for your club committee


Yeah OK, it should say "you avoid your club's AGM like the plague so you don't find yourself on the committee".


So who's actually on the CF Board then?


Both the NZF and CF websites should also tell you which members are elected and which are appointed and from when to when.


And club of origin - own barrows to push
Legend
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reg22 wrote:
Feverish wrote:
terminator_x wrote:

For those of us in Wellington the current Capital Football Board is:

Chairman Chris Canton

Deputy Chairman  Phil Barry      

Dave Trueman                                  

David Taylor                                  

Guy Smith                                  

Helen Mallon                                  

Jess Fraser                                  

Paul Houliston                                  

Steve Stevens

Again, I'm not sure who the elected members are or what clubs they are affiliated with.

http://www.sportingpulse.com/assoc_page.cgi?c=1-4205-0-0-0&sID=233951

Erase at least Smith and Stevens from that list.

Oh and I giggled that you said you vote for your club committee



is smith no longer on board?
no. um long story. nor Steve Stevens
Life and death
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So he wasn't allowed back onto the board AFTER COMING OUT OF JAIL ON THOSE 'CHARGES'?

Stage Punch
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reg22 wrote:
Feverish wrote:
terminator_x wrote:

For those of us in Wellington the current Capital Football Board is:

Chairman Chris Canton

Deputy Chairman  Phil Barry      

Dave Trueman                                  

David Taylor                                  

Guy Smith                                  

Helen Mallon                                  

Jess Fraser                                  

Paul Houliston                                  

Steve Stevens

Again, I'm not sure who the elected members are or what clubs they are affiliated with.

http://www.sportingpulse.com/assoc_page.cgi?c=1-4205-0-0-0&sID=233951

Erase at least Smith and Stevens from that list.

Oh and I giggled that you said you vote for your club committee



is smith no longer on board?


Correct. Steve and I resigned. I was naughty and abused a referee while coaching, was subsequently suspended, and the Board took the view that it should be a hanging offence. So I resigned. It was all pretty amicable although I think they over-reacted. 


Steve resigned in absentia at same meeting.


Jess Fraser and Paul Houliston joined in the last few months and both of them impressed me. Phil Barry and Dave Trueman are also very sharp.

Still Believin'
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So Smithy, are able to fill us in on who's currently appointed and who's elected?

And have you and Steve been replaced, or are there vacancies at the moment?


Stage Punch
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terminator_x wrote:

So Smithy, are able to fill us in on who's currently appointed and who's elected?

And have you and Steve been replaced, or are there vacancies at the moment?


I thought this was about NZF?

Steve was elected. I was co-opted. So Steve's resignation will trigger an election at the next AGM. 

Still Believin'
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Smithy wrote:
terminator_x wrote:

So Smithy, are able to fill us in on who's currently appointed and who's elected?

And have you and Steve been replaced, or are there vacancies at the moment?


I thought this was about NZF?


Steve was elected. I was co-opted. So Steve's resignation will trigger an election at the next AGM. 



If it's about effecting change at NZF, and the Federations elect three of seven NZF Board members, then it is also about understanding how to influence your Federation's vote at the NZF Congress. That involves knowing who is on your Federation Board and, in particular, who is elected and therefore (in theory, not always in practice) a representative of the clubs.


It beggars belief that despite all the "NZF are shit" platitudes nobody really seems to understand or care about this stuff. It seems people would rather donate $10 and write a derisory comment on Givealittle.com than actually try and engage in any meaningful sense.


It's been said before but we really do get the football governance we deserve in this country.


Still Believin'
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This article offers a few nice little insights into the current issues at NZF from Sport NZ's point of view:

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/9269511/Miskimmin-All-Whites-have-mountain-to-climb

I think Miskimmin's right to point out that NZF are responsible for a lot more than just the All Whites and in grassroots and the elite women's game they have been doing pretty well. I guess if you are sexist and/or elitist you might not think those areas are important but as a Govt body that certainly won't be Sport NZ's view.

It's also good to hear that they (Sport NZ) are apparently closely involved with the search for a new Chief Exec - I hope so. In fact, when you think about all the money they put into football anyway I reckon one of the most cost-effective things they could do in relation to football would be to top up the CE's salary. An extra $100k could be the difference between getting a good or a great CE and would probably generate a pretty good return-on-investment for Sport NZ, compared to some of their other funding.

I also thought it was interesting that given the chance to criticise the governance of NZF and the high turnover of CEs he chose not to. Sport NZ have never pulled any punches in the past when they've been unhappy.

Cock
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terminator_x wrote:

This article offers a few nice little insights into the current issues at NZF from Sport NZ's point of view:

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/9269511/Miskimmin-All-Whites-have-mountain-to-climb

I think Miskimmin's right to point out that NZF are responsible for a lot more than just the All Whites and in grassroots and the elite women's game they have been doing pretty well. I guess if you are sexist and/or elitist you might not think those areas are important but as a Govt body that certainly won't be Sport NZ's view.

It's also good to hear that they (Sport NZ) are apparently closely involved with the search for a new Chief Exec - I hope so. In fact, when you think about all the money they put into football anyway I reckon one of the most cost-effective things they could do in relation to football would be to top up the CE's salary. An extra $100k could be the difference between getting a good or a great CE and would probably generate a pretty good return-on-investment for Sport NZ, compared to some of their other funding.

I also thought it was interesting that given the chance to criticise the governance of NZF and the high turnover of CEs he chose not to. Sport NZ have never pulled any punches in the past when they've been unhappy.

*off topic* I asked this very same question in the football ferns thread of which only Feverish really kinda answered. How is it that the womens team get good results and the men are shit. Yes I get that there is less competition and but they must be doing something better than the mens programmes to get these results
Starting XI
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terminator_x wrote:
Smithy wrote:
terminator_x wrote:

So Smithy, are able to fill us in on who's currently appointed and who's elected?

And have you and Steve been replaced, or are there vacancies at the moment?


I thought this was about NZF?


Steve was elected. I was co-opted. So Steve's resignation will trigger an election at the next AGM. 



If it's about effecting change at NZF, and the Federations elect three of seven NZF Board members, then it is also about understanding how to influence your Federation's vote at the NZF Congress. That involves knowing who is on your Federation Board and, in particular, who is elected and therefore (in theory, not always in practice) a representative of the clubs.


It beggars belief that despite all the "NZF are shit" platitudes nobody really seems to understand or care about this stuff. It seems people would rather donate $10 and write a derisory comment on Givealittle.com than actually try and engage in any meaningful sense.


It's been said before but we really do get the football governance we deserve in this country.




that was a pretty daft thing to say, of course people care and we're also free to have an opinion about how our sport is run, be it good or bad.  and we don't have to spend our whole lives per-occupying ourselves with the ins and outs so that we feel entitled to have an opinion.  especially when the gaffs are very loud and clear.
Cock
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I don't think its daft. Lets look at a couple of things

1: staring at the 4th CEO in 5 years. Anyone worth their salt will not touch that job - its up there with the Chelski gig

2: We have (it appears) a HP Manager that is making micky mouse calls at the last minute.

3: We have kids that have to pay to represent their country.

We've employed some chumps and get what we pay for

David Parker for the next CEO please.


 

Starting XI
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i may have misread what terminator was saying

i though terminator was alluding to us deserving poor governance because of our appathy

Lawyerish
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You read his comment correctly and his post was a good one


Still Believin'
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reg22 wrote:

i may have misread what terminator was saying

i though terminator was alluding to us deserving poor governance because of our appathy


No mis-reading. That's exactly what I'm saying.


And I'm in no way having a crack at people's right to an opinion. What I am saying is that hardly anyone who has posted any criticism of NZF on this forum recently will actually do a single practical thing about changing the situation (and sorry, but giving $10 to the U17s and writing "NZF are a disgrace" in the comments doesn't cut it for me).


Let me ask this:

Is anybody even aware of which NZF Board members are elected?

Does anybody know which ones are up for re-election at the next NZF Congress?

Does anyone have any idea who their Federation intends to a) nominate b) vote for, at the next Congress? (Or even at the last Congress?)

Has anybody ever bothered to read the NZF rules to find out more about how the process works and how to influence it?


If we can't answer simple questions like this then yes, we get the governance we deserve.


Starting XI
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oh, ok.  because i have no personal interest in ever being involved, i don't make it my priority to know these processes.

that's not to say that others don't

i gather from your latest post that i have the right to have an opinion, which is cool.

but you also seem to be saying that i have the right to expect bad governance because i don't know the processes?  i can sort of see your point, but i think this comment needs to be reserved for those who consider themselves good enough to step up and have a passion to do so and are holding back from doing so.

Starting XI
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i should add, that if someone i knew and trusted did take affirmative action, i'd definitely be open to knowing the processes that could help them step up.

Starting XI
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Jeff Vader wrote:

I don't think its daft. Lets look at a couple of things

1: staring at the 4th CEO in 5 years. Anyone worth their salt will not touch that job - its up there with the Chelski gig

2: We have (it appears) a HP Manager that is making micky mouse calls at the last minute.

3: We have kids that have to pay to represent their country.

We've employed some chumps and get what we pay for

David Parker for the next CEO please.


 


not sure about David Parker, deserves a look in but not sure he is a strong enough character for the NZF gig.
Starting XI
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Jeff Vader wrote:
terminator_x wrote:

This article offers a few nice little insights into the current issues at NZF from Sport NZ's point of view:

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/9269511/Miskimmin-All-Whites-have-mountain-to-climb

I think Miskimmin's right to point out that NZF are responsible for a lot more than just the All Whites and in grassroots and the elite women's game they have been doing pretty well. I guess if you are sexist and/or elitist you might not think those areas are important but as a Govt body that certainly won't be Sport NZ's view.

It's also good to hear that they (Sport NZ) are apparently closely involved with the search for a new Chief Exec - I hope so. In fact, when you think about all the money they put into football anyway I reckon one of the most cost-effective things they could do in relation to football would be to top up the CE's salary. An extra $100k could be the difference between getting a good or a great CE and would probably generate a pretty good return-on-investment for Sport NZ, compared to some of their other funding.

I also thought it was interesting that given the chance to criticise the governance of NZF and the high turnover of CEs he chose not to. Sport NZ have never pulled any punches in the past when they've been unhappy.

*off topic* I asked this very same question in the football ferns thread of which only Feverish really kinda answered. How is it that the womens team get good results and the men are shit. Yes I get that there is less competition and but they must be doing something better than the mens programmes to get these results

The New Zealand-based Ferns (the ones in Auckland at least) do get together on quite a regular basis to train. That could be one reason at least.
Marquee
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Let's be realistic - Women's football is completely different level of competition to Men's, there is no way that you could run a programme for the men the same as the women (i.e. use predominantly home based players) and be successful - therefore the two really aren't comparable.

Starting XI
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james dean wrote:

Let's be realistic - Women's football is completely different level of competition to Men's, there is no way that you could run a programme for the men the same as the women (i.e. use predominantly home based players) and be successful - therefore the two really aren't comparable.



I also think they get a good dollop of financial support from Sport NZ as they as seen as a team with potential on the world stage. 

Plus I image most women are not prima-donnas like the men so don't expect first class flights, 6 star hotels etc and don't have their clubs on their back because of the crazy salaries the're on.
Appiah without the pace
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james dean wrote:

Let's be realistic - Women's football is completely different level of competition to Men's, there is no way that you could run a programme for the men the same as the women (i.e. use predominantly home based players) and be successful - therefore the two really aren't comparable.

Pretty sure only 2 players out of the sqaud that beat Brazil play in NZ.

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