New Zealand Men's U-17s

Because the academies tend to be very expensive?

There needs to be only 1 pathway so that the better development pathways don't win through. What a sad state of affairs.

Hearing the 32 player July camp has been cut to 20.

is this 20 players going to be the team? 

Quite simple really.

If NZF say that you need to do FTC/NTC to play for NZ. That is a clear as crystal for me! If you want to go to Ole - Fine. However just going to Ole and not attending NTC/FTC - you will not be selected for age group National Teams.

Jose, if NZF were to select players from only one academy system (FTC) then we live in a totalitarian state. Players choose not to do FTC for many reasons (they believe they can get better coaching elsewhere, travel is prohibitive, cost makes it unaffordable etc). Too many good players are being developed outside of the FTC academy system by schools, clubs, other academies for NZF to consider picking a national team of only FTC players. That is not in the best interests of football in nz. It would be the equivalent of only picking all whites teams from nz residents, or u17 team only from those attending state schools. Ridiculous! We live in a democracy, where freedom of choice is valued. Luckily, coaches don't give a toss where a player comes from, only that they are the best available. FDJ's challenge in this regard is to ensure the best eligible players at a a given point in time are known and that they trial.

Also a bit sad if the only way you can get kids to attend your academy system is by threatening them with exclusion (even if good enough) from national teams. Tragic.

That's the perception, but some comparative pricing would be interesting.

I'll add some indicative FTC/NTC costs into the mix;

4 Terms of FTC, kit, 2 x NTC camp - $1650

The question at hand is not about cost of one choice v the other, but about equal opportunity for all (assuming of course minimum talent requirements). If NZF keep trying to scaremonger players into their system by threatening non trial or selection, we are in a very, very bad space.

hasn't the u17 already been picked? 

I blame smart-phones in the hands of children. They should be out doing their 10,000 hours, not reading online trash ;)

NO!!!!!!

squad of 20 now?

That's what I've heard - first cut after the first ftc/ntc camp.

i can't stop laughing! 

Global Footy if you haven't heard from Jose it's not looking good i'm afraid mate.

Anyone heard any news on this? Was an assistant at July camp. Ivan?

U17 Assistant Coach

In other news, we've got a interview with Jose on this week's podcast. Global Footy may want to listen.

"Preference will be given to applicants who have previously worked within the NZ Football or Federation talent programs."

And that's a real mixed-bag in itself ...

Guess it is trying to create a pathway for NZ coaches.

It is a fair call I reckon.

All this years u-17's should have had some FTC/NTC time anyway. So should the coach eh?

Yes, best to have everyone drinking the same 'kool aid' ;)

yeah if we are told no FTC equals  no NTC equals no U-17 then same for coach.

Due to be announced on Monday.

i have been following this thread with some interest - and so when i had a chance to ask "someone" (JV knows who) at NZF about the selection process I was told that they will be looking at kids not in NTC but they will most likely only be looked at once, and if they can't make that trial date NZF dosn't have the resources to come and look at them all individually.

So NTC kids will have the advantage of being looked at about 5 times during the process where as kids in school or private provider programs will be given a trial date and if they miss it or under-perform then that's their shot gone.

It's not the ideal scenario - but it does allow kids who are at the required level from outside NTC the chance - in a perfect world with no $$ barriers they would come and scout each kid - but that's just not viabile i don't think.

Paul Temple ?

If speculation is anything to go by, Temple should stick with his faltering mens coaching career

#jobsfortheboys

Jobs for the boys alright! - if that is the case. I guess we shall know early next week but what a sorry state of affairs if true!

Surely the best boys and best ( assistant ) coach no matter where they come from should be selected or is that too idealist?

No wonder NZF ( age-group teams), on a global scale, is lacking behind and I wonder what Mr Hudson thinks of all this once he takes off his rose-tinted glasses.

Maybe NZ should just stick to girls and women's football!

Yes it is far too idealist

We are told one thing by NZF about the pathway

Yet it seems those external to it still get a crack 

Needs to be sorted fortwith

Given the Wanderers aspect of this, probably means all staff need to be Auckland based.  Just the way it is unfortuantely. 

JohnM, it's the week in, week out work the boys do in whatever environment they've chosen that makes a footballer; not whether or not they are selected for age group teams. As smithy has often commented, NZF U17 is no indication of future football success. Continuous hard work in the right environment is the key to taking you closer to the dream. Not sexy perhaps, but you've got to look at what your chosen environment has/is producing compared to the other options; and consider what the end goal is.

Like all fathers we have sons who we think have a bit of talent and given the right opportunity and chance could make something of themselves but not sure what others think on the whole FTC/NTC set-up.

Last season my son was put forward by his coach to the FTC ( I shall not say which region ) but when I inquired to the federation what the cost was, who the coach(s) are and what the commitment was they could not answer all my questions. I coach myself and have a few kids in my team that have been to the FTC and I do not wish to sound harsh or cruel but I did not see any real improvement in their technique and play.

Agree (Global Game), continuous hard work plus desire, passion and commitment regardless of selection to U17, U20s etc is more important.

So does NZF have the wrong set-up? Who really has progressed through these centres and gone on to an international (overseas) professional career, certainly Marco Rojas did not!

I think its to early to say anyone has gone through the path way and on to international career as FTC has only been going 4 years, its not going to happen over night! I think quality of the kids has improved year on year in terms of technical ability 2002 who are now in FTC are far better then 2001 lads. In saying that I don't think one FTC session a week can realistically improve these kids. This maybe a reason as to why FTC is seen to not be as good with some of the other programmes as they have less access to the players. Once these lads hit high school they have 3/4 different coaches a week all telling them different things. 

Think it is only 1 session a week during term 2 and 3. 3 sessions (IIRC) over term 1 and 4 is the key as we need kids playing 12 months a year.

Are you sure about that? I coached at the last national tournament in (iirc) 2008. Then FTC kicked in. So I think it's at least 5 years, if not 6.

And, FTC/NTC was really just a re-branding of what the existing programmes were (at least in Wellington). The staff didn't change and the number of sessions didn't really change either. So on that basis I reckon you're looking at (conservatively) 8 years of approximately the same system.

Like so many things NZF have done it has been neglected a bit, and is a bit tired now. But it hasn't fundamentally changed much for quite a while.

FTC in Chch (Mainland Football) started in 2012.

Each year it has been 2 sessions per week, 4 school terms.

It brings it own set of problems but is a vast improvement on the previous "School of Football" regime.

It is clear to  me that the FTC players are getting further ahead of their peers in the various Saturday morning grades. Their technical level is better than my generation ever got to.

FTC has been around for five years up here in Auckland.  

Overall mixed bag of coaching ability and from what I've seen - proof that having international coaching badges does not mean you have ability to relate to and effectively work with youth.

Plenty of talented players not in either Federation FTC programme up here in Auckland (AFF/NFF) because of doubts over quality of programme and cost.  Player development and quality of coaches at some clubs significantly better than Federation level.

Because the NZF model is 'cost recovery' you end up with a large enough player pool in each FTC age-group to cover costs and this results in players who really have no place at the FTC (i.e. ones who lack basic ball skills) working with significantly more capable players. This is great for the weaker players who get the chance to work with quality players but both frustrating and counter-productive for those more able.

Couple all of this with Federation/NZF lack of interest in receiving or sourcing constructive feedback on the programme and you have a development programme that is great in theory, but no wonder plenty of senior coaches in football tell players not to waste their time in the FTC system and have the opinion that it 'breaks' players.

Remember the point of all this FTC chat is in relation to selecting NATIONAL teams. The federation academies are only one of many environments to develop - other academies, schools, clubs. The bigger issue is that NZF selection process is robust - to find the BEST players to represent, no matter where they may be.