Local womens football (incl. W League)

ok so your solution is that players should suck up a sub-standard product they are paying for? 

where's Tegel at? surely he has all the solutions??

No, I agree it's a problem. But I've yet to hear how it can be fixed, instead I hear the same complaints a couple of times a season with no solu

I think I'm saying we should encourage more people to ref, and part of that will be gaining experience. We have a chronic shortage, so we don't have the luxury of starting new level 1 refs as ARs to learn in that environment.

No CF ref is getting rich on dispersements. (I don't think you're suggesting that players should pay more so Refs can be paid more to attract more people to reffing )

who's responsibility is it to fix?

Everyone's. I see the complaints on here but are people actually saying anything to the referees/capital football? I don't know what Capital Football or referee Wellington is doing about it either but I would hope something. Personally it doesn't affect me so I haven't looked into it further.

Now to you Greenie, what can anyone do to fix it, haven't heard an idea from you?

Where would I go to find out about getting involved in refereeing? I enjoy it when I do but don't know where to start looking.

http://www.capitalfootball.org.nz/referees/

wtf. I just said expecting people to give up a paid job on Sunday after volunteering their time to referee on a Saturday isn't exactly something that CF is in a position to do. Hardly a controversial statement. 

how is it everyone's problem??

You (and some others who have had exposure to a certain aspect of football) always speak like it some sort of kumbaya-hand-holding all in it together thing where everyone has to suck in any flaws that may 'unfortunately' occasionally come their way. 

The Vic Uni player who had a shark day doesn't give a rat's if ref's are paid averagely or handsomely. She just wants a good product for her $300 a season. 

There is a competing entity that folk are flocking to - because you're off the mark with your opinion that everyone should owe something to the game/competition.  

The solutions ultimately need to be forthcoming from the provider of the services we pay for if they want to grow and not shrink. 

It's everyone's as because why don't we have referees Greenie. How many referees after games and games of abuse have quit. So yes player are the problem too. Apparently referees despite making 100s of calls a game have to get everyone correct. If a referee gets a call wrong it's abuse, player stuffs up it's don't worry you'll get it next time. 

Why would you choose to volunteer your time for that?

is it the player's fault you are a 'volunteer' (since it always seems to come back to that)?

Fudge sake Greenie, remove the stick for once and try see both sides. I've agreed with you that it sucks for the team that had this one the weekend ,I'm trying to explain to you that there is a problem but I'm yet to see a solution. All I've done in this thread was provided explanations for things and why they are happening but you seem to have this idea that some how I'm suppose to fix it because I'm part of the referee organisation or even provide ideas of how too. To be honest I don't know how too and I also don't really care. Keep complaining if you like but this is my last post on this topic. 

no not my point. Capital football  need the solution not referees.

ok starting point solution- all refs fees paid to CF along with game fines go straight back to the officials of the match.

Should brand new referees coach junior games instead as a way of learning? The downside of that is they don't referee senior games, which means less games with a referee at all. 

I can't really think of much else they can do other than to just place referees down the grades as far as they can. Referees need games to gain experience and to learn from, and we have about 15 divisions, most of which have no refs at all - meaning a player has to give up a game they paid for in each team in order to referee their game. 

I guess if teams think they're prefer to referee games themselves than have an inexperienced referee, they could have an opt out system, where your games won't be assigned a referee (both teams would have to opt out). That would free referees up for games where they are actually wanted/needed. 

I don't think forcing referees to do Sunday's would work. There would be some who are happy to do it, but others who would see it as too demanding on their time, and pack it in. 

It would be good to know if that money is actually used for referee development and reimbursement, or if it's just being used for general CF activities. 

You do not have to put up with crap from players who abuse you. We all get pissed off with these idiots so send them off!

That's a really bad idea for obvious reasons. Not that refs would abuse that, but that it would be a bat to beat them with at every decision.

Who the fudge is going to sign a contract over volunteer work?

And if they broke the contract what is CF going to do about it? Probably ring them next weekend because they're short of refs.

The problem is simple supply and demand. If players want better refs, then the refs need to be paid better, which in turn means paying higher fees. Yet everyone whines about that too.

If a player is sent off or receives a suspension for 5 cautions should that player been sent to referee Womens Premier or Masters 1 they may then realize what its all about out in the middle, if player has a bad game their coach can drag them, if a ref's game is not going well he/she has to stick out for 90 mins and hopefully re focus and get control back, 1 person with a whistle, 22 players up to 10 team officals x amount of sideline referee's and if your lucky some spectators

Or abuse referees less (ideally not at all) then more people will want to volunteer their time to do it. 

that seems to be the same line brought out again and again and again. It obviously hasn't happened and it never will. So let's just park that one. Fact is we pay (last time I did the accounts) $50 per official. Fact is we pay $25 to $200 per card. That is on top of our subscriptions. Should that money go to the referees since it is A) Paid for them B) Somewhat proportional to the angst they receive during a game.

And give me a break saying a player who is paying decent money for a service is expected to go and do compulsory reffing for whatever reason. Also the comparison of reffing to players playing. Let's talk about this like a commercial business not a cooperative (refer to kumbaya comment)

$50 per official? That's like less than $3.50 per player who takes the field (less than $2 if it's only the home team who pays that fee. 

what?

$50/14 or $50/28 isn't a huge cost per player for a referee. I don't know how else to write that, seems pretty simple to me. 

and you point is?

You're complaining that a player is getting ripped off because of a bad refereeing performance because they pay for the service. When in reality that payment amounts to $2-3 per player. You get what you pay for I suppose!

Have Capital Football ever actually sought specific commercial sponsorship for referees.

so your value of a ref is > $25 per hour? cool what's your actual figure since you are now representing all referees with next to zero knowledge of how things operate?

I know as a cap 9 player I'd pay $2 per game to have a referee for our games. 

You're also simplifying it id have thought. Referees time + training + petrol + gear + admin etc it probably all adds up. 

I even actually agreed with you earlier by saying it would be nice to know that money actually goes toward referees reimbursement and development rather than to anything else. So not quite sure what your point is either. 

what would an attractive fee be for a ref?

is that $50 per team per game, or only the home side who pays that? If both, then I do wonder where all of that money goes. 

45 refs to do men's Cl,cap Prem, and w league, further 50 to do 10 divisions below so say 100 refs 10k per week x 18 weeks $180k per annum

So $50 plus a couple of bookings (which is less than average) and there's your $100. 

If referee quality is relative to $ paid then maybe CF should look into paying that to keep off player drain and volunteer coach disillusionment?

Ref talk in the reffing thread. Women's football talk in here. Will start hiding posts.

Well it came about because everyone went home in a sulk from a women's Prem game. Trying to find the solution :)

So Parklands, a Mainland WPL team have just dropped out mid season, leaving 5 Chch teams plus Nelson. Of those 6 teams, 2 are nationally competitive (Cashmere and Coastal Spirit), one is getting there (Nelson) and one is up and coming (Waimak United). There are 2 competitive teams in Dunners. How many in Welly/Central? Leagues are sharke in Dunedin, Chch, Nelson and Wellington. The womens game will die a slow death south of Taupo unless a multi-fed league can be sorted. Do Mainland, Football South and Capital care enough to have the discussion?