(The not-so-temporary quite-official) Gooner Thread (Part 3)

The last thing you guys ever needed was an inconsistent CB who is prone to wild errors and doesn't value the art of defending.

Wouldn't be surprised if in 10 years it came out David Luiz was part of a massive match-fixing ring or something. His transfers have been absolutely ludicrous and some of his performances for club and country simply insane.

It's probably to do with greasing up agents. The guys is just not a defender is he? Essentially, he's the guy we all played with at school who thinks he's Maradona but is actually the worst player in the group so gets picked last and shoved at CB because noone else will go there. Brighton will be gutted he's out, they are probably appealing the red card.

Mari confirmed out for the rest of the season. So that turned into another brilliant January window.

200+ consecutive games without injury before he signed for us.

Now out for the season before he's played a full 90 minutes.

Welcome to Arsenal Pablo Mari.

This really rarks me up too, but to be fair, in yesterday's game I only saw one foul like that, when the game was already gone for us, so I don't think it was really a factor this time round.

It's one of these things that really p*sses me off, but I'm an absolute hypocrite, because if Arsenal started doing it effectively then I'd probably be happy about it...

It's really on the refs to stamp it out of the game. They are soft on those fouls early in matches, and also when they happen deep in the opposition half. If it's clearly a tactical foul then they need to front up and give the yellow, no matter the time on the clock or the area of the pitch.

I think City's "magic" with it is most of the time they do it before breaks even start. Which means refs are hesitant to give yellows, and they just don't look that bad.

I agree, anything that isn't an honest attempt to play the ball should be an instant yellow.

Tactical fouling in sports sucks. Worst part of basketball.

There were a few fouls we didn't get from City's side I was disappointed. First half at 0-0 when Garcia dragged Nketiah to the ground was my main gripe.

Speaking of Garcia he seems OK, spent a night in hospital and is back with the squad. How we end up with Mari out for the rest of the season for simply 'running' and Xhaka doing his ankle after running into Guendouzi and this lad has a collision like that and walks away fine is unreal. Don't get me wrong, I'm glad the kids up and about and I wouldn't actively wish injury upon him, but it seems super unlucky for us.

This CB situation is an absolute cluster fudge.

Right now we have in the squad: Luiz, Mari, Mustafi, Holding, Chambers, Sokratis, and from the yoof Medley.

Mari & Chambers won't play another game this season. Luiz is out for 2. Leaves us with Mustafi, Sokratis, Holding, and Medley.

I think the powers that be need to be ruthless with both Mari & Luiz. Don't extend their contracts.

Leaves us with 4 available CB's for the remaining games.

Chambers, Saliba, and Mavropanos then come back in 6 + 1 to start next season with.

If we have the cash we can sell one of Mustafi or Sokratis and hopefully get a solid replacement.

If not the Mustafi redemption story continues.

Soares & Ceballos are the other two whose immediate future needs resolving. Ceballos seems a no brainer to extend through the rest of the campaign. Soares on the other hand...Another chance to be ruthless with our funds. Let him go, and cover the full back slots between Bellerin, Tierney, Kolasinac, and one of the youth lads - or Sokratis if we have to.

9 EPL games + hopefully 3 FA cup games to get through.

Time for those at the club to be ruthless and fix the mess they've made.

Sounds like mari is being signed permanently...

Predictions for today?

I'm guessing something like:

                       Leno

Bellerin Mustafi Holding Kolasinac

         Guendouzi AMN

  Pepe      Ceballos      Auba

                 Laca

Rotation is going to be really important for these next few weeks.

Not Leno!

oh geez now leno is gone for ages, that was a nasty one

Ffs

just our luck

Injury to Leno is devastating.

Very unlucky this morn but no one to blame. Missed our chances then switched off for the goals.

Arteta has a very big job ahead of him. It will be a long, rough ride.

At this point, no Europa League next season would probably be a blessing, financials aside. Carry a slimmer squad, get the culture sorted. 

Will Guendouzi get a ban for his shenanigans after the whistle?

Sorry i meant no one else to blame as in we cant complain that the result wasnt deserved

You know what I think we need to sign Libby Cacace to solve our defensive problems, after all an 88 TOTS card is better then most Arsenal players could warrant at the moment the guy is a legend!

https://www.premierinjuries.com/injury-table.php

We're now winning the injury table FFS.

We are in such a cluster fudge of a situation with contracts and rebuild.

I said it when Emery was "in charge" and I'll say it again:

We have few options besides blowing it up and starting again...

GK's - keep as is.

Defenders 

  - don't resign Luiz (unless it's an extension to the end of this current season).

  - Soares is going

  - sell (or giveaway if necessary) Mustafi, Sokratis, Kolasinac, and Chambers.

Midfield

  - be rid of the poisoned chalice that MO10 has (sadly) become... get someone in Asia, Turkey, the US, on the moon - to pay a third of his wage for the next year and get him out. 

  - Ceballos goes back to Spain.

Forwards

  - sell PEA (sadly) as he's not going to win anything with us in what's left of his top level career and we need the funds to reinvest/rebuild.

  - sell Lacazette as he's clearly disinterested and shows little (if any) motivation.

Upstairs

  - Sanellehi needs to stop talking shark and start producing some results (ie: positive change and some direction for the club)... as it stands; I've not seen it... apart from sucking up to one or two of his agent mates he seems a part of the problems; he needs to be part of the solution or he can piss off too.

  - and wtf is Edu doing? Again; he has to be part of the solution and currently I'm struggling to see how he his... sure, he played for us, nice dude, etc etc... but we need CHANGE - not just good dudes who used to wear the shirt and "understand the Arsenal way"... what a load of bollocks that is - we've got plenty of club legends who understand TAW but where is it getting us?... nowhere... because...

 - the Kroenke's are clearly great accountants but as long as they're in charge I struggle to see any hope of seeing top four; let alone any proper success. I mean seriously - build some success or start rowing back across the pond.

We need to bring in some PREMIER LEAGUE experienced/capable leaders... these don't need to be stars (luckily, as we have no money), but players who understand the PREMIER LEAGUE and can show our youngsters how to perform consistently in it week in, week out... we are so far away from Europe it's a complete irrelevance in the short-med term (ie: the next couple or three seasons).

This applies off the pitch as well - I've got no issues with former players getting gigs at the club; but what I have got a problem with is people getting gigs at the club they aren't yet ready for... we're not running an apprenticeship scheme FFS. Look at what experienced leaders can do with limited resources - Hodgson, Rodgers, NES, Mourinho... ok, not bluddy Mourinho but you get my point... and yeah, Arteta may be the man to do it - I sure as shark hope so... but it's a huge job, and he's going to need support which I have doubts he is, or will, receive.

The focus has to be on stripping back the culture of bullshark that has been allowed to grow in recent years and build our squad up using young players that want to work, develop, and reach their potential... it's going to take time. But I'm here for it.

What I'm not here for is a continuation of what we've had over recent years... the definition of insanity? Being an AFC fan.

Essentially the owners don't care. They have no ambition. They don't care about the culture, they don't care about being competitive. They've never reacted to the slide down the table. There's nothing we can do while they remain in charge and if you think this is rock bottom, think about next season playing with the same team minus Aubameyang and Saka, and with Ozil still on the books.

I'm still really angry about the Leno injury tbh. Was quite similar to what happened to Debuchy up at Stoke, taken out in the air with no threat to the ball and it essentially finished his career as a top level player as he never came back the same. As as soon as it happened and went unpunished I said to myself "absolutely no doubt that thug ends up scoring the winner now." Rugby doesn't allow playing the man in the air because it's dangerous, but of course "it's a contact sport" and Arsenal are soft pussies who "don't like it up em" so I'll leave it there.

Spot on re: the challenge on Leno in my opinion ajc.

Disgusting stuff. Yes he wasn't looking to injure him, but that comes with the territory when you try things like that, it's just reckless.

Some of the media/ex player attitudes to this stuff are terrible.

Remember when Marcus Alonso scored against us after knocking Bellerin out in mid air?

Bellerin "wasn't strong enough" that time apparently.

It's definitely a narrative for us that's been cultivated over the years, since ManU/Bolton etc started this kinda stuff against us a long time ago. There was truth to our soft underbelly back then, perhaps even now, but it doesn't mean we deserve to be subject to foul play, without punishment.

Any idea why Martinelli no longer gets any minutes? Feels as though he's been jettisoned almost since the Chelsea game but I'm not aware of anything coming out about any issues behind the scenes unless I've missed something. Cynical side of me half wonders if we're trying to hide him from this season's shop window now that we're unlikely to hold onto Aubameyang and probably Saka. 

Most of the talk I've been reading suggests Saka will sign a new contract?

Arteta is clearly a Riess Nelson fan, he's been trying to involve him a lot. He hasn't done a lot for us yet but he put in good numbers in the Bundesliga last season. Arteta sees something there.

Re: Martinelli, I think he's just in a tough spot with Aubameyang playing on the left, and Nketiah/Lacazette competing for the striker's role in the 2 games back so far. Don't think there's any kind of issue there, I expect to see more of him soon, particularly if Aubameyang does get sold.

@Surge I agreed with all of that bar Chambers, not sure I'd give up on him just yet.

I saw someone suggesting we try cash in on Guendouzi, I'd be up for that too.

What I found interesting against Brighton was the lack of on pitch leadership. You take Xhaka and Luiz out of the side and there isn't anyone barking orders or directing things. I'd hope Holding could have filled that but he didn't, while Mustafi has never been that player.

The Leno injury is super frustrating because if it's an ACL that'll be another investment in the transfer market for us this summer. Can't see us running most of next season with just Martinez/Macey in goal.

Joe Hart is rumoured to be a temorary replacement...

If it's an ACL then Leno is essentially out for next season which means we'll have to go to the market. As we probably have no money we could do worse than Hart on a free as a stop gap. Perhaps give Martinez the chance, and have the experience of Hart as backup?

I like that approach ajc - Martinez gets his chance, and have an old head backing him up.

Honestly hate the idea of Joe Hart, but if Martinez went down then it would be good to have someone coming on with a lot of high level experience, even if he's far from what he once was.

Actually quite interested to see how Martinez goes. Hasn't put much of a foot wrong in the limited opportunities he'd had, without looking like a world beater. He's put in the time with us, deserves a crack.

I've been a big fan of Guendouzi but I'm beginning to waver - he runs around a lot and he's visible but the end product is sorely lacking. And sure; he's young, developing, yada-yada. 

We need an experienced aggressive spine that can stand up to the rigours of the Premier League. These player aren't going to be teenagers/prospects from the biggest clubs in Europe; their more likely to be plodders/scrubbers you've barely heard of from the North of England or Scotland... we've got the high-potentials all over our squad; they need some leaders, and some guys to stand alongside them when they're getting pummelled... we need some backbone, we need some ugly, and we need it quickly.

so we're looking for the next Spanish Ambulance driver to save our team?

We basically need to buy the kind of cody goodness we had in Keown & Adams.

I'm a bit disappointed that the scrap happened at the end. If you'd done that to my keeper you'd have been on your arse the moment I got near you. The lack of fight for our man was a bit disappointing, very different to the scrap Lichsteiner had with Sp*rs last year.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Numbers-Game-Everything-About-Football/dp/0241963621

Heard about this book on a podcast today. The basic premise is that football is a team sport based on weak-link theory, where your team is only as good as your weakest link. Theory being given how the potential for a mistake can influence either a goal being scored or conceded, and how dependant the team is on each other for delivering means your weakest player sets the bar for your quality.

The numbers side of it highlighted that it was better for a team to invest in 5 x 20m players over a single 100m player.

I think that's where our summer went wrong when you look at Pepe.

If we'd managed to nab 4 x 20m players with a bit of bottle and rigour instead of relying on 1 x 80m player we'd be in a different spot for use.

Who could we have got for 15-25m I hear you ask?

Danny Ings, Ryan Sessengon, Kieran Trippier, Christian Erikson, Daniel James, Andre Gomes, Dennis Praet, Pablo Fornals, Tyrone Mings, Neaul Maupay, Sander Berge

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/premier-league/transfers/wettbewerb/GB1

I guess the point is there are great players out there we can get that would improve this team that don't cost the earth and come with experience in England. Is Arteta's style so foreign to the UK style that we must have overseas players? Of course not, look at the likes of Saka, Nketiah, Willock fitting into it.

Luiz has signed a contract extention....

Pretty much. It's all well and good for Guendouzi to have a go at him about his wages after the game after he's scored the winner, but do you think he'd have still be on the pitch at the 90th minute if we'd had a Keown or Vieira out there?

This might be controversial as for sure they are quality players, but I think Laccazette and Auba need to go. They dont want to be here, they dont have passion for this team anymore. I would rather a Chris Wood/Danny Ings who fights to the last minute and frees up funds to build on all areas. 

Luiz re-signs. Soares and Mari are signing permanent long term deals.

See the logic in your argument there brumbys, but in all honesty, I'd only take Eriksen and Mings from that list. Mediocre players for me, I'd prefer to blood our youngsters than have that lot.

Having said that, I don't disagree with your point overall, and there's probably an alternative list in that price range that I would prefer, so point definitely stands.

I think Pepe is the goods but he is clearly one of these guys that takes a while to acclimatise. For all his faults, I think Emery was spot on when he wanted Zaha over Pepe, who would have been far more likely to deliver consistency right away.

Overall I'm in a similar boat with Arteta that I was with Wenger.

I like and trust this guy. If he wants Luiz for another year, and Soares for 3/4, then I'm cool with that, whatever. Do what you need to do Mikel. 

I'm a bit tired of gnashing my teeth over the boardroom, ownership, transfers etc. My voice is tiny, I make no difference, nor do I want to, so whinging and whining has become very tiresome, not that i did a huge amount of it (dont laugh). I'm also tired of the huge kneejerk revisionism after every loss or error. The prominent arsenal voices online etc screamed after Arteta's appointment "give him time, it's a mess, we are in this for the long game, the ride will be bumpy" etc etc, and yet when we see the bumpy ride they accurately predicted, suddenly they are all "its all f*cked, sack that guy, get rid of that guy, what a joke" etc etc, I mean it's just laughable. "Do as I say, not as I do" comes to mind with a lot of arsenal pundits. I'm really tired of that world, paying less and less attention to it these days.

I'm looking forward to seeing the culture improve, the squad get refreshed, and us to lay the building blocks for a successful future under Arteta. If none of this eventuates, meh, I'll still be here anyway.

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11670/12013437/gabriel-martinelli-arsenal-forward-out-for-months-says-mikel-arteta

This is why Martinelli hasn't been playing. And I thought Leno would be out for longer. I think Maupay was entitled to go for the ball there and Leno should have probably protected himself better but you can't blame either player for the injury. Wish him speedy recovery

Guendouzi up for sale...

Disagree strongly on Maupay. It seemed clear to me that he shoved him purely with the intention of getting him outside of the area with the ball, Maupay was never getting near the ball and he knew it. I don't believe he ever intended to injure him, although having said that a few clips have been circulating showing foul play from Maupay in the past, so he is capable of that behaviour.