I guess its too much to hope that FIFA could ensure that teams are hosted appropriately. Clearly NZ weren't. Peru were pathetic.
But the CEO's comments before the first match were just ignorant and appalling.
All Whites vs Peru | Second leg | Thurs 16 Nov | 3:15pm | SS1
having seen a different Twitter thread to the one I saw this morning I'm a lot less annoyed.
The first one I saw basically implied it's due course for football in South America and analogies like lions not being nice to the prey they eat.
But having seem a lot of tweets where Peruvians didn't like it either, I'm more sympathetic to it because nobody wants 5o be judged by the "worst" in there group.
The same way I felt worry for the majority of fans when WSW was getting hammered for the flares.
Sorry guys, delaying planes, fighter jets over Hotel is absolutely wrong and if true, should be sanctions by FIFA.
That you may get idiots with a laser and firecrackers happens, still wrong and can‘t be not accepted.
I would probably think that's pretty cool. not how safe it is
If it was in the afternoon maybe, but I thought it was just after dawn and some of the players were still trying to sleep after being kept up all night by fireworks? From the interview with Hudson/Durante it seemed more like they were pissed at the lack of sleep rather than worrying the jets were going to open fire or anything.
from the footage I saw it didnt look like it was breaking dawn...looked mid morning
I realise it may look like whinging but we've all accepted we lost to the better side here, so why not move on from that, and have a very valid discussion about why this kind of behaviour is tolerated, and why people are being shouted down for suggesting that it shouldn't be?
There does seem to be a Peruvian fan back lash against the firecracker culprits. Potentially also by the people that lived near the zone. So maybe changes are slowly occurring. There appears two be two separate camps that debate how visitors should be treated (old school vs new wave school)
A lot of comments (not here but elsewhere) seem to make it like 95% of Peruvian fans were outside the hotel at 3 am lightning up the skies. From what I gather it was a small amount of fans being dicks. Similarly the stadium was not light up in lasers. Again a small amount in dicks.
Roughly 99% of people that turned up at the stadium supporting Peru did not have green lasers, did no boo the NZ national anthem (as far as I can tell) and simply spent 90 minutes turning the stadium into a pressure cooker.
Another issue that hasn't been discussed so far...
Westpac stadium should have been a rectangle?
Re: The Peru Air Force, from what I've seen the underside of the planes had a message painted supporting Peru, not a message saying "Dont' score NZ, or else ...", and some locals seemed to know it was going to happen. The only thing missing was a courtesy message to the NZ liason saying this is going to happen, you guys might want to get your cameras out.
... that blue thing in the sky, obviously photoshopped. Or perhaps kicking off mid-afternoon to suit Peru TV audience. If so it also helped lessen hours of jet lag our European players needed to overcome
... that blue thing in the sky, obviously photoshopped. Or perhaps kicking off mid-afternoon to suit Peru TV audience. If so it also helped lessen hours of jet lag our European players needed to overcome
Nope.
To your 'blue thing' comment... Oi!!
I was at the game in Lima - it was an amazing experience, but not without some iffy moments. Here are my thoughts, for what they're worth:
- firstly, the majority of the Peruvian fans were incredibly welcoming and I think quite surprised to see any NZers in the city. Plenty of them wanted to take photos with us, and were friendly and good sports.
- the culture of supporting football in Peru is on a completely different level to the support for any team in New Zealand, including the All Blacks. On the day of the game, probably 50% (no exaggeration) of the population were wearing Peru shirts. And the Estadio Nacional was unlike anything I've seen before: we arrived an hour before kick-off and the ground was completely full of Peruvians who sang for the entire pre-match (not to mention through the match itself). When Peru scored their first goal, the roar was so loud that the stadium shook (it actually registered on Peru's earthquake monitoring system) - it was not dissimilar to what I imagine being under aerial bombardment is like. It was quite incredible.
- the flipside of the incredible passion of the Peruvians for their team is that there is a fine line between positive support and unacceptable behaviour. While, as I said, most of their fans were really good, a couple of us Kiwis got hit with a flying bag of urine lobbed from the stand behind us during the match. The weird thing was, it happened after the second Peruvian goal, so we were already effectively out of the match; also, the liquid was cold, so presumably some hombre had been carrying round a bag of piss under his coat for 70 minutes...
- I felt totally safe as an NZ fan, although that might have changed if we'd won. Thankfully, there were a ton of jack-booted riot policemen and mounted police, presumably as a precaution in the case of an NZ win.
- as for the military jets, their effect was purely theatrical (the flyover happened about 2pm, so definitely didn't disrupt any sleeping patterns). However, it is always a worry when a government deploys the security forces specifically to intimidate or overawe an opposing team. I'm pretty sure FIFA has rules banning that kind of thing. It didn't affect the result, but it was also unnecessary and unacceptable, and I think it was right for NZ Football to lodge a complaint (though of course it shouldn't mean the result is overturned or anything).
- It would be great if someday we could get an entire stadium of people chanting for the All Whites like the Peruvians do for their Seleccion. The unashamed passion of the Peruvian fans is something to aspire to. On the other hand, I am glad that, for better or worse, New Zealand probably wouldn't resort to some of the Peruvian tactics. Intimidation and gamesmanship might be part of South American football culture, but that doesn't mean we have to accept it as normal or justified. Let the team on the pitch do the talking.
- But ultimately Peru absolutely deserved to win the match, and I'm happy for their fans for whom qualification means so much. The entire city was like one big party zone after the game. I think those of us at the Bahrain game can understand and appreciate the happiness of qualifying for a World Cup for the first time since 1982...
Sorry guys, delaying planes, fighter jets over Hotel is absolutely wrong and if true, should be sanctions by FIFA.
That you may get idiots with a laser and firecrackers happens, still wrong and can‘t be not accepted.
Re: The Peru Air Force, from what I've seen the underside of the planes had a message painted supporting Peru, not a message saying "Dont' score NZ, or else ...", and some locals seemed to know it was going to happen. The only thing missing was a courtesy message to the NZ liason saying this is going to happen, you guys might want to get your cameras out.
No one can perform at 100% if they are lacking sleep.
Was a 9.15pm kick off here in Lima. So if had gone to ET & then penalty shoot out - looking at a 12pm finish. I presume the AWs to set their body clocks right would have gone to bed, well after 12pm the night before. If they were woken by fireworks at 3-4am, then a jet flyover at dawn - they would have been lacking sleep.
Trust me Lima is not a quiet place, even in upmarket Miraflores. They have signs all around the suburb, saying that people using their claxon (car horn) at night will be fined 200?soles - but how do you police that???
Even in NZ fans (rugby) can get feral. At 2011 WC, some Aussie rugby fans were spat at. I think then going 24 years between Rugby World Cup wins increases level of feral behaviour & fan pressure. Some parallels to Peru and them going 36 years between football WC appearances.
Anyway had a great time here in Peru, and majority of fans have been awesome fun. Interviewed by 4 Peruvian TV/radio stations, and 1 Brazilian pre game!
Wow bags of piss...that's classy! Last time I heard of that was during an away game at Napoli where Roma supporters were effectively 'caged in' their own stand (for safety reasons) and it suddenly started raining urine.
Sean Dyche says Chris Wood was fine when he left Burnley.
Sort of contradicts Hudson's 'he came here unable to play' doesn't it?
Sean Dyche says Chris Wood was fine when he left Burnley.
Sort of contradicts Hudson's 'he came here unable to play' doesn't it?
Will he be all good to play 90 minutes against Swansea to day I wonder
Sorry guys, delaying planes, fighter jets over Hotel is absolutely wrong and if true, should be sanctions by FIFA.
That you may get idiots with a laser and firecrackers happens, still wrong and can‘t be not accepted.
b) he's asking for something that literally doesn't exist in NZ footballing culture (outside of Waiheke) AND HE KNOWS THAT
Whats the footballing culture on Waiheke like??
Ahhhh whatever. When in NZ things got done our way. Over in Peru it got done their way.
I enjoyed spending time with the fun and nice Peruvian fans over here for the first leg and I hope they felt like they were with friends, but if NZ fans/authorities had treated the Peruvian team like they treated ours I'd be embarrassed and sorry. In my opinion some questions should be asked about the 'official' level of some of the shenanigans - but as for fanatical fans - well it is South America....(and the same in quite a few other places I'm sure)
In balance and while it's not perfect, I'm largely happy with our 'fair go' and welcoming 'manaakitanga' culture, and walking the talk on that whenever possible. That is why I felt embarrassed about Martin's comments - but I'm so glad it had no effect on how we collectively behaved - just a few friendly 'who are ya' chants at the game and not a jetplane in sight....(not that we have any).
Yep I made a Peruvian friend who was over from Miami with his mum and then heading to Lima for the 2nd leg, nice guy, got him on facebook now, he was friendly as, me an my mate swapped shirts with them so we got Peruvian ones.
Personally I prefer our NZ mentality of hard and fair, go in hard for 50/50 balls etc.. not all the theatrics, this puts alot of kiwis off football unroftunately.
The fly over was some time around 3pm. We were at a bar and it sounded loud but there were only two fly overs and lasted about 3 minutes. Hardly a big deal.
As for Martin talking about the safety of fans. What bollocks. Never once did NZF contact us with advice about how to say safe. He walked into the hotel bar after the game and did his best to not talk to anyone.
b) he's asking for something that literally doesn't exist in NZ footballing culture (outside of Waiheke) AND HE KNOWS THAT
Whats the footballing culture on Waiheke like??
our players taking selfies on the field just before the game LOL
Just goes to show how far behind we are. This is supposed to be the most important game of the past 4 years. Peruvians 100 % into the game. Our players or a lot of them just having fun. We are not there to do tourism , we are there to win the game.
In other countries where soccer is a culture, they catch u taking selfies in a game like this and you loose , you may as well dont come back
Back in 2012/13 didn't we almost join conembol but Steph Blatter rejected it?
hudson taking selfies too OMGGG
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TuZuthvmxNo
That's not just before the game. That's as they have arrived. Probably 90 minutes before the game.
b) he's asking for something that literally doesn't exist in NZ footballing culture (outside of Waiheke) AND HE KNOWS THAT
Whats the footballing culture on Waiheke like??
Seriously fun.
Ha! that Waiheke vid is great. I spent time on Waiheke Island last week and it seemed like every second person we met was a young Argie. Apparently they run most of the vineyards and do lots of hospitality stuff. They create a nice vibe on the island.Wonder if there are any players that would be good enough for Team Wellington(or the Nix)?
I really don't care about the antics of the Peruvians. We kiwis need to harden up. We complain about what went down in Peru, we complain that playing in the Pacific islands is "too hot, too humid and the pitches too bumpy"" Then people wish we were playing in Asia to qualify. Well if we did that we would be exposed to playing in places like Azerbijan or Iran, freeze our arses off in winter matches in korea, play in hot humid Thailand etc.We would be exposed to all sorts of local pressures and hassles. Thats the rub for a pro footballer. You just have to suck it up and get on with your job.
The big question for NZ is what happens next for the AW's?. Unfortunately the answer is probably "nothing"". We have seen from the Peru qualifiers that there is a real appetite in this country for serious meaningful football. The fans want it, the media want it. But the reality is we will probably have only one more meaningful home game for the AW's, EVER......that will be the home qualifier for the 2022 World Cup. After that its direct entry from Oceania. We will then be lost for ever in the boringness of Oceania with just two games at the World Cup every 4 years.
b) he's asking for something that literally doesn't exist in NZ footballing culture (outside of Waiheke) AND HE KNOWS THAT
Whats the footballing culture on Waiheke like??
Nice over there next weekend, pity season has finished, would have gone to have a look!
Durante's view.
our players taking selfies on the field just before the game LOL
Just goes to show how far behind we are. This is supposed to be the most important game of the past 4 years. Peruvians 100 % into the game. Our players or a lot of them just having fun. We are not there to do tourism , we are there to win the game.
In other countries where soccer is a culture, they catch u taking selfies in a game like this and you loose , you may as well dont come back
What a load of BS. I was there. As mentioned above they were out on the pitch at least an hour before kickoff taking selfies. At that stage the ground was already 90% full, and the singing was in full swing. So different to NZ. What better way to try and relax, normalise the environment and take it all in, than by taking a few selfies.
No point getting stressed out, intimidated and wound up with still 60-90 mins to go. Plenty of time for that later. Guys like Thomas really busted their arse. They can stand tall.
our players taking selfies on the field just before the game LOL
Just goes to show how far behind we are. This is supposed to be the most important game of the past 4 years. Peruvians 100 % into the game. Our players or a lot of them just having fun. We are not there to do tourism , we are there to win the game.
In other countries where soccer is a culture, they catch u taking selfies in a game like this and you loose , you may as well dont come back
What a load of BS. I was there. As mentioned above they were out on the pitch at least an hour before kickoff taking selfies. At that stage the ground was already 90% full, and the singing was in full swing. So different to NZ. What better way to try and relax, normalise the environment and take it all in, than by taking a few selfies.
No point getting stressed out, intimidated and wound up with still 60-90 mins to go. Plenty of time for that later. Guys like Thomas really busted their arse. They can stand tall.
Peruvians also took selfies. it's a way to destress yourself. Take it all in
some of the peruvian comments on that instgram post from dura are quite special
shirley_vane92You guys stole some peruvian hearts ?, played till the last second with determination, punch, boldness and the heart. Feel really proud of yourselves because Peru will remember always always this amazing match and the All Whites ❤
p_a_l_o_m_a3Thank you for your words!!! You Made a good game. You played until the end with passion too. I am sorry for the fireworks, i think there are bad fans in every country. I hope you can remember the good things about us. Keep playing with passion and hearth. Greetings from a peruvian fan! ?
I like this post by Durante. Players starting to work from early age their asses off to play big games. All players can be proud of their performances. The disappointment will go away and good memories will stay. I thought they competed well and gave their best in those 2 games. But like ALL of us experienced, there is always someone better in the job, but hey, never stop dreaming.
Awesome that Dura got to play for the AWs, his attitude shows through in the post and shows how much he deserved to get that chance. Good on you Kiwi Dura!
And I thank him for the overall effort he put in over 180 minutes in what was a near impossible position as a team or player to win in!
Looking at it again it looks like one of the central defenders got drawn out to the player crossing the ball, so not his fault at all and he was desperately trying to get back to close him down, it wasn't intended as a criticism BTW - just an observation.
I thought Durante was to close to covering Reid. Weemac tracking Farfan is a bit of a stretch, he looked super fast.
Yeah watching it again you are right and McGlinchey was desperate trying to get back.
So you're blaming the midfield for not picking up the centre-foward?
Yeah sorry watched it again, Durante seemed to get drawn out of the middle a bit as stated by someone above and McGlinchey was desperately trying to get back to cover.
While it's sad that Durante will retire without attending the world cup he got closer than the bulk of footballers and has had a great career including winning the A-Leagie in 2007, was named the best defender in the history of the A-League, and is close to setting the all time appearance record in the A-League.
A fantastic career even if he fell short of his ambitions with and within NZ.
And let's not forget too that he came out of retirement at a time NZ desperately needed his experience and uncomplainingly gave his all in the kind of thankless slogs against Pacific Island minnows that other higher profile players couldn't/wouldn't turn up for. Obviously he will regret not getting to a world cup but he should be very proud of being an important part of two AW campaigns.