Andy Martin - All you expect and less

Um, is this question serious? 

I don't think having a yellow and black banner in the crowd means it is representative of the fever. 

Any cod can make a yellow and black banner, buy a ticket in the zone and fly their flag. 

Wait, did you just agree with me? 

Are you feeling alright? :p

It was either that or agreeing with Napier Phoenix

I thought however your explanation left a lot to be desired :)

Nah he was being okay. Did his job without being a cock about it.

I have noticed a trend towards this sort of thing over the last year or so. Wondering if everyone felt comfortable with this level of political/social advocacy given Yellow Fever is seen as a Phoenix supporters group and despite our level of involvement , by virtue of our prolonged participation most of us can be deemed part of Yellow Fever. Personally I am uncomfortable with part of the direction some of the group have been taking.

It's not life and death so why does it matter? I also can't wait for us to seek approval from everyone from 'Yellow Fever' before we next put something on the big banner.

so everybody has to get approval from everybody before displaying any sort of banner? seems unrealistic and unnecessary. 

well that's a reflection of the attitude of some of the 'elite' so no surprises there, wonder if there is a more reasoned view, not likely from the usual suspects I'd imagine. To new forum members, watch closely and you'll see how some of the screaming skulls react when they think their feifdom is being challenged.

What would you say if someone put up a banner saying something like "support racism" ? Still unnecessary?

how is it elitist to say that anyone can bring a banner to the stadium without checking with yellow fever first? 

I'd have thought its elitist to make people check with yellow fever before they're allowed to bring a banner in? 

Also the only one of the so called 'elite' who has commented is 2ndBest. Don't take one or two peoples post as being representative of the entire yellow fever either (like you apparently do with a banner). 

thank you boy, as usual take an example to the extreme without addressing the actual point raised.

I wouldn't automatically take it as being reflective of the entire yellow fever. I also imagine it breaks stadium and A league rules, yes?

Ok...i'm genuinely interested in examples where you think that the yellowfever 'elite' have made political/social comments and made it appear to be a wider Yellow Fever belief.

Couple of things here, I don't think NP means every sign needs to be signed off but can see his point that the sign going up in the middle of the zone does look like it is being "authorised" by YF. However I would hope most people would be smart enough to know that something put up in the zone isn't necessarily a representative of every fever member and anyone can take signs into the game and display them without them being the thoughts and feelings of every other zone member.

Someone waves a yellow and black NZ flag in the zone so i guess he shouldn't be allowed to given it might mean that YF supports the current flag in the referendum.

Probably shouldn't chant "Wellington is wonderful" because someone might think it isn't wonderful. Wouldn't want to misrepresent them. 

Mate, you're either a very bad troll or just an idiot.  I sincerely hope the former.

Hell, some of us even decided against doing a "Refugees Welcome" for round 1 this season like a whole lot of other aleague fan groups were doing because we didn't feel comfortable forcing those political views on the rest of the Fever.

When I saw that sign shown on here I did think it was a YF sign tbh. Looking like the signs displayed by YF before. Looks official.

I presume now it wasn't ????

I don't see that sign as offensive, it is someone's political opinion, which I don't agree with, and I don't see it as representing me as a YF member. Meh.

I would hope if something was truly offensive, the zone would "sort it"

Agree.Some may like Coldplay just the way they are.

there you go, so you do have a social barometer. You deemed the refugee banner as being a political view and made a choice not to display it because ....'rest of the fever'.... yet a political view of having the head of NZF removed/resign is ok to be 'forced' on the fever. Some of you will either never see the hypocracy in that or simply refuse to admit it. Again, no surprises thete.

It is a 2 edged sword isn't it? Of course every Fever member is unlikely to agree with what the banner infers but what I find disappointing is that Patrick and perhaps others have hijacked the zone that supports the Wellington Phoenix by displaying a banner that has no relevance to the club at all. despite what some of you are saying, a banner such as that displayed in the way it was, in the zone, will be interpreted as being an official view of Yellow Fever. I think it is a case of little boys playing with matches, it will be our house being burned down if it catches fire.

Don't think it was official like the big banner would be.

We are a lot of idiots but there is no way we would allow something truly offensive in the zone, I'd like to think the fever zone polices itself quite well when you hear what happens in other supporter groups.

you're quite welcome to bring a "Martin in" banner to the next game. We've had people bring all sorts of banners and flags into the feverzone. Most would realise that a small banner is hardly representative of everybody. 

If somebody other than Patrick bought the banner in, would you still have the same problem? (Did Patrick even bring it in?). 

The nix are a massive stakeholder of NZF, and deal with them on a number of issues. Hell, they stuffed up a transfer of a player of ours on deadline day very recently. They were also not exactly helpful with our licence issues. I'd say it's a relevant banner. 

Again, you're basically saying nobody is allowed to bring a flag or banner in, just in case somebody else doesn't like or disagrees with it. Does the same apply to chants? Where do you draw that line? Should we just sit silently with no banners or flags, in fear of misrepresenting someone? 

Don't chant "Wellington is wonderful" just in case someone thinks it isn't. 

Sit down in case someone thinks we shouldn't be standing (or do we stand in case someone thinks we shouldn't sit? - should we crouch to keep everyone half happy?)

Don't put a 10 more years banner up in case someone thinks we should have got 15. 

Edit: Tegal beat me to it

Hold on - how long ago was it that a "Liverpool" blanket in the Zone was deemed non political and not offensive.

Won't edit above but is the fan in his red shirt making a fever statement or a personal view.

how is it forced on people. It was on a small banner that someone bought in. Someone brings a FFA shark cods banner. Is that forcing it on us too.

still waiting.

Just adding my $0.10 worth here and I agree with the sentiments of the banner btw:

It is very easy to see how this could be seen as being an "official" fever sign. Yellow and Black and right in the middle of the zone and spanning approx 15 seats so around 10m long it is more than "someone bringing a banner" I think if you asked anyone in the stadium not connected with the Fever they would say "ohh the Yellow Fever put up a sign today wanting Andy Martin gone". Rightly or wrongly that would be the perception.

Added to that, Patrick and Matt were involved in the banner, and again I am not having a dig or a crack I am just trying to explain what the perceptions may be, and Patrick and Matt are seen in very many things (on TV adds etc) as being "faces of the fever" so to a degree the position you guys hold dictates what the perceptions of others may be. 

Personally I don't give a flying fudge what type of banner goes up and the sentiment in that one is about right but what if Patrick had decided to bring a one made in the same material??   

To Matt's credit, he had no idea what was on the banner, he was just asked to put it up and in true Matt style, he did so. He didn't even realise how long it was so it ended up covering up half the Yellow Fever banner down the front 

As I say mate, not having a crack at anyone or anything, just giving my opinion on the perception

Yep aware of that. Just making sure Matt doesn't get dragged down into this for various reasons. Wasn't really a direct response to you :) 

this? big banner?

I'm not in the fever zone very often so probably am not fever even though I post here regularly, however if this forum is anything to go by then by general consensus that banner does represent the fever.

I think it represents the people that are holding it up. A small banner that 4-5 people are holding up represents 4-5 people in the fever - people should be allowed to go nuts with that without having to put it to a committee chaired by NP. 

The big banner however, is held up by virtually the whole feverzone. So you're attaching the message to everyone holding it up. Which is why the big banner only ever shows generic messages of support for the team. 

Which I assume is why "Martin Out" was on a small banner, rather than the big banner. 

Sth.Jeff is bang on regarding the perception. As far as some of other postings in response to mine, not much there to sway myself or any other reasonable person from my view. I knew as soon as I thought about writing my original post that this was the reaction I'd get in the main. Some of you are like Pavlov's dog, and very hard to have intelligent debate with people that simply froth at the mouth and lash out rather than provide some reasoned thought. Just once I'd like the likes of Tegal or 2nd Best actually say," I take your point but I respectfully disagree", there are plenty of people in this forum that do that and it is far easier to give them credibility for their own views even if they differ to your own. 

I think sthn.jeff is spot on.

The perception may be that it is a YF stance, especially with how much Patrick does with\for the fever, that was my first thought when I saw it.

But 2 points:

1: A groups stance doesn't necessarily reflect all of its members.  E.g. if "NZ" does something that doesn't necessarily mean every NZer agrees, just means the chaps/chapettes in charge made a decision.

2: Who gives a shark? the banner is both correct and banter.  The YF "elite" cant be held accountable for representing every persons opinion and triple checking with every "member" 

Hell who counts as a "member"? someone who likes the Nix? someone with tickets in the fever zone? people who argue about dumb shark here? all of the above? or none of the above?, I mean I've never considered myself a member, I just sit with YF, listen to their pod, contribute to their charity stuff and argue on here, but I don't socialise with the group and just see it as the cool kids I can stand near.  Does YF have to reflect my opinions? Or all of them? Or do nothing on a yellow banner in case of the risk?  Seems silly to me.  

OH also, did patrick actually almost get punched for the banner?

Point 2 pretty much sums it up for me. What is the problem with football fans expressing their displeasure with the guy who is in charge of football in this country?