Ask what you can do for OFC- Not other way round?
Mr Positive
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All Whites, Ferns, and other international teams
Ask what you can do for OFC- Not other way round?
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I think taking the lines from a JFK speach might seem cheesey. But i have been thinking about this for awhile.
Ask what you can do for your confederation, Not what can your confederation can do for you!.
Its been 3 times now an OFC team made the World Cup. Should we be asking for a full WC spot now?
I know the argument about playing better national teams more often, And having a Confederation that governs its nations instead of counting cocanuts.
But with World Cup qualification comes sponcership dollars, The island nations would get more sponcership too and it would up the anti on all games played through the OFC cup + WC qualification games.
Not just that, it also makes getting friendly games more viable with other national sides wanting to play against a possible world cup team/foe.
We really have Australia to thank for us getting to the world cup, That help wont be there forever and we should push now for OFC to gain automatic entry for the World Cup.
Mr Positive
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We're way too small. As much as i agree that the world cup should have representatives from all over the world (and you could argue reps from all confederations),its just too small a confederation to justify it,and it really really wouldnt be fair.
Not giving us a full world cup spot just shows how little they think of us as a confederation,and theyd be right,we barely even count as one.
Allegedly
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I think taking the lines from a JFK speach might seem cheesey. But i have been thinking about this for awhile.
Ask what you can do for your confederation, Not what can your confederation can do for you!.
Its been 3 times now an OFC team made the World Cup. Should we be asking for a full WC spot now?
I know the argument about playing better national teams more often, And having a Confederation that governs its nations instead of counting cocanuts.
But with World Cup qualification comes sponcership dollars, The island nations would get more sponcership too and it would up the anti on all games played through the OFC cup + WC qualification games.
Not just that, it also makes getting friendly games more viable with other national sides wanting to play against a possible world cup team/foe.
We really have Australia to thank for us getting to the world cup, That help wont be there forever and we should push now for OFC to gain automatic entry for the World Cup.
Was offered to Oceania once before (when Australia was still there) but other Confeds cracked it, and it was changed within a month or two at the time. I'd doubt your proposal would sit in the major world footballing offices!
NZ had a pearler of a run to 2010 (Bahrain were poor to be honest and any Aust or NZ team of bygone eras would and should have smashed them). The biggest thing now is the next qualification for 2014. There's going to be some behind the scenes manoevering now. If anything, Oceania should be campaiging to send its top team through Asia's final stage, which guarantees 10 games, and is a "proper" World Cup campaign.
It's either integrate Oceania with Asia more I'd say, as I think FIFA will change things for 2014 and beyond.
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Its been 3 times now an OFC team made the World Cup.��Should we be asking for a full WC spot now
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OFC teams have qualified 4 times for the World Cup (Australia in 1974 and 2006, NZ in 1982 and 2010).
As for your idea, won't happen. Considering the current situation, DS's suggestion is probably the best we can hope for for now.
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I think taking the lines from a JFK speach might seem cheesey. But i have been thinking about this for awhile.
Ask what you can do for your confederation, Not what can your confederation can do for you!.
Its been 3 times now an OFC team made the World Cup. Should we be asking for a full WC spot now?
I know the argument about playing better national teams more often, And having a Confederation that governs its nations instead of counting cocanuts.
But with World Cup qualification comes sponcership dollars, The island nations would get more sponcership too and it would up the anti on all games played through the OFC cup + WC qualification games.
Not just that, it also makes getting friendly games more viable with other national sides wanting to play against a possible world cup team/foe.
We really have Australia to thank for us getting to the world cup, That help wont be there forever and we should push now for OFC to gain automatic entry for the World Cup.
Was offered to Oceania once before (when Australia was still there) but other Confeds cracked it, and it was changed within a month or two at the time. I'd doubt your proposal would sit in the major world footballing offices!
NZ had a pearler of a run to 2010 (Bahrain were poor to be honest and any Aust or NZ team of bygone eras would and should have smashed them). The biggest thing now is the next qualification for 2014. There's going to be some behind the scenes manoevering now. If anything, Oceania should be campaiging to send its top team through Asia's final stage, which guarantees 10 games, and is a "proper" World Cup campaign.
It's either integrate Oceania with Asia more I'd say, as I think FIFA will change things for 2014 and beyond.
Just because we beat them doesnt make them rubbish. These days our side are all pros and while not the most gifted technically, now that we have organised ourselves defensively and with some quite powerful players up front, we would have given most Asian countries, save the top 3, a fair crack in the play-off.
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Its been 3 times now an OFC team made the World Cup. Should we be asking for a full WC spot now
OFC teams have qualified 4 times for the World Cup (Australia in 1974 and 2006, NZ in 1982 and 2010).
As for your idea, won't happen. Considering the current situation, DS's suggestion is probably the best we can hope for for now.
No Australia was a Asian country for that qualifing in 1974, They rejoined OFC in 1976.
So NZ was the first to make it followed buy Australia, And now NZ again.
Also i know it means nothing and also brings nothing to the table but there are two new national sides joining the OFC next year and will be playing in the Pacific Games there after.
Mr Positive
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What they do will depend on how we go at the World Cup. Around the time when they were going to give Oceania an automatic spot we qualified for the Confederations Cup and got smashed, so they backed off giving it. So it's really up to us to earn the respect... I think it's fair to stick the winner of Oceania in the Asian groups.
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I think our starting 11 matches those in asia,we just lack depth that a lot of those nations have. But we're developing more and more quality players.
Allegedly
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What they do will depend on how we go at the World Cup. Around the time when they were going to give Oceania an automatic spot we qualified for the Confederations Cup and got smashed, so they backed off giving it. So it's really up to us to earn the respect... I think it's fair to stick the winner of Oceania in the Asian groups.
I totally agree with you there, But here is my point:
We have beaten the 5th best Asian national team, In the Confed Cup we draw with Iraq the current Asian champions. Bahrain have had 3 shots at qualifing and missed out, where as the OFC team only gets "One shot at glory" and New Zealand took it buy the ballz.
So why bother joining the Asian finial round when we have shown that we can/have beaten there 5th best team. We dont need to prove our selfs since we had done so anyhow.
And it was Asia that said NO for it to happen for the current WC qualifing rounds.
Mr Positive
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NZ had a pearler of a run to 2010 (Bahrain were poor to be honest and any Aust or NZ team of bygone eras would and should have smashed them). The biggest thing now is the next qualification for 2014. There's going to be some behind the scenes manoevering now.
[/QUOTE]
I disagree, Australia yes, but I think most NZ sides of the '90s would have struggled, barring the boys from '99 (2 who played on saturday (Ivan and Ryan) plus three other still playing, Bunce, Perry and Bouckenooghe)
[QUOTE=diego's son]
If anything, Oceania should be campaiging to send its top team through Asia's final stage, which guarantees 10 games, and is a "proper" World Cup campaign.
It's either integrate Oceania with Asia more I'd say, as I think FIFA will change things for 2014 and beyond.
This is what the 81/82 team boys had to do if I'm correct.
Supporter world's best and worst football teams: Waikato/WaiBop, Kingz, Knights, Phoenix, The Argyle, The Whites & the All Whites
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If anything, Oceania should be campaiging to send its top team through Asia's final stage, which guarantees 10 games, and is a "proper" World Cup campaign.
It's either integrate Oceania with Asia more I'd say, as I think FIFA will change things for 2014 and beyond.
This is what the 81/82 team boys had to do if I'm correct.
From memory yes, check here for more: http://www.ozfootball.net/ark/Socceroo/1981A.html
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What they do will depend on how we go at the World Cup. Around the time when they were going to give Oceania an automatic spot we qualified for the Confederations Cup and got smashed, so they backed off giving it. So it's really up to us to earn the respect... I think it's fair to stick the winner of Oceania in the Asian groups.
I totally agree with you there, But here is my point:
We have beaten the 5th best Asian national team, In the Confed Cup we draw with Iraq the current Asian champions. Bahrain have had 3 shots at qualifing and missed out, where as the OFC team only gets "One shot at glory" and New Zealand took it buy the ballz.
So why bother joining the Asian finial round when we have shown that we can/have beaten there 5th best team. We dont need to prove our selfs since we had done so anyhow.
And it was Asia that said NO for it to happen for the current WC qualifing rounds.
I get your point, but, if you play a 10-12 game proper world cup campaign, it allows the team to develop a style and provides at least 5 home qualifiers which the national federation would love (for income, sponsorship and so on).
Also now, the world will be looking at this result, so the other Confeds with much more power than the OFC will be calling on FIFA to make changes.
I've looked at Australia since its move to Asia, and even though the play-off game is emotionally a brilliant time, the 14 games Australia had to qualify were pretty good.
NOTE: If you guys got the Iran team we played in 1997, it would have been tougher. Looking at Bahrain the other night, they were sh!te!
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I get your point, but, if you play a 10-12 game proper world cup campaign, it allows the team to develop a style and provides at least 5 home qualifiers which the national federation would love (for income, sponsorship and so on).[/QUOTE]
Not true, Guus Hiddink had Australia for 2 games in Oceania agaisnt the Soloman Islands and then the play off with Uruguay, It took them F#$k all to adapt to his style of play in that short amont of time (Between Sol/Island game and Uruguay play off).
This also doesnt make any diffrence since Rickie Had his team and tactics changed with in a few weeks before the play-off's and it worked well.
Also now, the world will be looking at this result, so the other Confeds with much more power than the OFC will be calling on FIFA to make changes.
I doubt it, Why will they look at OFC when it was the AFC's 5th place team that failed? Surely it says alot. It dont mean Fiji cant beat them but it does look good for OFC and bad for AFC.
[QUOTE]
NOTE: If you guys got the Iran team we played in 1997, it would have been tougher. Looking at Bahrain the other night, they were sh!te!
[QUOTE]
NOTE: If you guys got the Iran team we played in 1997, it would have been tougher. Looking at Bahrain the other night, they were sh!te!
Yeah that game with Iran still is hard to watch for maney Aussies
, Bahrain did look sh*t thanks to the All Whites playing half decent, I still believe the All Whites played there best game against Iraq at the confed cup.
, Bahrain did look sh*t thanks to the All Whites playing half decent, I still believe the All Whites played there best game against Iraq at the confed cup.Mr Positive
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I get your point, but, if you play a 10-12 game proper world cup campaign, it allows the team to develop a style and provides at least 5 home qualifiers which the national federation would love (for income, sponsorship and so on).
Not true, Guus Hiddink had Australia for 2 games in Oceania agaisnt the Soloman Islands and then the play off with Uruguay, It took them F#$k all to adapt to his style of play in that short amont of time (Between Sol/Island game and Uruguay play off).
This also doesnt make any diffrence since Rickie Had his team and tactics changed with in a few weeks before the play-off's and it worked well.
Australia cancelled a game in August 2005 (prior to Soloman Islands) so that Guss had a full week and bit with the boys in London.
Australia also played Jamaica in London in October 2005 as well, which meant the players spent more time (around a week from memory) with Guus.
Like I said, the 14 game campaign that Australia just had for 2010 was good, whilst it was more workman-like, and lacked the pure intensity of 2005, OVERALL, no-one here is complaining. How Ricki coached the team is his business, but definitely the multi-game campaign helps the national team overall (and the Federation as well with constant income, sponsorship and marketing streams).
If NZ (I should say Oceania here) threw the 0.5 spot to Asia and said "we're sending our best team to the last phase in return (via a local OFC playoff)" then that may be possible (2nd guessing FIFA politics from here I'm not doing). NZF for example, would get around 5-7 proper home games for TV rights, sponsorship and exposure, and the NZ national team (if they won the Oceania comp as the best team) would gel as a result by playing more often.
Look above the NZ/Aus thing, think globally. Whilst some in Oz miss the pure emotion that you guys would have felt on Saturday night, overall, no-one here would go back to the way it was with Oceania. The on and off field benefits are huge for Aust now that they are an Asian Football Confederation nation.
diego's son2009-11-17 04:12:56
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Also now, the world will be looking at this result, so the other Confeds with much more power than the OFC will be calling on FIFA to make changes.
I doubt it, Why will they look at OFC when it was the AFC's 5th place team that failed? Surely it says alot. It dont mean Fiji cant beat them but it does look good for OFC and bad for AFC.
Not NZ's fault who they had to play, FIFA administers that. But Bahrain was poor compared to (say) Iran in 1997. NZ played to what opposition they had to, in order to make 2010, no one is saying otherwise.
If you want a GLOBAL view on it, look at some of the comments here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A59591271
How Oceania is handled form now on is anyone's guess... but believe me, the multi-game World Cup campaign has many benefits.
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We have beaten the 5th best Asian national team, In the Confed Cup we draw with Iraq the current Asian champions. Bahrain have had 3 shots at qualifing and missed out, where as the OFC team only gets "One shot at glory" and New Zealand took it buy the ballz.
So why bother joining the Asian finial round when we have shown that we can/have beaten there 5th best team. We dont need to prove our selfs since we had done so anyhow.
Reading this again, your argument could be considered flawed in the following sense. Read below.
In 2005 Australia knocked over Uruguay (5th best South American team) to make Germany 2006. BUT if Australia (or NZ for that matter) was POOLED in the South American qualifying group (with all the Sth American nations), how will they have travelled?
The argument is flawed, they'd be worldwide condemnation if Oceania was given a full spot. It happened once before and was taken away quick smart.
As I said above, Australia wouldn't swap the AFC for quids now, the multi-game campaign is fair and provides benefits on and off field. If FIFA split Asia, or bring in the best Oceania team to its formatted qualifying campaign, the benefits are huge. If you saw it that way then it helps!
diego's son2009-11-17 05:40:51
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Only 2 legs = more room for luck to play its part. So you cant simply say "we beat the 5th placed team and the asian champs in the confed cup so we should get an automatic spot". Also,would we deserve to qualify for EVERY world cup in the long run? (because thats what would happen). Our confederation is too small to even count as one really,so i agree that we shouldnt get a full spot.
Allegedly
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Not sure if this is the best place to post this, it also mentions the Nix specifically:
http://www.sbs.com.au/sport/blog/single/114652/Memo-to-New-Zealand:-make-a-dinner-date-with-Bin-Hammam
http://www.sbs.com.au/sport/blog/single/114652/Memo-to-New-Zealand:-make-a-dinner-date-with-Bin-Hammam
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Not sure if this is the best place to post this, it also mentions the Nix specifically:
http://www.sbs.com.au/sport/blog/single/114652/Memo-to-New-Zealand:-make-a-dinner-date-with-Bin-Hammam
http://www.sbs.com.au/sport/blog/single/114652/Memo-to-New-Zealand:-make-a-dinner-date-with-Bin-Hammam
I posted this in the main Wellington thread. Good find.
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