If you're playing in the Handy, you probably aren't good enough to play for the AWs. For me, that extends to coaching as well. Its a sad indictment on the quality of our National League but for me, Ramon needs to do something with someone other than Auckland City to even be considered an option.
This is absolute rubbish and attitudes like this just hold our game back.
Ramon took Auckland City to 3rd place in the Club World Cup - they won 4 games in 10 days and took South American Champions to extra time in the semi final - what he did was phenomenal - up there with the likes of Denmark and Greece winning the Euros.
and to say our National League coaches aren't good enough for the international job is bollocks
qualifying for the world cup is the most successful thing they can do, Ricki Herbert had won a National League and been 2x runners up with Central United, which got him into an assistants role with the All Whites
John Adshead never coached National League before he got the job but he did win the Northern League and Chatham Cup double with Manurewa and he went on to coach National League after the World Cup
Outside of the world cups, our next most successful coach was probably Ken Dugdale, (ONC winners, Confederations Cup & Merdaka Tournament winner) He coached Miramar in the NL, not successfully but took Wanganui Athletic into the national round of the superclub version of the NL. He also coached at Petone and worked extensively within the NZ system developing age group players. He set up the Ole Academy with Dave Wilson,
Of the other All White's coaches since 1982 that coached in the NZ National League
Allan Jones went on to coach National League after stepping down from the All Whites job
Kevin Fallon won the league with Gisborne City before he got the main job
Ian Marshall won 2x National League's and a Chatham cup with Christchurch United, then got the All White's job
Keith Pritchett won 3x National League titles and 3x Chatham cups with Waitakere City, then got the All Whites Job
Mick Waitt won 3x National League titles and 1x Chatham Cup with Napier City Rovers, then got the All Whites Job
Neil Emblem won 3x National League titles with Waitakere United, then got the All Whites Job (well the interim job)
Ramon has won 5x premiership titles (ie top of the league) and 2x Grand Finals and 7x Oceania Champions League finals but yet he isn't qualified enough to even get an interview for the job!
The 3 most recent imports for the job before Schmid have been Hudson, Joe McGrath and Bobby Clark.
Bobby Clark was good but left pretty quickly when he realised the state of NZ football - but he did play a key role in setting up the American university scholarship path for kiwi kids.
Joe McGrath, was an Irish guy with a love for golf, that claimed he had assisted Jack Charlton when he had been Ireland manager, it quickly became evident that this "assistant" role was most likely Jack Charlton asking him to get the cones in after training or making him a cup of tea. Ironically besides Hudson he was probably the most qualified on paper of the All White's coaches!
3rd at the Club World Cup is great, no one is denying that. To suggest it is on par with Greece winning the Euros is a joke though.
I don't think we should be looking backwards, when we are at a time when we should be moving forwards, just because Kiwi coaches have had success doesn't mean the current crop will, and football is a vastly different place now than for literally all of those coaches, bar probably Herbert (and Hay if you count him). I'm not denying that many of them achieved well in the role, but if we want to be qualifying for the World Cup and improving the standard of football that the AWs play, there are far greater resources overseas to do that than in NZ.
The All Whites need to be playing at a standard far, far higher than the Handy. I'm not convinced that constantly beating up on smaller teams is what is required as experience for the AWs job.
For me, a coach needs to prove himself at a higher level than the Handy to be considered for the role. I'd like to think our national league is of the standard to churn out All Whites and coaching staff, but I don't see that as the case currently - in fact, it was considered a joke when Hudson called up National League players like Dyer. I would like it to be that way in the future and I see the appointments of Heraf and Schmid with current coaches in NZ as assistants as a step towards it and hopefully we can improve the quality of local football to the point where coaches like Ramon and Jose can be considered for the top job. I think Ramon and Jose are great coaches, and I don't agree with Ramon being excluded from the interview process based on qualifications. But, with the relative quality of football overseas compared to home, the best candidate is likely to be from abroad. Whether we have made the right appointment remains to be seen, and Hudson was certainly not the appointment we needed to develop NZ football as a whole. I thought he did as well as could be expected when it came to WC qualification, even if there are many, many questions about his time in charge (not the place to go into that though).
I have no clue how recognising this holds us back in any way. Identifying and addressing your weaknesses is how you move forward, not ignoring them and blindly hoping for the best.
We can romanticise NZ football til the cows come home but the reality is that we should be aiming higher than what we have achieved in the past, and that means looking international to improve the game at home. I'd hope the current coach is aiming far beyond what any of the coaches you named achieved with the All Whites, bar Adshead and Herbert.