Funding of NZF Youth Sides

I think if your average operating loss over the past two years has been $0.6m and you have $2.5m total equity then it's not too soon to be talking about a financial crisis. The money is running out fast.

I agree that there simply hasn't been enough discussion about other options though. Not publicly anyway.

Me too. Just tell us what's going on and trust us to take part in an informed discussion.

I completely agree. This is one of the reasons I was not a fan of Glyn Taylor as he could not organise a dutch oven and even more so of Grant McKavanagh. There have been some good people that left the organisation purely cause they have said 'what the fuck is going on'. Its now starting to have far wider ramifications than just bumbling along. If this was big business (and I mean away from the sporting world) some of these people would have a hell of a lot to answer for and would have ben shot of long before now.

Tegal just made the same point. I look at it you have 10m to operate with, then $100k is only 1%. They can't find that elsewhere for the sake of taxing the kids (and lets be honest, the parents). Hence my call about the hangers on.

True yes you are right. I think if they were smarter and looked within, they would find that $100k without too much trouble.

this thread is awesome

Its a really good discussion and I am enjoying the points raised thoroughly (I haven't even called anyone an idiot!!!)

I called Fred today and asked if he'd come on ITZ for a chat. No call back so far.

HA!

This may be simplistic but why are the "Futsal Whites" getting NZF funding when we can't afford other international programmes.  Futsal players don't pay NZF affiliation fees do they?

I think there is also a further point.  Are we getting value for money focussing our international programmes on youth teams attending FIFA tournaments.  We've been doing it solidly for 6 or 7 years now - I can't comment on the women but I'm not convinced it's had an impact on the men, we're not seeing a load more players come through into pro football which to me is the only way we'll ever improve the All Whites.    

Valid question re the Futsal Whites.

All players pay fees to NZF for each season they play - so in some ways they get hit four times if they play just once a week year round.

National League players have largely had to pay their own way with only limited funding, but it varies from fed to fed. Many had to pay over $1000 for three weekends of competition last summer.

They are also well utilised as a promotional vehicle for grassroots festival - this year's Futsal Whites Road Show has meant thousands have participated and watched futsal, many for the first time. Two birds with one stone that one.

 

I think they're pushing Futsal so much so more will take it up in addition to football and improve their technical skills and touch. Don't mind it so much, but it is a good point to raise. 

I know it's administered by FIFA but it's always felt like a different sport to me.

I think this is should be the focus of development pathways for kids (off topic sorry) Futsal requires a completely different skill sit in terms of touch and time on the ball. If they start their skill development there and progress into the field game, I think we may see better technical footballers. I don't like futsal but I have been involved in a couple of workshops whereby it's been shown the difference in skill development of kids overseas that start playing futsal then progress to football.

I respect his may well be laughed at but I do believe there is some merit in it.

no JV, futsal can help some players , particularly those who have limited experience "on the ball". 

certainy having futsal alongside whatever football program for ages 5-8 would be an interesting thing to do. 

This might just be the most sensible thread i've ever read here.

Thanks.

Totally agree with this.

One word to describe this policy - disgusting. 

Two words on how to fix it - civil disobedience

Love it

What effect could futsal have beyond the age of 8 years old?

Good question. I don't know to be honest with you. The workshops I went to talked about using it up to the age of 10. I think it's more about developing a players time on the ball because you get less in futsal and also their technical skill i.e because you have less time, you have to have a better first touch.

I found it helped me a lot even as I was older. Confidence at holding the ball up, close touches etc. so can only imagine what it'd do to help skills in kids. 

I'm a believer. But obviously it should be a supplement to football training and games. 

Futsal is a great game. But is waaaay off topic here.

Futsal is a great game... there's a thread around somewhere.

However of relevance is the money being spent on NZ Futsal Whites roadshow if NZF has "budgeting issues". Interestingly Mainland Fed have recently cancelled Chch leg of the roadshow due to some sort of miscommunication around budget. Is it feds or NZF paying for the roadshow?

Until Fred provides more detail on the pay-to-represent decision than his "$2k isn't a big deal" sort of statement provided, every NZF decision is going to be subject to this sort of query.

Isn't futsal all the kids play in Spain until they are about 10, don't think the even touch a football in an organised environment before then. 

I agree with your last line. I do wonder if we are more likely to scrutinise it here cause we are a football forum than joe public would.

"yeah definitely" ;)

That's a given, isn't it JV? If nothing more is forthcoming questions will be asked - here and then more widely until further info is provided.

And so they should be. I'm waiting for the media furore if we miss WC 2014 asking about the financial plight of our game.... 

For those who feel passionately about this (and I suspect there are many on here), then the only way to fix this is through civil disobedience. That involves each player selected for their country in this tournament refusing to pay their fee, every hack here refusing to pay their sub. That is the only way that Fred will get the message and not implement this mercenary policy in the future.

But what does it actually achieve? I get what you are saying but if there is no cash coming, competitions can't be run. Everyone misses out.

And NZF still to state if this is now policy and reasons behind it. Can't properly judge until then.

and why is the U-17 the demarcation line? 

or is all the user pays stuff being rejected

Umm, yeah, I suspect that isn't actually true.

Also, I think you are waaaay over-estimating the number of sub-paying players and parents who actually give a toss about this (if they are even aware of it) especially when one of the other options is for everyone's subs to go up. The only people who really care about this are the 50-odd people per season directly affected by it (assuming the policy is extended to all age-grade rep teams) and then football nerds like us.

None of which makes it's right, although I'd like some more info before deciding whether it's "right" or not anyway.

Agree TX, so the ball is at Fred's feet to play...

Yeah. I suspect we are not going to hear squat from Fred on this. Its one of those pen stroke decisions and its done without discussion.

Could be right JV. I asked on the Womens thread if the same call had been made for 2104 Womens U17 World Cup in Costa Rica.

Fred's returned my call and said he's happy to talk. I'm hoping to speak to him this afternoon ahead of podcast tonight. If not, it'll be next week.