Vs Mexico 1st Leg Thurs 14th 9:30am SS2

I just two tix in the white noise!

*got

Obviously all we did was bash the ball forward. That's not trying to play football.

If you're not prepared to try and create some sort of passing game you will get wins against the Solomons and Tahiti perhaps but

you'll never have a chance on the bigger stages.

Of course Ricki wouldn't have told them "to smash it up front asap," but we're talking about fully paid professionals here.

Surely one can expect a wee bit more than that.

I guess sitting so deep doesn't help when attacking either...

Harry Kwell played for Australia at 17 ... I think Duke did as well... Rogic at 18 or 19 I think... Matthew Ryan at 20 .... hand on heart not the other thing Roux is a great player better than Pedj  and is used to working with weeMac down the right hand side like 8 months training trials and four A-League matches .... 

Sorry about the score ... old story re-visited and discussed a lot in the posts is the style and technical shape and to that end who do you choose to play that way ... 

There is a difference between having a go and loosing and winning by playing ugly ... I have often expressed the belief over time having a go and loosing is better than winning playing ugly [most on this site disagree I acknowledge] .. however playing ugly and loosing is the worst outcome nay playing ugly and losing badly is the worst.... my gut feel is Ricki and Lawrie McKinna are similar coaches with similar ability playing a similar style... the Mariners let Lawrie go after Hal 5 ... 

I also acknowledge Australia's last two coaches have been the play ugly ... and  the ratings and respect for the Socceroos have gone down ... 

Who / how / when ... I have no idea someone needs to take hold of game and stamp their authority on shape / technical issues / and developing youth ... 

Can i just say we played a far better Mexican team in 2010 with a far weaker team than now and didnt play negatively and lost 2-0.

Tactics were v v wrong and Mexico quietly went about their biz with no pressure

a friendly dude. context. 

I think venting about the poor buildup is reasonable. Can't do anything about the altitude, and playing against better teams is something we should aspire to do, but the NZF have performed poorly re the national team during the last WC cycle.

Depth and pathways for younger talent are key for next cycle..and a coach who wants to play football

1: Ricki didn't tell them to play that way as you suggest

2: The players are professional footballers as you suggest

3: Everyone would like to see them play a certain way, but they did not as you suggest

If the coach didn't say to play that way, and it's recognised they are pro footballers who did not play probably how they should, then surely that if these are the best we have, then it's a fair stretch to say that we were just not good enough and they were better than us? With that in mind, and these are our best, then how does NZF saying "Start to play more offensively minded football, string some passes together and don't just defend for 90 mins." change anything.

The problem is the quality of player we produce and all the best intentions and game plans and tactics in the world will not make two shits of a difference if the players are not good enough to play that way.

Now if you had said "NZF have to put better systems in place to produce a better quality of footballer so we have the ability to play better football" well then you would be onto something

today really cut me up, need to clean the wounds with whiskey

Was in Mexico City earlier in the year. Am a fit , healthy late 30s guy. Out of puff just walking up stairs, dizzy, nose bled when I blew it. Unless you have been there it's hard to appreciate how hard even moderate exercise is at that altitude.  Mexico are strong at home for reason., and it's not because they are such a brilliant football team. Not providing an excuse, just some context.

Geez blattersballs ive been at altitude many times. Never had that. Effects everyone differently. Seen big guys cope easily too

5-1-  was the weapon of altitude dizzyness ,   and some sloppiness may be related to the altitude factor... Vicellich looked like breathless for the last 25 minutes,  my  Boca team like 10 years ago, we   lost 4-1 vs America at Azteca but had won 3-0 in the 1st leg of copa libertadores

I'm guilty of it myself but sometimes we forget that New Zealanders can actually pass a ball when they're given a chance to.

I just really felt like this team felt restrained from doing that. I don't know how true that is; but that is the feeling I got and it was proved (to me) when we knocked it around well after we had nothing to lose anymore. Whether that was player nerves or just Ricki's instructions, who knows.

Watching Hi-lights Was Moss the only player to play at his full ability.  

ahahahahahaha stuff front page

Yes, well it clearly effects everyone differently. My point is that the Mexicans have a  physiological advantage. Whether our guys reacted like me to it, or to a lesser degree, at that level of sport small percentages make a huge difference. 

Written by Ryan Nelsens mouthpiece aka Tony Smith

I agree. It wasn't that we didn't have the players to make a game of it, we have a stubborn coach who plays favourites, even if they're simply not up to it. There is no way Lochhead, Bertos and Christie should have been out there trying to play a defensive game. Vicelich was only worth 45 minutes at that altitude at his age. Had Roux, Tuiloma and James been on from the outset then Sigmund and Vicelich could come on for the last 30 minutes to hold the line and we may have only conceded two or three goals. James proved we could play the ball in midfield, try to keep possession and push up. I would have liked to see Clapham come on in midfield for 30 minutes too. We had to attack them, albeit not recklessly, to relieve pressure on the defence. Two away goals would have kept us in it.

By the way I thought Moss was excellent. A ball watching defence left him badly exposed at times and he pulled off four or five great saves. It could easily have been seven or eight for Mexico.

Next game.

I can't believe you're serious Tegal! We were slaughtered, badly. At 4-0 it was tie over. Christie didn't backfire a bit, he was shocking. The game plan never worked, you could see we were going to ship a bucketful from the outset. Only Moss kept it to five. Seven or eight would not have been unfair to Mexico and plodder should have had a handball penalty given against him. They relaxed in the final 30 minutes because they could.

I think you mean Lochead here.

Was not even close to handball but never let facts get in the way of scapegoating

Looked damn close to me. And to the commentators. Isn't that why it was replayed?

Yeah funniest thing the pub had seen ...huge laughs

Including this piece of absolute lollery:

"Get a task force together of New Zealand football's best brains - men like Steve Sumner, John Adshead, Kevin Fallon and Phoenix coach Ernie Merrick."

So- get the 1981 team back and ask Ernie Merrick to be involved, even though he has sod all to do with NZ Football? Automatic credbility fail.

and this BS

"But today's game set back New Zealand football by a decade or more"

Yeah ok, remove "a bit" from that sentence! Fair call haha. 

Beyond clumsy - almost balletic. That's what fooled the ref.