Thought this would be an interesting topic and i think peoples opinions may differ. Could be a good debate.
Who are the worst officials you've seen in the ABS or the old National League?
1. Jamie Cross - all time shocker
2. Neil Fox - nickname 'cards'
3. Peter O'Leary - ''im the man/i love waitakere''
4. Derek Rugg - saw everything from 60 yards away
5. Chris Kerr - 'mr fitness'
Anyone else want to throw some names in?
Could even mention who has been the best on display?
Hester?
Thoughts?
Greyhound2011-11-21 19:29:18
Who are the worst officials you've seen in the ABS or the old National League?
1. Jamie Cross - all time shocker
2. Neil Fox - nickname 'cards'
3. Peter O'Leary - ''im the man/i love waitakere''
4. Derek Rugg - saw everything from 60 yards away
5. Chris Kerr - 'mr fitness'
Anyone else want to throw some names in?
Could even mention who has been the best on display?
Hester?
Thoughts?
Greyhound2011-11-21 19:29:18
Permalink
Permalink
Mirko deserves to be on the list...
Permalink
Permalink
You just happen to pick the most recent ones as well. Nothing historical?
There is a sense of irony that you ECFC guys are whinging about the referees when
a: you probably have the best record in the Premiership in the last 8 years
b: greyhound you were adamant that NZF wants you guys to be the best team in NZ so why would they have the referees conspire against you.
c: the names you mention all referee international football. Must be real donkeys especially when one of them has been to several age group world cups, your cherished CWC more times than you guys (looking at Ruanes page) and the big show in 2010....
If you have come up with names like David Lawrie, Alan 'Freddie Mercury' Martin, John Price, Danny McManus and Antony Riley, you might have had a point. Those 5 alone were f**king diabolical.
The best two by far have been Peter O'Leary and Kevin Stoltenkamp in recent times. John Cameron was by far the best. He actually was clever in what he did.
Stick to whinging in your other thread
Jeff Vader2011-11-21 22:16:45
There is a sense of irony that you ECFC guys are whinging about the referees when
a: you probably have the best record in the Premiership in the last 8 years
b: greyhound you were adamant that NZF wants you guys to be the best team in NZ so why would they have the referees conspire against you.
c: the names you mention all referee international football. Must be real donkeys especially when one of them has been to several age group world cups, your cherished CWC more times than you guys (looking at Ruanes page) and the big show in 2010....
If you have come up with names like David Lawrie, Alan 'Freddie Mercury' Martin, John Price, Danny McManus and Antony Riley, you might have had a point. Those 5 alone were f**king diabolical.
The best two by far have been Peter O'Leary and Kevin Stoltenkamp in recent times. John Cameron was by far the best. He actually was clever in what he did.
Stick to whinging in your other thread
Jeff Vader2011-11-21 22:16:45
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
Jeff what is your problem? i am not whinging i just thought it would be an interesting topic. You have serious anger issues.
Agree Stoltenkamp by far the best. Not sure where he has got to.
Jeff you are either a referee or on the blob.
Agree Stoltenkamp by far the best. Not sure where he has got to.
Jeff you are either a referee or on the blob.
Permalink
Permalink
Ruggie and Fox are hardly recent Jeff. O'Leary has reffed some excellent A-League games this season. He's a good ref in the right circumstances.
Permalink
Permalink
Right and so since you raised the topic, that must make you a ref too huh? Trying to stab all your mates in the back are you?
Unlke your clueless opinion, I just happen to know a little about football and I've seen more than a few games at more than a few grounds.
Unlke your clueless opinion, I just happen to know a little about football and I've seen more than a few games at more than a few grounds.
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
Ruggie and Fox are hardly recent Jeff. O'Leary has reffed some excellent A-League games this season. He's a good ref in the right circumstances.
I'll concede drugg but Fox has been there recently. Haven't seen him in about a year though but that would still qualify as recent.
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
Jeff Jeff Jeff....relax.
Can you have any discussion in life without getting angry or upset?! Try smile for once..you'l feel better.
Can you have any discussion in life without getting angry or upset?! Try smile for once..you'l feel better.
Permalink
Permalink
Derek Rugg was so poor at times it was comical....to be fair at least he would admit to his mistakes at the bar.
Jamie Cross....i dont think needs explaining....takes longer than Kerr to write a players name into a book just to get extended breather!!
Their use to be a character not long ago from Dunedin that wasnt too bad a referee but his name escapes me at the moment..
Jamie Cross....i dont think needs explaining....takes longer than Kerr to write a players name into a book just to get extended breather!!
Their use to be a character not long ago from Dunedin that wasnt too bad a referee but his name escapes me at the moment..
Permalink
Permalink
That would be Freddie Mercury. I sat in front of the 248 crew in year 2 when Dan Keat was playing for TW. The funniest 90 mins I have actually heard from fans because they kept telling the TW players to give to the ginger kid (Keat was on fire that year) and signing 'We Will Rock You' to the referee.
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
Jeff Jeff Jeff....relax.
Can you have any discussion in life without getting angry or upset?! Try smile for once..you'l feel better.
Can you have any discussion in life without getting angry or upset?! Try smile for once..you'l feel better.
Because whenever I try to have a discussion with any of your lads, you either choose not to reply or turn it back into a slagging match so to be fair, I'm not exactly enamoured with the knitting crew right now.
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
I remember Rick yelling at G Little to let the ginger kid play. That was quality.
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
Freddie was also the referee in the tackle when Shane Pascoe got his career destroyed playing for City. Shane is a quality lad and thats one player whose career got ended early because of a poor tackle that Freddie missed.
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
Sorry Jeff,even I have to call for the chill pill here 
Allegedly
Permalink
Permalink
Wow Jeff, I have been reading these forums for some time having a good laugh. And even though I have been agreeing with a few of your points and not really with the Auckland lad, give it a rest and shut the *&^% up. You go on like a nagging wife that won't give it a rest. Change the record. So what if the man brings up referees. You honestly must have no life. Wish I knew who you were in the football community, would probably say a lot!
Permalink
Permalink
I get abused for editing posts by Greyhound so I ended up with 4 posts as things came to mind, all on football and I still get sh*t.
f**k you all.
f**k you all.
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
I'd have to go with the asian / german lad (Mirko?) as the worst of the lot. I have witnessed games where he has been a genuine laughing stock.
In my opinion the best referees are the ones that can relate to the players and talk to them on their level. Hester springs to mind - ex military / navy so can't mess with him but a nice guy off the pitch. Great balance.
Some of the others mentioned seem to have 'chips on their shoulders' whilst refereeing. Not sure where it stems from - although bullied at school would explain a lot.
Fitness is clearly a big problem for some. Weird as I assume there are fitness tests?
Jeff - calm down mate. It can't be healthy for you to be this wound up for about 18 hours of each day. Try getting outside for some fresh air once in a while. It could do you a world of good...
In my opinion the best referees are the ones that can relate to the players and talk to them on their level. Hester springs to mind - ex military / navy so can't mess with him but a nice guy off the pitch. Great balance.
Some of the others mentioned seem to have 'chips on their shoulders' whilst refereeing. Not sure where it stems from - although bullied at school would explain a lot.
Fitness is clearly a big problem for some. Weird as I assume there are fitness tests?
Jeff - calm down mate. It can't be healthy for you to be this wound up for about 18 hours of each day. Try getting outside for some fresh air once in a while. It could do you a world of good...
Permalink
Permalink
I'd have to go with the asian / german lad (Mirko?) as the worst of the lot. I have witnessed games where he has been a genuine laughing stock.
In my opinion the best referees are the ones that can relate to the players and talk to them on their level. Hester springs to mind - ex military / navy so can't mess with him but a nice guy off the pitch. Great balance.
Some of the others mentioned seem to have 'chips on their shoulders' whilst refereeing. Not sure where it stems from - although bullied at school would explain a lot.
Fitness is clearly a big problem for some. Weird as I assume there are fitness tests?
Jeff - calm down mate. It can't be healthy for you to be this wound up for about 18 hours of each day. Try getting outside for some fresh air once in a while. It could do you a world of good...
Fitness tests? what get to the other end of the field without stopping?!!!...
In my opinion the best referees are the ones that can relate to the players and talk to them on their level. Hester springs to mind - ex military / navy so can't mess with him but a nice guy off the pitch. Great balance.
Some of the others mentioned seem to have 'chips on their shoulders' whilst refereeing. Not sure where it stems from - although bullied at school would explain a lot.
Fitness is clearly a big problem for some. Weird as I assume there are fitness tests?
Jeff - calm down mate. It can't be healthy for you to be this wound up for about 18 hours of each day. Try getting outside for some fresh air once in a while. It could do you a world of good...
Some of them have stopped booking players for kicking the ball away as it gives them a rest.
Yeh that Mirko is a card brander...loves a red or two.
Permalink
Permalink
Stoltenkamp best by a long way heard he was running or something instead now
havent seen O'Leary have a good game in NZ for a while now
just seems very arrogant to me on and off the pitch even when dealing with him aftermatch with teamcards etc
cant say ive seen any of the A-League games he's done.
Campbell Kirk-Waugh has been pretty good whenever ive seen him from memory
havent seen O'Leary have a good game in NZ for a while now
just seems very arrogant to me on and off the pitch even when dealing with him aftermatch with teamcards etc
cant say ive seen any of the A-League games he's done.
Campbell Kirk-Waugh has been pretty good whenever ive seen him from memory
Permalink
Permalink
No matter how bad O'Leary or any other referee is they will never surpass Jamie Cross in the all time worst award.
Kerr to be fair can be ok at times...if he can capture his 2nd wind and get out of first gear.
Cant believe Stoltenkamp has given it away...he was the only one that would let players tackles. Referees have destroyed the game over here. Stoltenkamp was a players favourite too one would imagine.
Kerr to be fair can be ok at times...if he can capture his 2nd wind and get out of first gear.
Cant believe Stoltenkamp has given it away...he was the only one that would let players tackles. Referees have destroyed the game over here. Stoltenkamp was a players favourite too one would imagine.
Permalink
Permalink
All-time worst Linesman award has to go to Jan Hintz i think his name is. The man is simply blind. Also not sure if he still quite understands the offside rule. Never keeps up with play, Absolute shocker. Infact to be fair to the guy hes not out in the middle anymore where he use to roam about and create confusion. Id give him a 4th official role and thats as far as id go.
Permalink
Permalink
I like Chris Kerr and Nick Waldron. I often find that even if I disagree with an individual decision, i tend to still respect their call because their percentages on getting it right are pretty good. i think they have a good feel for the game.
Remembering a ref has about 300 decisions to make during the course of a match.
As for Mirko, i have heard a lot of people with deep roots in the game bag him. But I have also seen him have some brilliant matches. when he is good, he is very good.
One of the referees i rate highly is Auckland's Mark Vincent. he seems to fly under the radar at top level, but he is real good value, in my opinion.
Mark Hester was named northern league referee of the year. Good on him, but personally i don't think he is above Vincent, Kerr, Waldron, Mike hester, O'leary, Mirko, or Stoltenkamp. But it's all in the eye of the beholder.
Mike Hester is a real fan of the game. You get the impression that if he wasn't in the middle, he would certainly be there on the sideline.
linesmen generally irritate me. Even when i am a neutral at matches, i am surprised at the number of times I am left thinking they have badly got wrong the few specialist duties they are there to perform. still, that could just be me. i ain't perfect either.
Permalink
Permalink
Bruce agree...Vincent outstanding most games...has player respect to i feel.
Dont agree with anything else you say though.
Mirko...rubbish..
Kerr and Waldron put each others shorts on and thats about it im afraid.
Stoltenkamp and Vincent are good for football in NZ...
Dont agree with anything else you say though.
Mirko...rubbish..
Kerr and Waldron put each others shorts on and thats about it im afraid.
Stoltenkamp and Vincent are good for football in NZ...
Permalink
Permalink
You seems to be quite all over this thread Greyhound. Its like you know all these guys personally...
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
I'm not a flag waver for refs or anything, but it is interesting how this topic sprung up as the worst referees thread, not the best referees thread.
It's good that most of the discussion has been balanced though.
Campbell Kirk-Waugh was outstanding when he was in Wellington. One of his first games here was for a team I was coaching and we had two sent off (last man, and second yellow) and I didn't have a word of complaint. He was superb.
Some of the best guys in Wellington would be better if they were fitter. They're great down the grades, but the pace of the game takes it out of them at the top level and they run out of puff and start making bad decisions.
It's a tough gig though.
I'm always reminded that people are quick to complain about referees' decisions, but also quick to complain if they don't get one. You can't have it both ways really.
Incredible stamina. No shame. Yellow Fever.
Permalink
Permalink
Thats probably quite true Smithy.
I see Greyhound you picked out the World Cup guy as the worst AR ever. He wouldn't have gone if he was crap. If I could nominate a different person, how bout the guy (I think he was from Palmerston North?) that called Ifill offiside in the last 5 mins of the game against Adelaide when he was quite clearly 10 yards onside (I kid you not). That guy is the worst ever. I can't find any footage of it but that would quite clearly be one of the worst decisions ever.
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
Selection for a world cup doesn't necessarily mean quality - either in the playing or refereeing stakes!
Incredible stamina. No shame. Yellow Fever.
Permalink
Permalink
Aren't you meant to be somewhere else?
Permalink
Permalink
I don't think I can agree with that Smithy totally.
I can see the process of how the teams/players get there because of quotas and representation from each confederation. NZ had 2 people there (O'Leary and Hester) from a backwater country. Amongst all the referees in the world there and all the leagues, we supplied 2 guys. Thats not quotas, thats something else. I'm not a fan of Hester but you have to wonder how that works. Its not politics either because OFC do not weild a big enough stick. Plus with all the decisions made at previous world cups, they are hardly going to take referees to it and exclude better ones. Thats just lunacy.
The only logical conclusion you can take is because there were more than good enough. I would be intrigued to find out why there was not more referees from Europe and South America there either. You would have to think that they would surely be the best with what they get exposed to.
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
You seems to be quite all over this thread Greyhound. Its like you know all these guys personally...
Jeff seriously you have issues ae...how and why do i know these guys personaly? all ive done is mention names and spoken about the individuals like everyone else. Youve had the same amount of opinions as me. Jeff you are a complete muppet.
If Jan Hinz is a world cup official...that shows us how bad refereeing and linesman standards are here in Oceania Federation.
Permalink
Permalink
I don't think I can agree with that Smithy totally.
I can see the process of how the teams/players get there because of quotas and representation from each confederation. NZ had 2 people there (O'Leary and Hester) from a backwater country. Amongst all the referees in the world there and all the leagues, we supplied 2 guys. Thats not quotas, thats something else. I'm not a fan of Hester but you have to wonder how that works. Its not politics either because OFC do not weild a big enough stick. Plus with all the decisions made at previous world cups, they are hardly going to take referees to it and exclude better ones. Thats just lunacy.
The only logical conclusion you can take is because there were more than good enough. I would be intrigued to find out why there was not more referees from Europe and South America there either. You would have to think that they would surely be the best with what they get exposed to.
Okay then, you keen riding that hobby horse until she dies.
Incredible stamina. No shame. Yellow Fever.
Permalink
Permalink
Houndie Houndie Houndie....relax.
Can you have any discussion in life without getting angry or upset?! Try smile for once..you'l feel better.
Can you have any discussion in life without getting angry or upset?! Try smile for once..you'l feel better.
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
I don't think I can agree with that Smithy totally.
I can see the process of how the teams/players get there because of quotas and representation from each confederation. NZ had 2 people there (O'Leary and Hester) from a backwater country. Amongst all the referees in the world there and all the leagues, we supplied 2 guys. Thats not quotas, thats something else. I'm not a fan of Hester but you have to wonder how that works. Its not politics either because OFC do not weild a big enough stick. Plus with all the decisions made at previous world cups, they are hardly going to take referees to it and exclude better ones. Thats just lunacy.
The only logical conclusion you can take is because there were more than good enough. I would be intrigued to find out why there was not more referees from Europe and South America there either. You would have to think that they would surely be the best with what they get exposed to.
Okay then, you keen riding that hobby horse until she dies.
When you look at the wikipedia site for the world cup, there are about 25 to 30 refs listed. 2 each from Uruguay, Mexico and NZ. Only 1 from Germany, Spain, Italy and England? Those leagues are powerhouse leagues on a world scale. How come those countries can't have 2 or 3 each going? It would be fair to say everyone knows who Howard Webb and his cohorts are because of the media exposure on the EPL and what they do each and every week in a pressure environment is front page and channel each weekend. Who would you take, the number 10 guy in England or the number 1 guy in NZ? I know England and FIFA aren't exactly cosy bed mates but there are other leagues, refs from the Champions League, AFC Championship. Refereeing O League, it looks like anyone can get a trot if you can carry a whistle.
Its quite easy to point out how many times refs f**k up as has been mentioned in this thread but surely thats the last thing Sepp wants at the big dance more so than they did. So why would you take two amatuer Kiwis from the bush league? Surely not to date the ugly sister that no one else will dance with. We are a poor confederation in comparison to the others so its not like we could bribe other ones to let ours go, chances are high that our two would be highly unknown to most of countries due to the lack of media exposure (well raised in the bitch fight thread). They had to have gone through some sort of process, (obviously age group WCs come to mind, CWC etc) because you just don't jump on the next plane, get off in Jo'burg and give a Kiwi 'I'm here lads'
They had to have been good enough to have gone or else why would you take them. I just can't understand what other conclusions there could be Smithy. Unless someone in OFC has embarrassing photos of Sepp, I'm riding this crocked horse all the way unless you want to buy me a different pony that rides a little differently Smithy 
Jeff Vader2011-11-25 14:39:55 Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
I get abused for editing posts by Greyhound so I ended up with 4 posts as things came to mind, all on football and I still get sh*t.
f**k you all.
See a shrink Jeff..f**k you all.
Permalink
Permalink
You sound like you are wound up tighter than a ducks ass. Maybe go have a lie down, cup of tea perhaps...
Grumpy old bastard alert
Permalink
Permalink
Since JV likes to ride horses and greyhound wants to join in here is something for everyone:
There were these two horses standing at the bar. One said to the other "How ya doin?" ...other replied, "not so good...the other day I was in a race and there were so many GREAT horses and jockeys I figured 'screw it', I ain't runnin' this race and all of a sudden WHOOSH! UP MY ASS! and I won by a head."
The other horse said, "No kiddin' yesterday I was in a race and the same thing ...I figured 'screw it', I ain't runnin' and half way around the track...WHOOSH! UP MY ASS! and I won!"
This greyhound walks up to the two horses and says, "Scuse me but I couldn't help but overhear you guys. Just today I was in a race and there were so many great dogs I figured 'screw it' I ain't runnin' in this race. All of a sudden WHOOSH! UP MY ASS! and I won by a length!!"
One horse looked at the other and said, "WELL I'LL BE DAMNED, A TALKIN' DOG!!!"
"Phoenix till they lose"
Posting 97% bollox, 8% lies and 3.658% genuine opinion.
Genuine opinion: FTFFA
Permalink
Permalink
This isn't at all related but i did ARF!
GUIDO, THE ITALIAN LOVER
Hard News2011-11-25 15:10:20
A virile, middle-aged Italian gentleman named Guido was relaxing at
his favourite bar in Rome when he managed to attract a spectacular
young blonde woman. Things progressed to the point where he invited
her back to his apartment and, after some small talk, they retired to
his bedroom where he rattled her senseless. After a pleasant interlude
he asked with a smile, "So, you finish?"
She paused for a second, frowned, and replied, "No."
Surprised, Guido reached for her and the rattling resumed. This time
she thrashed about wildly and there were screams of passion.
The sex finally ended and, again, Guido smiled and asked, "You finish?"
Again, after a short pause, she returned his smile, cuddled closer to
him and softly said, "No."
Stunned , but damned if he was going to leave this woman unsatisfied,
Guido reached for the woman yet again. Using the last of his strength,
he barely managed it, but they ended together screaming, bucking,
clawing and ripping the bedsheets.
Exhausted, Guido fell onto his back, gasping. Barely able to turn his
head, he looked into her eyes, smiled proudly and asked again, "You
finish?"
Barely able to speak, the beautiful blonde whispered in his ear, "No,
I'm Swedish."
Permalink
Permalink
So your logic as I understand it Jeff is that FIFA have a good honest perview of all the referees in the world, and they select the best ones based solely on merit.
Smithy2011-11-25 16:01:47
I dunno about you, but for me that's a tough argument to swallow.
I don't actually know how the referees are selected for the World Cup. I suspect you haven't a clue either. But I'm willing to bet, based on the absence of a significant number of European referees that you have identified, that it has to do with something other than being purely the best at their trade.
Maybe it's the same logic that drives the participation of teams in the World Cup. Not the best teams in the world, not even close, but a good geographic spread.
That, to me, is much more likely than FIFA's all-seeing eye fairly and even handedly selecting only the best.
This is, after all, FIFA.
I don't mean any disrespect to Kiwi referees by this, incidentally, I think the Kiwis who've got to the world stage have done admirably.
Incredible stamina. No shame. Yellow Fever.
Permalink
Permalink