The WaiBOP United Thread

WaiBop squad... It maybe that  "Jake" is  Jake #15...

http://www.waibopunited.co.nz/players-2/

My write-up and photos from the Wanderers game...

http://in-the-back-of-the.net/2013/12/01/oh-good-grief/

I'm normally receptive to your arguments Buff but you have basically no context here.

Here's your mate from your club, who you haven't seen train with WaiBOP, going up against defenders who you haven't seen at WaiBOP, and commenting on goals conceded which you haven't seen. Tyler Lissette and Takahiro Yokota have been two of the standout players so far this season, but ok, your buddy from Birko who JV (a more unbiased observer in this regard), doesn't think would cut it, should be starting every game.

Just think he deserves a chance. Is that a crime?

No, and as I said - I think he would have got a chance this week, but somebody said he's buggered off - which I cannot confirm or deny, but if its true, well then it is his fault for not sticking around.

Is Takahiro the guy who played for Metro during the Winter Season?

I have only seen one game this season (against Auckland City) and I would consider myself quite neutural (I certinaly don't support Auckland City) and i thought that both Tyler Lissette and Takahiro were poor in that game - Tyler had a much better second half while Takahiro in my opinion had a shocker.  This is not to support Buffon's opinion but just to add my point of view on the centre back pairing at the moment.

Yes I believe so. Takahiro was superb against Canterbury, Tyler the man of the match against Hawke's Bay, obviouslymost defenders are going to struggle against Auckland but in those circumstances I thought it was more the defence as a unit who stood up with some superb play, until of course the circumstances in the last 10 minutes - I actually can't remember any recollections of indiviudal performances in that one.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times/sport/9458949/WaiBop-striker-sidelined-for-antics

Interesting as many people called this prior to him signing, we he wear the WaiBOP colours again?

From what I hear big George got a good run but was lazy and did nothing I no your a big fan N-Bomb whats you verdict, you said Mcnabb looked sharp but seems they went with manko over both of them. I couldn't make the game so just 1 question N-Bomb penalty yes or no?

I'm not really a big Slefandorfas fan, but I think he could be a pretty decent player for WaiBOP if he puts in 100% effort, he does score goals against lesser opponents and that's one thing WaiBOP needs, but if he doesn't have a high workrate then he's probably not worth starting. Still a to-be-determined coming off the injury.

As for the penalty, I'm keen to see a replay, but from my original position it looked a terrible decision, McNeil came to punch the ball, and clearly did so - it went flying away from the goal at an angle which couldn't have been Holthusen heading the ball. Both players then collided, and Holthusen got cut, but from McNeil's reaction (absolutely livid), it seems Holthusen collided with McNeil, rather than the other way round, and besides, goalies always seem to get the benefit of the doubt in those scenarios. So no, I don't think it was a pen, but I am keen to see a replay if I can get my hands on one.

I had heard a story recently that the referees on the league have to train 4 times a week and they get $70 a game but only if they referee. So if they only do 3 games across the summer season, that's a lot of output for nothing. Also heard that they are struggling to get officials at some places including guys that only just got their ticket this year. That's bloody disgraceful and feel a bit sorry for them. It sounds like NZF treat the refs like they treat everything else. I would be interested to find out what support mechanisms these guys get just to see if it really is shambolic or these guys are just crap.

Probably, but then the league seems like it gets what it deserves then if it's true.

I get really pissed off with constant criticism of referees and try to avoid it entirely. It's an issue over all sports, and maybe just because I live here, seems particularly bad. Didn't hear much about the ref in the All Blacks recent last second victory over Ireland but you can imagine the barrage of shit he would have got if it had been a last second Ireland win under the same circumstances... Anyway, I'm getting a bit OT here... BAN ME!!!!

Edited for shit spelling.

No I'm not aiming criticism at referees at all. What I am saying is that it seems like each week, the referee has a shocker and I guess that's relative to what side of the fence you sit on.

I am asking, are these guys actually treated as second class citizens by their own body like the competition is (forget the fans and teams for a moment) and thus, the game gets largely what the national body has invested in them (i.e. refs that are not prepared nor have investment to do a good job) or are they given every tool to succeed and then do not (i.e. poor performance) There is a difference. The 1st one, I feel sorry for them. The 2nd one, well....  There is a 3rd option as well which is clueless whinging fan (not directed at anyone). Everyone says they would hate being a ref but then whinge when they don't get one or get a shit one.

I know this is the wrong thread but N-Bomb raised it about Mirko so just fleshing it out a bit. Would be interesting to get a ref or someone in charge of refs and ask them or maybe a question for the podcast. A story on refs is sure to put everyone to sleep I know but put it this way, from what I have seen this year of the A League, a few of the refs on the ASBP would measure up easily. Stu Hogg took aim on Twitter with a massive broadside but watching the game on Sommet, there was nothing in it at all to suggest the refs were destroying the game.

Ok guys - here's the clip of the penalty.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8iuHJKwDsSg (real-time)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajLupypDJ2Y (slow-mo)

Also, Mirko is miles away from the action. 

What do you reckon?

Pen. Just.

Yeah defo pen.... And really the Waikato team should be beating the makeshift 20s anyway ..

Based on the rather rough footage I reckon it is a penalty.

Keeper made a bad decision to come for it, and was late to the play. While he may have got a hand to it after the header, whether you get the ball is irrelevant. For me, you reward players who get their body in the correct location first, and punish those that get there second.

For example, say I went up for a header, win it and header it into an opponent’s face who is also challenging for the same ball. Him, arriving late to location he needs to win the ball then bundles me over. That is a foul. Regardless of whether he got the ball by me heading into his face.

Contrary to previous reports (And I can't remember where I or others got it from) - Maksim Manko will continue to be available for WaiBOP, its a possibility he may leave but nothing confirmed as yet. Which is very helpful as he's been excellent in the first four games.

This is a good read on the penalty decision, and also is a good explanation of how, in these circumstances, journalism and accuracy can be hard: http://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times/sport/9479739/Looking-back-a-second-take.

EDIT: Oh, it's already on the forums. How bout I post the WaiBOP preview v Southern this weekend as well: http://asbpremiership.co.nz/index.php?id=2145.

Happy mediocre reading.

Last thing from me (Promise), here are the three WaiBOP goals if anyone wants to see them, the three Wanderers goals are on there too:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iX_bFgsuYUw (Number One)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rA2v9rR7JE (Number Two)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1bxD5IsAUog (Number Three)

Thanks N Bomb - awesome!!

How is the Scottish keeper going?

Has a huge boot on him. Easily clears 70m on the fly from hand or ground. He is quite short but from what I have seen (and he didn't have to do much) you can see the class with the little things he does. He comes out for the cross and just plucks it out of the air like 'what, did you actually think I was going to drop it?'

He would not look out of place in Braveheart. Has a face only a mother could love and a grill to match.

Agree largely with what JV has said, the only slight nitpick would be that on occasion he has let in the only shots on target, eg Canterbury and HB games, hard to say whether they were his fault or not though. Commands his box well for a short fella. 

WaiBOP made the right decision to go to Cambridge, some excellent hospitality and volunteers, and the pitch was much better today after a bit of rain. Just need to work on the changing rooms in the offseason perhaps, but if they can get that done it's a very nice ground.

Solid performance today, Reid Drake's goal probably the goal of the season so far, wonderful strike, Milos Nikolic is now leading the golden boot standings too, while the defence held up reasonably well - an awful penalty decision going against them, was right in front of me and there was nothing in it. I thought the ref had a good game overall but that one decision was poor.

Southern really are poor, they defended ok but just had no possession whatsoever, kept giving the ball away in midfield and WaiBOP eventually made them pay.

Here's Drake's goal - goal of the season so far? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZE7m9M-bC4&feature=youtu.be

And the others:

Milos' penalty: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFj6WdPsuiM

Milos' second: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F5sPHgvCpkI

Shaydon Young's towering header: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIv7VsSpw8k

Keeper too far off his line

Off to my sixth WaiBOP game this season, some favourable Auckland scheduling so far. Will be updating on ASBP website if anyone wants to follow the game.

^ Here's hoping you win and win well.

We shall see how much of an impact the loss of Cardozo and Coombes will have on Waitakere. At least it's not a sure-fire loss like last year.

I found some of the quotes here rather interesting too, a good preview: http://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times/sport/9515640/Skipper-Scott-set-to-meet-familiar-faces

Sigh. It's official. I'm the jinx of WaiBOP...

http://in-the-back-of-the.net/2013/12/14/waitak-v-waibop/

Cheers Enzo. I liked the look of the new Waibop too, when I saw them 1st game of the season. As you say, ultra-competetive and playing with confidence. Sounds like the Nix. Hopefully both will come good v soon, otherwise the danger of heads dropping and internal squabbling.

PS You haven't been attending Nix games too I suppose?

I haven't been to a Nix game this season yet so they can't blame me!! ;-) I'll defo be at the Auckland game though and I usually get to at least one per season at the Cake Tin as well. Don't know which one yet...

When it was 1-0 and even perhaps at 2-0, you could have made a case that WaiBOP were the better side and were unfortunate, but when the third goal went in it was a simple case of Waitakere being far more clinical despite not dominating possession, territory or chances.

I only recall McNeil making two saves, while WaiBOP had about ten miscued half-chances, one which went off the post, and they had about 15 crosses which were claimed by Robinson under pressure. Nikolic would have helped, but Waitakere defended well.

WaiBOP are starting to get a habit of defending well the whole game, then conceding on a guilt-edged chance, a bit all-or-nothing, they hold strong for large portions, then one mishap and bam, 1-0 down.

But as Enzo pointed out, much more competitive, it won't be like years past where they battle with Southern and Manawatu (now Wanderers) to avoid the spoon, it'll be more competing with the likes of Hawke's Bay, Canterbury and TW for a playoff spot. The result may end up being the same, but they are a much improved side.

As an aside, why do Waitakere keep charging 15 bucks for entry when they barely can crack 250 fans?