Waitak in DIA investigation

Waitak in DIA investigation

I hope they get stung badly and it serves a warning for everyone else (clubs and NZFC) to stop screwing about with pokie money.  

Dirty money being spent just as dirty.  Brilliant.

Some people better check the glass house they are standing in before they throw stones. You can bet if Waitakere get done, you can kiss goodbye the rest of the 'paid' players (Vicilich and Lee come to mind instantly)

Innuendo Frank? Yeah right.
Jeff Vader2009-11-22 22:00:56

I agree, and its not just Auckland City either, i'm sure there are plenty of clubs round the country shafting these regs, and the sooner its cleaned up the better.

Just re-read the article again. Rex comes across very vague which is not like him at all. Obviously didn't want to say anything on the spot unless he did fork over the truth.

"Yeah mate thats why Allan Pearce sticks around and Jezzer plays here rather than in Wellington close to the Phoenix. In fact I think Aaron Scott is the same"

Big can of worms there News. It'll hopefully be the leveler the game needs and possibly the funding might now go to the parent body to divest equally across the NZFC 'game' as opposed to the direct-to-club funding of players.

Isn't it time NZF started policing this themselves for the good of the game? Why don't all clubs have to submit annual accounts to there governing body as part of the governance role NZF and the Federations are supposed to be responsible for? Surely that's an integral part of growing the game, to ensure club's are financially (and legally) sustainable?

What are the books going to say though? "Fees for coaching programmes = $500,000"

Either way whether they open the books or not it'll all be a load of phony baloney.

Tell me how 1 team needs 2 million over 3 years to run? You don't need to open the books to answer that one. The ACFC people should be just a worried (and silent) as they got just as much from Trillion if not more.

so do people think football in NZ would be all the better if these clubs didnt receive these $? If so how exactly?

I didn't say it would be better off. Just don't bullsh*t about it or abuse other teams when you are doing the same. I also fail to see how going into Liam Mulrooneys pocket and thus down the toilet in the form of pints (note plural) is better for football. How much does the flat for Roy and Benji cost I wonder? If you are talking betterment of football, this certain is not it.

"Yeah we took the money and paid players so we could win" - that I could handle. Be upfront rather than bullsh*t everyone. Naturally the 'charities' wouldn't because its not for that measure.

Personally, I would rather it all go to NZF targeted for running the NZFC OR directly to the kids. The guy from Ranui-Swanson hits the nail on the head when he says (sic) 'What kids coaching programmes"

To the pockets of Lee, Vicilich et al or to the parent body/kids (via SPARC). That money is good for football but when going in the right place, could be so much better for football.

If you pooled all the money that went to players wages and put that into the running of the NZFC, imagine how much better it would be in terms of exposure (the oppoturnity to get in front of media and maybe pro contracts for players) a proper league structure and everything not done on a shoe string budget.

While not entire the point, college kids don't get paid but they have no problems sticking out 4 years in a college programme when its run correctly. Everything is catered for them, they just have to turn up.

the old 'if you pooled the money chestnut'. It wouldnt happen. The money would be going to kids table tennis or something. At least this way it helped us win a world cup by keeping Vicelich in the game and kept other players in the country so the Nix could have first grab at them.

 

Keep players in the country so the Nix have first grab.......

Bertos - returned from Perth
Brown - returned from Newcastle
Daniel - imported
Smeltz - returned from England
Moss - Knights
Paston - Knights
Durante - signed from Newcastle
Muscat - signed from NSW
Lockhead - returned from USA
Lia - signed from Melbourne
Ferrante - signed from Melbourne
Hearfeild - signed from Melbourne
Ifill - imported
Greenacre - imported
Mulligan - returned from England
Caceres - lifeline from Central Coast
Diego - signed from Adelaide
Crowther - signed from QPR

The only ones you've really got are Sigmund, Costa and Rojas..... (off the top of my head)

Explain to me how that works again? You have got a point Feverish and I wont lie its very valid but Vicelich is the wrong example for your argument. How is paying those players in the NZFC transpiring into Nix contracts? If anything, ditch the likes of Vicelich and pick the young ones in the NZFC squads and pay them so they can train all day and become better footballers at a younger age. Tom Spragg and Jack McVeigh-Hobbs getting paid to train all day makes them a hell of a footballer when they turn 21. I would say that Rojas would be the example I'm looking at. At 21, I would expect him to be a full international.

Lets not bullsh*t everyone though. The NZFC is not an amateur league by any stretch except in (and I'm guessing) Otago and Waikato and the players are paid by the pokie machine trusts. Put the money into the kids damn it.
Jeff Vader2009-11-23 22:37:11

yes Im aware were the current Phoenix players came from. I was talking about current NZFC players who may step up to the A-Lge (and without a crystal ball this is pretty hard to dispel). They might prefer to be a full time tennis coach, boy racer or p-dealer if it wasnt for the pocket money they got. Who knows?

Ok so the scum got audited, will any other clubs get audited in the near future and be under the same investigation? Because i imagine City use the same type of funding on players? ahhh

Greenie - yes fair point that we want this money to go to football not other sports.  But if Waitak finished as a club tomorrow for whatever reason what benefit is there from the nearly 2,3 million bucks they've received?  The simple fact is that gambling cash shouldn't be spent on paying players in an amateur league and should be used for the benefit of the sport as a whole.  Yes there have been some corollary benefits in keeping the standards of the league up and sending better prepared teams to the CWC but overall pretty average players are paid a lot of coin to play a 14 games league.  That is a waste of time and doesn't produce any kind of legacy for the game.

Jeff Vader - how can Liam Malroney be your example? Surely he would be one of the lowest paid senior players in the Auckland team when he was there and he now no longer plays?? jonesy92009-11-24 10:13:11

If most players are on win bonuses only then you do agree that you pay players with pokie money then yes? Every team has the same story, train 4 days a week and 1 day with travel. Its the commitment with playing in the league. Doesn't justify the ruse.

I agree with James Dean. Where is the betterment of football in NZ (leats leave the AWs out of this for a mo as thats a different story) by paying players from pokie funds at an NZFC level when we all agree that the competition is going backwards and there is no legacy left from it.
Jeff Vader2009-11-24 21:18:18

 I disagree with the concept of  'we all agree the competition is going backwards/no legacy' and it seems almost troll-esque to drop it in a forum. 

 

 

Coaches can get paid. No problem there.  Especially 11th grade Div 3. They are really important.

Agree Vim and fair call. Was a bit of an assumption there. I'm just picking up on the general vibe I read that most people want to see the current incarnation killed and revamped with another NZFC but better... er

 

I like the NZFC.  Even went to watch Wgton vs Auckland when up there.  (why did I do that again?) 

Yes it is but with the horse racing industry being nabbed and now they are looking at Waitakere, I think the end is possibly near for this kind of thing (especially in football) Do you think Frank and co at NZF would let this happen a 2nd time. Tui ad moment - Yeah right.

I too prefer the NZFC and for the very reasons listed above. I just don't want to see it go back to a club based system. Anyway thats another thread.

Vader ..."Under Alan Jones, Mulrooney was one of the higher paid players"

Probably not the best example since a US College scholarship is worth around $40-60k in tuition fees etc so hardly just sticking around for a correctly run program....

Why have a win bonus in an amateur league? That is very contrary to the amateur status of the league and jeopardises the kids that come back from college to play as previously stated. I can't go along with a 3 tier structure of a win bonus when all players turn up to training and do the gym and fitness work in their own time yeah? I think you'll find that NZF cover the match day travel via entry fee and other than Matt Williams (and Matt Friel last year) when did petrol money become relevant? The likes of Kris Carpenter (as an example) would train 4-5 times a week, has no petrol travel (of any note) trains in his own time and I'm sure has to double up with the youth squad as well. If you are trying to justify a 3 tier win bonus because hes not involved on match day.....
Its was a ruse then and is now. And no, I don't believe in geting paid extra when you win. As for the beer, stop taking the piss.

How many volunteers get paid? I could think of a few people that put in a truck load of time for nothing and never hear from them saying 'poor old me' What about the ball boys that turn up for a coke and a bag of chips and I've heard plenty of players abuse them for absolutely nothing. What do the referees get paid? The list goes on so I can't go along with the '4-5 days effort for free' Everyone puts their bit in and its rarely for anything, not even a thanks.

Its poker machine money. While its dirty to begin with, you apply for it under a 'good faith' reason to spend it where you say you will i.e. coaching programmes. Not on lining players pockets.

Jeff I think you're being a bit harsh.  WHile it is an amateur league I think there is definitely a reason for people to be paid win bonuses in the NZFC considering the commitment level.  I have some sympathy for that considering that there's a lot of travel involved, people are required to commit to a lot of training (admittedly over a short season) and for the AK sides there is a lot of overseas travel.

Are Waitak and Auckland City the two clubs being investigated by DIA? What about other clubs in other leagues and in cities outsdie Auckland? Surely these can't be the only two clubs mis-using the pokie money.

The only thing that has been officially announced is an investigation into Waitak based on a specific complaint (see article on front page or on stuff).  No other clubs are being investigated at this stage that I am aware of but I am guessing that if Waitak are found to be paying professional players (which is in effect what this investigation is asking) then other clubs may come under the spotlight - but only if that issue is relevant to them.