The Dominion Post

They really need to clean up this opinion piece bs. Papers are just using it to push agendas and publish tabloid material. 

If they get away with it based on that defence you just posted, they can get away with anything - it is very weak. 

I must be dumb because I've lived in Wellington for 20 years and had no idea a pitcture of the author meant it was an opinion piece. 

Also "many of these fans are pro-Herbert"

Lolz

Interesting about the difference between columnists and journalist writing opinion piece. Here is an opinion piece from a journalist that is clearly market as an opinion piece and sits under the football section of stuff. http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/9431794/Woodcock-Tale-of-two-World-Cups-for-Herbert. So what is the difference between that and the online version of Worthington's piece. http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/9428638/Ricki-Herbert-lost-respect-of-All-Whites-players

They also basically tried to call you an idiot, biased or both. 

Saying that only you complained so it can't have been wrong is stupid. To take a boring work analogy (if you haven't seen hunger games yet and plan to...maybe don't read on..) we have an issue where the sound is slightly off from the picture (not just at our cinema), but despite that we only had one person complain. Just because she was the only one to complain about it, doesn't mean she was wrong or didn't have something to complain about.

 For them to say that you'd expect 100s of complaints if it was wrong is desperate hyperbole and you think the press council would see right through that as they would know how many complaints they get normally. 

The press council is a crock, its actually run by a journo and they investigate their own, so imagine how unbiased they are.

Yeah that's basically how I imagine it. 

Also a crock how they get a 4 page response and 2B is limited to 150 words. 

This was my favourite bit. Probably the only part of the report that I agreed with.

I watched it in Lower Hutt and never noticed it, I'd walked in and out of the movie so many times at work and never noticed it, then the lady complained and I looked very closely and noticed it clear as day.  After that, it's all I notice when I walk in haha funny how the brain corrects things I suppose. 

Poor lady (and you) though, it must have driven her nuts. 

But clearly it wasn't a valid complaint, because she was the only one to complain. 

I was actually contemplating writing a complaint about those articles, mainly on principle 6 because of the mental illness dig, amongst other complaints, but effort. 

Would be interesting to get some Journos to comment on the reply - but probably a bit unfair to ask them.

Maybe they could do so to the opaque YF exec and have their comments posted anonymously.

Rather arrogant/condescending letter I thought. 

Several years ago i complained about an article and received a retraction in the paper. The newspaper appealed it and i got a phone call from their (press council) investigator. It was quite evident that he was attempting to discredit me rather than investigate my complaint and i told him so. I recognised what he was doing because i had a similar job where i used to do the same :) The result of me telling him that I had no faith in his ability to provide an unbiased investigative outcome was a letter saying my original apology had been rescinded and a retraction of the retraction appeared in the paper. A total whitewash. As an aside, all of those self investigating bodies are a load of shit, someone really needs to be banged to rights before you'd get a result in your favour.

Both. Will be part of my response.

Hello. I'm a semi-retired journo (with enough cynicism and scepticism that I could criticise for New Zealand, incidentally) and occasional poster here. 

I found the Dom-Post reply to be embarrasingly weak in the arguments it presented. Cringeworthy. Quite amusing to think a picture byline is equated with an opinion piece. (They should start running mug shots with their daily editorial really).

But at this point I should add that I had no issue with the original article. As a long-time fan I've historically argued journos should put their jaw on the line far more often with opinions, given the priveliged role they play in getting to all those parts we ordinary fans can't.

On the world's best papers, sportswriters are encouraged to develop a personal style, to be irascible, cranky, analyse, argue, and take readers beyond what they can see for their own eyes. (Check out your fav writers in Fleet St) So I would like to see far more analysis and opinion, not less.

But for the Dom Post to claim vindication, in part, based on the number of complaints is the equivalent of arguing a book is better because it has more chapters.

Sad really.

With an ongoing story like this there is always the right of reply, a follow, a second take. But that shouldn't prevent journalistic expression of opinion.

As a reader I'd be disappointed if they sent this bozo halfway round the world and he didn't have a few opinions.

Many years ago the football fanzine movement was formed (late 80s) largely because of the dearth of opinion and comment that could be found in mainstream media.

Budgie's back....http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/sport/budgie-on-the-ball/9509986/Taking-a-job-with-Yellow-Fever

Maybe I expect too much from journalists. I would imagine that their opinion should be informed and not so easily discredited with a follow up piece as Sam's article was.

And that's kinda it really. Sam basically proclaims the earth is flat. Those that are none the wiser will go 'ok, the earth is flat'.

I'm all for opinions but A: label it as such and B: sound like you have a clue. That article was not labelled opinion and as was shown a couple of days later, shown to be utterly clueless.

Sam would not get railed as much as he does if he showed he had some grasp of what he is writing about. Mark Reason was mentioned but Mark ALWAYS posts opinion pieces and more of the trolling nature so he does have a style and that's recognised to be full of it.

John Armstrong wrote a piece that, while not exactly earth shattering, at least showed for a first piece, he had a clue what he was talking about. Sam could do that too, if he wanted too of course 

nice article - what is greene going to get him to do? on his idea of paid membership it does have it's merits - for $10 a member we'd raise a lot more than just 30k over 3 years. We have 5k members? That's $50k a year, which is the salary of a player - think about it we could posnsor a player every year and make our presence felt even more.

He also ignores the fact that we do have a paid membership - the fevercard. 

fever card? when did we pay for that?

It costs $10

Just read Burgess blog - oh Budgie.  Don't fall while you climb down off that soap box...

Have we got any Budgie Cardboard Face Masks?

But ultimately, isn't up to the intelligent reader to decide what they belive and what they don't? Many here have criticised the paper for the quality of reporting, lack of sources, opportunity for response etc and have formed a view on the accuracy of the story. Times have changed from when the majority of people were less educated and not bought up to question authority and what was written. i feel confident enough to make my own decisions on what is presented to me and i'm not going to trouble myself about what the great unwashed might be conned into believing. They are just as likely to decide the truth or otherwise based on what kind of car the journo drives than any facts presented to them.

Don't agree with people being more educated these days and question authority more. You only have to look at protests against Nuclear weapons, the Vietnam war and the 1981 tour to see that people could challenge and protest in the past. I think education is much poorer these days and that's despite the internet. I was talking to a young guy the other day. I recommended a book on medieval warfare as I knew he liked the subject. He said "I don't read books I look at the internet" and was proud of it. What person could be proud of not reading books? This guy has a degree. In times past getting a degree was seen as a very challenging, (unless you could buy it). These days any muppet can get one.

If anything people are less challenging and more accepting of the rubbish served up by the media as truth that's not only "the great unwashed".