Beneficiary bashing

Beneficiary bashing

Here we go again. Beneficiary bashing. The last refuge of a desperate government...  

Well, you know if they just got a haircut and stopped beating their kids...

Your options a more than a little one sided, hence your poll is invalid. This is not beneficiary bashing by the government it's forcing people to take responsibility for themselves. Something we all should have been taught by our parents as children. There are far too many people in this country who live on welfare for bullsh*t reasons and excuses. It's time to end this vast waste of my hard earned money.

The fact that these miserable and miserly reform policies apparently enjoy wide public approval should be taken as a sign of how bitterly depressed New Zealand has become. We are being invited to turn on each other. If blame has to be levelled, it should be being directed at those politicians who are currently skiving off from their job of fostering an economic climate in which real work opportunities at decent pay actually exist. Because if you want to enforce responsibility on those at the bottom, maybe there should be a lot more responsibility being shouldered by those at the top.

Source:

Invalid? Of course it is! 

YES, it is 'beneficiary bashing'. There is a clear differnce between encouraging responsibility and 'beneficiary bashing'. This is clearly the latter.
Helping to buld better life skills is entirely with merit but be clear this governemnt are not truly going down that path.

You say "far too many". Based on what evidence?

When I met my partner she was living on the sickness benefit because she had mild eczema. This sort of nonsense is far too easy for people to get away with and you can't tell me that lazy people don't take advantage of this. If these losers wont take responsibility for themselves, then yes I'm more than happy for the powers that be to force it on them. Personally I'd rather have these people clearing drains and picking up rubbish for their money than sitting at home doing nothing. Why should I be allowed to quit my job today and have hard working people who pay their taxes to keep schools and hospitals open pay for my meaningless life?

The reforms are not overly dramatic and certainly not as dramatic as the left make out.

I think Duncan Garner sums it up best here http://www.3news.co.nz/Garner-In-defence-of-Bennetts-welfare-shakeup/tabid/1135/articleID/244787/Default.aspxotagofan2012-03-01 13:19:35

Well done on writing a whole paragraph that sounded intelligent but saying absolutely nothing in it.

The problem is the paragraph was rubbish. I'm sorry please explain how our country depends on welfare payments? The reason so many people sit on welfare is because it's become a career path under the over generous Labour government. Think of it this way, these people are running New Zealand as a business, there's no hiding that. When you run a business do you pay people to sit around and waste time or do you pay them to benefit your business? (This is also why unions in this country are a train wreck).

Thta's an interesting thought but can a country be run as a business? My thought is no.

Definetly not.

As a conservative I agree, but things have to be tightened up to stop the rorts that have been going on for years.

So anyone on a DPB is a loser?

And there is a 13 week standdown period if you've quit your job before you can get the dole.
2ndBest2012-03-01 19:40:18

on certain types of beneficiary are to be bashed.

In fact it's considered poor form to even mention who is for the main the recipient of the state's largesse.

Pensioners?

N.Z is going to be f**ked if the government doesn't sort out how to deal with them lot before the baby boomers sign up to the super gold club.

No savings - no way.Azevo2012-03-01 21:47:54

Read from the start of my post 2ndBest, I never mentioned the DPB, infact I'd pretty much narrowed it down to people who abuse the system. But to put that into perspective, I was raised by my mother on the DPB and she studied to become a teacher while I was still in primary school. I wasn't aware of the stand down period, I've never received a benefit. In a flip flop kind of way I'm all for better student allowances and interest free student loans as long as the individual is seen to be giving it their best shot and, again, not just abusing the system.

+ 1

It doesn't take much to run down to the doctors and get a medical certificate that says you can't work because you're getting headaches and claim the sickness benefit for the stand down period either. On top of that you'll get a community services card which provides you with free panadol on the tax payer too.

And is that the doctor's fault or the state's? I wouldn't want some bureaucrat in an office making medical decisions and over ruling doctors.

^This

I don't think anybody would want that, because people who are genuine would miss out because of those just trying to take advantage. I work 13/14 hours 11/12 day "weeks", if I decided I can't be buggered doing that any more and I'd rather just sit at home playing on my PS3 all day, I could do what I just described before and who would be paying for it? You would be. Is that fair? No it certainly is not. I know not all beneficiary cases are like this but it does stand that there needs to be change in legislation to try and prevent this from happening and make people who abuse the currently over generous system take responsibility for themselves and contribute financially like all good tax payers.

I think everybody knows somebody who has abused the sickness beneficiary (or other) system. Thats pretty bad.

A countdown opened in Manakau last year and they had over 1500 applications for around 300 jobs. When Woolworths in Te Awamutu switched to Countdown apparently over 400 people applied for jobs before any positions were even advertised. I agree there are bludgers out there, but is the time to crack down on it when there are so many people trying to get work?

How is it generous?

I certainly don't.

You are kidding right? I've said this twice already but I'll give it another crack. Currently I could do what I've described and I would not be held to account. Let me refer you to the case of Tania Wysocki who the Herald reported on a few weeks back. She is getting almost twice as much for the DPB, student allowance, accommodation suppliment and what ever other benefits she might be on as someone who works 40 hours a week at minimum wage. Yeah that's fair. I mean, for goodness sake I work (based on an average of 5.5 days a week) about 75 hours a week and she's getting almost as much as me! And I'm paying for this! So are you!

Beneficiary Bashing topic: 300 odd views. 15 votes.

There's your result.

The other way to think about it is that the minimum wage is pretty sh*t.

A lot of those benefits are available to people on the minimum wage too, so you are being a bit disingenuous when you say she is getting double the minimum wage.

And for the record, I'm happy to pay for a safety net for other. Like probably everyone else, I don't want to see people ripping off the system via benefit fraud, but I'm concerned that people see these isolated cases and extrapolate across all or most beneficiaries.

Yep.

However a few years back there was a bit of an effort to get families that spanned several generations on benefits into paid employment. That seemed like a good initiative - wonder how successful that was.

I'm happy to pay for a safety net too, just as long as it's for short term cover and not somebody's nonsense career choice, which is what the current government is trying to get across. It's not about taking money away from people who need it, it's about discouraging people from being lazy at the expense of honest people.

I agree minimum wage is ridiculous, but if you work out what I earn per hour (I'm on a salary of $47500) it's about $11.86. We live on a sole income with one child and get back $110 a week with working for families tax credit, yet if you looked at our lives from a wider angle we would be considered middle class. Jobs are out there and it's more than possible to earn a living wage, sometimes you just have to make sacrifices to do it. At the end of the day if you want to get a job and get out of poverty it's a decision you need to make and not expect that the tax payer pay for it. Tax credits are not benefits either, because I'm getting some of my tax back, not yours.

The evidence from the last 3-4 years certainly suggests otherwise.

You realise everyone pays tax right.