Central League

The stomp by Rossi is as about 38:44. What a Muppet.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3_deb9Y0XY&t=38m40s

What is the status of Wests players? Like they train full time yeah? But are they students who pay to go to Ole? Is Ole an educational institute? Just curious

Ole is a football academy - the kids all train 5 times a week, before and\or after school

Liam Hyslop's article here gives a good overview of Ole

Yep, Weenix certainly put out a younger side this week; 

Weenix line up v Team Taranaki: (turned or turning age this year depending when their birthday is)

K.smith 18

L Cacace 17

L Moore 17

S Phillip 17 or 18?

N Tipene 16

J Williams 17

T Byamana 16

O Whyte 17

S Sutton 16

B Waine 16

W Ebbinge 16

Subs

O van Hattum 15

O Smith 17

G Gray 18

T McFadyen 17 (unused)

Played like Arsenal: had about 70% possession, failed to score :(

Needed that bit of luck/experience in front of goal.

Here's my write up on Western Suburbs Central League win on Sunday

Ole players train full time and attend local schools (training is usually before school for the 1sts and 2nds). The players still in the academy program (Elijah Just, Owen Parker-Price, etc.) are paying, though there are scholarships, while former academy players now at US Universities (Noah Billingsley, Kyle Adams, etc.) have come back to play for Wests on their summer break rather than the US summer leagues.

any word on possible coaching movement in 2018

give them a chance - still 2 games to go in 2017!!!

Highlights: Western Suburbs v Palm North

fantastic game at DaveyF to end the season Olympic still can't beat Miramar

Great atmosphere, Olympic had a noisy group of fans along

Miramar won 4-3 despite being down to 10 from the half hour mark and going behind 3 times

a frantic game, with several yellows and 2 red cards Bredeveldt for Miramar for back chat and making an obscene jesture and Olympic's Gonzo Amado, in the last minute, pushed a Mar player to the ground and got a second yellow

now 15 games since Olympic last beat Miramar - that was way back in 2010

Other results

Stop Out beat Wests 2-1 and last I heard from Napier v Team Taranaki it was 2-2

Palmy Marist v Rapa is postponed until next weekend

Yes some game at Davey F..Miramar showed some real quality with their ASB players determining the result.. However Olympic were very young. Dark boy in midfield 17 years and red head at the back 18 years and the left back..I think he is a HIB player 16 years.. great future and gave as good as they got.

Didn't Wiremu play under Jacobs way back at Miramar? Both gentlemen showed great personal qualities from the side line.

Both reds were debatable.. Rowbury is getting a reputation of becoming to referee focused and it is affecting his reputation and also the quality and outcome of game he controls.

wouldn't say both were debatable (and I'll now go on to debate them both!)

first one was for the verbals and a gesture Bredeveldt made after the challenge from Blake Weston, I heard Rowbury tell the Mar bench that he couldn't ignore the gesture and had to issue a red. That one I thought he could have given a yellow and a final warning

Second one was down to stupidity \ frustration from Gonzalo Amado. Olympic had been awarded a free kick, it was the last minute and he was trying to get the ball and shoved the Miramar player. I've seen players sent off for that, but he was only given a yellow, but it was his second so he went

I actually thought Rowbury had a good game, he controlled it well, he let the players know why he made decisions. A weaker ref could have seen the game descend into a farce

I'm just here the referee reckons from Olympic fans.

Great game and Joel Stevens MOM for me. Rowbury loves the attention and any chance he has of dishing out a card, he takes it. For me he's way too familiar with the players, and comes across as arrogant. The Miramar red card could have been a yellow. Had their player stayed on the field, score would've been more I think. 

Was the gesture directed at player(s) or the match officials? Not clear from above.

The two best match up games of the CL season.

#MIRvOLY and #OLYvMIR - Fan passion at its best

if the gesture was to the croud/player and offensive, abusive or insulting, its a red under the laws. Silly player, hardly the refs blame

Yes, a great game to watch yesterday. As a passionate Olympic fan, I am bitterly disappointed with the result but have to congratulate Miramar on a well deserved win.

To be brutally honest to us Olympic supporters, I am grateful that Miramar still think of us a great rival, given the track record in the last 10+ years.

Playing with 10 vs 11 for almost 60 minutes and winning the 2nd half 3:1 is certainly something that should be admired.

My two cents on the game :

Miramar had 'a few too many' National league battle-hardened players especially in the attacking third (Jackson,Stevens,Molloy) against a young bunch of Olympic players (2 of the 4 in the back line were teenagers)...In the middle, Bevin was outstanding.

Olympic , on their part didn't have Coralles and Barcia (red cards last week) yesterday - clearly two of their key players...

The other 2 National League players in the Olympic squad (apart from Scott in the goal who was solid) : Blackburn and Palezevic were just nowhere near their best yesterday.

And to finish it off (don't want to disappoint at the end of the season) : Olympic being a man up was a totally new experiance for them...Usually (and frequently) it is the other way around. Yesterday, they had no clue what to do with that extra man on the pitch.

All the best boys and girls and look forward to more banter etc. the next season...

As team v team their are greater rivalries for both clubs.  Ie WDU  n NCR 

But the Club v Club of these two go back a long way at top level in Wgtn 

Thank you...The famous 'Kiwi hospitality' at its best :-)...

As a long time Miramar person exiled in Auckland for 25 years I find the rivalry with olympic interesting.

when I was growing up the rivalry with Seatoun was the focus - Fox Cup was highly prized and battles at Junior Level were just as intense.

Then  Seatoun faded and became irrelevant with Miramars acension to National League ,  and the rivalry with WDU became the focus. Most of us still have nightmares about the 7-0 in 1981 (although it did become a turning point in Miramar's history) , and a lot of the rivalry came out of the Wellington City history. I'm sure you could get a Miramar person and a WDU person and get two different versions of the Wellington City story.

Then as Wellington United faded , the rivalry became with Olympic. I'm not sure that anywhere else in the world would you find such a flexible derby rivalry.

Ask Bobby Minshull about the rivalry between Diamonds and the Mar', and then be prepared to sit awhile 

Here's my take on the game

and some photos

Great report , overall, but I do have a problem with your 'they only have themselves to blame'  (referring to Wellington Olympic) assessment. 14 red cards vs 2 red cards (on average, assuming what you say is correct and a result of some sort of calculation/research)  for other teams in CL.

14:2 = 7:1 = 800(or 700, whatever) % difference.

If all of that was on pure merit,  I would be the 1st one to say - get those crooks out of the league, out of NZ football, they don't deserve to be in the top division (one of)  of the 'least corrupt countries in the world' !  But, realistically : a number of you commenting here have been at the Wellington Olympic games and can you really say that Wellington Olympic games are pure Hell compared with the other CL games !?

20,30,50% more passionate, less politically correct, loud,... Ok, I will agree with that.. But, 800% (7-8 times worse)  , really people - lets use some common sense here.

And , now , I sense the hair splitting element of NZ society is about to kick in -' this is not the correct thread' etc.

NZ is a beautiful country,  the people in NZ are friendly, if the visitors are Anglo-Saxons,  but the rest of  us (Greeks and similar)  who NZ-ers treat like shark, have a completely different story to tell...

 

the figure of 15 is for Olympic CLUB as a whole for the season (not just Central League), I asked Capital Football who were only able to give me a breakdown per club, not per division (and the numbers are correct up until 18 Aug, Olympic has had at least 1 more since then)

The top 5 looked like this

Olympic 14

Miramar 10

Petone 7

Then Lower Hutt, Stokes Valley & Vic Uni with 4 each

The figure for Olympic is disproportionately high, and It shows what I believe is a lack of discipline within the club. Of the red cards I have seen Olympic receive this season, I don't think they can dispute any, and that along with other incidents such as players making alleged abusive statements, and one clashing with away fans (luckily the refs didn't see that one), I feel back's this up, hence my statement that Olympic only have themselves to blame.

When you go to Olympic games, you know that you are usually going to get a pretty decent game of football, a boisterous crowd, but there isn't any surprise if the ref has to get out a red card during the game and this shouldn't be the case. 

Mate,

You have either made the most epic honest mistake here (and me, having a soft heart want to believe that !) or you have tried to add some more nonsense to that kiwi anti-immigrant hysteria that is already in place.

Where is the mistake? Seems he did his research before commenting. The numbers don't lie, do they?

Just on this, I doubt JourneyFan (or anyone else for that matter) is making it an ethnic issue. No one here as far as I feel is saying they are getting the cards because they are Greek or saying they deserve it because of who they are. Instead they are saying they are getting the cards on their behaviour alone. 

You may be right...

It is clear he did some research...

He came  here to the "Central League' (remember : CENTRAL LEAGUE) topic and presented some numbers that suggested the red cards are about the Central League. I questioned that, and it turns out it is not about just  the Central League - it is the Olympic club he was talking about - ...in the Central league forum...And it seems my English is that bad that you clearly cannot read and understand what I say, but you are perfectly capable of understanding what that guy is thinking without even saying it...

This is what I wrote on my blog (and as it was a Central League game one of the ways I promoted it was via this forum)

"However with suspensions they really only have themselves to blame, they may try and point the finger at officials but when as a club (ie at all levels) they have received 14 red cards before this game when this seasons average in Wellington is two per club, they really do need to look at their internal discipline as it has cost them not only financially but also in the league, such as today's game where they were missing Luis Corrales and Mario Barcia due to them both having been sent off the week before."

I thought I was pretty clear that it was as a club, but as the blog was about a Central League game I can see how you mis-understood it

However it doesn't detract from the stat that Olympic as a club had received 14 red cards (now 15) which was much more than other clubs

I would expect Capital Football to be contacting Olympic and Miramar (as the two clubs with double figure red cards in the last season) and asking for an explanation as to why they had so many

And also just to be clear, this has absolutely nothing to do with the ethnic origins of Wellington Olympic, it is about an awful disciplinary record. If Miramar (whose record isn't much better) had been ahead on the number of red cards I would have said the same about them

Its a good write up I think.

If I did not know anything about the clubs mentioned, I would not take anything ethnic about it at all in the way it was written. I think there is a want to be "outraged" by some posters when their club is named.

I really shouldn't be replying to this - people reading this forum are starting to get sick of this Olympic thing with the refs (and me complaining about it all the time), but I just felt it is in order to write and apologise to you for me misreading about the red cards.

Yes, indeed -  I read your blog again and you did say it was at the club level. 

But, as you pointed out, the fact that it was posted in the CL topic on YF forum, blinded me somewhat (and those 2-3 glasses of wine probably didn't help either)  and adding to that my frustration over the last few months (which I sometimes vented on this forum) of the way the refs treated Wellington Olympic CL team - all that lead to the misunderstanding.

STILL though : 14:2 (on average, for other clubs)  red cards ratio cannot quite be explained by just the poor discipline/culture , call it whatever you want, at the Wellington Olympic club.

You seem to have a good source of info for many football related things and I would be interested to see the ranking of the CL clubs by the number of red cards received this (and , if possible, the last few seasons) season.

As someone who watches (almost) every Wellington Olympic CL game and who goes to their club rooms after every game , and who has been to every club room in Wellington, and quite a few around NZ, I am struggling to understand who/what creates that culture that you are referring to !?

Stu, the coach ? Don't think so...Nick, the president ? Definitely not... Players ? (only one ethnic Greek player in the starting 11 this season from what I could tell)...Doubt it, cannot spot anything obviously different about the Olympic Players vs players from other clubs in CL.

The supporters ?...hmm, yes - that could be the only reason if you ask me. Don't want to repeat what has been said many million times before on this forum and elsewhere, but Olympic supporters are a little different , little louder, little less politically correct, and all that...I can agree with that.

And this is my point - no matter what supporters do (unless they physically endanger players,refs etc.) should ever influence referee's decisions.  But, that is not the case with the CF referees. If the Olympic supporters feel that a refs's decision was a wrong one (and unfortunately, they often do that early in the game) , the refs will hear it ...And most of the refs in that case allow their ego to step in and a red card or penalty against Olympic or a disallowed goal (all of that happened this season) is just a matter of time. 

Don't know what the solution is - Anglo-Saxonise  the Greek supporters and make them as quiet as all other CL supporters, kick the Greeks out of the league, or train the refs to ref using the rules and not their egos....

Whatever the solution is - the refs treat Olympic differently, never in a totally obvious way (they are not that stupid), but certainly most of 50-50 calls go against Olympic , once the refs ego kicks in.

Anyhow, another long post  I didn't intend to write, but I just want a level-playing field for my club, Olympic, and I don't believe they are getting that.

maybe just stop kicking people and arguing and all will be happy in the world. That's the evaluation I came to after picking up nine yellows and a red in one season. Didn't blame the coach, supporters, or my cat.

Just so you know, they're called Laws, not rules. Im not quite clear what you are saying; that the refs punish olympic more severly for their infractions, or that they invent infractions? Either way, its massively disrespectful to a bunch of us who work hard to improve their skill levels, their foul recognition, and who care deeply about the game, or they wouldn't stand in the middle or side of the field in all weather, to be harassed by a bunch of supporters who probably think it can't be a foul if the player 'got the ball'. 

Supporters, players and coaches on average, have a good understanding of about 15% of the laws according to most research that i've seen. 

I don't have a dog in this fight, I have been reading this thread and something in this post made me think.

What if the supporters are actually inadvertantly winding up their own players and not the referee?

Must be hard for players on the pitch to stay blue headed when their fans are losing it at the referee, maybe that's a trigger?

I also don't have a dog in this fight, but here's some 2 cents...

I've spent a Federation season with a team that was by far the worst disciplined in the league. We'd get a red card every other game at best. Every now and then we'd implode and just have 3 players sent off in one hit. We actually didn't get many yellows. Just stupid reds usually from reacting to players or swearing at refs. The other teams knew it and would play for it.

The one thing that the whole club agreed on though: the refs hated us. Being on the outskirts of the city, the refs always had to travel extra far to ref us. We were outsiders. That was part of the reason we decided they hated our club and we generally built from that. Also a few people on the board had certain personality issues with the refs, etc etc.

At the end of the day, having played in the team and reflecting a few years later it had nothing to do with refs and everything to do with a shocking attitude. From the top down everyone blamed the ref. And when the board (through club room talk), the coaches (through the dressing room), and the supporters (through yelling stupid shark at refs) all believe it the players live to it as well. It gives them a reason for brain explosions that we as players were never held accountable for.

But yeah. I don't know Olympic from a bar of soap. I don't know who the board or coaches are. What I can tell you is that the chance there is actually a referee conspiracy is zero. Stop blaming everyone else. Look in the mirror. Learn some gamesmanship. Learn some composure. Get your head in the game.

/2cents

Laws it is - not rules, I stand corrected and accept that is the key point in this discussion :-)...Well, maybe not.

Do you really think that an average Olympic (or Western Suburbs, Birkenhead,Cash Tech etc. any club and place really) supporter doesn't appreciate the fact that you refs are investing a lot of your spare time to improve your skills, that refereeing at Wakefield 1 or 2 in the middle of winter is not for everyone, good on ya for doing that.  And the Olympic folks will show you their appreciation - but, after the game.

During the game though , they are not there to appreciate your sacrifice and massage your ego...They are there to support their club, want their club to win, they are not their to be objective - they are there to 'create the atmosphere', 'put the pressure' on visiting players, referees, yes ...The fact that you may have attended a ref course late the night before the game and that you are freezing (same as them) during the game is the last thing on their mind ! 

You clearly admitted in your post that you are influenced by the crowd. Correct  me if I am wrong, please.

Maybe that is something they need to teach you at those courses and not just the ru... er, I mean Laws of the game. How to not be influenced by the home crowd, especially as vocal one as Olympic's.

the last game I saw was Cap Prem ft Olympic. No Olympic let alone vocal Olympic supporters (Karori home game) yet they still seemed to rack up and completely deserve six yellows (I think) and two reds.Try again...

And when did I say that this thing against Olympic started on that Saturday when Oly 2nds played Karori  at the Karori park ?

We are talking about the problem that has existed for years (decades !?) , at all levels. Everyone is talking about the culture at the Oympic club. I am talking about the ref culture (against Olympic)  that exists at all levels (and has for some time now) in Welly, and that includes the game Oly reserves played against Karori. 

Don't try again.