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Phoenix Ownership - Rob says FTFFA (Part 2)

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Posted May 15, 2018 22:48 · last edited March 18, 2021 07:34

Bullion wrote:
coochiee wrote:
Maaaaaaatt wrote:
coochiee wrote:
AucklandPhoenix wrote:

So if Wellnix had been successful in flogging the club for 15 million, how much money does everyone think they would have made/lost bearing in mind other revenue streams?

Without looking at financial accounts for last 7 years, simply impossible to know. 

But if continually told need crowds of 10k to break even, but in truth averaging 5-6k, someone smart with numbers could have a stab.

My guess is still a loss.

Just did a back of the envelope based on the attendance figures for games at westpac on Ultimate A-league. I couldn't be arsed bringing in the travelling circus games.  

Assuming:
10k attendance is break even &

$15 is the average revenue per ticket

Welnix would have lost $3.2 million since September 2011, or $40k per game. Lifting the average ticket to $20 would bring the loss up to $4.3 million so the numbers are very rough.

Interesting back of the envelope stuff. Terry S apparently tipped in $1.5M a season, when paying the players but not the IRD.

Is that only losses from stadium hire? I don't assume that takes into account costs associated with academy, central league, handa youth and prem teams, and first team (which we are told is just about always above the cap in terms of $ spent), marketing and other staffing costs when the main source of income doesn't even cover the cost of our first team.

Impossible to say for certain without looking that the companys financial statements, but I think the "10k attendance is breakeven" applies to the business as a whole. 

I think Dome mentioned on the podcast that it was $50k just to open the gates at Eden Park, and he implied that that was higher than Westpac. Assuming the cost of Westpac hire is 50k, and average per ticket revenue of $15 attendance of just over 3.3k would be required to break even on the stadium hire. 

The remaining 6.7k tickets at $15 would bring in $100k which would be available to cover all the other costs. This would imply that the remaining costs to Welnix are about 1.3-1.4 million, plus whatever the other revenue (advertising, merch etc) they receive would cover. 

Please note however, that this analysis is based on pretty much zero real information and has a number of large assumptions that may or may not be accurate and there are a lot of moving parts which we don't know about (advertising revenue, spend over salary cap, other costs). 

David Dome if you read this feel free to set me straight. 

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Unknown editor edited March 18, 2021 07:34
Bullion wrote:
coochiee wrote:
Maaaaaaatt wrote:
coochiee wrote:
AucklandPhoenix wrote:

So if Wellnix had been successful in flogging the club for 15 million, how much money does everyone think they would have made/lost bearing in mind other revenue streams?

Without looking at financial accounts for last 7 years, simply impossible to know. 

But if continually told need crowds of 10k to break even, but in truth averaging 5-6k, someone smart with numbers could have a stab.

My guess is still a loss.

Just did a back of the envelope based on the attendance figures for games at westpac on Ultimate A-league. I couldn't be arsed bringing in the travelling circus games.  

Assuming:
10k attendance is break even &

$15 is the average revenue per ticket

Welnix would have lost $3.2 million since September 2011, or $40k per game. Lifting the average ticket to $20 would bring the loss up to $4.3 million so the numbers are very rough.

Interesting back of the envelope stuff. Terry S apparently tipped in $1.5M a season, when paying the players but not the IRD.

Is that only losses from stadium hire? I don't assume that takes into account costs associated with academy, central league, handa youth and prem teams, and first team (which we are told is just about always above the cap in terms of $ spent), marketing and other staffing costs when the main source of income doesn't even cover the cost of our first team.

Impossible to say for certain without looking that the companys financial statements, but I think the "10k attendance is breakeven" applies to the business as a whole. 

I think Dome mentioned on the podcast that it was $50k just to open the gates at Eden Park, and he implied that that was higher than Westpac. Assuming the cost of Westpac hire is 50k, and average per ticket revenue of $15 attendance of just over 3.3k would be required to break even on the stadium hire. 

The remaining 6.7k tickets at $15 would bring in $100k which would be available to cover all the other costs. This would imply that the remaining costs to Welnix are about 1.3-1.4 million, plus whatever the other revenue (advertising, merch etc) they receive would cover. 

Please note however, that this analysis is based on pretty much zero real information and has a number of large assumptions that may or may not be accurate and there are a lot of moving parts which we don't know about (advertising revenue, spend over salary cap, other costs). 

David Dome if you read this feel free to set me straight.