New Zealand Men's U-17s

Harry is LB, Harry and Ben both featured In qualifying, as did Jackson Manuel and Ryan Verney EDIT and Hayden Aish who missed out here.

Some strong competition for places.

what relevance does school football results? Do nix boys play for school teams? 

Most do – but in the case of the press release it's as much about ensuring no-one gets left out. Surprised they didn't chuck federations in there too.

Playing for school or club doesn't matter if you are playing well enough word will get back to those who need to know. I feel sorry for those that missed out but its all about game time and playing where ever and catching the eye good luck to those chosen it may be the last time they get chosen.

Damn autocorrect...I meant Mexico and Argentina ;)

Ecuador and Nigeria seemed logical as they are in Australia group and might be looking for similar opposition, while we would be looking for West African and South American.... suits both sides.

Argentina suitable mimic for Brazil, but Mexico, they have much similarities to Canada as we have to Solomon Islands. USA would have been better, but I guess it comes down to who agrees to play you, and USA have no need for playing us.

Declan not happy

The squad is pretty fair, apart from a few Aucklander's such as Aish, Milicich, and Verney who really should be there in place of Ingham (who will die at world cup given his size), Bark, and Naicker, the squad is fair really. And people saying its regionally bias etc don't understand that the majority of the nations best players at this age grade are at either the only professional club in this country's academy or the Ole academy which has been very successful over the years. You wouldn't expect a very promising young footballer in lets say for instance Australia who is in contention for their age group team to be successful playing football for a small desert team or whatever in the Northern Terriotory? They would most likely if they were any good be playing and schooling on a scholarship (which many of these nix boys are on) in a A League sides academy. Issue in NZ is that we only have really two major academies and one pro team, if we look at football playing numbers and proportion there is technically speaking quite a bit of competition here in comparison to Aussie or other nations with various professional clubs.

If we take away a possibly (as many says a questionable or bias) odd squad selection and if we stand back and erase our opinions or views on these players etc etc, and we look at the current set up as if we don't know anyone. I think everyone would be able to agree that having the director of NZ's only pro club academey as assistant coach of any national team is a clear cut conflict of interest. Paul Temple is a good guy and I have nothing against him, but given his role at nix he should not be in the role he is in with the 17s. Why? Because well he has input in the selection process and every coach want's to see their players be picked or go far etc so its influences his input into selections!   

What about when Ricki Herbert was coach of the All Whites as well as the Phoenix?

Thats proof of how behind and poor nzf are! In no other decent footballing country does this sort of thing occur!

Is this standard Declan Status update or a special one?

Surprised no one has set up a Declan Status page to simplify things

All this team does is reinforce the fact that currently if you want to make a NZ team, the best place to be is Wellington... it use to be Auckland, but with the NIX and OLE down there this has changed.

Whilst I want to trust the system, it just doesn't look right. Where is the coach from... if its Wellington it looks even worse.

Coach of Auckland City and the coach of the Phoenix Academy. Not passing comment on the decision influences related to that.

Just checked his twitter and wow he's really not! (in amongst climate scepticism and 9/11 truth-ism :S)

I don't know much about the relative results and teams, but were the ages similar between Wests and Lower Hutt, or did Wests have some more 17+ players?

Wests by the end of the season were as young as the Phoenix academy side but for a period through the middle of the season had some older players. 

Having said that based on the games I have seen from the respective sides I am surprised at the sides balance towards Phoenix players.

I thought Edge thought underage WCs were a waste of time. Or do I have that wrong.

Haven’t read his comments, but don’t see him likely to have any near future involvement with AWs/NZF even with Hay as coach.

You have a point. 

He was encouraging his players not to attend NZ U23 games. Now upset at NZ U17 selection.

I'm sure he has some valid reasons for his actions and comments. But his comments do seem a bit contradictory. As a high level coach maybe social media is not the best place to be airing views about the governing body.

You can't have your cake and eat it too. 

Congratulations to the players, they have parents who can afford $30k per year to send them to private academies where they receive better training. Money does not equate to talent.

Most parents could never consider this option so the boys from the provinces miss out again.

Doesn't the U17 tournament or NZSS results not count for anything.

Declan cant complain as it was his players who dislodged the Eastern Suburbs players in the summer.

Jose has done this before so why would you expect change.

It all Nepotism

If the Wests side continually outplayed/beat the Lower Hutt side as indicated in the message above, Declan has a right to be a little pissed, whether he thinks the tournaments are worthwhile or not.

More than how the two clubs did in the league (Wests won it, Lower Hutt came sixth. The biggest difference between their squads was Wests getting to call on a couple of American interns in their mid-20s while Lower Hutt's oldest player was 21) or how they did against each other (a win apiece, I believe), it's...

...about how the four Wests players in the squad and at least two others who are eligible were regular players in the Central League, but only four of the 10 Lower Hutt players were, with the others predominantly playing in Cap 1, two grades lower (five of those other six did play *some* Central League).

That all sounds pretty simplistic.

Not how the real world works though.

nothing is cut and dry... but generally speaking, when selecting players coaches tend to pick players playing at the higher levels, not lower levels.

I understand that this is not as marked in youth teams, but picking players from lower levels is risky as there is no evidence of being able to step up etc, just a coaches belief.

From the outside yes. It looks like the elite and rich kids that attend the big academies are getting the breaks.

We have a good example in our system how things can be done differently. A currently successful NZF youth football coach in Leon Birnie. He visits the regions hold's camps with the most promising young players. He has a presence at age group tournaments. and I assume now knows alot of the regional coaches and has a good idea on talent coming through. And his NZ teams contain players from all over the country.

I don't know if Jose went to the same extent as Leon when scouting for talent. And yes there is more to it than just scouting the best players but Leon has the results to prove what ever he is doing is working. 

I know the set-up of girls football in NZ is different to boys.   But then why is that. Why is it different. 

The academies as yet don't have as many girls as boys. That is changing.

Who knows in 10 years time, it could be very similar, ie majority of female national underage players, coming from likes of Weenix, Ole. 

Welnix setting up a W League team will accelerate that.

You're not even trying to fit in here, spouting all that thought out sensible stuff ;)

How Leon does it is exactly how all football is done - with credit to Leon who appears a bit more "hands on" - NETWORKS

~10k kids per sex per age group all playing similar times means even looking at 22 kids at a time even Santa would struggle to see all the good kids in person. That's why he has elves.

Clubs/schools/parents identify the young talent, send said talent to local reps/soccer schools/academies, who filter the best and send them to Feds, who filter them and put them in NAGT and forward to NTC/identification camps. Good coaches want their protégés to do well so pass them up the tree. Coaches all talk to each other. I doubt any coach has seen all, Leon included, but they all know about what's out there and look at the best. And they still keep an eye on those that don't move to the big academies. Half the last camp were not 'Academy Boys' but still in the mix.

I despair of armchair critics questioning why kids from NZSS tournament weren't 'looked at', or even NAGT. They were. But newsflash; there's 6 NZSS tournaments, each with 24 to 32 teams, all playing over the same 5 days. No, Jose didn't go to them all. Neither did Leon. And half the best players weren't at any of them. But somebody was looking.

To answer your question, main difference with girls, as Coochiee says, is the big academies don't yet have the same setups in place for girls. Girls have, however, in the recent past, been encouraged to move (to AK in particular) for better competition, training and opportunity - including some of Leon's protégés. 

Fully agree with everything you have said. And our NTC and NAGT systems are such an important part of youth player development. Especially in the regions where big academies are not an option.

And yes national coaches can't be everywhere at once. Get your point. Yes that is what networks are for.

Here is a wee article to highlight one that almost slipped through because she didn't move to Auckland. Note that she was not even on the radar but Leon spotted her at a NZSS tournament. Good on him for being there.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/nz-teams/108725725/amelia-abbott-played-against-boys-before-u17-womens-world-cup-debut

Don't get me wrong, i agree with your points. I'm just batting for those that live in the regions and can't for what ever reason send there kids away to Wellington to get the best training. And i am reassured to hear from you that those kids are still being looked at.

PS. I'm not just an armchair critic but am involved be it only at a regional and SS level.

Yep, system works. Not perfect but it works.

"armchair critic" wasn't aimed at you BTW

NZU17 side leave for Brazil (via Argentina) this weekend.

Auckland get a last chance before tournament to see them play in a friendly 2:30 Saturday Albany outer oval.

Who they playing?

Eastern Suburbs.

I am pretty sure Matt Garbett was born overseas and has spent all his NZ days in Wellington. 

Born England, has French duel citaccording to xfermkt, lived in Canterbury in early years According to Journey Fan joined Ole around 9 or 10

Journey Fan not often wrong but definitely is in this case. Definitely a Wellington Lad 

Cheers for that

I may be wrong on this but I understood he was born in the UK and was in Christchurch before he moved to Wellington to join Ole

Wouldn't normally give away my sources but in this case it was his Dad (or someone on twitter prentending to be his dad, which you'd have to ask why?) 

always happy to be corrected though.

Understand the u17s have match vs either Mexico or Argentina today or tomorrow, do we have any squad details for game?, any twitter feed?.

Watched u17s play Eastern Suburbs on weekend with Luca Taylor in goal for u17s playing second half and he made three or four fantastic saves to keep the score respectable with a 6 1 loss. Great to have two quality keepers in the side as they maybe busy against the South Americans!.

It's a World Cup warmup match, so I imagine we'll get a FT score and maybe the scorers and that's it.

The boys are training at the AFA Football Complex in Ezeiza.

The warmup games are vs Mexico (friday) and Argentina (sunday) this one at the Estadio Ciudad de Caseros (Estudiantes de Buenos Aires home ground) and yes, the team colours are white and black =)

The game will be open to the public sinse in order to get a ticket you must exchange it for canned food (for charity)

Mexico wins 2-0

Mexico won 2-0 in the 'behind closed doors' friendly

NZ thought they played very well and it was a cloer than 2-0 match. Was a fairly even match overall. NZ Created some decent chances and were reasonably strong at the back. Mexico finished their chances.

Not sure when the goals were scored.

Eugenio, who was at the Phoenix academy about 3 years ago was 'pretty class' for Mexico.

What was the starting 11, and who came off the bench?

If you can work out the faces

https://www.nzfootball.co.nz/newsarticle/83319