All Whites vs Peru | First leg | Sat 11 Nov | 4:15pm | RoF

Seems like some suggestion that Doyle wasn't picked for a reason other than form/fitness - such strange inconsistency from Hudson!

Colour me shocked.

Could be he is too slow at left back to combat the speedy Peru wingers based on his Confed Cup performance and the time he came on vs Japan, thought Colvey wasn't much better though. Small speedy wingbacks could be helpful as long as they don't get skinned as much as Dane did vs Mexico & Japan

Or he simply doesn't think he is as good as the other two options... if not for injuries Doyle wouldn't be starting for the NIX currently.

No there is a quote in the article in the Dom Post today specifically suggesting there is another reason ("that's between me and Tom" kind of stuff)

We all know Hudson will start Ingham, he has some real blindspots and seeing Ingham getting chewed up time after time after time against top players doesnt augur well for the Peru game.

Seems Hudson has some standards he simply won't bend on (fitness, attitude etc), but skill and actual footballing ability seem to be flexible.

While one goal in 49 appearances for the AW's is poor, I think that Brockie is useful as a squad player to come off the bench.

We have few other options and Brocks is currently one of the few well-performing NZ strikers in professional football internationally.

It should be noted that of Brockie's 49 international appearances at least 21 have been as a sub:

http://us.soccerway.com/players/jeremy-brockie/486...

The stats in the above link ignore his appearances before 2008 but of those seven games, only one was a start.

Brockie has rarely started against OFC nations.

Although his first cap came against Malysia in 2006, he had played only one game against an OFC nation before his second cap against an OFC nation on 4/6/12 in the Honiara horror OFC Nations Cup.

Brocks played in only one OFC qualifier for the 2010 World Cup.

His call-ups have been very patchy under both Herbert and Hudson.

Herbert gave Brockie only one cap between March 2007 and March 2009 and none between 20/6/09 and 24/5/10.

Brockie started only two of six OFC qualifiers for the 2014 World Cup in 2012-13.

He then played vs. Saudi, UAE and Trinidad in friendlies when NZ was in poor form and the side scored only one goal and started both the play-offs vs. Mexico.

But at least Brockie's goal-scoring record is better under Hudson: one goal in two starts and three sub appearances.

And of those five games under Hudson, only two were against OFC opposition (in June 2016 in World Cup qualifiers).

By comparison, prominent England international attacking players who scored few goals in internationals though scoring freely for their clubs:

Raheem Sterling (outside forward): 2 goals in 35 England appearances 

Emile Heskey (forward): 7 goals in 62 games

Peter Beardsley (forward): 9 goals in 59 games

John Barnes (outside left): 10 goals in 79 games

Glenn Hoddle (attacking midfielder): 8 goals in 53 games

Chris Waddle (outside forward): 6 goals in 62 games

I think that is overegging it a bit.  Hudson is probably right that we need to be at least at the same physical level as our opponents to compete so I do understand why he has a focus on fitness.  I'm not sure it is necessarily working though but there is some logic to it

Some players simply dont play/perform as well at international level when compared to their club form. The most obvious case I can think of is Sergio Aguero who fails to deliver in official games for Argentina

Paolo Guerrero most probable replacement has not exactly been scoring for fun at international level

Raul Ruidiaz has 3 goals in 24 games..and one of those goals was with his hand (vs Brazil in Copa America 2016). On the flipside he scores for fun in Mexico with 27 goals in 43 games.

Arohamai if this has been covered already, but out of the two squads who would make a combined XI? Anyone cleverer than me want to have a go?

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/nz-teams/98598678/tumultuous-tunisian-experience-has-recalled-all-white-jeremy-brockie-primed-for-peru

looking forward to hopefully seeing him play and crowd giving him a ex Nix welcome..

Farfan has only recently come back into the fold and while he was away in exodus, Raul Ruidiaz took up the mantle of Guerrero's first option. Most people believe Farfan should start at CF but the Peruvian coach is loyal to a fault with his players and it would not surprise me if he gives Raul Ruidiaz the starting spot and leaves Farfan on the bench

In terms of scoring ability Edison Flores has the most goals in the campaign with 5 (vs Chile, Uruguay, Ecuador, Bolivia and Paraguay). Guerrero also had 5 (his 6th was determined to be Ospina's own goal).

In terms of Peruvian local based players taking the pitch on Saturday I envision that only 2 will start. 

Alberto Rodriguez - 33 years of age - Centreback - massive amounts of international experience against the likes of Falcao, Cavani, Suarez, Sanchez, Messi, Brazilians, etc. He also played for many years in Portugal. He will also be captain. 

Aldo Corzo - 28 years of age - probably the most technically weak player in the team. But he has heart ill give him that. Luis Advincula who plays in Mexico is a much better player but had discipline problems, hence the coach is sticking with the guy who is a model pro

the other 9 players all play in Mexico (Gallese, Ruidiaz), Brazil (Cueva, Trauco), Ecuador (Ramos), Netherlands (Tapia), MLS (Yotun), EPL (Carrillo), Denmark (Flores) and maybe Russia (Farfan)

Off the bench the likely players are

Hurtado - plays in Portugal 

Polo - plays in Mexico

Aquino - plays in Mexico

Advincula - plays in Mexico

Farfan - plays in Russia

Reyna - plays in MLS

Pena - plays in Spain (second div)

So essentially hardly any Peruvian based players will more than likely take the field

Getting very excited about Saturday! I have no time for Hudson but that needs to be put aside this week - time to give our full support to the All Whites and back whoever is on the pitch. Plenty of time for angst, or humble-pie eating, next week!

Winston Reid for sure

unsure about the rest

I have been having similar feelings, I tend to shut them down quickly but they keep bubbling up to the surface

https://www.transfermarkt.com/jeremy-brockie/natio...

I count 11 games against OFC sides, or 22% of his games. Even if you say 21 sub appearances is equal to I don't know, 5 starts, that's 34 games for one goal. Which isn't great even if half his games were as a winger or forward.

I do think he's a valuable asset for the wider squad but I also think that it would be easier to justify if Hudson had given him more of a run in recent games to see if he can deliver in this set up. Brockie is also quite a streaky player so a few games to get him in the groove might have been wise.

Sure thing, I'll take a stab :)

Marinovic would be backup goalkeeper behind Pedro Gallese, star goalkeeper in Mexico.

Reid's a definite, considering the Peruvian's injury crisis. Probably the best CB in both countries regardless of injury. Smith, Boxall, Themi etc. wouldn't be in the top 10 Peruvian CBs though.

NZ wingbacks have no hope.

In centre midfield, Thomas might (just might) make the first XI on a good day, Peru's a little weak in depth for centre midfield and he might displace Yosimar Yotun, who plays in the MLS and is a similar type of player (short and agile but a great ballwinner).

May be a surprise, but Rojas would most likely be in the subs as a right or left winger - he'd flourish in a South American team given his playstyle, and the fact that he's not a fudgeing central player, Mr. Hudson. Wouldn't start ahead of Carrillo though (star Watford winger), but could displace Edison Flores (plays in Denmark for Tamati Williams' team, Aalborg) on the left on a good day.

Chris Wood would be second-choice striker behind Guerrero (captain, plays in Brazil and is one of the best players in the league), and just ahead of Raul Ruidiaz (plays in Mexico, but is a star player in the league - completely different type of player to Wood though, nicknamed the 'Peruvian Messi').

So starting in a combined squad? Only one or two Kiwis. On a good day, maybe four max. Here's the best case scenario :)

                                            Gallese

Advincula              Zambrano               Reid           Loyola/Trauco

Carrillo                      Tapia                 Thomas            Rojas

                                        Farfan/Cueva

                                             Wood

There seems to be a lot of people who think that we're absolutely outclassed everywhere on the pitch by Peru. Truth is, we're better than we think we are, and while we'll likely lose, our players can always surprise us!

fixed it slightly

                       Gallese

Advincula Rodriguez  Reid Trauco

Carrillo Tapia Thomas Rojas

            Cueva

            Wood

Zambrano has not been called up to Peru for over a year - has essentially been banished - no one knows why

This + Peru played 18 matches against some very fine teams since 2015 to get to this point. They must be run like an oiled machine. We are underdogs, no doubt, we have a small chance if we play our best game on Saturday.

Can think of a few Kiwis that's happened to...

I sitll reckon Zambrano is their best centreback, I saw he wasn't in the last squad on Wikipedia which surprised me since I remember him being an absolute rock in the Bundesliga, so I put him in just to include the best players possible.

And yup I agree with Cueva and Trauco, actually edited them in just after I posted but seems I was too late :)

I think this would be only the second game in which Guerrero would not be on the pitch. Not 100% sure but I think he played 17 out of 18 qualifiers and played all the games in the Copa America of 2015 and 2016

Bolivia at home is the game he missed, Peru won that 2-1 (goals by Flores and Cueva)

Zambrano had an incident with someone in the team after the rounds 5 and 6 and has not been back since. He is now wasting his talents in Greece after leaving the Bundesliga. He is probably slightly hating life watching his former team mates inch closer to the WC

I fully agree re fitness, that should be one area where we can be ahead of our rivals or at least equal, but to suggest Ingham is a better bet than Roux or that Dyer offers more than say Musa (on previous selections), i think is where he leaves most of us baffled.

I don’t understand why we are talking about fitness all the time. You can reach a perfect fitness level in a few weeks, month, but playing good football takes years.

The thing is that Alberto Rodriguez is a better CB than Carlos Zambrano. He has had an injury prone career which impeded him moving to La Liga at a certain point after impressing in Portugal (played UEFA cup final with Sporting Braga) but he is class and easily better than Smith even at the age of 33.

he had a particularly great match vs Suarez and Cavani this year. I think Suarez only beat him once in their personal duel (which resulted in Uruguay's goal)

My personal opinion is that in terms of absolute talent the best player by far in both squads is Jefferson Farfan. However he has only now got his act together after going into semi retirement in UAE last year.

Reid the best player on the park?      What a load of crap.

I think a lot of us are severely overrating Peru, they're better than us but they're not God's XI or anything. Reid is 100% in the top three players, if it wasn't for Farfan's return to form Reid would be the best on the park on paper. He's also playing for the biggest club out of anyone in either team.

Ironically I think people might be overrating Andre Carrillo (who cant score to save his life and sometimes hogs the ball too much) and Tapia (who sometimes holds onto the ball too much and tries interesting moves in risky positions ) and underrating Yoshimar Yotun (who is the key player in the midfield as underlined by the Uruguayan coach when Peru played Uruguay) and Flores (who has an uncanny ability to score important goals - joint top scorer in team with Guerrero).

That is probably because Carrillo and Tapia play in "better" leagues. 

All that being said, this Peru team is not in the playoff because of the individual ability of its players, its in the playoff because the team works well as a unit and has a starting 11 that can be recited from memory and it has essentially specific subs for each of the starters (also from memory). e.g. if Cueva goes off then Hurtado will come on. If Tapia goes out then Aquino goes in. If Corzo gets injured then Advincula will start

regarding Reid at West Ham...you could argue that Flamengo and Sao Paulo of Brazil are "bigger" clubs that West Ham. Seeing as they are both huge clubs in the most football mad country in the world. I would wager that playing for Flamengo brings more pressure than playing for West Ham. But I guess it depends how you define what a "big" club is

Does anyone know where they are training and if spectators can get close?

I don't think you can over rate the 10th ranked team in the world (whatever you think of FIFA's ranking system), and a team which has come through an ardous 18 game qualifying process in the toughest confederation there is. 

If anything now AWs fans are getting a bit optimistic, playing a South American side without any big names. Lets face it most of us would be lucky to recognise any one Peruvian player, if he was quietly walking the streets of NZ. 

However I imagine they are going to be better than we anticipated - a team Aristotle may have had in mind for 'the whole is greater than the sum of its parts'. They sound very experienced, well drilled, match hardened, united and mostly settled. I don’t think our two top CBs - Reid and Smith - have played a game together in years, let alone a massive competitive game, where they need to get their timing as a combo perfect.

We have some very average players (who may become better players). They'll have none.

We are a chance esp in the first leg of course, but over 2 legs Peru are huge favourites. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqwJUEm_ES8

It of course depends on how you measure it but West Ham is certainly worth more and by revenue is one of the biggest sports teams in the world.