Kick Heraf out now.
Hopefully there are enough negative media reports to question anyone who ever thinks of hiring him again, cant say I will shed a tear over that.
Football Ferns
If allegations by FFs and age group sides are proven to have substance then yes Heraf needs to be sent back to Austria.
I'm prepared however give Martin some leniency. Up until Spain trip, seems Ferns players were happy with Heraf - he even persuaded Erceg to come out of retirement.
So seems at that point all was rosy. Don't think you then blame Martin, for recruiting Heraf in the first place for either DOF (he would have taken guidance also from Readings & Hudson) or FFs coaching role.
However Martin needs to act quick and dismiss Heraf if allegations are true. Then ideally appoint coaches already in NZ (or worse case Australia), for both DOF & FFs roles.
Just feel if Martin also goes, leaves too many important roles at NZF, vacant all at the same time. Then looks a bit of a shambles and very unsettling. Esp with Schmid only in his job a few months. NZF needs a bit of stability right now.
Martin has his faults for sure - but he wasn't only one duped it seems by Heraf. However he needs to now act decisively, otherwise yes that then shows a real lack of leadership. He should also then if possible look to re recruit any good people forced out of NZF by Heraf.
Good post
It appears that Heraf has a great CV and he certainly has a lot of experience.
But, which member of the recruitment panel signed off on his football philosophy? Heraf appears to wear it so proudly on his chest, and we know his teams have a track record of playing 'chip and star' so it's not like his philosophy was a secret.
If allegations by FFs and age group sides are proven to have substance then yes Heraf needs to be sent back to Austria.
I'm prepared however give Martin some leniency. Up until Spain trip, seems Ferns players were happy with Heraf - he even persuaded Erceg to come out of retirement.
So seems at that point all was rosy. Don't think you then blame Martin, for recruiting Heraf in the first place for either DOF (he would have taken guidance also from Readings & Hudson) or FFs coaching role.
However Martin needs to act quick and dismiss Heraf if allegations are true. Then ideally appoint coaches already in NZ (or worse case Australia), for both DOF & FFs roles.
Just feel if Martin also goes, leaves too many important roles at NZF, vacant all at the same time. Then looks a bit of a shambles and very unsettling. Esp with Schmid only in his job a few months. NZF needs a bit of stability right now.
Martin has his faults for sure - but he wasn't only one duped it seems by Heraf. However he needs to now act decisively, otherwise yes that then shows a real lack of leadership. He should also then if possible look to re recruit any good people forced out of NZF by Heraf.
Problem is this comes back to another issue under Martin while he is/was in charge. He appears to have ignored warnings after Spain and even in the last two weeks, with Erceg retiring again, long-serving team manager Claire Hamilton leaving and Stuff approaching NZ Football with on-the-record comments from a Football Fern who had concerns about the lack of professionalism on the team's tour of Spain in March, with the NZF response being to go to the PFA, to reminded the player that she could be fined for bringing the game into disrepute if she spoke out. This seems to sum up his thoughts on the warning signs "I think you guys are making a lot more of it than what it is, to be quite honest".
You also have to take in the past problems under him
- Eligibility saga
- Rivalism/Peru Supporters farce
- TV rights for National League (gave all rights away to Sky)
- Peru away tickets saga
- Alex Jones transfer
- Comet
If allegations by FFs and age group sides are proven to have substance then yes Heraf needs to be sent back to Austria.
I'm prepared however give Martin some leniency. Up until Spain trip, seems Ferns players were happy with Heraf - he even persuaded Erceg to come out of retirement.
So seems at that point all was rosy. Don't think you then blame Martin, for recruiting Heraf in the first place for either DOF (he would have taken guidance also from Readings & Hudson) or FFs coaching role.
However Martin needs to act quick and dismiss Heraf if allegations are true. Then ideally appoint coaches already in NZ (or worse case Australia), for both DOF & FFs roles.
Just feel if Martin also goes, leaves too many important roles at NZF, vacant all at the same time. Then looks a bit of a shambles and very unsettling. Esp with Schmid only in his job a few months. NZF needs a bit of stability right now.
Martin has his faults for sure - but he wasn't only one duped it seems by Heraf. However he needs to now act decisively, otherwise yes that then shows a real lack of leadership. He should also then if possible look to re recruit any good people forced out of NZF by Heraf.
Problem is this comes back to another issue under Martin while he is/was in charge. He appears to have ignored warnings after Spain and even in the last two weeks, with Erceg retiring again, long-serving team manager Claire Hamilton leaving and Stuff approaching NZ Football with on-the-record comments from a Football Fern who had concerns about the lack of professionalism on the team's tour of Spain in March, with the NZF response being to go to the PFA, to reminded the player that she could be fined for bringing the game into disrepute if she spoke out. This seems to sum up his thoughts on the warning signs "I think you guys are making a lot more of it than what it is, to be quite honest".
You also have to take in the past problems under him
- Eligibility saga
- Rivalism/Peru Supporters farce
- TV rights for National League (gave all rights away to Sky)
- Peru away tickets saga
- Alex Jones transfer
- Comet
don't want to defend him here but you can't really put TV rights in as a problem - we have football regularly on TV which we never did before he was here. The deal might not be the best, but we are very much beggars when it comes to getting football on TV.
Everything else is valid, just don't think you can put TV rights in as a problem
If allegations by FFs and age group sides are proven to have substance then yes Heraf needs to be sent back to Austria.
I'm prepared however give Martin some leniency. Up until Spain trip, seems Ferns players were happy with Heraf - he even persuaded Erceg to come out of retirement.
So seems at that point all was rosy. Don't think you then blame Martin, for recruiting Heraf in the first place for either DOF (he would have taken guidance also from Readings & Hudson) or FFs coaching role.
However Martin needs to act quick and dismiss Heraf if allegations are true. Then ideally appoint coaches already in NZ (or worse case Australia), for both DOF & FFs roles.
Just feel if Martin also goes, leaves too many important roles at NZF, vacant all at the same time. Then looks a bit of a shambles and very unsettling. Esp with Schmid only in his job a few months. NZF needs a bit of stability right now.
Martin has his faults for sure - but he wasn't only one duped it seems by Heraf. However he needs to now act decisively, otherwise yes that then shows a real lack of leadership. He should also then if possible look to re recruit any good people forced out of NZF by Heraf.
Problem is this comes back to another issue under Martin while he is/was in charge. He appears to have ignored warnings after Spain and even in the last two weeks, with Erceg retiring again, long-serving team manager Claire Hamilton leaving and Stuff approaching NZ Football with on-the-record comments from a Football Fern who had concerns about the lack of professionalism on the team's tour of Spain in March, with the NZF response being to go to the PFA, to reminded the player that she could be fined for bringing the game into disrepute if she spoke out. This seems to sum up his thoughts on the warning signs "I think you guys are making a lot more of it than what it is, to be quite honest".
You also have to take in the past problems under him
- Eligibility saga
- Rivalism/Peru Supporters farce
- TV rights for National League (gave all rights away to Sky)
- Peru away tickets saga
- Alex Jones transfer
- Comet
don't want to defend him here but you can't really put TV rights in as a problem - we have football regularly on TV which we never did before he was here. The deal might not be the best, but we are very much beggars when it comes to getting football on TV.
Everything else is valid, just don't think you can put TV rights in as a problem
Sure and I took this from the Andy Martin where I posted it that had a good and a bad side, and the TV rights are on the good side as well, in the fact that we do have the National League games on TV, but really it is an incredibly dumb mistake by NZ Football to give away all the rights to the coverage meaning none of the teams can use it on social media to promote their games. Sky has full say over it all.
Even after the clubs actually pay for that TV coverage. It isn't having the games on TV that's a bad deal, its the details.
I read somewhere this morning (cant find the link now) that suggested two players had been left out of the Japan game squad due to apparent "issues" with Heraf.
Presumably these were Katie Rood who is at Juventus and Aimie Phillips who plays in Serbia. The reports suggested that the two players were "undermining" Heraf.
Can anyone add any more to this?
I read somewhere this morning (cant find the link now) that suggested two players had been left out of the Japan game squad due to apparent "issues" with Heraf.
Presumably these were Katie Rood who is at Juventus and Aimie Phillips who plays in Serbia. The reports suggested that the two players were "undermining" Heraf.
Can anyone add any more to this?
If Katie Rood has an issue with a coach then there has got to be a problem with that coach. Katie is an incredibly dedicated and hard working person who will do her best to follow instructions and direction.
With respect to the bullying thing and coaches yelling at players the Ferns and essentially it should be happening at all federation level coaching sessions the players for the last 6 or 7 years as part of the WoF philosophy should have been experiencing a process referred to player centered coaching and under that ideal there is absolutely no room for yelling at players in any situation. The Ferns will have experienced for the last 10 years this sort of approach to coaching, Herdman started down this path when he first took over. Player centered coaching doesnt mean the coach doesnt dictate how teams play etc but does mean players thoughts and feedback is important and valued.
Even 20 years ago the idea of having to yell at players to get results was frowned upon at NZF coaching courses and in the last decade its been clearly directed against.
Most importantly this is again another example of a coach acting exactly in the opposite direction of NZF directives/ideals to Federations and coaches.
It just keeps getting worse and worse from New Zealand Football.
Ferns scandal latest: More damaging developments; NZ Football told to stop contacting Ferns players, with immediate effect, over concerns about attempts to shut down complaints about Andreas Heraf. Almost unbelievable... almost..
It just keeps getting worse and worse from New Zealand Football.
Ferns scandal latest: More damaging developments; NZ Football told to stop contacting Ferns players, with immediate effect, over concerns about attempts to shut down complaints about Andreas Heraf. Almost unbelievable... almost..
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?...
How could you possible think you're doing well for an organisation when you:
Require radical lobbying to make a change (Gender pay parity) and have meetings about silencing negative opinions on the organisation (fans and players voices alike).
A good organisation is open to criticism and change in any industry, they don't try to censor people, promote groupthink and actively take measures to avoid change.
I read somewhere this morning (cant find the link now) that suggested two players had been left out of the Japan game squad due to apparent "issues" with Heraf.
Presumably these were Katie Rood who is at Juventus and Aimie Phillips who plays in Serbia. The reports suggested that the two players were "undermining" Heraf.
Can anyone add any more to this?
It just keeps getting worse and worse from New Zealand Football.
Ferns scandal latest: More damaging developments; NZ Football told to stop contacting Ferns players, with immediate effect, over concerns about attempts to shut down complaints about Andreas Heraf. Almost unbelievable... almost..
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?...
Have to say that the players themselves have done the NZ football community a huge favour in this because they are with their actions setting up for future settings/processes. Whats going on right now by the ferns is brave, difficult and forward thinking. I really hope at the end of this they get the credit they deserve, it is not an easy thing to go up against a governing body in any section of society and should be applauded.
When assessing managers across all walks of business, even if the manager 100% in the right, if the large majority of his or her team is not happy with them then the manager has failed with one of their core responsibilities - getting buy in from their team members.
When assessing managers across all walks of business, even if the manager 100% in the right, if the large majority of his or her team is not happy with them then the manager has failed with one of their core responsibilities - getting buy in from their team members.
I'm not certain that the Ferns example is one where huge change is drastically needed to the degree that there has to be a "like it or lump it" stand off. But if it is, or more importantly, the entire NZF governance group believe it is, then I have some sympathy with the view that some eggs need to be broken to make the omelettes.
My suspicion is that NZF will come out with the line that change is really really really necessary and Heraf has the full support of NZF in making these changes and those players that don't like it need to make way for others that buy into what Heraf is doing. If that is not what they say, I bet there will be a little bit of that in their response.
6 months ago NZF might of got away with this, but with the new board members - unlikely. They will see it as an opportunity to bring more needed change.
I expect both to go now - especially if Martin knew about the phonecalls. If he didn't he might surive... maybe.
When assessing managers across all walks of business, even if the manager 100% in the right, if the large majority of his or her team is not happy with them then the manager has failed with one of their core responsibilities - getting buy in from their team members.
I'm not certain that the Ferns example is one where huge change is drastically needed to the degree that there has to be a "like it or lump it" stand off. But if it is, or more importantly, the entire NZF governance group believe it is, then I have some sympathy with the view that some eggs need to be broken to make the omelettes.
My suspicion is that NZF will come out with the line that change is really really really necessary and Heraf has the full support of NZF in making these changes and those players that don't like it need to make way for others that buy into what Heraf is doing. If that is not what they say, I bet there will be a little bit of that in their response.
If this is the case then i come back to the point I keep banging on about and that this is completely the opposite of the approach and directives of the WoF plan and what NZF has been pushing via the federations and the NZF coaching courses and systems for the past 6 or more years. It would be a total about face on what they have pushed very hard the way forward. They would be going against their very own policies.
What time is the media conference this afternoon? Or have I missed it?
What time is the media conference this afternoon? Or have I missed it?
3pm, in five minutes' time.
What time is the media conference this afternoon? Or have I missed it?
3pm - can watch on Stuff's Facebook page apperently
Here we go
Football Ferns coach and NZ Football Technical Director Andreas Heraf has been given a notice of investigation with a proposal for suspension, in the meantime he is on special leave with immediate effect from his roles until the completion of the necessary employment processes
— Andrew Gourdie (@AndrewGourdie) June 20, 2018
What time is the media conference this afternoon? Or have I missed it?
3pm - can watch on Stuff's Facebook page apperently
Has anyone found it?
Here is the stream https://www.facebook.com/Stuff.co.nz/videos/101565...
NZ Football press release http://www.nzfootball.co.nz/newsarticle/64282
Andy is deluded, he's quoting a report that was forwarded and approved by the Technical Director (Heraf). It shows there is a major conflict of interest when Heraf can control the environment as a coach and sign off on any reports from his staff and potentially change the report because of the 2 positions of power that he holds.
Somehow, Andy Martin retains the "100% support" of the board.
Somehow, Andy Martin retains the "100% support" of the board.
If they were going to remove him, or even place him under investigation, then he wouldn't be at the press conference.
Can't hear any of it. Are they addressing Heraf's coaching philosophy vis a vis WOF strategy?
Not yet. All of the questions have been about process/Ferns so far.
If terms of reference are to be signed off by NZPFA, then i assume WOF/philosophy not on the agenda. This would be a big fail.
Change is needed which is fine but the one area which had the biggest impact on improving the ferns standing over the last decade was the player centered coaching process. if there is change needed to move forward it most likely to me would be a tactical and playing improvement. Herafs approach is indeed a tactical and playing approach but thats not an approach which is likely to improve the players individually or as a team. An approach which isnt player centered in the broader sense to a very dictatorial approach is never going to work for a number of reasons. firstly its an approach which has been show to be far less effective today and and approach which has been dropped by so many sports teams around the world. The most notable relative to NZ is the All Blacks in the last decade. Their whole approach has a very strong player centered culture and I know so many on here hate the All Blacks and discount Rugby due to its lack of a world prescence but relative to NZ its a prime example of player centered systems being successful and prominent.
We needed a new tactical direction, the players are not buying in to Herafs approach and as someone else mentioned earlier if you dont get buy in you have failed before you start.
Have to say having the DoF being the one producing the technical review under the guise as the coach is a pretty silly thing to happen, massive conflict of interest and transparency issue there.
Blaming a lot of this on "implementing a change strategy within the Ferns". Not sure if I can attribute all the comments and facts to something like that.
The only other explanation for ignoring the WoF is that they are abandoning the current plan. Which, considering how much Martin is focusing on how the All Whites and Ferns have "failed" to do certain things might be the case. That would be alarming but also very NZF.
Andy is deluded, he's quoting a report that was forwarded and approved by the Technical Director (Heraf). It shows there is a major conflict of interest when Heraf can control the environment as a coach and sign off on any reports from his staff and potentially change the report because of the 2 positions of power that he holds.
When the dual roles were approved, Martin should have ensured that all reviews of The Football Ferns came through himself. Martin is looking real foolish and he is not someone I would trust.
If only a CEO Pro license was required to be a football CEO, knowing our luck we would still get someone like Andy making the decisions.
Andy is deluded, he's quoting a report that was forwarded and approved by the Technical Director (Heraf). It shows there is a major conflict of interest when Heraf can control the environment as a coach and sign off on any reports from his staff and potentially change the report because of the 2 positions of power that he holds.
When the dual roles were approved, Martin should have ensured that all reviews of The Football Ferns came through himself. Martin is looking real foolish and he is not someone I would trust.
Why I thought the media did a really good job in the press conference, they were asking hard questions and questions that will hopefully/likely catch Martin in a lie after this review. Seems they were giving no quarter
Something that stood out to me is that Martin said staff members were just being "too close" to players when it came to encouraging them not to complain. The report I saw suggested that it was several players contacted by multiple staff members. Does Martin really expect us to believe that this happened to naturally come up in multiple conversations between Ferns and NZF staff?
Blaming a lot of this on "implementing a change strategy within the Ferns". Not sure if I can attribute all the comments and facts to something like that.
If allegations by FFs and age group sides are proven to have substance then yes Heraf needs to be sent back to Austria.
I'm prepared however give Martin some leniency. Up until Spain trip, seems Ferns players were happy with Heraf - he even persuaded Erceg to come out of retirement.
So seems at that point all was rosy. Don't think you then blame Martin, for recruiting Heraf in the first place for either DOF (he would have taken guidance also from Readings & Hudson) or FFs coaching role.
However Martin needs to act quick and dismiss Heraf if allegations are true. Then ideally appoint coaches already in NZ (or worse case Australia), for both DOF & FFs roles.
Just feel if Martin also goes, leaves too many important roles at NZF, vacant all at the same time. Then looks a bit of a shambles and very unsettling. Esp with Schmid only in his job a few months. NZF needs a bit of stability right now.
Martin has his faults for sure - but he wasn't only one duped it seems by Heraf. However he needs to now act decisively, otherwise yes that then shows a real lack of leadership. He should also then if possible look to re recruit any good people forced out of NZF by Heraf.
Problem is this comes back to another issue under Martin while he is/was in charge. He appears to have ignored warnings after Spain and even in the last two weeks, with Erceg retiring again, long-serving team manager Claire Hamilton leaving and Stuff approaching NZ Football with on-the-record comments from a Football Fern who had concerns about the lack of professionalism on the team's tour of Spain in March, with the NZF response being to go to the PFA, to reminded the player that she could be fined for bringing the game into disrepute if she spoke out. This seems to sum up his thoughts on the warning signs "I think you guys are making a lot more of it than what it is, to be quite honest".
You also have to take in the past problems under him
- Eligibility saga
- Rivalism/Peru Supporters farce
- TV rights for National League (gave all rights away to Sky)
- Peru away tickets saga
- Alex Jones transfer
- Comet
don't want to defend him here but you can't really put TV rights in as a problem - we have football regularly on TV which we never did before he was here. The deal might not be the best, but we are very much beggars when it comes to getting football on TV.
Everything else is valid, just don't think you can put TV rights in as a problem
Sure and I took this from the Andy Martin where I posted it that had a good and a bad side, and the TV rights are on the good side as well, in the fact that we do have the National League games on TV, but really it is an incredibly dumb mistake by NZ Football to give away all the rights to the coverage meaning none of the teams can use it on social media to promote their games. Sky has full say over it all.
Yes, but the national league hadn't been on TV (besides a couple games) since they used to do those NZFC highlights packages years ago. NZF were in absolutely no position to try and bargain with Sky - if they hadn't accepted the terms then Sky would pull the pin on any coverage.
Consider both sides before calling it an "incredibly dumb mistake"; because an even bigger mistake would've been trying to demand greater rights, only for the coverage to be pulled completely. IMO there is no way you can say that the TV rights deal was a negative at all, when looking at the bigger picture
