New Zealand Men's U-20s

and the croud is exiting...that's embarrassing

Ok.

Am I the only one who thinks Sail was to blame for that 4th goal? He had the best view of where everyone was and could have easily come off his line and gathered it, or at least hoofed it clear. Our defenders looked like that's what they thought was going to happen which is why they stood there and watched it

Wellington bound. they have alot of work to do

Bazeley looked relieved at full time that it was over.

If your keeper doesnt look like coming for it you have to take responsibility and hoof it.

I think the quality of coaching in New Zealand is one of the problems. Darren Bazeley isn't going to be a guy who creates a tactical system that leads to success and from what I've seen it's simply English football. You could argue he doesn't have a lot to work with but his job is also a development one. I think NZF missed an opportunity to appoint a more technical coach for this tournament and one from overseas (not from the UK). if the whole board of NZF was Spanish and German I think football in the country would be set. 

If the goal is to qualify for a tournament and get by spending as little money as possible on coaching then we are always going to fail. 

The only two players who look to know what to do with the ball are Tuiloma and Edge, and that's it. Billingsley showed some things but nothing special. And why has been Dyer playing??

Perfect game to highlight our problems. Technically some of our players arent too bad however skill wise we are awful. The skill part is never going to improve with long ball football. Launching balls forward into spaces will never work as we go higher up the food chain. Sure in Oceania we can play balls forward into spaces and win the ball or pressure the defenders and nail the Island teams but as soon as we hit the higher levels we have got to have players capable of keeping the ball. Our biggest problem tonight with retaining the ball has been our skill levels. We are capable of controlling the ball but often that control is the wrong choice, we receive whilst turning into opposition players, we receive so that we turn away from our own support.  We very very rarely string 3 or more passes together because of this and so in turn are constantly having to swithc from attacking to defending which in turn means players are having to adjust shape and jobs every few seconds.

I know a few of these players and some of them have decent talent. For example at U15 level Matt Ridenton  was the only player in his age group who was dragged up an age group at NTC level because he was so advanced of his own age group. Others in this side were very good at U15 age level but sadly when they start to head into the older age groups they end up having to change from the pass and move football they have been learning as younger players to playing for field position. Its our national age group coaches and club coaches doing this as these players hit our senior teams.  Very sad.

Tzanev to get a chance against Myanmar? In the last U-20 World Cup Crocombe and Basalaj both played

I should have stayed at the stadium for the Arg v GHA game after the first one, instead of coming home to watch this tripe

I missed MKR for this lolz shyte

Too much aligned tiki-taka football in the fine kiwi summer weather for the Wanderers lads. They couldn't play their fluid passing game in tonight's conditions ;)

Wonder if the Junior AW next game will be a hard stretch to sell tickets. CMON welly FIRE UP

I'm mighty impressed by what I saw from Ghana. 

Not sure aye, i don't think so though

My mum is dead

:edit - jokes,but she she did say you're sharkhouse in the sack

see this is what happen's when we get thrashed 4 zip...we turn on eachother..haha

Yep!  Agree with you. The team has had enough time and coaching to be at a higher level. 

We seemed to have selected a bunch of old school big English style centre forwards....Patterson, Holthisen and Billington, all of whom got a run tonight. But they seemed a lot of time to be playing wide yet they are more suited to playing the central target. The USA TV commentators mentioned that point. The odd thing was that we had two of these guys on the field after Ridenton came off....you would think at that stage the best tactic would be to pump the ball into them. But we still tried to play the ball on the deck around the box.

The other point I would make is about Dyer. You don't need him in CM because Tuiloma is doing that job. Our biggest problem was that we were "shut out" as they like to say in the USA, by their four man midfield.(they were playing a 4141). We caused ourselves problems because our passing was way too slow. You combine that with a lack of mobility up front and the USA had plenty of time to swarm on defense and shut us down. Coming back to Dyer.....our best passer by far is Rufer. He's been playing that deep passing role for the Nix reserves and doing it very well. Rufer spent the match on the bench. Dyer is more of an old school hustling CM.

I think Bazley is a bit of on old school UK coach. He does not seem to me to be tactically or technically up at a higher enough level. Would love to see Ramon coaching these guys.

The reality of this game is that there is a huge gulf in ability. The USA were man for man better. However I think we could have played better tactically and with a few changes in selections.

Its a shame about the goal blow out. We are now minus four. To qualify for the next round as best third placed side we are going to have to do the business against Mynamar. However one shot on goal against the Ukraine and one shot on goal in this game(until the USA stopped defending at the end) doesn't inspire me with confidence of thrashing Mynamar.

I agree. If we want players to develop then I think we need to send them over to Europe as soon as possible. Rufer and Ridenton have sat on the Phoenix bench for two years and they don't seem to have progressed as footballers. I think when you are in Europe in proper youth set ups it is going to be way more beneficial.

:-)

I wonder what Hudson thinks of the team so far. How much input into the playing style has he had, if any? 

I know.. it's all good 

The English lads win it. Stop watching that sharke.

Dear the mothers of Ryan Thomas and Tyler Boyd, why couldn't you hold on for another few weeks.

Seriously missing some attacking impetus. Those two would be a huge step up on what we have currently.

Why no Alex Rufer tonight? 

LOL

I think Boyd missed out on qualifying by a few days

We really need more mobility up front. Boyd and Thomas would have been great.

I wonder if Rufer is on the outer not being a Wanderers lad.

Is 0-4 our biggest defeat at this level? I seem to remember us shipping 3 against Ubekistan????? Two of those goals against the USA were really poor. One a keeper error and the other was just bad defending...lots of guys just ball watching.

The Mynamar game won't be easy

From tonight's game I think the coaches should be applauded and have created alignment with both the All Whites seniors and juniors now pumping the ball long for 75 minutes,  getting behind, other teams ease off at 75 mins, and make subs, we start passing it around, create a couple of half chances for a consolation goal, coach says we just need to play like the last 15 for the whole game...

In all seriousness as much as I would like to see us moving the ball round, players moving into space, one touch football etc against the good teams it isn't going to happen anytime soon. In fact by so trying to play this brand of football we end up exposing ourselves through giving it away with an errant pass just in front of the back four.

It's clear that we want to play a certain brand of football and I think a high pressing, fast ball movement style sounds great in theory but what I'm starting to realise is that Hudson may have to come up with a plan B style given our players. Remember he talked about this style before "really" understanding the players he had at his disposal. 

These kids can all play and I'm sure compared to the other NZ and Oceania lads they stand out. Even in defeat I thought Paterson was enterprising and moved well but he was one of the only few who seemed to "want the ball" and was decisive, even if some option taking was average. 

Against Myanmar the guys will be playing a quicker and more skilful team. We are going to have to win the 50/50s and catch these guys on the counter with fast transitions. That doesn't mean long balls but quicker passing and off the ball movement. 

Despite the loss it's nice to have this tournament in our backyard. Am sure a lot of kids like mine are getting into it. 

why are people shocked that a team of amateurs can't compete with a team comprising of mostly professional players?  

I don't know. I just know that we don't have the resources to develop players here. 

Just look at the senior team. Our best players are Reid, Smith, Wood, Thomas, Barbarouses, Rojas and Tzimopulous. Only Rojas and Barbarouses came through the NZ pathway.

If this is the pathway Anthony Hudson and NZF are looking to take our national game then I'm worried. As opposed to Saturday's game, tonight we saw not just the players individually put to the test, but the whole team and playing philosophy which unfortunately failed embarrassingly.

We can compare the difference between the size of our nations (player pools), we can compare the players like for like (pro v amateur), we can compare the financial resources between each Federation,  but what is glaringly obvious is that we do not have an identity on the pitch. Despite the obvious differences mentioned above all of these can more often then not be over come by a well organized, tactically prepared and clesr identity on the grass.

Now someone mentioned Ramon previously...look what he has achieved at ACFC in the past 5 years. He has faced all the same constraints mentioned above, but has over come them all with quality coaching, installing total belief and confidence into his players that this is the best way to play and achieved unparalleled success for a New Zealand team both at home and on the biggest stage. We the it be BA or Barcelona they face ACFC have a clear playing philosophy...dominate possession, care for the ball, move the opposition! They did this at the Club World a up regardless and finished 3rd!

This group of U-20 players are technically sound, they can hold their own on the pitch but the type/style/structure they are being asked to play does not work on the international stage. 

This current ALIGNMENT from All Whites to 17s is worrying we are moving away from the key ingredients needed to survive, compete and win on the international level. It's all well and good pressing, being aggressive, not giving the opposition time on the ball (which we were all awful at tonight & what Anthony wants) but we look lost, naive and without any real structure when we win the ball back.

I guess what I'm saying is that I believe we have too many of the counties most influential coaches (club, school, national) teaching our players the wrong things. Every coach will tell you "we want to play out, keep the ball etc" but there's another thing being brave enough to do it...Ramon is/was and look what he achieved...WE CAN DO IT IN NZ! WE CAN COMPETE!