If i had my way 3 months ago i wouldve told Lochhead you need a club to be considered.
If not then id start tuiloma there
All Whites, Ferns, and other international teams
The Road To Brazil 2014 via Wellington feat. Mexico
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[/quote]Secondly, while Christie is in the squad there is the actual possibility that he could get on the pitch. Andy Barron was used at the WC when Herbert wanted to make a point about amateur players (Brownie was on the bench) - so never put it past Herbert to do something completely bizarre.
Wasn't Brown crocked at the tournament, and only got his ticket for South Africa, for other reasons?
yes.
What reasons?
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I'm guessing Lochhead's trial at Chivas after the Trinidad match didn't go too well then?
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[/quote]Secondly, while Christie is in the squad there is the actual possibility that he could get on the pitch. Andy Barron was used at the WC when Herbert wanted to make a point about amateur players (Brownie was on the bench) - so never put it past Herbert to do something completely bizarre.
Wasn't Brown crocked at the tournament, and only got his ticket for South Africa, for other reasons?
That is not his (Brown's) view
Normo's coming home
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It's completely absurd that both Lochhead and Christie are in the AW squad, these are players who aren't even remotely match fit. That Herbert still picks them reflects badly on his professional judgement. There we have young Ryan Thomas playing 90 minutes in the Dutch first division and he isn't picked.
If Lochhead trots out in Mexico City he'll be creamed by the speedy Mexican players, likewise Christie won't even get a look in. It's so obvious, but there's no accounting for Herbert's stubborn nature. Can't someone in the AW camp make him see sense? We really need Nelsen standing on Herbert's shoulder.
He played in a cup match against something like a 3rd division side. He definitely has potential. But one good match for someone of his age shouldn't warrant a spot in the squad.
Plus 90 minutes against PSV Eindhoven. So a full time professional contract at a club in a decent European league doesn't warrant a place, but playing in the ASB Premiership (or for noone), does? His future potential alone warrants him being there in front of at least 3 players in this squad.
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I understand christie because he is to cover the yellow situation of vicellich and has experience only because of that, between clapham and keat he opted for clapham that can play right back and right midfielder as well ,, relax,,,he should have brought a 24 player in keat, though, because of the bookings
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I think its too soon for Thomas. I'm still worried were not going to use Marco in the away leg. I know he hasn't had much football but I don't see the point in saving him, could be over after first leg. Also, Brockie has rarely looked great internationally
Normo's coming home
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It's completely absurd that both Lochhead and Christie are in the AW squad, these are players who aren't even remotely match fit. That Herbert still picks them reflects badly on his professional judgement. There we have young Ryan Thomas playing 90 minutes in the Dutch first division and he isn't picked.
If Lochhead trots out in Mexico City he'll be creamed by the speedy Mexican players, likewise Christie won't even get a look in. It's so obvious, but there's no accounting for Herbert's stubborn nature. Can't someone in the AW camp make him see sense? We really need Nelsen standing on Herbert's shoulder.
He played in a cup match against something like a 3rd division side. He definitely has potential. But one good match for someone of his age shouldn't warrant a spot in the squad.
Plus 90 minutes against PSV Eindhoven. So a full time professional contract at a club in a decent European league doesn't warrant a place, but playing in the ASB Premiership (or for noone), does? His future potential alone warrants him being there in front of at least 3 players in this squad.
The only puzzling selection is Christie.
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I think this new Mexican defence is suspect and a weakness. They are going to be expecting us to park the bus.
I think we should name our team as late as possible, and go all out attack for the first 30 minutes- high intensity, pressing, possession etc to try and nick a goal or two, and then make some subs and park two buses if we have. Marco, McG, Kosta, Wood, Roux, James, Bertos, Clapham, Henderson, Brockie, Fallon...not sure how that would work out as an XI, but...
Tactics trying to park the bus- do we try and hang on to possession or do we just defend and defend? Surely having possession is a lower energy way to have negative tactics...
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Agree with Ryan and JD. Ryan Thomas's time is not now.
Ricki did say in print that he expects Smeltz and Marco to play 10-20 so there are 2 of your subs. James will be the 3rd.
Grumpy old bastard alert
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Secondly, while Christie is in the squad there is the actual possibility that he could get on the pitch. Andy Barron was used at the WC when Herbert wanted to make a point about amateur players (Brownie was on the bench) - so never put it past Herbert to do something completely bizarre.
is this speculation or do you know something? Are you saying he gave Barron a run for the sake of a point he wanted to make?
Grumpy old bastard alert
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yes the experience there is with rafa marquez and sledgehammer rodriguez at the back plus the keeper corona, up front they have experience in de negris and the new striker uribe that is having a late spring , but the mdfield area is with less caps, thats why he called a 38 years old player brazilian attacking midfielder zinha that has like 65 caps or so . the altitude is a proble, nz needs to slow down the tempo, play sure balls, and save energy, clean at the back, and speedy up front, JAMAICA GOT A 0-0 THERE PLAYING A 4-4-1-1 plus jamaica lost an uncredible goal at the very start , AND USA THE SAME , nz needs to play the fastest team available at altitude
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It's completely absurd that both Lochhead and Christie are in the AW squad, these are players who aren't even remotely match fit. That Herbert still picks them reflects badly on his professional judgement. There we have young Ryan Thomas playing 90 minutes in the Dutch first division and he isn't picked.
If Lochhead trots out in Mexico City he'll be creamed by the speedy Mexican players, likewise Christie won't even get a look in. It's so obvious, but there's no accounting for Herbert's stubborn nature. Can't someone in the AW camp make him see sense? We really need Nelsen standing on Herbert's shoulder.
He played in a cup match against something like a 3rd division side. He definitely has potential. But one good match for someone of his age shouldn't warrant a spot in the squad.
Plus 90 minutes against PSV Eindhoven. So a full time professional contract at a club in a decent European league doesn't warrant a place, but playing in the ASB Premiership (or for noone), does? His future potential alone warrants him being there in front of at least 3 players in this squad.
The only puzzling selection is Christie.
Not saying Thomas should play. Just saying that there will obviously be players who will play no part in either match, therefore would rather have an up and coming youngster experiencing this kind of environment for the future rather than an unattached has-been coming along for the ride as one of "Ricki's boys". Taking a long term approach (much like Walcott's inclusion for the 2006 World Cup squad).
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We cant throw all youngsters in. Roux and tuiloma there due to depth. Ideally roux would have a season with mariners under belt and tuiloma would crack top side
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[quote=newbyone]
JD :
I agree with 2nd Best - I don't like the fact we have to use Lochhead but that's life unfortunately. But Christie just smacks of all the things you hear about NZ junior sides - favouritism, cliques, players being picked because of who you know etc.
Welcome to Ricky Herbert's world of Football. He's always selected based on cliques, favouritism etc. Then there are some players, where one year Ricki thinks they're the best thing since sliced bread, heaps of potential, etc eg: Michael Boxall. He should be in the AW ahead of Christie!
Sorry I didn't finish my sentence: Then there are some players, where one year Ricki thinks they're the best thing since sliced bread, heaps of potential, and for some unknown reason they fall out of favour with him eg: Michael Boxall. Once they're on the outer, it's unlikely they get back in!
Which he is totally entitled to do so long as he his head coach.. I say let him pick who he picks and stop whining about it. Its his ass on the line if it doesn't work and we are not going to replace him before the playoffs. Christie won't get near the pitch he is just one of the lad's and if that adds to team chemistry then let him be there.. We need our starting XI to be as focused and prepared as possible and if that means taking a couple of players to help keep the team motivated then I have no problem with it. I'll start complaining when he start's Christie and we lose by 3+
1 - Ricki isn't coaching after the next world cup, so really his ass isn't on the line. I think that was obvious after the Oceania cup anyway. Any other nation with an equally dissapointing result at a tournament like this would have have more than likely started looking for a new coach. Not NZF. Instead the idiots are happy to have Herbert because they hardly pay him anything even if it means we lost $1mil from not qualifying for the Confedereations cup. Typical short sighted NZF. Typical look after your mates NZF.
2 - Christie getting picked to add team Chemistry?!?!?! Really????? Fine if we want to pick someone for team chemistry who will never play then why don't we pick Rhys Darby to add a bit of humour for the lads. Even better lets pick Dave Dobbyn so the lads can have a sing along.
I expect the coach to pick the 23 players that are going to benefit New Zealand football best with a balancing act at looking short term and long term. Not a bunch of mates to go along for a ride!!! The fact that Christie has been picked is an absolute disgrace. He was no where near the level 4 years ago, and now he's 32 and has no club, he some how has made the squad again. There are so many more players I would rather see in the squad including any Under 17 player, any under 19 player and any player attached to a professional football team.
These types of decisions is what damages New Zealand football. How often do the All Blacks make similiar decisions. I know New Zealand football is no where near as strong, but it should still follow the same philosphy as the All Blacks. You have to earn that shirt. Can anyway claim Christie has earnt it?????
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These types of decisions is what damages New Zealand football. How often do the All Blacks make similiar decisions. I know New Zealand football is no where near as strong, but it should still follow the same philosphy as the All Blacks. You have to earn that shirt. Can anyway claim Christie has earnt it?????
Grumpy old bastard alert
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[/quote]Secondly, while Christie is in the squad there is the actual possibility that he could get on the pitch. Andy Barron was used at the WC when Herbert wanted to make a point about amateur players (Brownie was on the bench) - so never put it past Herbert to do something completely bizarre.
Wasn't Brown crocked at the tournament, and only got his ticket for South Africa, for other reasons?
That is not his (Brown's) view
I'm not surprised by that. But it doesn't mean it's fully accurate either.
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It's completely absurd that both Lochhead and Christie are in the AW squad, these are players who aren't even remotely match fit. That Herbert still picks them reflects badly on his professional judgement. There we have young Ryan Thomas playing 90 minutes in the Dutch first division and he isn't picked.
If Lochhead trots out in Mexico City he'll be creamed by the speedy Mexican players, likewise Christie won't even get a look in. It's so obvious, but there's no accounting for Herbert's stubborn nature. Can't someone in the AW camp make him see sense? We really need Nelsen standing on Herbert's shoulder.
He played in a cup match against something like a 3rd division side. He definitely has potential. But one good match for someone of his age shouldn't warrant a spot in the squad.
Plus 90 minutes against PSV Eindhoven. So a full time professional contract at a club in a decent European league doesn't warrant a place, but playing in the ASB Premiership (or for noone), does? His future potential alone warrants him being there in front of at least 3 players in this squad.
Agree, Thomas should have been selected instead of Christie who is deadwood. Likewise Lochhead who is also taking up valuable space. I'd rather that went to Boxall, who at least like Thomas will be match fit. The problem with having Lochhead available is that Ricki has for so long pencilled him in first, he could do it without realizing and we'd already have gifted Mexico two goals before a ball is kicked.
Not playing for a club no way should you be going!
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Simon Elliott didn't have a club and he played in the World Cup in 2010.
Don't think it's quite as clear-cut as you seem to be suggesting.
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It's completely absurd that both Lochhead and Christie are in the AW squad, these are players who aren't even remotely match fit. That Herbert still picks them reflects badly on his professional judgement. There we have young Ryan Thomas playing 90 minutes in the Dutch first division and he isn't picked.
If Lochhead trots out in Mexico City he'll be creamed by the speedy Mexican players, likewise Christie won't even get a look in. It's so obvious, but there's no accounting for Herbert's stubborn nature. Can't someone in the AW camp make him see sense? We really need Nelsen standing on Herbert's shoulder.
He played in a cup match against something like a 3rd division side. He definitely has potential. But one good match for someone of his age shouldn't warrant a spot in the squad.
Plus 90 minutes against PSV Eindhoven. So a full time professional contract at a club in a decent European league doesn't warrant a place, but playing in the ASB Premiership (or for noone), does? His future potential alone warrants him being there in front of at least 3 players in this squad.
The only puzzling selection is Christie.
Not saying Thomas should play. Just saying that there will obviously be players who will play no part in either match, therefore would rather have an up and coming youngster experiencing this kind of environment for the future rather than an unattached has-been coming along for the ride as one of "Ricki's boys". Taking a long term approach (much like Walcott's inclusion for the 2006 World Cup squad).
Spot on.
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We cant throw all youngsters in. Roux and tuiloma there due to depth. Ideally roux would have a season with mariners under belt and tuiloma would crack top side
We're going to need young match fit legs in the energy-sapping high altitude, not aging unfit ones. We're going to need to attack, but with possession to take the pressure off our defence. If we just park the bus it'll end two or three nil and tie over.
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Simon Elliott didn't have a club and he played in the World Cup in 2010.
Don't think it's quite as clear-cut as you seem to be suggesting.
People like Coldplay and voted for the Nazis. You can't trust people.
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[quote=newbyone]
JD :
I agree with 2nd Best - I don't like the fact we have to use Lochhead but that's life unfortunately. But Christie just smacks of all the things you hear about NZ junior sides - favouritism, cliques, players being picked because of who you know etc.
Welcome to Ricky Herbert's world of Football. He's always selected based on cliques, favouritism etc. Then there are some players, where one year Ricki thinks they're the best thing since sliced bread, heaps of potential, etc eg: Michael Boxall. He should be in the AW ahead of Christie!
Sorry I didn't finish my sentence: Then there are some players, where one year Ricki thinks they're the best thing since sliced bread, heaps of potential, and for some unknown reason they fall out of favour with him eg: Michael Boxall. Once they're on the outer, it's unlikely they get back in!
Which he is totally entitled to do so long as he his head coach.. I say let him pick who he picks and stop whining about it. Its his ass on the line if it doesn't work and we are not going to replace him before the playoffs. Christie won't get near the pitch he is just one of the lad's and if that adds to team chemistry then let him be there.. We need our starting XI to be as focused and prepared as possible and if that means taking a couple of players to help keep the team motivated then I have no problem with it. I'll start complaining when he start's Christie and we lose by 3+
1 - Ricki isn't coaching after the next world cup, so really his ass isn't on the line. I think that was obvious after the Oceania cup anyway. Any other nation with an equally dissapointing result at a tournament like this would have have more than likely started looking for a new coach. Not NZF. Instead the idiots are happy to have Herbert because they hardly pay him anything even if it means we lost $1mil from not qualifying for the Confedereations cup. Typical short sighted NZF. Typical look after your mates NZF.
2 - Christie getting picked to add team Chemistry?!?!?! Really????? Fine if we want to pick someone for team chemistry who will never play then why don't we pick Rhys Darby to add a bit of humour for the lads. Even better lets pick Dave Dobbyn so the lads can have a sing along.
I expect the coach to pick the 23 players that are going to benefit New Zealand football best with a balancing act at looking short term and long term. Not a bunch of mates to go along for a ride!!! The fact that Christie has been picked is an absolute disgrace. He was no where near the level 4 years ago, and now he's 32 and has no club, he some how has made the squad again. There are so many more players I would rather see in the squad including any Under 17 player, any under 19 player and any player attached to a professional football team.
These types of decisions is what damages New Zealand football. How often do the All Blacks make similiar decisions. I know New Zealand football is no where near as strong, but it should still follow the same philosphy as the All Blacks. You have to earn that shirt. Can anyway claim Christie has earnt it?????
Sure Herbert may have already decided to retire soon so is just doing favours for old mates. Unfortunately the short term financial health of New Zealand football is at stake. If we don't qualify for the World Cup with its $10 million payday then NZF is going to pull its spending on the development of the game in this country for the next few years - pleading poverty. It's vital we qualify. I don't care about Ricki's retirement plans.
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[quote=newbyone]
JD :
I agree with 2nd Best - I don't like the fact we have to use Lochhead but that's life unfortunately. But Christie just smacks of all the things you hear about NZ junior sides - favouritism, cliques, players being picked because of who you know etc.
Welcome to Ricky Herbert's world of Football. He's always selected based on cliques, favouritism etc. Then there are some players, where one year Ricki thinks they're the best thing since sliced bread, heaps of potential, etc eg: Michael Boxall. He should be in the AW ahead of Christie!
Sorry I didn't finish my sentence: Then there are some players, where one year Ricki thinks they're the best thing since sliced bread, heaps of potential, and for some unknown reason they fall out of favour with him eg: Michael Boxall. Once they're on the outer, it's unlikely they get back in!
Which he is totally entitled to do so long as he his head coach.. I say let him pick who he picks and stop whining about it. Its his ass on the line if it doesn't work and we are not going to replace him before the playoffs. Christie won't get near the pitch he is just one of the lad's and if that adds to team chemistry then let him be there.. We need our starting XI to be as focused and prepared as possible and if that means taking a couple of players to help keep the team motivated then I have no problem with it. I'll start complaining when he start's Christie and we lose by 3+
1 - Ricki isn't coaching after the next world cup, so really his ass isn't on the line. I think that was obvious after the Oceania cup anyway. Any other nation with an equally dissapointing result at a tournament like this would have have more than likely started looking for a new coach. Not NZF. Instead the idiots are happy to have Herbert because they hardly pay him anything even if it means we lost $1mil from not qualifying for the Confedereations cup. Typical short sighted NZF. Typical look after your mates NZF.
2 - Christie getting picked to add team Chemistry?!?!?! Really????? Fine if we want to pick someone for team chemistry who will never play then why don't we pick Rhys Darby to add a bit of humour for the lads. Even better lets pick Dave Dobbyn so the lads can have a sing along.
I expect the coach to pick the 23 players that are going to benefit New Zealand football best with a balancing act at looking short term and long term. Not a bunch of mates to go along for a ride!!! The fact that Christie has been picked is an absolute disgrace. He was no where near the level 4 years ago, and now he's 32 and has no club, he some how has made the squad again. There are so many more players I would rather see in the squad including any Under 17 player, any under 19 player and any player attached to a professional football team.
These types of decisions is what damages New Zealand football. How often do the All Blacks make similiar decisions. I know New Zealand football is no where near as strong, but it should still follow the same philosphy as the All Blacks. You have to earn that shirt. Can anyway claim Christie has earnt it?????
Sure Herbert may have already decided to retire soon so is just doing favours for old mates. Unfortunately the short term financial health of New Zealand football is at stake. If we don't qualify for the World Cup with its $10 million payday then NZF is going to pull its spending on the development of the game in this country for the next few years - pleading poverty. It's vital we qualify. I don't care about Ricki's retirement plans.
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Diff is Elliott was good. He was also waived by san jose just a few months before South Africa so lets not compare the 2 shall we
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Simon Elliott didn't have a club and he played in the World Cup in 2010.
Don't think it's quite as clear-cut as you seem to be suggesting.
Oh yeah, Plodder selection is indefensible. But some of the other complaints are a bit outlandish.
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Simon added a lot more to the squad than just his ability. He played a big role in the leadership circle and was Ryan's right hand man.
Christie offers nothing.
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I thought I made it clear I wasn't referring to Plodder's selection?
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Simon Elliott didn't have a club and he played in the World Cup in 2010.
Don't think it's quite as clear-cut as you seem to be suggesting.
Oh yeah, Plodder selection is indefensible. But some of the other complaints are a bit outlandish.
Fuck this stupid game
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Apparently tossing in a 19-year old with barely two professional games under his belt (if that) would be preferable.
That could probably lose us the play-off in the first twenty minutes.
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Apparently tossing in a 19-year old with barely two professional games under his belt (if that) would be preferable.
That could probably lose us the play-off in the first twenty minutes.
Some occasions are just too big for rookies no matter how capable they look.
Fuck this stupid game
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Apparently tossing in a 19-year old with barely two professional games under his belt (if that) would be preferable.
That could probably lose us the play-off in the first twenty minutes.
I think it's frustrating that pressure hasn't been put on Locchead to find football somewhere, anywhere - he said he's remained in Wellington because his wife has a job there. Understandable but I don't think it's good enough that he hasn't gone and got some football somewhere. But there is no alternative really with Hogg suspended
Normo's coming home
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If we qualify and he doesnt find a club he prob knows he doesnt even need a club given christie selection
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And you have to remember that Hogg managed to look more out of his depth at A-league level at times than Caira. So you might even say there is no alternative really with Hogg...though he had been really good for city and for the AWs previously
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There has finally been some common sense in some of the last few posts.
Everyone is all "Lochhead sux" but no one has a viable alternative cause there is none.
While not directed at you TV specifically I accept you have a rod for Roux and Tuiloma. Fair enough and I have zero doubt they are the future and I back your calls on those two. You have to admit, the experience of Lochhead is a crucial factor in a home and away leg where the pressure is going to be huge. Does Herbert pick his trusted vet he has seen do a job time and time again or a kid playing youth football in France.
Its a similar reason Ivan is still there at his age. He goes out every time and does a job and the others don't perform better than him.
Grumpy old bastard alert
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I thought I made it clear I wasn't referring to Plodder's selection?
I wasn't referring to your comment. Just making a general statement about Elliott and Christie.
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I kind of feel all these arguements...though expressed with great passion are really just like arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.
Have a look at our midfield. We have 38 yo Ivan at DM....he is a great warrior but can we realistically expect him to run and chase in a high tempo game at an altitude that would knacker a player 10 years younger. Ivan admitted it was really tough in SA playing DM. In reserve we have the amateurs Clapham and Christie.....the gulf in quality between those guys and the Mexican midfield is enormous.
I got no problem with Locky, he is there by default but he knows the drill....however he should have had more pressure to get his arse into any club and get some match time.
Xavier is right...NZ has to really slow the tempo of the game way down. If we end up running around too much then after an hour or so the Mexicans will just carve us up
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I kind of feel all these arguements...though expressed with great passion are really just like arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.
Have a look at our midfield. We have 38 yo Ivan at DM....he is a great warrior but can we realistically expect him to run and chase in a high tempo game at an altitude that would knacker a player 10 years younger. Ivan admitted it was really tough in SA playing DM. In reserve we have the amateurs Clapham and Christie.....the gulf in quality between those guys and the Mexican midfield is enormous.
I got no problem with Locky, he is there by default but he knows the drill....however he should have had more pressure to get his arse into any club and get some match time.
Xavier is right...NZ has to really slow the tempo of the game way down. If we end up running around too much then after an hour or so the Mexicans will just carve us up
they call it a tactic game, a smart game, IN SA also most games were at altitude we played at soccer city and the ball was bouncing like a stone, very flat and weird bouncings. The heat is not a factor there, will be 16, 17 degrees good temperature, the altitude, yes it is hard for our team from Argentina and Uruguay to play from the beaches area to altitude, tactic game pass around , a linker barbarouses or brockie behind a striker wood, that nneds to man up and do the hard work of moving from left to right ,,...nz needs to play like USA AND JAMAICA DID THE OLD FASHIONED DYNAMIC,,,,..4-4-1-1, THEY BOTH GOT A RESULT....both Honduras and Panama played 4-4-1-1 and one won the other lost . Honduras changes to 4-4-2 in second half and reverted the result came from behind to win it 2-1 and Panama played blas perez as lone striker and got caught up so quickly a few times, and before half time, mexico scored a goal from a defensive blunder, thye changed more attacking, added a forward in 2nd half they drew level only to concede that goal from nowhere, very unlucky Panama
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