Leggys back!
Manchester United
Leggys back!
Only very occasionally.
Should have won last night. Thought Chelsea, despite all the possession, were toothless in the first half. Then we were easily the better team in the second.
The current situation is incredibly frustrating though... we're actually a pretty decent side when we play some bloody football. Pogba, Martial, Rashford, Mata... they all come alive when not being asked to chase long balls. Sure, we're short a decent defender, but we need to play football!
Reportedly Martial wants a new contract, Mourinho or no.
Another point towards the argument that "Jose has changed" (noted that there have been a few things said recently to argue he wont be here long)
"Because the approach was much more defensive [last season] and with a much more defensive approach you can hide better your weaknesses, so when the team is really defensive and you have a more defensive mind then you base the work on that, then the team doesn't develop enough in other areas but the team managed to get results based on that. I'm trying to find a balance where we develop the team in the second and first phase of attack and we develop the talented players that we have without losing the balance. When we are in control we have no problems, when the opponent is in control I think the team has problems."
Big performances needed against Juve and City - while wins would be huge, if we play well, then we generate some momentum to end the year.
2-1 come from behind win this morning, not sure they managed that Juve should have been up 3-0. We will take that
Juventus never lose at home. Massive result.
If there's anything I've learnt from watching United in the last few years, the words "should have won" mean nothing. ***Should*** qualify from here but still plenty of work to do.
I have to admit that that was a massive result. I watched it up to just after Ronaldo scored (and what a goal that was!!) and thought there was no way you getting anything out of that game. Was surprised to see the result later on. Well done.
Not sure who I hate more, Ronaldo the sexual assaulter or Mourinho the man child - I think Ronaldo may edge it, so well done to you.
Not sure who I hate more, Ronaldo the sexual assaulter or Mourinho the man child - I think Ronaldo may edge it, so well done to you.
Lets hope Ronaldo does not follow these threads otherwise you could have a libel case against you.:)
what's guna happen in this one?
City's "beautiful" football relies on the ability to get half their team forward. And to do that, you have to prevent counter attacks. Pep Guardiola sides are the kings of this.
Whether it's players falling over if they're pressed, Fernandinho cynically putting in two footed challenges from behind (like he did today), Stones rugby tackling players (like he did today), Mendy standing on the football incessantly, or even fans refusing to give the ball back.
And Steven Taylor bought it every single time.
City sure do play some class football, but it is built on a foundation of bullshark. Not sure why everyone laps it up so much.
In other news, we still look bad. We have scraped wins in the last week, but the football is still sharke. Matic has been terrible all year. Lukaku offers nothing. Fellaini is still Fellaini. And players like Fred and Pereira rot on the bench.
City's "beautiful" football relies on the ability to get half their team forward. And to do that, you have to prevent counter attacks. Pep Guardiola sides are the kings of this.
Whether it's players falling over if they're pressed, Fernandinho cynically putting in two footed challenges from behind (like he did today), Stones rugby tackling players (like he did today), Mendy standing on the football incessantly, or even fans refusing to give the ball back.
And Steven Taylor bought it every single time.
City sure do play some class football, but it is built on a foundation of bullshark. Not sure why everyone laps it up so much.
In other news, we still look bad. We have scraped wins in the last week, but the football is still sharke. Matic has been terrible all year. Lukaku offers nothing. Fellaini is still Fellaini. And players like Fred and Pereira rot on the bench.
Not to mention they also rely on UEFA looking the other way (during AND after the fact) while they break FFP regulation.
Agreed.
I don't buy this narrative some are presenting, saying things like "spend all the money you want, you still won't create football like that".
What a load of trash.
Spend that kind of money and you get the quality that CAN play football like that.
Agreed.
I don't buy this narrative some are presenting, saying things like "spend all the money you want, you still won't create football like that".
What a load of trash.
Spend that kind of money and you get the quality that CAN play football like that.
Fact is they are the best team in the league by a mile. Have quality in every position with back ups for each position. Anyone with any football knowledge would be be able to win the league with those players.
It's pretty well known Pep doesn't do challenges, he does winning teams who have big budgets.
It's pretty well known Pep doesn't do challenges, he does winning teams who have big budgets.
Can you blame him though? He keeps getting the gigs, keeps winning trophies, keeps making the money. Will go down a very successful coach without having had to deal with the big challenge of working with out of form teams without budgets.
Nope can't blame him at all, but I guess there will always be that question surrounding him and if what he's doing is truly special, or if another top level manager given the same resources could achieve the same?
As much as I find Mourinho outrageously petulant at times, I think what he achieved last season with coming second, given the squad that he had at his disposal, was a brilliant effort. Yes it was helped by several other top teams having average seasons but it was still a great position to end the season in.
I seriously do think that a lot of problems that United are having stem from the ownership and management of the club, the game is changing massively and they've already got a lot of catching up to do. I actually think they'll push pretty hard in January and look to sign one top player if not two.
I'm prepared to give Mourinho credit for the fact that he publicly maligned both Martial and Shaw and looked to have forced them out the door and they've come back and been two of our best this season. Of course that kind of treatment isn't going to motivate every player that way.
I'd love to see how we'd go under Mourinho without him being handcuffed by Woodward and co. Hopefully we go out in January and get a decent right winger and a strong centreback, but wouldn't be surprised if we waited for the summer.
I'm prepared to give Mourinho credit for the fact that he publicly maligned both Martial and Shaw and looked to have forced them out the door and they've come back and been two of our best this season. Of course that kind of treatment isn't going to motivate every player that way.
He maligned them in 2016.
I don't think this was a planned 2 year strategy to get to this point... Martial would not even be playing if the other forwards hadn't been so bad of late...
This rubbish that Mourinho is handcuffed by Woodward... please.
Jose Mourinho has spent how many millions and we've got a -1 goal difference. We can barely look good in a game against some of the worst teams in the league. Christ, we can't even string 4 passes together. Even when we're playing "well".
I would buy the excuses if we were sitting just below the best, playing decent, and needed an extra world class players to truly be the best in the world. But Mourinho has sold everyone bridge that he can't finish in the top 8 unless he has another 200 million.
The football is so extremely bad at Old Trafford, even with the last couple of wins. Players can't even shift the ball without taking 4 touches.
Mourinho has to go.
I would buy the excuses if we were sitting just below the best, playing decent, and needed an extra world class players to truly be the best in the world. But Mourinho has sold everyone bridge that he can't finish in the top 8 unless he has another 200 million.
Yet his arch enemy and 'specialist in failure' managed to consistently hit top 4 without that kind of coin. Man's imploding, what a joy to watch.
As much as I find Mourinho outrageously petulant at times, I think what he achieved last season with coming second, given the squad that he had at his disposal, was a brilliant effort.
This is just delightful.
We beat fudgeing Juventus at home during the week, then lost to one of the best footballing sides to play in the Prem, ever. Its not all roses and there's tons of room for improvement but christ the lot of you jerk your knees so hard I'm amazed you still have ACLs
I'm prepared to give Mourinho credit for the fact that he publicly maligned both Martial and Shaw and looked to have forced them out the door and they've come back and been two of our best this season. Of course that kind of treatment isn't going to motivate every player that way.
He maligned them in 2016.
I don't think this was a planned 2 year strategy to get to this point... Martial would not even be playing if the other forwards hadn't been so bad of late...
He's been publicly maligning Martial all season up until a few weeks ago. In pre-season he had a massive go at him for his commitment following the birth of his second child.
Lukaku, Lingard and Sanchez have been injured recently so him getting a run in the team initially had nothing to do with how bad the other forwards were.
I would buy the excuses if we were sitting just below the best, playing decent, and needed an extra world class players to truly be the best in the world. But Mourinho has sold everyone bridge that he can't finish in the top 8 unless he has another 200 million.
Yet his arch enemy and 'specialist in failure' managed to consistently hit top 4 without that kind of coin. Man's imploding, what a joy to watch.
It's like Campbell and Tataurangi. One could be consistently good, but the other could produce the sublime. Maybe. All kinds of career paths.
Nope can't blame him at all, but I guess there will always be that question surrounding him and if what he's doing is truly special, or if another top level manager given the same resources could achieve the same?
I'm prepared to give Mourinho credit for the fact that he publicly maligned both Martial and Shaw and looked to have forced them out the door and they've come back and been two of our best this season. Of course that kind of treatment isn't going to motivate every player that way.
He maligned them in 2016.
I don't think this was a planned 2 year strategy to get to this point... Martial would not even be playing if the other forwards hadn't been so bad of late...
He's been publicly maligning Martial all season up until a few weeks ago. In pre-season he had a massive go at him for his commitment following the birth of his second child.
Sounds like a great plan. What a masterstroke from Mourinho. Such an innovator with the motivation of young players. They must love him.
I would buy the excuses if we were sitting just below the best, playing decent, and needed an extra world class players to truly be the best in the world. But Mourinho has sold everyone bridge that he can't finish in the top 8 unless he has another 200 million.
Yet his arch enemy and 'specialist in failure' managed to consistently hit top 4 without that kind of coin. Man's imploding, what a joy to watch.
It's like Campbell and Tataurangi. One could be consistently good, but the other could produce the sublime. Maybe. All kinds of career paths.
Yea I like the analogy but it doesn't really apply. They aren't quite the right words... I certainly wouldn't describe any of Mourinho's teams as sublime by any stretch.
He spent tons of money, played dour football, won leagues and champions leagues, but not in sublime fashion. And I don't actually think he's capable of winning them any longer.
Wenger has certainly produced some very sublime teams, including one that went a league season unbeaten, playing a style of football Mourinho could only dream of. However I don't think he's capable of winning leagues any longer either.
Actually, perhaps they are like Campbell and Tataurangi, in that they're both finished?
Current thoughts...
Jose wanted to improve the squad by getting some more players he wanted and he didn't get them. Has largely the same squad as last season, plus Fred. Stat - only two Mourinho signings started against City.
The team has tried to play more open football, but clearly the defenders / team defending capabilities are not up to it. Yet the attackers, who have been allowed more freedom in some games, have not performed.
With Faria out and Carrick / McKenna in, there has certainly been pressures to move away from the focus on defense every game. But in the bigger games the compact, deep defending is still there. Inconsistencies in the system do not help players to consistently perform.
Because the players have been inconsistent, Jose has played the players who he trusts to follow his strategies more than their performances probably deserve. Lukaku and Sanchez needed rest earlier than they were given it, Matic has been poor for a number of weeks and we have been leaking goals but the back four doesn't change. Pereira hasn't been seen since week one and Fred has been used sparingly. Having league cup games would have been great.
After this break, there are 10 games in 5 weeks to the end of the year so there needs to be a very good run amongst that to turn things around. Valencia, Arsenal and Liverpool away will be tough so the remaining games need to be wins.
The problem is that there are many people that have a real bias against JM and their judgement is clouded. Changing managers right now would change nothing.
If Pep for example took over today,would we win the league----- no, because our players are not good enough. Sure we have some very good players but not enough to compete for the title. Look at it another way, Picking the best 11 from City/Utd we would at best get 2 in.
Looking at the best 11 in the EPL, City would get perhaps 5. It is one thing to be parochial but the fact is we would need to replace at least 5 players to challenge for the title. I have been saying this for some time. I have watched the City game twice and we were not crap, but they had a lot more classy players than we did. Some of the so called Utd fans can't see the wood for the trees.
Your players are of high enough quality to win the league, end of story.
No Pep would not win the league this year because they're mentally a shambles, and already too far behind. But he might win it next year or the year after. I'm pretty sure Mourinho won't, even with a lot more investment. He's already peaked last year with this team, that's how he rolls, time and again through his career.
Pep signed Mahrez, a proven EPL performer, he comes in and does a job. Mourinho signs Sanchez, a proven EPL performer, he's on the bench and a shadow of his former self. Perfect example of the gulf in class between Mourinho and Pep right now.
Your players are of high enough quality to win the league, end of story.
No Pep would not win the league this year because they're mentally a shambles, and already too far behind. But he might win it next year or the year after. I'm pretty sure Mourinho won't, even with a lot more investment. He's already peaked last year with this team, that's how he rolls, time and again through his career.
Pep signed Mahrez, a proven EPL performer, he comes in and does a job. Mourinho signs Sanchez, a proven EPL performer, he's on the bench and a shadow of his former self. Perfect example of the gulf in class between Mourinho and Pep right now.
That is only your opinion. There are lots of EPL pundits that disagree and former Utd greats. Even Keown has said so.I know which of these I would believe before you.
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/15115/1154...
This is only one that I have read of in the past few weeks.
Yes, correct, that is my personal opinion.
I don't care if you agree with it or not.
If all players were on top form we may have a shot. However, outside of Pogba and de Gea we don't have any truly world class players. The league can be won with lesser players (See Leicester, Fergie's last season) but it takes a perfect storm.
Given the lack of signings in the areas we need to sign players, which is no fault of Mou's, I think it is perfectly reasonable to put a good chunk of the blame back on the board and Ed Woodward.
Your players are of high enough quality to win the league, end of story.
No Pep would not win the league this year because they're mentally a shambles, and already too far behind. But he might win it next year or the year after. I'm pretty sure Mourinho won't, even with a lot more investment. He's already peaked last year with this team, that's how he rolls, time and again through his career.
Pep signed Mahrez, a proven EPL performer, he comes in and does a job. Mourinho signs Sanchez, a proven EPL performer, he's on the bench and a shadow of his former self. Perfect example of the gulf in class between Mourinho and Pep right now.
Pep would have to buy at least 2 new starting defenders, 1 new starting centre mid and a new atacker, plus a fair few (5?) squad players just so the squad would fit his system. And you think the United board would let him do that?
Pep has always been able to spend money where he has been, no surprise about the results then. When Pep started at City, they already had Aguero, Silva, Kompany, Sterling and De Bruyne and yet he has still signed 14 first team players. Jose had Martial, De Gea and Mata and has only made 9 signings
Jose has been trying to fit square pegs into round holes for two and a half seasons now. Should he change his approach? Yes, and this season I think he is making efforts to do so. But the players have not performed under any system for a while now and Jose masked some of that with his structured system.
It's so funny in here, honestly.
I hope it continues, the longer he's there the better for the rest of us.
ManU are a soundly sleeping giant right now, everyone shhhhhhhhhhhhhh please
Yes, correct, that is my personal opinion.
I don't care if you agree with it or not.
To assume that the players at Utd are good enough to win the league I would think that you would have watched them a few times this season. Well I bet you have not. I have see every game they have played, some more than once and I watch all the other sides in the top 6. There is no doubt that the squad as a whole does not have the quality.
It's so funny in here, honestly.
I hope it continues, the longer he's there the better for the rest of us.
ManU are a soundly sleeping giant right now, everyone shhhhhhhhhhhhhh please
At least we have not been asleep for 14 years.
Yes, correct, that is my personal opinion.
I don't care if you agree with it or not.
To assume that the players at Utd are good enough to win the league I would think that you would have watched them a few times this season. Well I bet you have not. I have see every game they have played, some more than once and I watch all the other sides in the top 6. There is no doubt that the squad as a whole does not have the quality.
*in your opinion*