Turns out all they needed to do was sack Muscat.
Liberato Cacace (Empoli | Italy)
Looks like it was one of his better games all season too, from what I'm seeing on forums. STVV fans seem to have had issues in the past with him being too defensive and not running with the ball enough - who would have thought? FWIW, he's looked comparatively great every time I've watched him
0-2 win this morning, Libby with the assist for the second. That is 5 wins in their last 6 games now.
Turns out all they needed to do was sack Muscat.
I wish the 'this' button still worked for this comment ?
Pretty typical Libby assist. Good work from the striker to have the awareness to step over the cut back.
Libby being linked with Juve ...
Juventus are interested in signing Liberato Cacace from Sint-Truiden as left back [it’d be for the U23 team]. Still details to be sorted to complete Bryan Reynolds deal with Dallas FC. ⚪️⚫️ @SkySport @DiMarzio #Juve
— Fabrizio Romano (@FabrizioRomano) January 20, 2021
https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/world-game/...
if this is the case he'd be crazy not to take it, playing in their under 23's for a couple of years would be amazing.
The name itself is amazing and shows that he made the right choice in going to a team where he is playing.
On a side note, what is the level like of the u23s? would it be better to stay with where he is if it means he is playing at a higher level?
The name itself is amazing and shows that he made the right choice in going to a team where he is playing.
On a side note, what is the level like of the u23s? would it be better to stay with where he is if it means he is playing at a higher level?
Agent talk?
U23s play in Serie C. So definitely a step down from the Belgian 1st Division.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juventus_F.C._Under-...
If they loaned him out to a lower Serie A club, or Serie B side may make some sense, whilst on books of Juve. Bit like Singh with Bayern, who was initially signed to BM II.
But if it's going well in Belgium, why leave so soon.
I'm sure New Zealand Power would have some views, on whether be a good move or not.
It would be a good move if he got to train with the first team and maybe the odd appearance on the bench or in cup games but if he’s just playing with u23’s it’s probably not worth it
It would be a good move if he got to train with the first team and maybe the odd appearance on the bench or in cup games but if he’s just playing with u23’s it’s probably not worth it
Pretty much my thoughts on it too, especially since he's been playing first team football since he was what, 17? Still, nice to see he's getting noticed by the calibre of clubs we all think he should be aspiring too.
Ok, a few things to mull over...
- Juve U23 play in Serie C (third - and fully pro - tier in Italian football). Decent enough level though a step down from the Belgian top flight. Added bonus of being scouted by other teams in Italy/potentially being aggregated to the first team (would be massive)
- Juve's interest has been reported in the Italian media over the last few hours, including SkyTV who are reporting €5-6 are on the table at this stage.
Overall, it would be a good move for his, especially if his goal is to play in Italy/potentially Serie A.
Juve are the most successful club and their U23 is chock full of talent. He'd be playing for a strong Serie C team and who knows what might happen next. He'd also not have the issue of learning the language/fit in with the culture which is huge!
That being said, why leave after only 16 games in the Belgian top flight?? Really difficult decision. Staying put has worked for him in the past.
I guess it will come down to a) are Juve REALLY interested, b) can they afford him?, c) how much will they offer him and what promises will they make to him?
Juve U23 is a graveyard for young players, and Serie C is a loooong way down from top division football in Belgium. If Juve are seriously interested they'll get him and loan him out to a Serie A or, at worst, top tier Serie B team. If U23 is all that's on offer, he'll take a big step down just to be at a big club, and it'll hurt him developmentally while not realistically bringing him any closer to the Juve first team.
I count six players in the current Juve squad who came from the u23s. Only one (Gianluca Frabotta) seems to have cemented a spot in the matchday squad.
Agree with 2ndBest. Juve have drawn from their youth team and players have gone on to bigger and better things.
Agree also with Boxy that Belgian top tier >>> Serie C as I said in my post.
Tough decision though as a club like Juventus doesn't come knocking on your door every week...
But Belgium is a very good league and certainly puts him in the shop window within Europe
Agree with 2ndBest. Juve have drawn from their youth team and players have gone on to bigger and better things.
The difference with the guys that Dale mentioned is that they were basically 18/19 year olds playing in Serie C when Juve U23 came knocking. You obviously jump at an opportunity like that from that type of situation.
When you're an established starter at 20 years old in a respectable top division in Europe with close to 3 seasons of full professional experience, you're not going to advance your career by going to Serie C, even if it is Juve U23.
would be the most crazy move, considering the deliberate move he made to a mid table club in a mid quality league
Of course putting muscats sacking to one side
Libby being linked with Juve ...
Juventus are interested in signing Liberato Cacace from Sint-Truiden as left back [it’d be for the U23 team]. Still details to be sorted to complete Bryan Reynolds deal with Dallas FC. ⚪️⚫️ @SkySport @DiMarzio #Juve
— Fabrizio Romano (@FabrizioRomano) January 20, 2021
Such a click-bait non-story.....
Reporter; hmmm, Juventus need a LB for their second team. Let's check out transfermarkt.
Three mins later.....
Reporter; Ahhhh, look at this! A young Italiano LB who would cost peanuts. Bingo!
Editor; Fabrizio my boy, this is mucho mucho grande!! Who was your source?
Reporter; (strokes his chin a la Marlon Brando).....I know people......
Agree with 2ndBest. Juve have drawn from their youth team and players have gone on to bigger and better things.
Agree also with Boxy that Belgian top tier >>> Serie C as I said in my post.
Tough decision though as a club like Juventus doesn't come knocking on your door every week...
But Belgium is a very good league and certainly puts him in the shop window within Europe
I was actually implying that of their match day squad only one has come through the u23 team. That's not great odds.
If you look at contracts acquired by the likes of Chelsea etc. is Libby better off keeping his fate in his own hands for now? Which move makes it more likely for him to be a guaranteed starter in a good league in 2 or 3 years? Hard to say.
If Juve are interested surely others are too? Or maybe are prepared to wait?
Guess we'll see. He was rumoured to have turned down bigger clubs for STVV yeh?
Agree with 2ndBest. Juve have drawn from their youth team and players have gone on to bigger and better things.
Agree also with Boxy that Belgian top tier >>> Serie C as I said in my post.
Tough decision though as a club like Juventus doesn't come knocking on your door every week...
But Belgium is a very good league and certainly puts him in the shop window within Europe
I was actually implying that of their match day squad only one has come through the u23 team. That's not great odds.
Of the 31(!) players that were released or sold from the Juve U23 team at the end of last season (many of them were on loan). Nine now play in a better league than the Belgium first division, a further 8 player in Serie B. That's not bad odds to play either at a better level or at least in Italy as it appears he wants to do.
I've been an All Whites fan for nearly 40 years. Gotta say it warms my heart to have reached a point where a New Zealand footballer has multiple decent professional options in Europe and it seems fairly normal... wouldn't have thought "stay in Belgian First Division or move to Juventus" would've been a part of the future when I was watching the All Whites v Chinese Taipei at Western Springs in the late 80s *... it's just really good :)
[*Aside from the "Wynton to Lazio" rumour when he was at Werder Bremen, but then his whole career was really an outlier at the time]
This is a stunning move. He's undoubtedly going to be on a few loan moves throughout his Juve career, with Serie A teams already interested (main one is Sassuolo). When he's not out gaining experience in a top 5 league, he's going to be training alongside Ronaldo at one of the best facilities on the planet with world-class coaching and competing for Juve's very weak left-back spot.
This is absolutely not a stockpiling transfer - there's a difference between this and, say, Issa Kabore. There's a clear pathway with Cacace, and if he doesn't make it at Juventus I'm sure he'll settle with Serie A, a league in which he's good enough to play a part in already without a doubt.
I've been an All Whites fan for nearly 40 years. Gotta say it warms my heart to have reached a point where a New Zealand footballer has multiple decent professional options in Europe and it seems fairly normal... wouldn't have thought "stay in Belgian First Division or move to Juventus" would've been a part of the future when I was watching the All Whites v Chinese Taipei at Western Springs in the late 80s *... it's just really good :)
[*Aside from the "Wynton to Lazio" rumour when he was at Werder Bremen, but then his whole career was really an outlier at the time]
This.
It may just all be rumours/agent talk (but does appear more than that), but yeah sheer fact people are debating whether a young Kiwi should sign with Juve or not, would have been the football news of the decade in 1980's to early 2000's.
But now you have Singh signed by Bayern, plus a swathe of young Kiwis at Euro pro clubs. Joe Bell could have been no 1 MLS Super Draft pick last year, and this morning Welnix grad Calvin Harris who was almost signed by the Nix on a Visa deal according to David Dome, goes no 2 pick. Mexican wunder kid Eugenio Pizzuto, who was also at Welnix and is now at Lille.
Heady times and if Cacace signs for Juve (aside of all the whether it's a good move for him), more people overseas will be looking at NZ Football, and esp the Nix. Even in Aus they will be wondering a bit, why on the surface NZ's development programme seems to be out performing theirs's.
I've been an All Whites fan for nearly 40 years. Gotta say it warms my heart to have reached a point where a New Zealand footballer has multiple decent professional options in Europe and it seems fairly normal... wouldn't have thought "stay in Belgian First Division or move to Juventus" would've been a part of the future when I was watching the All Whites v Chinese Taipei at Western Springs in the late 80s *... it's just really good :)
[*Aside from the "Wynton to Lazio" rumour when he was at Werder Bremen, but then his whole career was really an outlier at the time]
This.
It may just all be rumours/agent talk (but does appear more than that), but yeah sheer fact people are debating whether a young Kiwi should sign with Juve or not, would have been the football news of the decade in 1980's to early 2000's.
But now you have Singh signed by Bayern, plus a swathe of young Kiwis at Euro pro clubs. Joe Bell could have been no 1 MLS Super Draft pick last year, and this morning Welnix grad Calvin Harris who was almost signed by the Nix on a Visa deal according to David Dome, goes no 2 pick. Mexican wunder kid Eugenio Pizzuto, who was also at Welnix and is now at Lille.
Heady times and if Cacace signs for Juve (aside of all the whether it's a good move for him), more people overseas will be looking at NZ Football, and esp the Nix. Even in Aus they will be wondering a bit, why on the surface NZ's development programme seems to be out performing theirs's.
This to both of you!
I've been an All Whites fan for nearly 40 years. Gotta say it warms my heart to have reached a point where a New Zealand footballer has multiple decent professional options in Europe and it seems fairly normal... wouldn't have thought "stay in Belgian First Division or move to Juventus" would've been a part of the future when I was watching the All Whites v Chinese Taipei at Western Springs in the late 80s *... it's just really good :)
[*Aside from the "Wynton to Lazio" rumour when he was at Werder Bremen, but then his whole career was really an outlier at the time]
This.
It may just all be rumours/agent talk (but does appear more than that), but yeah sheer fact people are debating whether a young Kiwi should sign with Juve or not, would have been the football news of the decade in 1980's to early 2000's.
But now you have Singh signed by Bayern, plus a swathe of young Kiwis at Euro pro clubs. Joe Bell could have been no 1 MLS Super Draft pick last year, and this morning Welnix grad Calvin Harris who was almost signed by the Nix on a Visa deal according to David Dome, goes no 2 pick. Mexican wunder kid Eugenio Pizzuto, who was also at Welnix and is now at Lille.
Heady times and if Cacace signs for Juve (aside of all the whether it's a good move for him), more people overseas will be looking at NZ Football, and esp the Nix. Even in Aus they will be wondering a bit, why on the surface NZ's development programme seems to be out performing theirs's.
With all those names mentioned you'd have to imagine/hope that some top European club's would be making some sort of moves to align or partner with the Nix. The Australians in our squad would definitely benefit too no doubt - the Piscopo's and Devlin's who I'm sure would have aspirations to get a crack at Europe.
As for Libby, even though the interest may be there from Juventus, he has his head firmly on his shoulders. I mean if he gave the Nix another year in terms of playing last season for us, then made a sensible decision to get to a decent European league where he's able to tick up first team minutes week in, week out, then I'd say he's got at least another season in Belgium to tuck into before any thought of another move. If club's are still after him at that point, then he might have to sit down and have some decisions to make. Other than that it's all up to him, however, I do think he'll still be in Belgium for at least another season.
Looks like overnight 'Juventus interested in Liberato Cacace for their under-23/Serie C team' became 'Juventus interested in Cacace to loan him to fellow Serie A club Sassuolo to help them sign young Italian striker Gianluca Scamacca'.
— Andrew Voerman (@andrewvoerman) January 22, 2021
Might make it a more attractive move. https://t.co/IPQ7y3HhSR
I'm really excited by all these rumours but I can't shake the memory of that Fiorentina v Roma game a few years back when Josh Brillante, who at the time had done very well in the A-league, got mauled alive and never played another game in Serie A ever again.
Sure, Libby has had a few games in Belgium and is proving himself there, but we're talking one of the best leagues in the world where the amount of pressure in unbearable for many. You make a mistake and you're in the line of fire for months.
Sassuolo would be a great destination though, they have a proven track record of developing young players... Then again he'd get more games in Serie C..
I'll keep watching with interest and see what the Italian news have to say
I'm really excited by all these rumours but I can't shake the memory of that Fiorentina v Roma game a few years back when Josh Brillante, who at the time had done very well in the A-league, got mauled alive and never played another game in Serie A ever again.
Sure, Libby has had a few games in Belgium and is proving himself there, but we're talking one of the best leagues in the world where the amount of pressure in unbearable for many. You make a mistake and you're in the line of fire for months.
Sassuolo would be a great destination though, they have a proven track record of developing young players... Then again he'd get more games in Serie C..
I'll keep watching with interest and see what the Italian news have to say
Yeah in the last, what, four weeks? Huge potential but hasn't exactly lit up the league prior to a month ago.
this is the academy programmes. Nix would get a piece of any transfer?
this is the academy programmes. Nix would get a piece of any transfer?
this is the academy programmes. Nix would get a piece of any transfer?
This from Chris Wood thread, 3.5 years ago when he moved from Leeds to Burnley, re sell on clauses.
MetalLegNZ wrote:
at what point do his previous clubs stop getting a cut... even if it was only .5% Hamilton Wanderers would be stocked. I know the rule was brought in to help support small clubs not been taken advantage of... just don't know what age it stops.
RR wrote:
Solidarity Payments (5% of the transfer fee spread over the clubs they were at from ages 12-23) occur every time a fee is paid.
Jerzy Merino wrote:
so if he goes for 15 mill and Cambridge, Hamilton, West Bromwich, Leicester are his previous clubs, they all stand to get a quarter of 750 thou which is 187,500 pounds. Which is $NZ337,500. Which ain't bad.
RR wrote:
5% of the 5% for each year at ages 12-15, 10% of the 5% for each year at ages 16-23. So 0.25% of 15 mil if he was at your club when he was 12, its a very handy pay out for a club.
This from Chris Wood thread, 3.5 years ago when he moved from Leeds to Burnley, re sell on clauses.
MetalLegNZ wrote:
at what point do his previous clubs stop getting a cut... even if it was only .5% Hamilton Wanderers would be stocked. I know the rule was brought in to help support small clubs not been taken advantage of... just don't know what age it stops.
RR wrote:
Solidarity Payments (5% of the transfer fee spread over the clubs they were at from ages 12-23) occur every time a fee is paid.
Jerzy Merino wrote:
so if he goes for 15 mill and Cambridge, Hamilton, West Bromwich, Leicester are his previous clubs, they all stand to get a quarter of 750 thou which is 187,500 pounds. Which is $NZ337,500. Which ain't bad.
RR wrote:
5% of the 5% for each year at ages 12-15, 10% of the 5% for each year at ages 16-23. So 0.25% of 15 mil if he was at your club when he was 12, its a very handy pay out for a club.
The Cacace to Juve is a cool story. Probably only a rumor but it shows that Libby is on a solid pathway. At 20 years of age you really want to be getting as many games under your belt as possible.Playing where he is perfect for his development. The really top clubs like Juve and Bayern have 60+ players on their books. As Singh found out the chances of cracking the first team are close to zero. You then get dicked around being loaned out and you need a lot of luck to find somewhere secure.
The ideal pathway for me for Libby would be to stay in Belgium for a couple more seasons, maybe be picked up by one of the top teams in the Belgium League, play for them in the Europe Comp and then hopefully get your big break to somewhere in Italy when you are likely to be first team material.
The Cacace to Juve is a cool story. Probably only a rumor but it shows that Libby is on a solid pathway. At 20 years of age you really want to be getting as many games under your belt as possible.Playing where he is perfect for his development. The really top clubs like Juve and Bayern have 60+ players on their books. As Singh found out the chances of cracking the first team are close to zero. You then get dicked around being loaned out and you need a lot of luck to find somewhere secure.
The ideal pathway for me for Libby would be to stay in Belgium for a couple more seasons, maybe be picked up by one of the top teams in the Belgium League, play for them in the Europe Comp and then hopefully get your big break to somewhere in Italy when you are likely to be first team material.
Not taking into account first team football at their new club, out of the 15 players to leave Bayern 2 at the end of last season - 9 are playing in a better league than the Belgium first division, 2 are playing in 2. Bundesliga (and 1 is retired). It seems the odds of playing at a high level after being part of the development for a top tier club are pretty good. Will be a difficult choice for Libby if the chance presents itself, but it's most likely that whatever his decision, he has enough talent and it will be his ability to not get injured that decides where he ends up in his career.
Woke up early this morn, any tips on where I can find a stream for the game they have in an hour or so?
Full game and a yellow, in a 0-2 home loss to Excel Mouscron (16th)
2nd goal conceded at 89 mins.
Good run of beating teams above them, then lose to a lower placed side.
S-T 15th