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Danny Hay's views

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Danny Hay's views
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Most of us would agree with his comments about Old, and despite Elrich's form I wonder if Hay is deliberately ignoring the fact that Elrich isn't (as far as I know) on marquee wages.

But my main interest is in his comments about Dodd, what's going on there? Ego? Or is Dodd's play flawed in ways i and others on here haven't noticed?

And it seems that Danny has focused on Lia as a stop gap right back , not as a midfield player.

Interesting, and it confirms Marius's view that the Sunday News offers the best (if not necessarily the most palatable) Phoenix coverage on a Sunday.

But overall, despite the fact that i struggle to read criticisms of Nix players and keep a clear head, the general direction of the article is probably spot-on.



tigers2008-01-27 10:25:06
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
cheers Yomcat, fixed
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I think Danny Hay needs to keep his conker out of it.

"Do you know who I think I am" - Needs to be said to Hay
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
that's pretty much how i reacted at first, but a bit of time (and two edits ) later, I'd settled down a bit





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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Let's face it he's just saying what we've been saying on here for the last few months.  Except in regard to Dodd.  I don't think he's so far wide of the mark, and he has been there and done that in world football more than most in this country.

Incredible stamina. No shame. Yellow Fever.

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Lonegunman will agree with his thoughts re Dodd. A fair summary. A lot of his points have been mentioned at various stages this season. So some people here do know what they are talking about.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Who are ya?

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Yep LG, will be in like Flynn

but I'm still unclear what specific weaknesses either LG or others see in Dodd's play


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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
tigers wrote:
I'm still unclear what specific weaknesses either LG or others see in Dodd's play


All that Hay seems to be saying is that Dodd isn't the guy to lead a backline - don't think he's implying that Dodd's a bad player, just that he needs a bit more guidance on the field. I would not entirely disagree with this view; I think the fact that Dodd has been our best defensive player this year doesn't mean that he's perfect or doesn't have room to improve.
Totally agree with Hay on Elrich, I'd also be tempted to release Rees, but I'd look to keep Lia and Aloisi, although I'm not sure I'd be looking at either of them as potential starters for the next season at this point.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Is Rees relased or not? I've heard conflicting reports. I'd agree with him about everything bar Dodd, I think him and Durante in central defense would be an excellent base.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Lia? f**k off.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
In before LGM.

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Definitely agree with him.

It still hasn't been confirmed that we are resigning Felipe.
If we are then we only have openings for 2 foreign players, should they both be defenders, or should we get a marquee striker?

I'd rather get a marquee defender who can organise the backline.
We have enough youth strikers for now.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Yep you got it. It's brutal but in reality it's acurate. we'd all like Aloisi to another year, not sure if his legs are that much gone. But Aloisi has that captains respect, experience and personality that is helpful to all the players. From the junior debutants to the seniors such as Covs. If he doea retire, I think the club should keep him on in a coaching role and make the use of his skills and experience.
 
Harsh too on Rees whom for me apart from lochhead at the back was our best defender.
 
Dodd, what can I say? Started off really well and then got found out. Slow on the turn, heads the ball well but usually to an opponent. Not alone of course, Old and O'dor weren't up to the standards required and Plodder was a stop-gap fix at RB.
 
Elrich? Well we've all been saying that, Wonder goal and thats it from him.
 
Smeltz desperately needs a partner. Covs was an excellent foil. Not scoring but creating chances and dragging players away from Smeltz. I reckon we need another Covs but 18 years younger. Lia promised much but didtn't deliver as much as his talent could have.
 
Shame Johnson isn't 15 years yonger. We need a player that can throw himself about and remind the opposition who's da boss.
 
Despite what you all think of me and my views. I'm sure that the players all went out there to give their best (even Elrich) and although it didn't quite work out that way, they tried. And for that I'm really happy. We never really got thrashed, not even in our poorest performances. 4-1 being our worst score but also our best! The noise at the stadium when we score is something I always cheerish and when we witnessed a win for our team, the buzz around town after the game was so noticeable.
 
Hay, maybe some jealousy but then it was his choice to stay in Auckland. His loss not ours. Yet what he said needed to be said if we want to keep going forward. Now if only Mr Hay would like to offer some names as a solution.
 
For me, we need a RB, or a RWB, 2CB's and a striker. I'd be aiming for the 24 - 28 age group and for players whom dont want to play in snow and rain and like the lifestyle Wellington can offer them. An understanding of English and Portugeeze would be a big advantage.
Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!

The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I'm not going to be popular for saying this, but to be honest I wouldn't be too worried if we don't keep Felipe. He is a brilliant player but in midfield we have Bertos, Ferrante, Daniel, Lia, and Elrich (who admittedly had an awful season, but I think he will do a lot better next season). We don't really need him do we?

I agreed with most of what Hay said except about Dodd who I reckon has done a good job with our shaky defence.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Lia? f**k off.


Why not Lia, HP? He's still young and has shown some promise, I'd like to keep him around next season and see how he fares rather than writing him off this early, even if as just a squad player.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I think HP meant keep lia look at his sig.

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
If we had to let a defender go for a new defender. I think it might be Rees because he is the only one coming off contract. I'd prefer Old went but that would be bad for the salary cap.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
*faceplants* My bad haha
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Is it just me, or does Danny Hay need to shut his mouth and face the fact that he's not in the Phoenix squad, nor will he ever be! Some of the things he said were true (aka. Old = crap) but I'm in defence of his assessment of Karl Dodd, he's a young defender and has been good this season, just happened to be poorly supported. Nobody wants to hear from Danny Hay, stick to playing in the AMATEUR league that is the NZFC old man!
 
Rant over,
shabba1212008-01-27 15:26:25
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Do you think, shabba121, that the reason Danny Hay mentioned Karl Dodd is because Hay wants Dodd's spot in the squad?loyalgunner2008-01-27 15:35:29
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
chocnut wrote:
I think HP meant keep lia look at his sig.



Yep I did. I was saying f**k off to Hay.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
At the end of the day, Hay told the club he didn't want to move to Wellington but he would be interested in commuting down via aircraft. He made his choice and has to live with it.
 
Despite my criticisms of Dodd, he's young and learning. If some of you believe he's good now, he isn't as good as he could be with the right coaching. Hay has had his day and I think he'd have been a disruption to the Nix if he had of signed up.
 
Dodd does have a future, Hay has retirment. I'd like to see the Nix sign a top quality CD for Dodd to learn from/partner with. I'd also like to see Durante here.
Lonegunmen2008-01-27 19:44:23
Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!

The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
How can anyone rate Rees over Dodd? Stupid. Rees is a VPL player at best and is simply a stop gap measure.

I don't understand how people can defend Lia either - sure, he showed a little bit of promise in a couple of games but what does he really offer? He can't tackle without lunging in, isn't a great passer of the ball, not that much pace etc. He's a decent bench player/squad player but that is it. Ferrante is 2x the player he is.

Suprisingly I agreed with most of the points Hay made.
valeo2008-01-27 15:58:26

a.haak

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Why is Rees getting potted all of sudden? I think he made a huge difference to the back line from his first appearance - there was much more stability and times were less nervous when he was on the field.
Steven Old to go makes sense, he doesn't seem match aware and it hasn't improved over the season.
And maybe as said above, Felipe could go - he's a good footballer but he's made about as much impact as Juninho, due to getting muscled off the ball.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I presume Danny Hay wrote this in his column. He's gotta be able to say something in his column, and good on him for commenting on the Nix lpayers, better than most other columnists who stick to safe generalities.
I know Hay seems close to the mix, and so it seems like sour grapes. I cenrtainly felt this way when he left the Knights and played against us for Perth, and played better than he had for us!
But still I support him in making those points.
I reckon Dodd has done well, but if you look at most other franchises, they have mean experienced centre backs who keep everyone else on their toes, e.g. Popovic telling Renaud to do his job in very persuasive language, on Friday night. Keep Doddy but get a leader.

Oi Oi Edgecumbe... lets have a clean sheet

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Why is Rees getting potted all of sudden? I think he made a huge difference to the back line from his first appearance - there was much more stability and times were less nervous when he was on the field.
Steven Old to go makes sense, he doesn't seem match aware and it hasn't improved over the season.
And maybe as said above, Felipe could go - he's a good footballer but he's made about as much impact as Juninho, due to getting muscled off the ball.


Uhh, our defence may have looked better to you but how many goals did we leak? About the same as we did without him. His positioning is just as bad as Old and he gets run around very easily. He might be better in a back 4.

Juninho has the most assists in the league btw and he has only played about 1/3 of the games.
valeo2008-01-27 16:47:47

a.haak

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Why is Rees getting potted all of sudden? I think he made a huge difference to the back line from his first appearance - there was much more stability and times were less nervous when he was on the field.
Steven Old to go makes sense, he doesn't seem match aware and it hasn't improved over the season.


Rees is getting potted because he is the only defender coming off contract. It would be stupid for Ricki to fire Old because his salary would still count for next season (as he is on a 2 year contract) and make it harder for us to attract a better defender. Don't get me wrong I think Rees made us a ton more stable at the back but to challenge for the playoffs we need some defenders that have a bit more skill. I'd prefer to see Old or Christie go.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
EXACTLY LG, Hay is jealous of Dodd being a younger and more talented CB than he was/is/ever will be.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
As much as I hate to admit it, what Danny Hay said made quite a bit of sense. Sometimes you need someone to be brutally honest.
 
Rickie had to recruit last year after every other A-League side had already settled their squads. So we got quite a few, what you would describe as "journeymen" players. Either formally good players on their way down because of age...such as Aloisi, Johnson, Coveny or players who struggle to excel at the A-League level eg Old, Lia, Christie and maybe Rees.
 
The key word is EXCEL...if the Phoenix are to make the playoffs next year we need more players who can perform at the very top level, not journeymen. There is room for the like of Lia and Rees but only as squadies to cover for injuries etc for your A team. I am more positive than Hay. We have the core of a good team...it may only need 3 or 4 top quality players to make it a great team!!
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
shabba121 wrote:
EXACTLY LG, Hay is jealous of Dodd being a younger and more talented CB than he was/is/ever will be.


Hmm, I don't know about that.  How many Champions League appearances do you think Dodd will get?  Not at centre back I'll grant you, but still, Hay was very very good in his day.

Incredible stamina. No shame. Yellow Fever.

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
smithy246 wrote:
shabba121 wrote:
EXACTLY LG, Hay is jealous of Dodd being a younger and more talented CB than he was/is/ever will be.


Hmm, I don't know about that.  How many Champions League appearances do you think Dodd will get?  Not at centre back I'll grant you, but still, Hay was very very good in his day.
 
He was also injury prone and played more games for Wallsall than Leeds.
Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!

The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Lonegunmen wrote:
smithy246 wrote:
shabba121 wrote:
EXACTLY LG, Hay is jealous of Dodd being a younger and more talented CB than he was/is/ever will be.
Hmm, I don't know about that.� How many Champions League appearances do you think Dodd will get?� Not at centre back I'll grant you, but still, Hay was very very good in his day.

�

He was also injury prone and played more games for Wallsall than Leeds.


He didn't play many games for Leeds at all - wouldn't be surprised if the number is in single figures. And his Champions League experience consists of a 2 minute appearance as a substitute at Nou Camp with Leeds losing 4-0 at the time. Not exactly great credentials.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
he was pretty fortunate that Leeds had about half a dozen injured defenders at the same time

Founder

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I think Danny Hay's assessment was harsh and honest and generally right, and most of the posts on this forum make very good points.  I don't want to criticise any specific players as I prefer to leave the selection of the squad to Ricki and the Phoenix management.  Also, I agree with Lonegunmen when he says that all the boys went out there and tried their best.  Ricki realises that to be successful in attracting the crowds and sponsors (which equates to earning important revenue) he needs to play an entertaining brand of football.  Based on the 2007/08 season, the club will need to recruit several new players who are able to perform at a higher skill level, and who have more pace and vision, if we are to target the top four.  In this regard, the imports and marquee player will be critical decision areas for the club.  They need to be the core around which the team is built.  On Dodd, I thought he was one of the best and most consistent performers throughout the season, particularly for someone so young.  As LG points out, he will only get better and better if the club can recruit a classy experienced central defender (perhaps one of the import spots).  All the best to Ricki and Tony P for their forthcoming overseas recruitment trip.  It's a tough assignment but a crucial one for the club if we are to build from the previous season.  It was also pleasing to see Terry S comment during the week that he now better understands what is needed to drive the club forward.  His comments indicate that he is a man with ambition and drive, and is motivated to do well. 
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Lonegunmen wrote:
smithy246 wrote:
shabba121 wrote:
EXACTLY LG, Hay is jealous of Dodd being a younger and more talented CB than he was/is/ever will be.
Hmm, I don't know about that.  How many Champions League appearances do you think Dodd will get?  Not at centre back I'll grant you, but still, Hay was very very good in his day.

 

He was also injury prone and played more games for Wallsall than Leeds.


He didn't play many games for Leeds at all - wouldn't be surprised if the number is in single figures. And his Champions League experience consists of a 2 minute appearance as a substitute at Nou Camp with Leeds losing 4-0 at the time. Not exactly great credentials.


A lot more credentials than anyone on this forum though.

Also much better credentials than Dodd, which was the original point.

Incredible stamina. No shame. Yellow Fever.

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
smithy246 wrote:
Lonegunmen wrote:
smithy246 wrote:
shabba121 wrote:
EXACTLY LG, Hay is jealous of Dodd being a younger and more talented CB than he was/is/ever will be.
Hmm, I don't know about that.  How many Champions League appearances do you think Dodd will get?  Not at centre back I'll grant you, but still, Hay was very very good in his day.

 

He was also injury prone and played more games for Wallsall than Leeds.


He didn't play many games for Leeds at all - wouldn't be surprised if the number is in single figures. And his Champions League experience consists of a 2 minute appearance as a substitute at Nou Camp with Leeds losing 4-0 at the time. Not exactly great credentials.


A lot more credentials than anyone on this forum though.

Also much better credentials than Dodd, which was the original point.
 
I agree Smithy.  Let's not simply rubbish Hay's views.  He does have experience and was certainly good enough to interest clubs and play at a high professional level in the UK (and probably would have done a lot better if not for his dodgy groin).  It a bit like Pim Veerbik's views the other day about the standard of the A-League - harsh but honest, from a reputable European coach.  Let's take the criticism and move forward.  The A-League is understandably no where near the standard of the professional stuff in the UK and Europe.  It simply doesn't have the pedigree or the money.  I had a friend from London out here in December who is a fanatical Chelsea supporter (since being knee high to a grasshopper) and took her her one of the Phoenix home games.  She thought the standard of the game was comparable to one of the part-time professional leagues in England, although admittedly it was, unfortunately, one of the less attractive games the Phoenix have played in 2007/08.  However, she also really enjoyed herself and got into the chanting etc (thought the YF were fantastic) as if she were at Stamford Bridge.  Same for me.  The A-League has been fantastically entertaining and the Phoenix have certainly had a huge impact on my life.  I'm sure it's going to get a lot better in the next few years as youth development happens and the competition is able to attract better imports and marquee players.  The point is, let's be realistic about what we've got and enjoy it, and look forward to an even higher standard of entertainment as the league progresses in the coming years. 
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I'd love to volunteer as baggage boy for Ricki & Tony so long as they supply travel for me too! My passport is still valid!
 
Seriously. On my list I'd be looking at players whom are good but not getting the games at their club. One's who might be prepared to take a wage cut for a more relaxed lifestyle. We want winners of course and players who want to give their best for the Nix. Players whom are currently part of a squad but want first team football. Aged between 23 & 28 - that means they;ll give us a future and should have some serious match experience already. Players prepared to be idolised by 11K of hardcore Nix fans.
Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!

The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!

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