Is Oz turning into a nasty, mean-spirited country?

Or has it always been this way?

Serious thread.

Compared to what/who.

I think so

Compared to what it was say 5, 10, 20 years ago.

Oz is just like the US in terms of perceptions. Anyone who has spent a decent amount of time in the US knows that the average American is just like the average Kiwi, we all essentially want the same things. Same with Aussie. Spend some time there and you end up loving the place and more importantly the people.

OK, I should elaborate a bit more.  Am really looking at Government (Federal and State), instruments of Government, but yeah maybe even the national psyche (the vibe in The Castle vernacular).

It may be just the type of media that is developing in the last few years, but here in Really East Sydney it just seems that Oz is more xenophobic, intolerant and rigid than it used to be.

As I don't live there I'd be very curious to know if that is just a media beat up.

Funny you should mention being like the USA.  When you have a leading contender for the Republican presidential candidate in the form of Trump, the next one being some self-important neuro-surgeon and an increasingly militarised police farce, you've really got to wonder...

Yes, people are the same all over the world in terms of what we want.  The few times I've been to Oz I've really liked it, but then I've liked going to the USA and other places.

Think you would love living in Auckland as well Junior

Steady on.

I reckon it's all down to a good economic climate with folk being well off with a libralist government in power.

Some of us had money under Thatcher but she was a c*nt  and life reflected that. Intolerance, etc. 

Look at Clinton and that was a pretty good period for the USA.

The more contented we are the less angry we are.

Australa has gone dramatically downhill since I crossed the seas by which it is girt

Don't think there's been that much of a change. I feels like there's been a dearth of political talent of late. I feel that Hawke, Keating and Howard were much better leaders than the current lot (or maybe I was just younger and stupider).

Aussie has always had some fairly nasty parts to its society, but many parts that live up to the young, lucky country moniker. I think Aussie has always a been a bit tougher and rougher than NZ, less forgiving. I have a theory it's the climate. 

I certainly think the Conservative movement spin-doctors Crosby Textor certainly have tapped into a nasty vein in NZ, Aussie and Britain (and perhaps Canada?), but it has to be there to be tapped into, or else it doesn't work right?

Also when a group is in power other groups tend not to stick their neck out, as mostly the only thing that happens is it getting chopped off. With Abbott, his guys feel empowered.

Although the Lucky Country moniker is ironic (and hence the popular adoption of it in a positive sense is even more ironic than an Alanis Morissette song).

The climate varies hugely from state to state, so not sure what the climate has to do with anything.

on the whole a bit warmer and drier than NZ is my basic point. A lot more desert, a lot less snow and frost. Overall less green. I think you might have heard the phrase "going troppo'? Sure you can get depressed as f- in the rainy cold, but the heat fries your brain and makes you a bit tetchy. IMO. But sure, cities like Sydney and Melbourne are larger than NZ as a whole population-wise, so generalisations are a bit silly I guess.

Also the it was nicer in my day thing:

I think it has gone down hill. Other than deporting any New Zealander in sight, yet they cannot sort out their own racial problems with the Serbs, Croats, Greeks etc. Easy for Aussie to point the finger at us but their own issues need addressing. I mean they deported a Kiwi here for a minor drug conviction 30 years ago ffs, apparently been a good citizen ever since.

I think they consider themselves the poor mans version of the USA at times. Noting the crap reality shows just like here. In the 60s, there used to be a white paper policey and yet they were having goes at South Africa and how they ran their country, yet the poor Aboriginals got a crap deal.

There are over 650000 New Zealanders living in Australia, that would not include thousands that have taken out citizenship over the past 30 years. All the Kiwis I have spoken to reckon it is a good job that these crims are being sent home.  Not sure where you get they are deporting on sight. They are deporting any person that has a criminal record that are not citizens. I think that is fair. Why should the Australian taxpayer pay for foreign criminals. There are enough dicks here already without importing 'others' . The Serb/Croat thing it not the problem it was years ago.

In some cases they are deporting their own problems to us, people who have lived in Australia since childhood and do not consider NZ home will become a burden on the NZ tax payers.

The way NZ treats Australians is more civilised and respectful - after 1 yr here they can vote and have access to social services, even the way we treat Australians that have spent time in prison is better, the longer they have lived in NZ the longer they have had to spend in prison before the option of deportation is brought up - in some instances they have had to have jail sentences over 10yrs.

Though Australia do take in far more refugees per capita than NZ and in Victoria have banned the selling of dogs online and pet stores to stop puppy mills.

Some of your comments are incorrect. Two of my grand kids were born in NZ and went to Australia when they were very young. They have NZ passports. The youngest was born in Australia and has an Australian passport.

yeah, but we get C-Diddy, so it is all swings and roundabouts.

The problem in Aussie is that not everyone whom is law abiding, working and pays their raxes, are reaping the benefits from those taxes. sur3ly if you are paying your taxes and health insurances which I believe are compulsory, then you should reqp them when required but the Aussie Government are grabbing the taxes and giving nothing back for them.

There are good things about Aussie and then there are the politicians.

This whole issue is a legacy of our (in Australia's view at least) lax Immigration laws, which allowed people into New Zealand, afforded them Citizenship in NZ and as a result, allowed them, as of right, entry into Australia.

The so called clamping down, started back in the days of the Clark Labour government when the Little Aussie Battle, Johnnie Howard implemented a range of changes which the saw as a way of stemming the tide.

True jeff. I have a South African friend who was a qualified accountant but 20 years ago Aussie did not need him  and so he was accepted into NZ. and was given citizenship.   15 years ago he moved to Australia and is now a citizen of Oz.

We could go back to 1972 too but this is about Australia.

I am curious to know if they are deporting people back to Serbia, Croatia etc where there seems to be issues within the Australian way of life or is it just the Pacific countries that need this treatment?

The only one I know of is Dragan Vasiljkovic who was deported for war crimes.

Watch a Victory V WSW  game, 

That is like saying 'watch a Millwall v anyone game'

Very true or Leeds V anyone.

How did that work?

My godson was born in Aus and has a NZ passport as apparently his parents couldn't get him an Aus passport because they aren't citizens.

So he could conceivably be raised with the Australian way of life, learn to do bad things form Australians, and get caught doing something wrong and be sent to NZ where he has never even been because he doesn't meet the Australian character requirements.

76 years ago a little Corporal had the same idea for the fatherland. Is this the desired direction for Australia to follow?  I sincerely hope not. But the similar path has started at the very basic level. Well it appears like that.

Let's do an OZ...... deport him!

Chavez

Now most of the users on here whom have met me know my above message is more than a touch cynical and really is basically a cheap shot at the Australian political spectrum at the present moment. No way would I really endorse any of that for minor issues. Perhaps for Murder or Rape, then they can be deported. No racial inferences intended. Just thougt I better clear that up before I get flamed again.

I have no idea, but the parents are still NZ citizens.

[/quote] NZers that move over there do so on a special visa that prohibits them to vote or to receive many social services other tax paying members are afforded. These kiwis have no direct path to permanent residency and hence citizenship, they have to apply like any other immigrant - no matter how long they have lived in Australia - and may not meet the criteria for permanent residency. This is a problem for many who moved as kids to Australia (and I think even those born to NZ parents in Australia) , they are for all purposes Australian but may never actually be able to become citizens.

The way NZ treats Australians is more civilised and respectful - after 1 yr here they can vote and have access to social services, even the way we treat Australians that have spent time in prison is better, the longer they have lived in NZ the longer they have had to spend in prison before the option of deportation is brought up - in some instances they have had to have jail sentences over 10yrs.

Though Australia do take in far more refugees per capita than NZ and in Victoria have banned the selling of dogs online and pet stores to stop puppy mills.

[/quote]

My daughter who is in her early 30's  has been out of NZ travelling the world for the last 3 years. She is now based in Aussie with here partner who isnt Australian. She got pregnant a year ago and then found out that because she had been out of NZ for longer than 2 years she wasnt eligible for any govt assistance back here in NZ . So they had their daughter in Aussie and got all govt assistance that any other Aussie gets. 

I said "or to receive many social services"

http://www.nzembassy.com/australia/new-zealanders-...

SCV holders who arrived in Australia after 26 February 2001 also have limited eligibility for a range of state provided services such as public housing, training courses, transport subsidies, disability services etc.

I would not think that NZ, or many other countries, would limit social services to citizens and even permanent residents.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/apr/...