[quote=Lonegunmen]
The Deloitte Five Eyes Arena as John Key calls in some favours.
[/quote]
fixed (reaches for his Invisibility Cloak)
A-league Expansion - Derbies
My post of 7 bids in the other thread seems to be close to the mark... 442 have just posted an article which confirms FFA have 6 bids in...
http://www.fourfourtwo.com.au/news/ffa-six-bids-vy...
BTW my post in the other forum...
If recent media reports are correct, we have potential bidders...
AU City... long standing club and could share existing facilities for matches and the team has a history and local support.
South Melbourne... Long History existing ground is HHHHHmmmmm needs work but their appears to be investors willing to invest.
Tassie .... is putting in a bid ... looks like using an oval ground, small population and would the AFL just invade with matches ...
Geelong ... not sure about this bid a regional centre very AFL town ...but a very serious bid for a team.
Canberra ... Strong Rugby Union / League town with The Great Waste of Space playing some games very crowded sports market ... having access to a quality playing surface could be an issue.... there are bidders ...
South Western Sydney ... Son of the the Drive Bys huge potential, stadium ready to go only issue is the MacArthur area is not a Football heartland like Liverpool / Fairfield up the road ... however has a lot going for it.
Southern Sydney ... Could it kill SFC is the issue as many SFC fans come from this area .... two small stadiums to choose from ... will either work or drag fans from SFC... but there is a bidder ...
A Sydney United along with a couple of other former NSL clubs add to SU stadium at Liverpool similar issue to South Melbourne in many ways... but they have backers ...existing 12k stadium as well with lighting good enough for broadcasting.
Brisbane former Strikers and Lyons teams making noises and a bid expected to arrive soon... stadium is the big issue...
Not sure in Auckland has expressed an interest in bidding but AFC issues would need to be sorted first I guess.
Me I would go for AU City + Sydney United along with some former NSL clubs in Liverpool ... will hurt WSW but WSW should be able to deal with it..
My gut tells me more will apply.... looks like AU City and West AU are both applying I do wonder aloud why they don't do a join bid...
In Brisbane looks like two bids coming now maybe 3, Strikers, Lyons and Logan City... Perry Park upgrade seems on teh cards if its thye strikers ... https://www.google.com.au/search?q=perry+park+bris...
In Sydney ... Southern Sydney, South Western Sydney and a combination of old NSL clubs around the Fairfield / Liverpool area.
Canberra
South Melbourne and like Sydney United thye have a 10 K stadium already ... look up Lake Side Stadium... https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1...
Tassie by the guys who formed MV and they have backers with heaps of cash..
Geelong .... the council has a stadium and wants in...
Our little league is growing ... 6 bids already and that's not counting Auckland assuming AFC allow ... so good to read stories like this...
FFA set to introduce A-League expansion framework after meeting with Tasmanian bid
http://www.theage.com.au/sport/soccer/ffa-set-to-i...
Football Federation Australia will fast track the expansion of the A-League and invite bids for new licences after meeting representatives from Tasmania this week.
I think this could be a good thing,hopefully football fans in both countries get behind it and start turning up in numbers. Would like to see Auckland get a final chance to put their money where their previous incarnations did not.
re Tassie bid ... excellent podcast ... sounds like they could be in...
South Melbourne to launch a bit.... they already have a 15K stadium and heaps of history.
http://forum.insidesport.com.au/2447066/South-Melb...
Scroll down to see the full article in the herald Sun
The commentary team at Canberra were talking up a Canberra team for inclusion and also mentioned that day's attendance was the highest they had for an A League game there, 5,000 something. Honestly if FFA are serious about considering the likes of Canberra, then it makes a mockery of any calls for us to increase our crowd numbers to remain in the A League.
The commentary team at Canberra were talking up a Canberra team for inclusion and also mentioned that day's attendance was the highest they had for an A League game there, 5,000 something. Honestly if FFA are serious about considering the likes of Canberra, then it makes a mockery of any calls for us to increase our crowd numbers to remain in the A League.
5000? They got more than that to AFL games in Wellington, didn't they?
FFA have said a number of times Canberra will not get their own team.... FFA want population centres of one million plus for new teams.
The Tassie bid is being looked at because its going to be government backed so money and stadium availability is no issue but I still doubt thye will get a team.
The commentary team at Canberra were talking up a Canberra team for inclusion and also mentioned that day's attendance was the highest they had for an A League game there, 5,000 something. Honestly if FFA are serious about considering the likes of Canberra, then it makes a mockery of any calls for us to increase our crowd numbers to remain in the A League.
Yeah but lets not forget that Mariners v Nix would have to be the least marketable game in the A League for a neutral fan to watch (no offence to either club).
No where near the same as asking a Canberra football fan to turn up as a partisan spectator of his/her own local A League side. Socceroos have played few times in Canberra last few years against 'lesser known' Asian sides like Kuwait and managed to pull in big crowds.
However I suspect a deal maybe done where a Southern Sydney side based at Cronulla gains entry, but as condition of entry they play a few games a year in Canberra to build a supporter base there as well. Hawthorn Hawks play about 3 AFL games a year in Tasmania (with financial incentive from Tassie Govt), and so smartly have built their 'brand' and pocketed some extra dollars in the Apple Isle, ie there is a precedent for doing this sort of thing in Aussie comps.
So who played in the other A League games played in Canberra? This game v the Nix out pulled any of those. I wouldn't put too much emphasis on the Socceroo figures, they are their national team and fans will come from all around to watch them. You'd sell out Spriggens Park if the All Blacks were playing but only half fill it for Wanganui [for an example].
Midfielder, how many of these markets are there then? don't they already have teams in them all? Its just a matter of carving up these places even more is it? The NRL had the problem where the competition was just too Sydney-centric, FFA will be aware of that.
So who played in the other A League games played in Canberra? This game v the Nix out pulled any of those. I wouldn't put too much emphasis on the Socceroo figures, they are their national team and fans will come from all around to watch them. You'd sell out Spriggens Park if the All Blacks were playing but only half fill it for Wanganui [for an example].
Midfielder, how many of these markets are there then? don't they already have teams in them all? Its just a matter of carving up these places even more is it? The NRL had the problem where the competition was just too Sydney-centric, FFA will be aware of that.
FFA have been quite specific in what they want, and are currently in the process of saying what teams will need to bring.
FFA as I said have been specific, they want a population of one million or more, a large player base in the area, to create derbies in capital cities. The Mariners would be no chance of meeting whats required today.
To answer your question.... third Sydney, third Melbourne, second Brisbane, second AU, second PG .... if AFC are willing [and that's a big if] Auckland ... Auckland offers a huge advantage in having a time zone for broadcasters ....
The population centres according to Gallop are needed as they get bigger ratings than smaller regional towns.
There are two maybe 3 groups in Brisbane preparing bids according to the media.... two groups in AU .... Tassie's bid is government backed which adds to it..... the Canberra bid as I understand it if it comes will also be government backed.
I do wonder were the new players are coming from for the new teams...
The street talk is the next media deal wants 12 teams to start and 14 teams at the finish..... how close this is to the mark I don't know...rating and crowds are up this year crowds by 12% and ratings by just over 40%.
Have a look at this link .... http://www.footyindustry.com/?page_id=2576 then go back to the home page and you can see the other codes.
Just consider this and this is behind FFA's thinking and new media partners.
12 teams by 3 rounds is 198 games + finals + FFA Cup ... so 215 or so A=League matches + the W-League.
AFL has 198 games and their Fox average ratings is 190K per match... currently the A-League is rating 87 K per match.... but any analysis of the match ratings shows the non capital city teams i.e. Mariners, Nix and maybe Jest drag the average down... New teams in capitals cities especially Sydney, Melbourne and Brisbane rate very well...
That footyindustry site is excellent if anyone is into stats as it covers all codes ...
2 other CCM home games in Canberra have drawn just over about 5,000. The thing is, the a-league seems to be more of a local league. The games probably don't get a lot of coverage in the Australian press unless you have Tim Cahill. For instance, I don't see a huge variation in our crowds based on who we play. I think the a-league is more about supporting your local team than it is about caring about the opposition. Hopefully more FTA football would change that.
The real question is how can you add more fans to the a-league? If you put another team in Adelaide and they get average crowds of 5,000 but the current Adelaide team receives crowds of 4,000 less, have you really achieved anything? Sure you have a derby but the best rivalries are ones that grow organically. We all have seen how little the distance derby means to us.
It seems to me that Gallop believes there are thousands of football fans in the major Australian cities who want to support an a-league team but don't currently because they don't like their current team. I just don't see much evidence to support that.
Ryan54
FFA's logic is very simple they want ratings for media partners ... Evidence suggest over all hal seasons to date is capital cities rate, especially Sydney, Melbourne, and Brisbane..... Further derbies rate the best ...
So putting extra teams in Sydney, Melbourne and Brisbane as they see it is the way to go... who gets the last spot ... and who in Sydney, Melbourne and Brisbane will get teams will be interesting.
I guess they don't publish their research nor do their media partners...
What jumps off the page is using Canberra as an example and using that awful word metrics ... the belief is Canberra does not or could not get the metrics FFA and their broadcast partners want ... the key metric being TV ratings...
It should be remembered FFA are pushing very hard to get at least one if not two games broadcast on a commercial FTA station, meaning the broadcasters need faith that the teams will rate...
This is driven as much if not more by media players as it is by FFA ...
To put into context, the last media was 35 million cash and 5 million in ads.... of the 35 million cash its estimated 10 million for the Socceroos and 25 million for the A-League.... the AFC has taken over Socceroo broadcast rights and all Gallop has to sell is the A-League from a base of 25 million 4 years ago... he is pushing for 70 + million... which is a massive jump in four years .... and he wants a commercial FTA station to broadcast Football something they have never done before...
Just a messenger ... saying what I think is the logic behind FFA capital city push and the key issue they have in convincing the media broadcasters to pay pay big money and broadcast... as a comparison the ARU receives 55 million from SANDZZAR which includes all Super matches, all Tri Nation matches and a share of overseas sales... its been said that the Super rights by themselves in Australia is less than 10 million in the overall deal...
To illustrate how much I know [don't] FFA have just announced they will consider regional teams and population centres are not as important as before...
From .... 442...
That tells me that a team from Tasmania will be in the next expansion.
What a day first from 442 with a great interview on Football Australia at the end on a podcast...
Former Brisbane Roar Coach Miron Bleiberg says serious money is behind Brisbane Strikers A-League bid with his experience set to have them ready in seven months.http://www.fourfourtwo.com.au/news/money-bags-stri...
Then different groups putting in their bids having a go at each other... Not exactly one out of the playbook on how to make friends but the South Melbourne pres sent the following tweet about the Geelong bid.
Both South Melbourne and Strikers can have 15+ stadiums ready for the start of next year and both have teams in the NPL thus have a lot of infrastructure in place...
FMD the bids are coming from everywhere.... could be a dozen or so by years end ... this one sounds excellent very similar to WSW... its from outer Melbourne...
I have taken this from the first part of the article to illustrate how strong this particular bid is and then with South Melbourne ... its a hard choice...
Casey-Dandenong soccer clubs ready to unite behind local push for an A-League license
MATT WINDLEY AND DAVID DAVUTOVIC, Herald Sun
November 17, 2016 9:28pm
Subscriber only
THE six biggest soccer clubs in the Casey-Dandenong region say they would unite behind a local push for an A-League license.
The Casey and Greater Dandenong councils also endorse a south-east A-League bid and both have already identified appropriate locations - Casey Fields and Dandenong Showgrounds.
WHERE SHOULD VICTORIA’S THIRD A-LEAGUE CLUB BE BASED? VOTE IN OUR POLL AND HAVE YOUR SAY IN THE COMMENTS BELOW
Former Springvale City and Socceroos star Vince Grella headlines an impressive south-east production line that includes current players Scott McDonald, Eugene Galekovic, Curtis Good and Jackson Irvine.
With a rapidly growing population that already numbers 1.2 million, the south-east is a perfect home for a professional club according to locals.
Tis heating up if the media are to be believed the following all have bids they want to put in...
North Queensland ... Cains not Townsville
Brisbane ... Strikers & Logan City Council
Sydney ... Southern Sydney {Cronulla leagues] and Campbelltown
The Gong
Canberra
Melbourne ... Geelong, South Melbourne & South East Soccer clubs
Tassie
Adelaide... AU City and West AU
Thats 13 bids plus maybe a Perth bid abd an Auckland bid...
An article from Michael Lynch in the Age does not make one mention of a 2nd NZ team, even when suggesting 16 teams.
Thats because even though some of us would like to see Auckland make a serious go of it, nothing has come it from Auckland to suggest they are interested......officially or not officially.
Thats because even though some of us would lojke to see Auckland make a serious go of it, nothing has come iut from Auckland to suggest they are interested......officially or not officially.
There was that leaked document a year or two ago that showed Auckland City FCs goal was to be in the A-League within 5 (I think?) years. Greg O'Rourke, the boss of the A-League, also said a couple of weeks ago on the Daily Football show that anytime there was a whiff of expansion talks a group from Auckland submits an unsolicited proposal. I'd assume that's ACFC.
Thats because even though some of us would lojke to see Auckland make a serious go of it, nothing has come iut from Auckland to suggest they are interested......officially or not officially.
There was that leaked document a year or two ago that showed Auckland City FCs goal was to be in the A-League within 5 (I think?) years. Greg O'Rourke, the boss of the A-League, also said a couple of weeks ago on the Daily Football show that anytime there was a whiff of expansion talks a group from Auckland submits an unsolicited proposal. I'd assume that's ACFC.
Thats because even though some of us would lojke to see Auckland make a serious go of it, nothing has come iut from Auckland to suggest they are interested......officially or not officially.
There was that leaked document a year or two ago that showed Auckland City FCs goal was to be in the A-League within 5 (I think?) years. Greg O'Rourke, the boss of the A-League, also said a couple of weeks ago on the Daily Football show that anytime there was a whiff of expansion talks a group from Auckland submits an unsolicited proposal. I'd assume that's ACFC.
From TWGSydney 'super club' ready for lift-off
http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/domestic/867...
ACFC have placed a "tentative bid", my guess is unless they pull it together quickly they won't get the nod as other teams seem quite well organised.
Are they saying tentative as to not raise expectations?
No point coming out all big and with bravado if you get told no.
Will a Auckland team be a good or bad thing for the Nix ?
I think we need to have two teams from NZ. The derby would be great. But where would they play? Kiwitea St?
I think it would benefit both teams, local rivalry, opportunity for fans to get involved in friendly banter etc. Could be a marketers dream within the football confines. Auckland fans would need to show up on a consistent basis. I would imagine it has progress up north beyond the mistakes of the Kingz & Knights management.
Fingers crossed that everyone makes an effort to make it happen.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/domestic/867...
ACFC have placed a "tentative bid", my guess is unless they pull it together quickly they won't get the nod as other teams seem quite well organised.
That's quite an astute observation..... time for pulling the finger out if they are serious
The Brisbane bid has backers a stadium design and council backing,
The Southern Sydney design, has two stadiums to play out of wealthy backers and massive player numbers.
The Canberra bid is in the pipeline but tis said it will blow people socks off.
The two bids from Melbourne both mega huge and with South Melbourne aside from having a stadium,are talking of hiring a marquee coach and player.
Tassie have signed up the council, state government, federal government, have a key stadium deal signed... wealthy backers who originally set up MV.
Adelaide both very strong bids with one of the bidder approaching Robbie Flower to be their coach, both have stadium deals set up.
Will a Auckland team be a good or bad thing for the Nix ?
yes and no, the rivalry would be great but if an Auckland team got in the Phoenix would lose a lot of sponsors to them Auckland's a much bigger market
http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/domestic/867...
ACFC have placed a "tentative bid", my guess is unless they pull it together quickly they won't get the nod as other teams seem quite well organised.
or they are playing the long game and realise that they won't be in the mix for the first expansion
Everything seems to point to any Auckland team not being seriously considered until 2nd or 3rd phase expansions ie 14 or 16 teams
At this very early stage some of these Aussie bids sound like they maybe pretty impressive. Like the idea of expansion but do wonder about player depth and effect on the football quality. Especially if rich Chinese clubs, also look to sign more of the top players from A League as has been reported
Any non Auckland expansion can only help the Phoenix in terms of quality, right now each A-League team has about 2 million people per team to get players from, the Phoenix have more than 5, it would also drive up the wages of the Australians but without competiton young kiwis should be cheaper.
Everything seems to point to any Auckland team not being seriously considered until 2nd or 3rd phase expansions ie 14 or 16 teams
At this very early stage some of these Aussie bids sound like they maybe pretty impressive. Like the idea of expansion but do wonder about player depth and effect on the football quality. Especially if rich Chinese clubs, also look to sign more of the top players from A League as has been reported
I'd be more worried about where the fans are going to come from. Whats the differentiation in fan-base between Brisbane Strikers and Brisbane Roar? Outside of derbies that's Melbourne Heart/City all over again, but from a smaller population base. South Melbourne? One of those Melbourne team still struggles to get decent crowds despite spending millions on marquee players. Two Adelaide teams? Again where are the supporters supposed to come from?
Untapped markets like Auckland, Tassie and Canberra do sound like the best options for expansion.
There is no way a NZ team will be in first wave of expansion. 2nd doubtful third possible