$40-45 Million Soccer Specific Stadium - Petone Phoenix
According to Bob Clarkson, Baypark stadium in Tauranga was originally built for 24 million. There has been 13 years of inflation but at the same time it is quite a bit bigger than what is proposed here. I'v never actually been there so I don't know what the facilities are like but we don't need anything too fancy. I would scrap corporate boxes altogether. The press only need a few small cubicles etc. The real big advantage here is it sounds like the land is free when that would usually be half the cost.
Seats around 20k. Originally had no roof on stands so probably not included in the original cost. Not sure about costs for build but didn't Bob the Builder own a construction company at the time? Wonder how much work was "done in kind" with the actual costs hidden. Also lighting requirements for Speedway significantly below that required for football.
Media nowadays require something a little bit more than a few cubicles.
I very well may be wrong, but close to 30 years in the construction Industry leaves me more than a little skeptical.
I reckon it could be done:
According to Bob Clarkson, Baypark stadium in Tauranga was originally built for 24 million. There has been 13 years of inflation but at the same time it is quite a bit bigger than what is proposed here. I'v never actually been there so I don't know what the facilities are like but we don't need anything too fancy. I would scrap corporate boxes altogether. The press only need a few small cubicles etc. The real big advantage here is it sounds like the land is free when that would usually be half the cost.
Seats around 20k. Originally had no roof on stands so probably not included in the original cost. Not sure about costs for build but didn't Bob the Builder own a construction company at the time? Wonder how much work was "done in kind" with the actual costs hidden. Also lighting requirements for Speedway significantly below that required for football.
Media nowadays require something a little bit more than a few cubicles.
I very well may be wrong, but close to 30 years in the construction Industry leaves me more than a little skeptical.
Yeah he is in construction so he would be able to get things as cheaply as possible. He wouldn't want to hide costs though, in fact you want to inflate reported costs as much as possible for taxation purposes. I don't really have any idea how much it would cost other than by comparing it to similar things. I do get the feeling that having too many people who don't know what they are doing involved in this kind of project bloats the price significantly.
If there is any stadium being built, one way of making it a bit cheaper is having standing terraces (in the 'active support areas') rather than an all seater.
Suspect that wouldn't meet A-league requirments.
The Baypark stadium is actually all wood. Those that were in the Fever zone at Napier this year, it is a more modern version [and lower] of the stand you were in. So [from memory] no actual seats, just benches. Haven't been inside to check facilities but there must be changing sheds etc in there now. not sure if there were to start with because it was built primarily as a stockcar track and all the vehicles, pit area etc were outside the stadium buildings.
Baypark Stadium My recollection was wrong, there are seats. With no track around the outside, the stands would not need to be so big and slightly lesser cost perhaps?
Lower Hutt ratepayers would be happy to foot a big chunk of the $30 mill?
$30mn seem very cheap to me
We're not all high rollers like you JD :)
It's a lot of money to us poor antipodean folk.
Doesn't JD work for a bank in London? That's just last week's bonuses.
Anyway, I think he meant $30m sounds suspiciously cheap - even though it is still a large amount of money by NZ stds.
So that just leaves Newlands as the only viable site.
I exclude Karori Park as development would ruin its heritage character as Wgtn's sh!thole sports venue.
Hang on - I thought we were moving the airport to Newlands and building the new stadium on the old airport in Rongotai, which comes with a massive carpark already in situ.
You haven't gone and built a new stadium in Newlands have ya?
#shambles
Errmm, no, no. I done nuffink.
*stands in front of gaping big hole in Newlands*
Umm, has anyone had a closer look at the Wgtn airport in Paraparaumu option recently?
Lower Hutt ratepayers would be happy to foot a big chunk of the $30 mill?
$30mn seem very cheap to me
We're not all high rollers like you JD :)
It's a lot of money to us poor antipodean folk.
Doesn't JD work for a bank in London? That's just last week's bonuses.
Anyway, I think he meant $30m sounds suspiciously cheap - even though it is still a large amount of money by NZ stds.
Humour detector to full power.
Lower Hutt ratepayers would be happy to foot a big chunk of the $30 mill?
$30mn seem very cheap to me
We're not all high rollers like you JD :)
It's a lot of money to us poor antipodean folk.
Doesn't JD work for a bank in London? That's just last week's bonuses.
Anyway, I think he meant $30m sounds suspiciously cheap - even though it is still a large amount of money by NZ stds.
Humour detector to full power.
What's confusing me is I'm not sure whether JD was making a joke in the first place. If he had put a :) or a :P or even a ;-) then whole different kettle of fish.
If only we had emoticons this never woulda happened ;-P
Anyway it surely can't cost $30m to build a stadium on the airport site at Rongotai because all the groundworks are done. That is some runway-quality flatness they already have out there.
Didn't the Nix have a meeting with the Hutt City Council to present their plan for Petone Rec this week?
Does'nt have a dogs show.
However there have been examples of cheap stadiums built in NZ. Google "Trafalgar park, Nelson Rugby World Cup". Nelson had a stadium similar to Petone rec with one small stand. They used tempory stands to increase the capacity to 18,000. It meet RWC requirements and by all accounts was a great success. The stands were left in to play quite a few Crusaders games when their stadium in Chch was munted. All the temp stands were uncovered and it was in winter too.
If they did something like that for 9000 in Petone it would be relatively easy from an assembly point of view. Logistically running an event for < 9000 is no big deal....its smaller than Homegrown or Toast Martinborough. If the Nix played their spring home games away in Chch and Napier then the temporary stadium would only have to be up from mid December to March.
I,m sure Gareth could crunch the numbers....economically it would stack up IMO. But what would kill it would be Resource consent, FFA regs, fan resistance and the biggy.....no TV grade flood lights. Plus Wellies rat shit summer weather
Didn't the Nix have a meeting with the Hutt City Council to present their plan for Petone Rec this week?
Does'nt have a dogs show.
However there have been examples of cheap stadiums built in NZ. Google "Trafalgar park, Nelson Rugby World Cup". Nelson had a stadium similar to Petone rec with one small stand. They used tempory stands to increase the capacity to 18,000. It meet RWC requirements and by all accounts was a great success. The stands were left in to play quite a few Crusaders games when their stadium in Chch was munted. All the temp stands were uncovered and it was in winter too.
If they did something like that for 9000 in Petone it would be relatively easy from an assembly point of view. Logistically running an event for < 9000 is no big deal....its smaller than Homegrown or Toast Martinborough. If the Nix played their spring home games away in Chch and Napier then the temporary stadium would only have to be up from mid December to March.
I,m sure Gareth could crunch the numbers....economically it would stack up IMO. But what would kill it would be Resource consent, FFA regs, fan resistance and the biggy.....no TV grade flood lights. Plus Wellies rat shit summer weather
Speaking to a hutt city councillor , it received a very positive response..sounds like its a great chance of going ahead...and I for one think its a great idea
They should learn from Auckland. We have 3 stadiums where we only need 1 (and the one we have is a dogs breakfast)
They should learn from Auckland. We have 3 stadiums where we only need 1 (and the one we have is a dogs breakfast)
they should learn from christchurch. build another stadium that isnt slap bang in the middle of a fault line.
[quote=austin10]
Didn't the Nix have a meeting with the Hutt City Council to present their plan for Petone Rec this week?
Speaking to a hutt city councillor , it received a very positive response..sounds like its a great chance of going ahead...and I for one think its a great idea
Wow! thats amazing. I initially thought that this plan was just to put pressure on the Wespac stadium management to wrangle us a better deal. However this might have more legs to it.
I can see where the club is coming from. Right from day one Gareth said the club is being gouged by the stadium. Knowing Gareth as we do, he is going to think outside the square to remedy this situation. If the PetRec stadium got FFA approval and Council approval then logistically it is very do-able(see my Nelson RWC reference above). I for one wouldn't mind temporary stands or Portaloos if it meant the club was going to get the lions share of the gate. It would be worth it just to sit close to the action. For those who have never watched football in a ground where you can almost reach out and touch the players then its 1000x better than the ROF experiance.
The other benefit for the Nix is they would control and profit from food, beverage and merchandising on the day. I have been to small European grounds where the club put up marquees around the ground and sell food and alcohol on match day.....they get all the profit. Imagine marquees around the ground at the Petone Rec. Serving proper beer....serving interesting food. They could open it 2 or 3 hours before the game. The YF could drink up on site before the game......all the profits would go to the club.
The Nix generate a large amount of money on match day. Unfortunately a very considerable amount of it goes to the Stadium, the Back Bencher etc. If the club can come up with a suitable alternative that is financially better for them and enhances the fans experiance then I am 100% in support. Its an interesting and fun debate to have however the probability that we will stay at the ROF is 95%+ IMO
Umm I don't think this is a Nix led thing. It's the hutt council.
Yep the east and west councils have been pushing ideas to get big sport in their zone for a long time.
So not all new. You can't forget any proposal has to also fit the FFA.
IMO it is GM pushing to get the best press, deal, fans and attendances to games.
Name in the paper more often is good to raise awareness
How far along is the Council amalgamation debate in Wellington? I thought they might be next cab off the rank after us in HB. What that will mean is that a full amalgamated council [if it happens - and it probably will as the National Govt. wants it] is unlikely to support another stadium that competes with one of its biggest regional assets. It would also be unlikely to get widespread public support in an amalgamated environment because people in Wellington, Porirua, Wairarapa etc won't want their money spent in Petone when there is the cake tin down the road . So what that means is: every chance that Hutt City [if they want it bad enough] will push the plans through and get it consented and building started so if amalgamation goes through, it will not be able to be undone. This makes me think we will either get some really quick decision making on this or we can just forget about it in the short to medium term.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/league/9727396/Two-Wellington-bids-for-an-expansion-NRL-team
A second NRL team might find a new, purpose built, Nix home more attractive than the cake tin.
I reckon it could be done:
very good :)
Umm I don't think this is a Nix led thing. It's the hutt council.
I don't think this is correct.
How far along is the Council amalgamation debate in Wellington? I thought they might be next cab off the rank after us in HB. What that will mean is that a full amalgamated council [if it happens - and it probably will as the National Govt. wants it] is unlikely to support another stadium that competes with one of its biggest regional assets. It would also be unlikely to get widespread public support in an amalgamated environment because people in Wellington, Porirua, Wairarapa etc won't want their money spent in Petone when there is the cake tin down the road . So what that means is: every chance that Hutt City [if they want it bad enough] will push the plans through and get it consented and building started so if amalgamation goes through, it will not be able to be undone. This makes me think we will either get some really quick decision making on this or we can just forget about it in the short to medium term.
Second stadium, no matter of size may have to be privately funded on council lease land to float, without a huge public outcry.
How far along is the Council amalgamation debate in Wellington? I thought they might be next cab off the rank after us in HB. What that will mean is that a full amalgamated council [if it happens - and it probably will as the National Govt. wants it] is unlikely to support another stadium that competes with one of its biggest regional assets. It would also be unlikely to get widespread public support in an amalgamated environment because people in Wellington, Porirua, Wairarapa etc won't want their money spent in Petone when there is the cake tin down the road . So what that means is: every chance that Hutt City [if they want it bad enough] will push the plans through and get it consented and building started so if amalgamation goes through, it will not be able to be undone. This makes me think we will either get some really quick decision making on this or we can just forget about it in the short to medium term.
Second stadium, no matter of size may have to be privately funded on council lease land to float, without a huge public outcry.
That sounds sensible. Maybe hit up one of the UK banks for a few spare shekels?
Their lies the circular formula, to build you need money, to pay back the money you need a profit, fans to turn up and pay back the loan.
Sounds like a problem being wrangled over by the bigger codes in Wgtn with our existing facility supplier. Which has an advantage it is built, is close to debt free with only maintenance and upgrades to cover. IMO
That sounds sensible. Maybe hit up an EPL team for a few spare shekels?
:)
Is this the stadium Terry was going to build?
Is this the stadium Terry was going to build?
The WGA Arena.
Is this the stadium Terry was going to build?
The WGA Arena.
How far along is the Council amalgamation debate in Wellington? I thought they might be next cab off the rank after us in HB. What that will mean is that a full amalgamated council [if it happens - and it probably will as the National Govt. wants it] is unlikely to support another stadium that competes with one of its biggest regional assets. It would also be unlikely to get widespread public support in an amalgamated environment because people in Wellington, Porirua, Wairarapa etc won't want their money spent in Petone when there is the cake tin down the road . So what that means is: every chance that Hutt City [if they want it bad enough] will push the plans through and get it consented and building started so if amalgamation goes through, it will not be able to be undone. This makes me think we will either get some really quick decision making on this or we can just forget about it in the short to medium term.
Second stadium, no matter of size may have to be privately funded on council lease land to float, without a huge public outcry.
How far along is the Council amalgamation debate in Wellington? I thought they might be next cab off the rank after us in HB. What that will mean is that a full amalgamated council [if it happens - and it probably will as the National Govt. wants it] is unlikely to support another stadium that competes with one of its biggest regional assets. It would also be unlikely to get widespread public support in an amalgamated environment because people in Wellington, Porirua, Wairarapa etc won't want their money spent in Petone when there is the cake tin down the road . So what that means is: every chance that Hutt City [if they want it bad enough] will push the plans through and get it consented and building started so if amalgamation goes through, it will not be able to be undone. This makes me think we will either get some really quick decision making on this or we can just forget about it in the short to medium term.
Second stadium, no matter of size may have to be privately funded on council lease land to float, without a huge public outcry.
Private consortium is the only way forward I can see.
Problem solved, introducing the new Sam Morgan Stadium, 60 million out of 600, not a problem and write it off as a donation! problem solved!! You heard it from me first! ;)
Next, the Easter Bunny was seen shopping at Cadburys today....
Problem solved, introducing the new Sam Morgan Stadium, 60 million out of 600, not a problem and write it off as a donation! problem solved!! You heard it from me first! :)
Radio Sport reporting in their news that Gaz is "unveiling plans" today for a Petone stadium (midday presser - he luvs it).
MEDIA ARE INVITED TO ATTEND:
Monday 17 February
Noon
Pelorus Trust Sports House
93 Hutt Park Rd, Seaview, Lower Hutt
Media are invited to attend a presentation by the Hutt City Community Facilities Trust and Welnix Director Dr Gareth Morgan.The presentation will outline a proposal to bring a multi-purpose community sport and event centre to Petone, Lower Hutt.No comment on the proposal will be given until after the presentation when Trust Chair Alister Skene and Dr Morgan will be available for questions. About the Hutt City Community Facilities Trust:The Hutt City Community Facilities Trust (CFT) was established by the Hutt City Council with the aim of leading a rejuvenation of key community facilities within Lower Hutt.For more information about the CFT visit www.cft.org.nz
Wow. I think its safe to say it is more than a negotiating tactic now. Will be interesting to see how far advanced and how how specific they are.
MEDIA ARE INVITED TO ATTEND:
Monday 17 February
Noon
Pelorus Trust Sports House
93 Hutt Park Rd, Seaview, Lower Hutt
Media are invited to attend a presentation by the Hutt City Community Facilities Trust and Welnix Director Dr Gareth Morgan.The presentation will outline a proposal to bring a multi-purpose community sport and event centre to Petone, Lower Hutt.No comment on the proposal will be given until after the presentation when Trust Chair Alister Skene and Dr Morgan will be available for questions. About the Hutt City Community Facilities Trust:The Hutt City Community Facilities Trust (CFT) was established by the Hutt City Council with the aim of leading a rejuvenation of key community facilities within Lower Hutt.For more information about the CFT visit www.cft.org.nz
I love Gareth Morgan.....with him shit happens.
The management at Westpac must be spewing....especially if the Wellington Lions buy into this as well. I thought this all was a ruse to pressure Westpac for a better deal. One thing is certain Welnex would not enter into this unless the numbers stack up. If they are losing money at Westpac then its a no brainer to look at alternatives.
MEDIA ARE INVITED TO ATTEND:
Monday 17 February
Noon
Pelorus Trust Sports House
93 Hutt Park Rd, Seaview, Lower Hutt
Media are invited to attend a presentation by the Hutt City Community Facilities Trust and Welnix Director Dr Gareth Morgan.The presentation will outline a proposal to bring a multi-purpose community sport and event centre to Petone, Lower Hutt.No comment on the proposal will be given until after the presentation when Trust Chair Alister Skene and Dr Morgan will be available for questions. About the Hutt City Community Facilities Trust:The Hutt City Community Facilities Trust (CFT) was established by the Hutt City Council with the aim of leading a rejuvenation of key community facilities within Lower Hutt.For more information about the CFT visit www.cft.org.nz
I love Gareth Morgan.....with him shit happens.
The management at Westpac must be spewing....especially if the Wellington Lions buy into this as well. I thought this all was a ruse to pressure Westpac for a better deal. One thing is certain Welnex would not enter into this unless the numbers stack up. If they are losing money at Westpac then its a no brainer to look at alternatives.
With Gareth Morgan shit does not happen.... He talks plenty, but how often are his Pet projects carried out beyond mere ideas / press bites / ramblings?
Maybe this will happen . I am still firmly in the "no Chance camp" at present.
Even if it were a goer this would still be at the very least three years off at a guess. Hutt City would need to amend their district plan to accommodate a stadium in the area, Resource consent applied for then approved, which in itself could take years with every Tom Dick and Harry having the opportunity to object because the lights may be on at 9:15pm, then construction period of probably at least a year.