Wellington Phoenix Men

Daniel the Kiwi

91 replies · 1,225 views
over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Daniel the Kiwi

VUW AFC - Victoria University Football for life

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Just saw on the sports news that Daniel received citizenship today. Hope this is not being discussed anywhere else. If that's the case I apologise.

Wow, that was quick by the way! When did he even get PR??!

Anyway I ain't complaining. I think Daniel playing for the AW's would be just great!!!
well done, mate!

VUW AFC - Victoria University Football for life

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Citizenship or Residency? Don't know if it makes a difference, but congratulations to him. I look forward to seeing him in New Zealand colours.
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Its yeh brilliant he seemed very happy too!

And seeing even Terry went to the ceremoney thing, Ricki's seems expected to include him.

Daniel is a properly dedicated player to Phoenix and New Zealand though.
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I made a mention in the "Five return - one goes (Gao gone)" Thread.

That is great news. The article said that he could even play against Spain next year.

I think that Daniel had some NZ connection beforehand which cut down the years in waiting.
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
they said citizenship and showed footage of the cerimony. I got my Residence and you don't get a cerimony. Only for citizenship. and both the speaker and Daniel said that he's now elegible to play for the AW's, so it's citizenship for sure.

VUW AFC - Victoria University Football for life

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
In that case, bloody superb for the club and for New Zealand. I assume that opens up an extra foreign player spot for us too?
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
good bloody point. i believe it does!! so we can now have 4 brazilians and only pay for 3 !

VUW AFC - Victoria University Football for life

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Im pretty sure it doesn't open up a spot. He definatly can't play for AWs as FIFA have a 5 years min rule so countries don't fast track players residency as Tony P has already said.wellyphoenixfan2008-12-02 00:03:51
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
oh you're good at spoiling other people's parties aren't you! :P

Well to be honest I thought so, but that's what they said. If he has to wait for 5 years then that's a bummer. but if he is a New Zealander, then he shouldn't count as a foreigner. I'm sure in Italy lots of South Americans apply for citizenship (since they often have a granny from Sicily) and they are not considered foreigners from the moment their request is accepted (see Daniel).

VUW AFC - Victoria University Football for life

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Either way we hardly need the extra space.
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I think that 5 year rule was only if theyve previously played for a different country?

Allegedly

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Tegal wrote:
I think that 5 year rule was only if theyve previously played for a different country?
Nope doesn't matter however I think he has played at under-21 level or something and I THINK this counts aswell although if you have played for a country you can't play for a different side no matter how long you wait. Hope I got all that right.
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
If you play at U17 or U21 level I don't think it counts as a full international cap so you can play for a different country. Though I think you have to declare which country you want to play for before the age of 21.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/4619604a1823.html

I found that article - it says there that he needed to wait 2 years before getting citizenship. The article was posted in July of this year. How did it get fast tracked?
valeo2008-12-02 00:31:44

a.haak

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
How has he got citizenship so quickly, when any other punter has to have PR for 5 years before even applying for citizenship?

I should know, I missed out on the old PR and legally resident for 3 years for citizenship route by a couple of months, went from being eligible for citizenship from Jun 2006 to Nov 2010 :(

When Hibs, went up, to win the Scottish Cup - I wisnae there - furfuxake!

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
ginger_eejit wrote:
How has he got citizenship so quickly, when any other punter has to have PR for 5 years before even applying for citizenship?

I should know, I missed out on the old PR and legally resident for 3 years for citizenship route by a couple of months, went from being eligible for citizenship from Jun 2006 to Nov 2010 :(


You should have shown them your 'Brazilian" Ginger.......


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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
People are getting confused the 5 years rule is set by FIFA not the NZ government although it could be the same but FIFA set the 5 year rule so countries don't fast track residency from say 5 years to 2 years so that the player can play for the country earlier.
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Sevilla's Brazilian-born striker Luis Fabiano, obtained Spanish citizenship, meaning he no longer takes up one of the Sevilla squad's places for a player from outside the European Union in July 2008 according to FIFA.com so this would be the same thing for Daniels with the Phoenix.
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Right, I'm going to ignore what wellyphoenixfan has said because it isn't positive.  This is good news.  In all honesty, if a country grants citizenship then it should really be out of FIFA's jurisdiction.  Having said that, in Qatar Brazillians were flocking for citizenship to play international football so I guess something needed to be done.

But the guy said he could even play Spain next year, so that's got to mean somethings been sorted out surely?
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
loyalgunner wrote:
Right, I'm going to ignore what wellyphoenixfan has said because it isn't positive.� This is good news.� In all honesty, if a country grants citizenship then it should really be out of FIFA's jurisdiction.� Having said that, in Qatar Brazillians were flocking for citizenship to play international football so I guess something needed to be done.But the guy said he could even play Spain next year, so that's got to mean somethings been sorted out surely?
He might think he is but NZF isn't going to risk a fine from FIFA. Plus I doubt he would even make the starting line-up he thinks all he needs is residency to get in the squad yet he can't even make the Nix's starting 11. The starting four for the AW would be Elliott, Bertos Brown and (Most likely) James.wellyphoenixfan2008-12-02 01:11:57
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Sorry, what four for the AW's?
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
valeo wrote:

If you play at U17 or U21 level I don't think it counts as a full international cap so you can play for a different country. Though I think you have to declare which country you want to play for before the age of 21.
I think you are right there and I guarantee he didn't pick New Zealand although this is probably a new rule.
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
loyalgunner wrote:
Sorry, what four for the AW's?
Starting Midfield.
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Oh, sorry, got yah.  In all honesty, though, Elliot is nearing the end of his career, while Bertos and Brown have both been known to have long injuries which could be aggravated.
loyalgunner2008-12-02 01:15:39
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
People are getting confused the 5 years rule is set by FIFA not the NZ government although it could be the same but FIFA set the 5 year rule so countries don't fast track residency from say 5 years to 2 years so that the player can play for the country earlier.[/QUOTE]

Tony P has got it a bit wrong.

At 58th FIFA Congress in Sydney, Australia, held an 30 May 2008, the changing of Eligibility to play for representative teams in Article . 17 (d) of the Regulations Governing the Application of the FIFA Statutes was approved.

The previous wording was: " for at least two years in the territory . . . "

The new wording is now "he has lived continuously for at least five years after reaching the age of 18 on the territory of the relevant Association."

The new wording came in force with immediate effect on 18th June 2008 via FIFA Circular no . 1147 TO THE MEMBERS OF FIFA.

Since Daniels has started his football with the Wellington Phoenix way before 18th June 2008. The old wording applies to him, not the new wording.

This is the article;

[quote=FIFA]

VII . Eligibility to play for representative teams

Article 17
Acquisition of a new nationality

Any player who refers to art . 15 par . 1 to assume a new nationality and who has not played international football in accordance with art . 15 par . 2 shall be eligible to play for the new representative team only if he fulfils one of the following conditions :

(a) He was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(b) His biological mother or biological father was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(c) His grandmother or grandfather was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(d) He has lived continuously for at least five years after reaching the age of 18 an the territory of the relevant Association.
AllWhitebelievr2008-12-02 01:17:28
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Originally posted by wellyphoenixfan
He might think he is but NZF isn't going to risk a fine from FIFA. Plus I doubt he would even make the starting line-up he thinks all he needs is residency to get in the squad yet he can't even make the Nix's starting 11. The starting four for the AW would be Elliott, Bertos Brown and (Most likely) James.
 
Daniel would have a great chance of making the All Whites if he was eligible. Even if he wasn't in a starting slot, he'd definitely be one hell of a chance to make the bench. There's no doubt that one or two of those four will pick up an injury just prior to an All Whites match at some point as well... If he's eligible, the call up is pretty likely.
jamesnz2008-12-02 01:17:46
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
People are getting confused the 5 years rule is set by FIFA not the NZ government although it could be the same but FIFA set the 5 year rule so countries don't fast track residency from say 5 years to 2 years so that the player can play for the country earlier.[/QUOTE]

Tony P has got it a bit wrong.

At 58th FIFA Congress in Sydney, Australia, held an 30 May 2008, the changing of Eligibility to play for representative teams in Article . 17 (d) of the Regulations Governing the Application of the FIFA Statutes was approved.

The previous wording was: " for at least two years an the territory . . . "

The new wording is now "he has lived continuously for at least five years after reaching the age of 18 on the territory of the relevant Association."

The new wording cam in force with immediate effect on 18th June 2008 via FIFA Circular no . 1147 TO THE MEMBERS OF FIFA.

Since Daniels has started his football with the Wellington Phoenix way before 18th June 2008. The old wording applies to him, not the new wording.

This is the article;

[quote=FIFA]

VII . Eligibility to play for representative teams

Article 17
Acquisition of a new nationality

Any player who refers to art . 15 par . 1 to assume a new nationality and who has not played international football in accordance with art . 15 par . 2 shall be eligible to play for the new representative team only if he fulfils one of the following conditions :

(a) He was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(b) His biological mother or biological father was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(c) His grandmother or grandfather was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(d) He has lived continuously for at least five years after reaching the age of 18 an the territory of the relevant Association.


When you say that the new wording came in with immediate effect, does that mean that every case in the future would be subject to it, or every case at the present and in the future would be subject to it?
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
jamesnz wrote:

Originally posted by wellyphoenixfan

He might think he is but NZF isn't going to risk a fine from FIFA. Plus I doubt he would even make the starting line-up he thinks all he needs is residency to get in the squad yet he can't even make the Nix's starting 11. The starting four for the AW would be Elliott, Bertos Brown and (Most likely) James.

�

Daniel would have a great chance of making the All Whites if he was eligible. Even if he wasn't in a starting slot, he'd definitely be one hell of a chance to make the bench. There's no doubt that one or two of those four will pick up an injury just prior to an All Whites match at some point as well... If he's eligible, the call up is pretty likely.
Im not saying he won't make the squad im just saying between now and the WC qualifiers I can't see him in the starting 11, though in saying that look at Mulligan he still does.
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
IAllWhitebelievr2008-12-02 01:29:25
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
loyalgunner wrote:

People are getting confused the 5 years rule is set by FIFA not the NZ government although it could be the same but FIFA set the 5 year rule so countries don't fast track residency from say 5 years to 2 years so that the player can play for the country earlier.[/QUOTE]

Tony P has got it a bit wrong.

At 58th FIFA Congress in Sydney, Australia, held an 30 May 2008, the changing of Eligibility to play for representative teams in Article . 17 (d) of the Regulations Governing the Application of the FIFA Statutes was approved.

The previous wording was: " for at least two years an the territory . . . "

The new wording is now "he has lived continuously for at least five years after reaching the age of 18 on the territory of the relevant Association."

The new wording cam in force with immediate effect on 18th June 2008 via FIFA Circular no . 1147 TO THE MEMBERS OF FIFA.

Since Daniels has started his football with the Wellington Phoenix way before 18th June 2008. The old wording applies to him, not the new wording.

This is the article;

[quote=FIFA]

VII . Eligibility to play for representative teams

Article 17
Acquisition of a new nationality

Any player who refers to art . 15 par . 1 to assume a new nationality and who has not played international football in accordance with art . 15 par . 2 shall be eligible to play for the new representative team only if he fulfils one of the following conditions :

(a) He was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(b) His biological mother or biological father was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(c) His grandmother or grandfather was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(d) He has lived continuously for at least five years after reaching the age of 18 an the territory of the relevant Association.
When you say that the new wording came in with immediate effect, does that mean that every case in the future would be subject to it, or every case at the present and in the future would be subject to it?


It means that any footballers who has started to live on the territory of another Association on the 18th June 2008 and onwards has to wait five years.

Daniels lived continuously in NZ for two years. He started to live here before 18th June 2008 and so is under the old wording of two years not five years.
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Good, the only possible negative I can think of would be for Daniel if he doesn't get picked.  He'd be mildly frustrated to say the least.  Maybe Ricki would feel he had an obligation to pick him for a few games at least.
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
loyalgunner wrote:

People are getting confused the 5 years rule is set by FIFA not the NZ government although it could be the same but FIFA set the 5 year rule so countries don't fast track residency from say 5 years to 2 years so that the player can play for the country earlier.[/QUOTE]

Tony P has got it a bit wrong.

At 58th FIFA Congress in Sydney, Australia, held an 30 May 2008, the changing of Eligibility to play for representative teams in Article . 17 (d) of the Regulations Governing the Application of the FIFA Statutes was approved.

The previous wording was: " for at least two years an the territory . . . "

The new wording is now "he has lived continuously for at least five years after reaching the age of 18 on the territory of the relevant Association."

The new wording cam in force with immediate effect on 18th June 2008 via FIFA Circular no . 1147 TO THE MEMBERS OF FIFA.

Since Daniels has started his football with the Wellington Phoenix way before 18th June 2008. The old wording applies to him, not the new wording.

This is the article;

[quote=FIFA]

VII . Eligibility to play for representative teams

Article 17
Acquisition of a new nationality

Any player who refers to art . 15 par . 1 to assume a new nationality and who has not played international football in accordance with art . 15 par . 2 shall be eligible to play for the new representative team only if he fulfils one of the following conditions :

(a) He was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(b) His biological mother or biological father was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(c) His grandmother or grandfather was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(d) He has lived continuously for at least five years after reaching the age of 18 an the territory of the relevant Association.
When you say that the new wording came in with immediate effect, does that mean that every case in the future would be subject to it, or every case at the present and in the future would be subject to it?


It means that any footballers who has started to live on the territory of another Association on the 18th June 2008 and onwards has to wait five years.

Daniels lived continuously in NZ for two years. He started to live here before 18th June 2008 and so is under the old wording of two years not five years.
So you are saying he will be playing for New Zealand soon?
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Jez this is some confusing stuff.

I'm just happy Daniel is a New Zealander now!
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Everything is pending on AllWhiteBelievr's answer...
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Also can someone confirm if he played for an age grade team I can't remember if this was a fact or a rumour. If its a fact it creates a new problem.
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
People are getting confused the 5 years rule is set by FIFA not the NZ government although it could be the same but FIFA set the 5 year rule so countries don't fast track residency from say 5 years to 2 years so that the player can play for the country earlier.[/QUOTE]

Tony P has got it a bit wrong.

At 58th FIFA Congress in Sydney, Australia, held an 30 May 2008, the changing of Eligibility to play for representative teams in Article . 17 (d) of the Regulations Governing the Application of the FIFA Statutes was approved.

The previous wording was: " for at least two years in the territory . . . "

The new wording is now "he has lived continuously for at least five years after reaching the age of 18 on the territory of the relevant Association."

The new wording came in force with immediate effect on 18th June 2008 via FIFA Circular no . 1147 TO THE MEMBERS OF FIFA.

Since Daniels has started his football with the Wellington Phoenix way before 18th June 2008. The old wording applies to him, not the new wording.

This is the article;

[quote=FIFA]

VII . Eligibility to play for representative teams

Article 17
Acquisition of a new nationality

Any player who refers to art . 15 par . 1 to assume a new nationality and who has not played international football in accordance with art . 15 par . 2 shall be eligible to play for the new representative team only if he fulfils one of the following conditions :

(a) He was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(b) His biological mother or biological father was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(c) His grandmother or grandfather was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(d) He has lived continuously for at least five years after reaching the age of 18 an the territory of the relevant Association.


Makes sense to me. Good news.

Daniel will be able to provide creativity we certainly lack. I'd take him in a heartbeat for the AW's team.
valeo2008-12-02 01:51:09

a.haak

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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
loyalgunner wrote:

People are getting confused the 5 years rule is set by FIFA not the NZ government although it could be the same but FIFA set the 5 year rule so countries don't fast track residency from say 5 years to 2 years so that the player can play for the country earlier.[/QUOTE]

Tony P has got it a bit wrong.

At 58th FIFA Congress in Sydney, Australia, held an 30 May 2008, the changing of Eligibility to play for representative teams in Article . 17 (d) of the Regulations Governing the Application of the FIFA Statutes was approved.

The previous wording was: " for at least two years an the territory . . . "

The new wording is now "he has lived continuously for at least five years after reaching the age of 18 on the territory of the relevant Association."

The new wording cam in force with immediate effect on 18th June 2008 via FIFA Circular no . 1147 TO THE MEMBERS OF FIFA.

Since Daniels has started his football with the Wellington Phoenix way before 18th June 2008. The old wording applies to him, not the new wording.

This is the article;

[quote=FIFA]

VII . Eligibility to play for representative teams

Article 17
Acquisition of a new nationality

Any player who refers to art . 15 par . 1 to assume a new nationality and who has not played international football in accordance with art . 15 par . 2 shall be eligible to play for the new representative team only if he fulfils one of the following conditions :

(a) He was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(b) His biological mother or biological father was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(c) His grandmother or grandfather was born an the territory of the relevant Association ;
(d) He has lived continuously for at least five years after reaching the age of 18 an the territory of the relevant Association.
When you say that the new wording came in with immediate effect, does that mean that every case in the future would be subject to it, or every case at the present and in the future would be subject to it?


It means that any footballers who has started to live on the territory of another Association on the 18th June 2008 and onwards has to wait five years.

Daniels lived continuously in NZ for two years. He started to live here before 18th June 2008 and so is under the old wording of two years not five years.
So you are saying he will be playing for New Zealand soon?


Yup, he can be playing for NZ soon as for "will be" that's not my decision but Ricki's.
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
YAY Daniel! That's so cool he has become a kiwi!! XD
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Also can someone confirm if he played for an age grade team I can't remember if this was a fact or a rumour. If its a fact it creates a new problem.


It's all bollocks. When he first came over there was a big article in the dom that said the Wikipedia article (where said rumour originated) was pretty much all wrong.

I'll dig it up once I get to work.
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over 17 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

I think it might of been like a national schoolboys level or something, I have it at home somewhere.

As for making the starting lineup I think the fact that he'll bring a different style to the team makes him a great chance of making the team. By playing someone who isn't as much of a "Kiwi" style footballer we would surely be able to bring a bit of a new dimension to the side would we not??
You know we belong together...

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