Phoenix Ownership - Rob says FTFFA

Interested on what exactly you base your 'indifference to the Nix' on?

ps where was the 'monopoly' quote?

Hi team,

I'm going to do a wee write up on Wellingtonista.com encouraging people to get along to the game this Friday and better yet buy a membership. I just wanna double check details around this whole hot mess.

- In licence discussions FFA originally offered Welnix 3 year licence?

- Welnix counter with 10 years

- FFA: NOPE 4 years for you.

- Every other club has a 20 year licence

- FFA currently keeping Newcastle Jets afloat?

Anything else I'm missing? Anyone have dates of all of the above? Any must link to articles for Joe public?

Next TV deal will be in 2016/17 to be worth $80mil or more and $4 million to each club. Nix will be part of that next TV deal if they take up the four years on offer.

SKY TV or Lightbox sports to pay more for A-League TV rights come 2016/17.

I thought that the rumoured original offer was 5 years, and that the 4 year on the table is actually one that was in the original license agreement that Welnix got 4 years ago, so it was for 4+4 years. A lot of what we are working with is supposition and/or stuff that was leaked through the media and is not neccerarily correct.

How do you know the next TV deal will be that much? Ratings are down for all clubs and the current TV deal was part of an overall football package that Fox put together which included the EPL, Fox has lost the EPL now so it could be that the A-League is less attractive to them as the only football content.

Plus FTA has been called a 'disaster' for SBS.  http://www.fourfourtwo.com/au/news/league-disaste...

They are deep in the shark at FFA HQ but no one seems willing to call them on it other than social media.

Because $80 mil is next to nothing compared to the NRL $186 mil and ARL $418 mil per season. The A-League could do with two more teams but back onto the subject $80 mil is pocket change and should be easy to get via FTA bidding and FOXTEL.

Put Finals on FTA and the ratings would / should go up.

Please read Disco Damien's article for more "shooting one's self in the foot" from the FFA. Damn good article.

Also just heard the 5am news and not sure if I heard this right as I was half asleep but Rob Morrison allegedly sat down for a chat with Lowry & Gallop yesterday and discussed some of the issues. What made my ears prick up, was a mention about the Broadcasting fees paid by Sky, certainly being one of the more important stumbling blocks. I hope someone else can verify whether I got that right or wrong. Apologies if I did.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/a-league/738...

Not sure I like the last bit about a New Zealand identity, but if that's what the FFA say we need to do to survive....

Personally I think the touring roadshow/NZ Phoenix idea isn't sustainable.

Season tickets would be a waste of time, how can the club expect the hardcore to continue to follow them around the country on a Tiki Tour. The New Zealand Phoenix just leaves me feeling cold and unattached. I don't see Australian clubs that are currently being financially kept alive by the FFA, touring around Aussie to keep up a fan base. Just a red hearing to some extent.

I do acknowledge though, that Wellingtonian's really do need to start showing up. We should really have a consistant fan base of 12k at home games by now. The club have been around long enough to have etched itself a local mark. Sadly on sites like this though, we are already preaching to the converted and regular attendees.

The Herald article on the subject  kind of suggests that FFA and Welnix will be ganging up on NZF, which I personally have no problem with. I wouldn't be happy going down the "NZ Phoenix" route, although it might be more convenient for me with more Auckland games. But they have a point - they want a 4.5 million market, not a 450,000 market, and getting a solid following in AKL and Chch is vital for that.

Ultimately though I think the biggest issue with becoming the NZ Phoenix is it pretty much ensures no future expansion into the NZ market, and IMO the single biggest thing that could be done to increase interest and visibility in the A League across all of NZ media and public would be to create a 2nd kiwi franchise and get some sweet derby action going. That might still be years away but that should be a long term goal for all stakeholders.

Gets to be a bit tiresome that the Phoenix seem to be continually asked to operate under different rules than other A league teams. Dont think any other team is expected to talk to a broadcaster. They want to dilute the Sydney market yet want us to expand ours. Not convinced a travelling circus will work, so what we will be expected to give a way home advantage on a more regular basis. 

When is someone going to have the balls to call out the FFA on some of the rubbish thats gone on recently.

The last time there was a team calling itself "New Zealand" in the A League they averaged crouds of about 3000, it ended horribly and only the creation of a WELLINGTON team saved professional football in this country.

Just sayin'

;)

Many, many people - including Shirley Bright, that great muckracking blogger - are calling the FFA out at the moment, ballane. 

But I have never been in favour of the option that if the FFA act like dicks, Welnix should take their ball and go home. Their house - sadly - their rules, until all the club owners decide to get together and take over the A-League (and how much would be required for that to happen).

Its all about sky in the end, nz following = ratings = money. The Phoenix negotiating with sky = metrics ( get a good deal or you're out) = money.

They can increase their nz fanbase by getting a free to air deal for instance. Are the nz warriors any more popular than the Auckland warriors were? Do the nz warriors have a faceting road show. Nope.

The thing about expanding identity across NZ might also be a way of bringing NZF into an agreement of some sort. I guess there's probably elements of the footballing public in NZ who would complain about NZF helping a "Wellington" team.

Anyway, this press release is a positive sign I reckon. I think the FFA might back down quite a lot from their previous hardline stance. Either they underestimated the backlash kicking us out would get from within Australia, or this was all just a negotiating tactic the whole time, or some combination of the two. Regardless, I think there's more than a glimmer of hope for us now...

I was always convinced it was a negotiating tactic, but the backlash made that tactic far less effective. Hopefully we'll learn more tomorrow night.

Can I just make it clear as a Wellingtonian born and raised, JAFA for work and marriage; I am completely opposed to "NZ Phoenix" (as I am to NZ Warriors or NZ Breakers). So how does a Wellington team start getting ratings and interest in the broader Auckland (and South Island) football market? Because that's the question which will sway the FFA.

Where is this money coming from that NZ Football are expected to help out with its not as if they are rolling in it.

Sepp Blatter could find it, so why can't NZF?!

Isn't FIFA withholding a million dollars that it owes NZF? That's how Blatter can find the money but NZF cannot.

My view is the coaching at secondary school level is rubbish, and at FTC mediocre; So yes, perhaps if the different coaching was of a high standard there might be a different argument to be had, but international best practice at this age would be focus on technical player development, and it's hard to encourage that when one day are week players are told to focus on one touch / posession / movement in formation, and on other days told to hoof it upfield to the big tall lad up front.

Fox apparently had to increase what it pays the AFL substantially so will have less money to play with, plus A-League ratings are down, plus Optus now has the EPL and Fox packaged the A-League and EPL together as an overall football product, the same panellists and shows were used for the EPL and A-League. Without the EPL the A-League is less viable, and potentially without the Eurosnobs A-League ratings will go down.

Hopefully Fox decides to double down on the A-League and make it the star rather than an adjunct to the EPL. Or hopefully Optus decides to go for the A-League and pay over-odds like they did with the EPL. But just saying that they should pay more because they pay more for other sports doesn't really make sense. The NBL has to PAY Fox to be broadcast, Fox doesn't pay a cent for that content - that's life outside of the big three sports in Australia.

Optus is embarking on a strategy akin to what Spark is doing with Lightbox and Lightbox Sport, that is buying other peoples content and broadcasting it, they aren't currently manufacturing content.

Could Auckland City be ready to go within 4 years? Could a commitment from NZF and "other stakeholders" be a workable start point? 

This is premised obviously on the goal of getting NZ as a market to contribute more to FFA's A league. I'm firmly of the view that a 2nd NZ franchise is the best way to meet that goal, via expansion, not the latest rubbish that the Nix suddenly attract more $ from broadcasters by sending more games to Auk and Chch.

Didn't Auckland City say they plan to be in the A-League within 5 years?

Ryans Rovers was saying on twitter that the 40 million license that Fox pays the FFA is for the socceroos and the A-League, and that most of that money is for the Socerroos, the A-League wouldn't generate enough revenue from TV to go anywhere near covering the cap. If that's true then it kind of makes sense that the FFA are pissed at NZF for not contributing.

If the NZ stakeholders are in charge of the NZ part of the competition and have more autonomy from the FFA does that mean that we actually have an increased chance of getting an Auckland City in?

Rumour

FFA really need a wake up call and to play the long game here. If they want more $ out of the NZ market, they need to start working towards that. The way football works and geography make NZ Nix impossible, IMO. Ergo, Auk franchise the only realistic solution.

Disagree. Wellington Nix are almost NZ Nix anyway. Just need to admit it and go for it properly.

Please refer to a well publicised comment by Gareth that if nobody else is likely to get a franchise in Auckland up and running, he would have to. While I know Gareth said a lot of things in the past that should be taken with a grain of salt, I thought he made a lot of sense when he said "you need to have an Auckland A-League team in addition to The Nix in order to grow football in this country".

That would also avoid the stupid godawful rebranding of WPX into NZPX, while increasing the spread of coverage.

On a more realistic note, could we somehow prevail on SKY to put an A-League highlights package show on Prime TV that they own?

Not going to happen. From a marketing and biz POV, it won't work. Auckland stakeholders in the game needs to grow some balls and get a franchise going.

And alienate our Wellington fans?  Yep that would be a tremendous business model.

The FFA are playing a dirty blinder here. They've conceded nothing so far, instead trying to get Marshall and the focus on NZF and the NZ market. That whole statement is designed to keep their hands clean and is neat in that it repeats an already established piece of rubbish and then opens up new lines of attack/problems with stakeholders

1 - The Sky deal. FFA negotiated it. And yet it's up to Nix to talk to them? Nah mate, you shark on your own floor - you don't make someone else clean it up.

If the Nix are talking to other broadcasters, what does that mean for the Sky deal? And how are the FFA getting out of the current deal.

2 - NZF. The FFA want NZF to fund the Nix, therefore partly funding the FFA? It'd basically slave the NZF to the FFA and there'd still be no concrete certainty that at some point down the line the FFA don't just bin the Nix off. I know that sounds awful, but it's the reality of not having the Nix in the NZF - they've got no reason to keep the Nix if they can get something going across the Tasman.

3 - Expanding the brand. Awwwwww shark. I reckon Lowy, Gallop and that see NZ as ONE market, 4,000,000 strong and can't understand why taking the Nix on tour like some sort of Harlem Globetrotters is a terrible idea. Here's where the relative population of Aussie and NZ come in, eh? Sydney's got two teams and 4,000,000 people and pull in a reasonable amount of fans. Why can't NZ do that? Er, because it's two islands, one country and a hell of a lot of different regions.

Even if there's 15k in the RoF on Friday, even if WCC get on board, even if NZF chime in... I reckon there'll be suddenly more conditions and more things for Nix to resolve. This is a fudgeing shakedown and no mistake.

It's just I would think this is a no-brainer.  They already have the content, they could simply put on Prime (Monday nights?) the short show they used to have with Denis Katsianos.  It may even lure some more innocent souls into subscribing to SKY.

Gotta try something new it seems. Alienate maybe 500 but maybe gain 5000. 

Of course if 15,000 WELLINGTONIANS were now to start attending REGULARLY it's a different matter.