I am sorry but from what i have seen live and on tv Steven Old is
not up to this level - his distribution is poor, for a big lad he
isnt strong in the air or tackle and positionally he gets caught
time and time again......
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Yep he was the worst player on the park tonight. Completely killed
our momentum at every opportunity. valeo2007-12-14 21:41:03
a.haak

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unfortunatly I have to agree. all he did was play useless
longballs, a big disapointment
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Its not the fact he plays the long ball 10 times out of 9, when he
does try anything else he looks like a gorm and either argues with
the ref/lino or himself, i dont know which is worse...
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never passed it to a phoenix player
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No you're wrong, he did pass it to Lockhead once.
I really hoped Ricki would sub him off, drop Locks back and bring Daniel on to link up with Felipe. Together they might have won the game for us.
Oi Oi Edgecumbe... lets have a clean sheet
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Why does he consistenty make this side - i thought he was average
in the a-league last year when he played and in the nzfc he wasnt
outstanding... does surprise me how he gets chosen above others -
sigmund included in the last few years
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we play to many long balls all the time. the amount of possession
we give away must be mad.
the set plays were a waste of time, and some of the free kicks
were so rushed we might as well od just given the ball away.
long ball = absolute s hi te it has to stop
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on the long ball point i agree especially in the last ten mins, but
v sydney (h) and perhaps adelaide (h) we were perhaps trying to be
too intricate and close, at least there some variety there now for
the opposition to have to respond to
re Old, I'd want to see an improvement before the end of the season (or, if not - 2 new wide defenders)
re Old, I'd want to see an improvement before the end of the season (or, if not - 2 new wide defenders)
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For once, I agree with everyone, Old is not up to it, drop lochead
back, hes a fullback not a wide player.
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To be fair, we aint good enough playing the ball from the back full
stop.
Too many long high balls that the defences are just eating
up.
We need Daniels energy in there to try and work the ball thru
on the ground. We looked a different side when he came on.
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Also have to agree with everything been said on here
I suspect he could be one of the players released at the end
of the season
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I bet he isnt tho and that is the scarey part - seems he is liked
in some quarters
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Distribution is mud. Every time he gets the ball I cringe. Shame
really.
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shown up by Rees - he also hasn't got pace, but he gets the tackle
in before the opponent gets away - and I always seem to
notice Rees heading back from the opposition goalmouth after
looking for a header opportunity. Where's Old in all this?
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Rees can deliver a damn good cross. Old and even Dodd is starting
to make me nervous passing it around the bck instead of feeding the
midfield.
Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!
The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!
The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!
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For once, I agree with everyone, Old is not up to it, drop lochead
back, hes a fullback not a wide player.
Each to their own horus, sure Lochhead is also good in a 4-4-2, but he's doing fine in his current role
I've been impressed with Lochhead's contribution as a wide mid, he reads the game well, is prepared to commit to a tackle but will also close a player down until he's got cover, he posses the pace and willingness to go past players that someone like Elrich seems to have lost, and he gets involved, his passing options are usually intelligent
he also generally snuffs out any threat from the opposition wide defender coming forward
tigers2007-12-15 09:58:47
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Unfortunately he got a lot of attention as a very young player and
hasn't really fulfilled his potential. He should really be
stepping up but looks out of his depth.
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He's played pretty well over the past few weeks, but he wasn't as
clinical as he has been in previous games last night, which he'll
probably be the first to admit.
But he's a young guy who thrives on confidence, and anyone who's ever watched him move through age grade football can tell you that. He's at his best when he's got a little moxey going on.
This season, however, he seems to be short a positive thought or two, and when you don't have experience to fall back on, that really really hampers your performance. I still think he's worth the time and effort, because he has shown glimpses of what he's capable of when he's in his zone, but for the intents and purposes of this season he might be better left on the bench.
But he's a young guy who thrives on confidence, and anyone who's ever watched him move through age grade football can tell you that. He's at his best when he's got a little moxey going on.
This season, however, he seems to be short a positive thought or two, and when you don't have experience to fall back on, that really really hampers your performance. I still think he's worth the time and effort, because he has shown glimpses of what he's capable of when he's in his zone, but for the intents and purposes of this season he might be better left on the bench.
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This is fantastic!!!! I said this about OLD at the start of the
season but really copt it had people saying I was negitive, Im not,
but that guy is in no way up to A League standard. Glad people have
seen it.
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oldy might be a good lad and all but seriously ya cnt extend his
contract hes gota go.chuck him bak in the nzfc.hes a big lad he'll
improve if hes not constantly chucked in the deep end
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He's played pretty well over the past few weeks, but he wasn't as
clinical as he has been in previous games last night, which he'll
probably be the first to admit.
But he's a young guy who thrives on confidence, and anyone who's ever watched him move through age grade football can tell you that. He's at his best when he's got a little moxey going on.
This season, however, he seems to be short a positive thought or two, and when you don't have experience to fall back on, that really really hampers your performance. I still think he's worth the time and effort, because he has shown glimpses of what he's capable of when he's in his zone, but for the intents and purposes of this season he might be better left on the bench.
But he's a young guy who thrives on confidence, and anyone who's ever watched him move through age grade football can tell you that. He's at his best when he's got a little moxey going on.
This season, however, he seems to be short a positive thought or two, and when you don't have experience to fall back on, that really really hampers your performance. I still think he's worth the time and effort, because he has shown glimpses of what he's capable of when he's in his zone, but for the intents and purposes of this season he might be better left on the bench.
hi Michael, can you pse help this old fella out?
"moxey" ??
I tried wikipedia and dictionary dot com, and my teenager's not here so I'm stuck
does it mean 'aggro'' (ancient term for "niggle/scrapping") or is it more like mojo/confidence??
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He's played pretty well over the past few weeks, but he wasn't as
clinical as he has been in previous games last night, which he'll
probably be the first to admit. But he's a young guy who thrives on
confidence, and anyone who's ever watched him move through age
grade football can tell you that. He's at his best when he's got a
little moxey going on.This season, however, he seems to be short a
positive thought or two, and when you don't have experience to fall
back on, that really really hampers your performance. I
still think he's worth the time and effort, because he has shown
glimpses of what he's capable of when he's in his zone, but for the
intents and purposes of this season he might be better left on the
bench.
I'd agree with that.
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Afraid I agree with the comments about Old. The A-League is not the
place to give promising young defenders time to develop.
Experiance is everything....look what we are getting out of
Rees. He just knows where to be most of the time. Let Old go back
local league for a few years and get more experiance. He might be
worth another look in a few years.
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I must say whenever he has the ball I mumber quietly "oh god,
please dont make him c ock this one up".
Central Hawkes Bay Nix
and tragic follower of Charlton Athletic
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Old has been trying hard past few weeks but too many sleepy moments
on defence and his distribution is poor. last night his
distribution was appalling.
Answer is not pulling Lochead back into a back 3 as he
did not look comfortable in that position. Need to
strengthen defensive options for next year.
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He's played pretty well over the past few weeks, but he wasn't as
clinical as he has been in previous games last night, which he'll
probably be the first to admit.
But he's a young guy who thrives on confidence, and anyone who's ever watched him move through age grade football can tell you that. He's at his best when he's got a little moxey going on.
This season, however, he seems to be short a positive thought or two, and when you don't have experience to fall back on, that really really hampers your performance. I still think he's worth the time and effort, because he has shown glimpses of what he's capable of when he's in his zone, but for the intents and purposes of this season he might be better left on the bench.
But he's a young guy who thrives on confidence, and anyone who's ever watched him move through age grade football can tell you that. He's at his best when he's got a little moxey going on.
This season, however, he seems to be short a positive thought or two, and when you don't have experience to fall back on, that really really hampers your performance. I still think he's worth the time and effort, because he has shown glimpses of what he's capable of when he's in his zone, but for the intents and purposes of this season he might be better left on the bench.
hi Michael, can you pse help this old fella out?
"moxey" ??
I tried wikipedia and dictionary dot com, and my teenager's not here so I'm stuck
does it mean 'aggro'' (ancient term for "niggle/scrapping") or is it more like mojo/confidence??
Yep, the latter. It's typically used in conjunction with "youthful" (i.e. "youthful moxey"), but "mojo" sums it up pretty nicely too.
Another thing I worry about is the "sink or swim" attitude that's lumped on players Old's age at any high level of sport. Forgive me for mentioning the egg-chasing game, but Old's situation is freakishly similar to that of Isaia Toeava, the young buck identified by Graham Henry and his cartel as being a superstar in waiting at the tender age of 19, and thrust into the AB's #13 jersey during the 2006 Tri-Nations.
Now, this kid had torn up every age-grade team he'd been selected in; he was likened to a pacific island version of Christian Cullen, and the good oil pointed towards him being something unlike anything NZ rugby had seen in a very, very long time.
So what happened? He was overwhelmed, forgot all the basic fundamentals of playing rugby and fell apart at the seams. His confidence was shot completely, and he was understandably dropped from the 2006 end of year tour. However, in this year's Super 14, he was slick, he was classy and he was beginning to churn potential into results. He's still not talking the talk completely at AB level (did someone say rotation?), but his growth in the last twelve months has been tremendous.
What the 'Nix have with Old is a guy who's still stuck trying to convert potential into performance. Even though he's young, he's aware of the time and effort that's been put into him from an early age, and simply as a human being with goals and aspirations he knows what he wants and what he wants to achieve, and most importantly, what he has to do to do all that. It's that old cliche about the top two inches making all the difference, and therein lies the secret to Steven Old. His mistakes last night were mental mistakes, that's all. But as we all know, when the pressure's on and you're stuck in a bit of a rut, it's incredibly easy to make those mistakes over and over -- especially when you're trying your damndest not to repeat them.
So, here's the problem: Riki Herbert's investment, one S. Old, isn't returning the dividends it should. There isn't some economic slight of hand at play here; anyone with a pair of eyes can tell you what Old's doing wrong and what needs to happen to fix it. If the answer lies upstairs, then it's obvious what the guy needs is a mentor. PROBLEM! The Phoenix's defence is, well, sh*te, and would you feel at all comfortable with one of Elrich, Dodd or Rees as a mentor? Exactly.
The solution? For the love of all god, Riki, buy a top-class defender. Someone who's at the peak of their game, and has been around the track a few times. Pair this guy with Old -- not so much as a babysitter -- but as a guide, someone to look up to, someone to feed off and someone to emulate. Have them train together, play together -- hell, even have them share a hotel room together on away games. The young buck will pick up on a few things, and his game and the Phoenix defence as a whole will be much better for it. The investment could very well turn into a "two for the price of one" deal, and that's worth it's weight in (g)old.
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like all players steven old has his days
but i dont like steven o'dor
WHAT A SHOKER
but i dont like steven o'dor
WHAT A SHOKER
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He Cant Even Kick A Small Little Soccer Ball Into The Crowd Thats
How Bad He Is
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He Cant Even Kick A Small Little Soccer Ball Into The Crowd Thats
How Bad He Is
Why Do People Type Like This
ive got a song that wont take long, Adelaide are rubbish.. the second verse is same as the first.. ADELAIDE ARE RUBBISH
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Old is actually not a bad defender. He wins ball for us back
there. Problem with defenders in the a-league is they have to
be able to play as well and he cant unfortunately. I cant
believe O'Dor isnt starting in the back 3.
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I cant believe O'Dor isnt starting in the back 3.
I can.....!!!!!!!!!!
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Michael Oliver You have sumed up Old fullstop.
He will be a great player. I'm sure Herbert only wanted him as
a squad player and with the poor defending that the Phoenix have
been doing Old has been thrown in 12 months early.
I still rate him as a player, yes I got pissed off with him
playing the long ball but by the same token Dodd has the same
thinking, kick the sh*t out of the ball.
Old is a kid and he is still in the early stages of pro
football stop knocking him he will come good.
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OLD and O'Dor..... Cut 'em both Ricky
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I cant believe O'Dor isnt starting in the back 3.
He's injured.
On top of that he's 20 years old, how many successful centre backs are at their potential at 20 years old ? He's a million times the player Jack Pelter is and look where he has ended up. He's ranked by the Australians well enough to play in the Aus U-20 side, the side that contains all the kids people on here repeatedly fap about.
In two or three years time he may well be one of the best defenders in this league, if not for us then another A-League side. I know which I'd prefer.
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He's played pretty well over the past few weeks, but he wasn't as
clinical as he has been in previous games last night, which he'll
probably be the first to admit.
But he's a young guy who thrives on confidence, and anyone who's ever watched him move through age grade football can tell you that. He's at his best when he's got a little moxey going on.
This season, however, he seems to be short a positive thought or two, and when you don't have experience to fall back on, that really really hampers your performance. I still think he's worth the time and effort, because he has shown glimpses of what he's capable of when he's in his zone, but for the intents and purposes of this season he might be better left on the bench.
But he's a young guy who thrives on confidence, and anyone who's ever watched him move through age grade football can tell you that. He's at his best when he's got a little moxey going on.
This season, however, he seems to be short a positive thought or two, and when you don't have experience to fall back on, that really really hampers your performance. I still think he's worth the time and effort, because he has shown glimpses of what he's capable of when he's in his zone, but for the intents and purposes of this season he might be better left on the bench.
hi Michael, can you pse help this old fella out?
"moxey" ??
I tried wikipedia and dictionary dot com, and my teenager's not here so I'm stuck
does it mean 'aggro'' (ancient term for "niggle/scrapping") or is it more like mojo/confidence??
Yep, the latter. It's typically used in conjunction with "youthful" (i.e. "youthful moxey"), but "mojo" sums it up pretty nicely too.
Another thing I worry about is the "sink or swim" attitude that's lumped on players Old's age at any high level of sport. Forgive me for mentioning the egg-chasing game, but Old's situation is freakishly similar to that of Isaia Toeava, the young buck identified by Graham Henry and his cartel as being a superstar in waiting at the tender age of 19, and thrust into the AB's #13 jersey during the 2006 Tri-Nations.
Now, this kid had torn up every age-grade team he'd been selected in; he was likened to a pacific island version of Christian Cullen, and the good oil pointed towards him being something unlike anything NZ rugby had seen in a very, very long time.
So what happened? He was overwhelmed, forgot all the basic fundamentals of playing rugby and fell apart at the seams. His confidence was shot completely, and he was understandably dropped from the 2006 end of year tour. However, in this year's Super 14, he was slick, he was classy and he was beginning to churn potential into results. He's still not talking the talk completely at AB level (did someone say rotation?), but his growth in the last twelve months has been tremendous.
What the 'Nix have with Old is a guy who's still stuck trying to convert potential into performance. Even though he's young, he's aware of the time and effort that's been put into him from an early age, and simply as a human being with goals and aspirations he knows what he wants and what he wants to achieve, and most importantly, what he has to do to do all that. It's that old cliche about the top two inches making all the difference, and therein lies the secret to Steven Old. His mistakes last night were mental mistakes, that's all. But as we all know, when the pressure's on and you're stuck in a bit of a rut, it's incredibly easy to make those mistakes over and over -- especially when you're trying your damndest not to repeat them.
So, here's the problem: Riki Herbert's investment, one S. Old, isn't returning the dividends it should. There isn't some economic slight of hand at play here; anyone with a pair of eyes can tell you what Old's doing wrong and what needs to happen to fix it. If the answer lies upstairs, then it's obvious what the guy needs is a mentor. PROBLEM! The Phoenix's defence is, well, sh*te, and would you feel at all comfortable with one of Elrich, Dodd or Rees as a mentor? Exactly.
The solution? For the love of all god, Riki, buy a top-class defender. Someone who's at the peak of their game, and has been around the track a few times. Pair this guy with Old -- not so much as a babysitter -- but as a guide, someone to look up to, someone to feed off and someone to emulate. Have them train together, play together -- hell, even have them share a hotel room together on away games. The young buck will pick up on a few things, and his game and the Phoenix defence as a whole will be much better for it. The investment could very well turn into a "two for the price of one" deal, and that's worth it's weight in (g)old.
The only problem with this is attracting a "top class
defender", we are the Phoenix, we'll finish 6th at best, there's a
salary cap and if we're not careful we'll be seen as a club with
high player churn, all of this will make it very difficult for
Rikki to attract any decent "known" players. If the raw
talent is there, maybe it's about investing in the coaching
staff? I'm pretty sure there are journeymen in the UK that
would jump at the chance of taking a coaching position in NZ as a
first step in management (look at Mitch at Perth).
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Why do you think it will be hard to sign 'known' players? Most
players really respect Ricki as a coach and that is the reason a
lot of the players we do have are here.
a.haak

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steven old lacks determination and never puts his body on the line.
man if i eva played 4 the nix i would put everything into it,
another thing steven gives up to easy and its no coincidence that
he keeps giving up these stupid brain explosions
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