Was - Phoenix Transfer Speculation

3999 replies · 239,887 views

over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

gings wrote:

I like the way everyone automatically assumes we'll be running the bare minimum youth spots (3)...

i havnt seen anyone assume this anywhere?

the facts are we will be signing 2 more youth players, but every signing is going to have to be up to A-League standard, or quite close to it, in order to have a strong enough squad.

I personally would love it if we had 4 or 5 young guys, at different levels where they can slowly be integrated into the squad. However Ricki wants to be able to drop any of them into the A-League at any point, and I'm not sure if there are many young guys unsigned who could do that.
Plus the cash worries lead us to believe we are only going to sign the 20 minimum needed.

On the previous page theres a few saying 2 out of the 3 (Thurtell, Bran and Chettleburgh) will be signed.

Also, the 'cash worries' may lead to us signing all 3 if they're cheap and up to standard (I'd imagine they will be, can't see any one of those 3 being able to command more than the minimum rate). I'd say it'll be quality that is the issue, not cost.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

I'm not so sure.

I think if Rigters and Dirty Sanchez sign, then it will be two minimum signings to come. Think we could sign more if we had more money, but dont think we will. If we do sign anyone else, I think it will be a released guy in the Ward, Caceres, Reddy situation.

I do think we shouldnt limit ourselves to the 3 minimum u20s, but it does come down to quality costs and depth, also RH has said he only wnats 20, so I guess that is why we are all going with what he has said.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

I personally think that paying the wages of extra players above the minimum squad size of 20 is pointless UNLESS that player/those players are of a high standard who will be regularly pushing for a 1st team place.

It's not,like we have a Yoof team for the reserves to play in every week like the other clubs...

"Ive just re-visited this and once again realised that C-Diddy is a genius - a drunk, Newcastle bred disgrace - but a genius." - Hard News, 11:39am 4th June 2009

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Smithy wrote:

Doloras wrote:

C-Diddy wrote:

2 U21's (Out of Bran, Thurtell & Chettleburg)

You don't think any of the Junior All Whites have done enough to get a slot...? Me neither.

I don't think they have. Because they're not here in Wellington trialling, when they could be. They are (mostly) sat in Auckland (probably) complaining about how the Nix don't sign Kiwis.

I think there is also an issue that they are mostly not up to A-League level.

SMithy do you think there is a bit of an issue in that many o them don't have agents pushing them to do these kind of things?

Normo's coming home

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Also, hell of a non-vote of confidence in Millicich (and very un-joined up thinking) if the guy droppes from the U20s ends up being the one signed by the Phoenix post tournament.

Normo's coming home

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Can I also add, where has this greenacre to midfield idea come from?

Nothing at all of how I have seen him play suggests that he is the answer there, it just smacks of chucking mud at a wall and hoping something sticks (which is pretty much how all of our recruitment in that position has been done).

Normo's coming home

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

there was an apparent bust up between the two.
Plus Chettleburgh doesnt play the hoofing style Milicich favours

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

That says a lot about NZ Football. If the national coach likes a player then surely he should be picked in the U20s and both of them should get over it

Normo's coming home

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

james dean wrote:

Smithy wrote:

Doloras wrote:

C-Diddy wrote:

2 U21's (Out of Bran, Thurtell & Chettleburg)

You don't think any of the Junior All Whites have done enough to get a slot...? Me neither.

I don't think they have. Because they're not here in Wellington trialling, when they could be. They are (mostly) sat in Auckland (probably) complaining about how the Nix don't sign Kiwis.

I think there is also an issue that they are mostly not up to A-League level.

SMithy do you think there is a bit of an issue in that many o them don't have agents pushing them to do these kind of things?

some of them might want to go to a US College?

Founder

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Feverish wrote:

some of them might want to go to a US College?

Agree, however, they could still come train/trial with the nix.

Why not test yourself against the only pro team in the country. Then after the nix offer you a contract is when you can decide whether you want to turn them down and go to US or not.

Surely training /trialling with them is going to also increase their skills and experience so could actually help their chances of making it into a US college??
playwithFire2011-08-23 21:32:33

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Ritgers
--------------------------- Ifill----------------------------------------

-Pantelis------------------ Lia/Brown----------Bertos------------------------

------------------------------------- Muscat----------------------------------------
--------- Lochhead------ Siggy---------- Durante ----- Downey

------------------------------------- Warner ----------------------------------------

Sanchez smells of Totovaleo2011-08-23 21:47:20

a.haak

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

id go

                paston

downey      sigmund       durante lochhead

   muscat    lia
                      sanchez

ifill                       rigters              pantelis

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

I've always felt Ifill is best coming from wide out. And means our wide men once again are the source of all creativity - pretty much the same as the last 2 seasons...

I really think a quality player in midfield would raise our whole side up a level

james dean2011-08-23 22:05:16

Normo's coming home

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

I've got this feeling that Bertos is going to have the starting spot over Pantelis for game 1, but I hope Pantelis can shine because when I've seen him recently for the nix, and for the pissants, I've really rated his ball delivery and technical ability.

leo has become far too hesistant over the past seasons. Maybe he will be back to his best after getting over his injuries and with a new sponsorship deal, but I hope Pantelis is given a fair shot to take his spot. Pantelis also offers more ias a goal scoring threat in my opinion, and is a more confident player.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

james dean wrote:

Can I also add, where has this greenacre to midfield idea come from?

Not sure who has said what about this but I actually spoke to him in person. He said he had to play in midfield during pre-season and practice so the 'striker' triallists can have a go. He is not so keen on creative midfield role but if asked, can fill in a midfield spot. It was a 20 min long coversation so dont think he was rushing to explain. Also, Greenie's copped a bit from our midfield maestros about prospects of him playing in midfield. So its all speculation... Unless he was lying and/or someone knows otherwise.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

ok that's interesting, cheers - sounds like ithe kind of thing that could have come from the football manager types on herejames dean2011-08-23 22:15:17

Normo's coming home

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

playwithFire wrote:

id go ï¿½ ï¿½ ï¿½ ï¿½ ï¿½ ï¿½ ï¿½ï¿½ pastondowney sigmund durante ï¿½ ï¿½ lochhead ï¿½ ï¿½ ï¿½ ï¿½ ï¿½ ï¿½ ï¿½ ï¿½ï¿½ muscatï¿½ ï¿½ ï¿½ ï¿½ ï¿½ï¿½ lia ï¿½ ï¿½ï¿½ ï¿½ sanchezifill ï¿½ï¿½ rigters ï¿½ ï¿½ pantelis

Agree

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

james dean wrote:

ok that's interesting, cheers - sounds like ithe kind of thing that could have come from the football manager types on here

yup. quite possible.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

playwithFire wrote:

id go

             (not) Paston

downey      sigmund       durante lochhead

   muscat    lia
                      sanchez

ifill                       rigters              pantelis

+ 1

sounds good. wonder if it'll work with no one in 'midfield' (wings) with pace. Only thing that could go wrong with this formation + players is that Ifill and Pantelis will have to reack back in midfield to defend and it'll become 4-5-1. Just like dunners. IMO.

FIXED

Ankit2011-08-23 22:57:07

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Would Love to see ricki give this a go.

                                          Warner

            Downey.     Durante.     Siggy.      Lochhead

                                Muscat.        Lia

             Ifill.                     Sanchez             Pantelis

                                          Rigters

Only problem is that sanchez is reliant on decent passes from Lia,Muscat and the backs. The sooner we keep the ball on the ground the quicker a player like sanchez can put through The likes of rigters and ifill . Simples really. Possibly see how chettleburgh goes instead of Lia.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Why is Sanchez in everyones starting lineups when we haven't seem him properly play and it sounds like he hasn't impressed in trial games?

a.haak

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Doloras wrote:

C-Diddy wrote:

2 U21's (Out of Bran, Thurtell & Chettleburg)

You don't think any of the Junior All Whites have done enough to get a slot...? Me neither.

That guy Marco something looked pretty good. Maybe we should sign him.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

valeo wrote:

Why is Sanchez in everyones starting lineups when we haven't seem him properly play and it sounds like he hasn't impressed in trial games?

I suppose the assumption is that the coaching staff wouldn't be signing him if they didn't think he was good enough to play that position

Normo's coming home

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Ricki seems more taken with Sanchez's determination to succeed rather than his actual ability. From what I've read here he has yet to show much on the park. A wee whiff of desperation as the start of the season bears down on us?

Perhaps a slightly unfair summation as Ricki is in the best possible position to know if he's good enough. Fingers crossed quite frankly.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

StopOut wrote:

Ricki seems more taken with Sanchez's determination to succeed rather than his actual ability. From what I've read here he has yet to show much on the park. A wee whiff of desperation as the start of the season bears down on us?

Perhaps a slightly unfair summation as Ricki is in the best possible position to know if he's good enough. Fingers crossed quite frankly.

There's your problem. People speak their 'own' minds here. what THEY think. 100 people, 100 opinions etc etc.. Think we shud leave the guesswork to Ricki if we shud/shudn't put him in starting positions. It would be fair to judge Sanchez on his performance. not what others say.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

james dean wrote:

valeo wrote:

Why is Sanchez in everyones starting lineups when we haven't seem him properly play and it sounds like he hasn't impressed in trial games?

ï¿½

I suppose the assumption is that the coaching staff wouldn't be signing him if they didn't think he was good enough to play that position

this

I personally have not been overly impressed with what I have seen, but he is allegedly still coming back from injury. I would hope that his signing means he is good enough to take up a starting spot in the side, because to be honest, I dont want him if hes not going to be in the 1st XI, or at least bloody close to it.

think valeo said he is shaping to be toto v2, I would say its more likely he would be diego v2.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Let's be realistic, people on here have seen Sanchez in what, 2 local friendlies and half a game coming back from injury? Compare that with the 5 weeks or so the coaching staff have seen him day in and day out. They are the ones who can see him in action, we're feeding off scraps generally. They have made the wrong call before for sure - but really we just have to trust their judgement.

I use the plural but we still don't have much in the way of coaching staff

Normo's coming home

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

At the very least I like the fact that Sanchez is so committed to getting a contract. I don't expect him to be some Flores-like midfield wiz, just someone who is prepared to work hard for a first team place and hopefully give us a bit of extra spark in attack.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

StopOut wrote:

Let's not go overboard - he's an unemployed professional footballer, of course he wants a contract!

Normo's coming home

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Rigters deal has fallen over [source, agent quoted on theworldgame.com.au]- back to the drawing board james dean2011-08-24 02:02:03

Normo's coming home

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

james dean wrote:

Rigters deal has fallen over [source, agent quoted on theworldgame.com.au]- back to the drawing board

Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrgggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If this is true than that is a serious setback. Especially as Mehmet has supposedly buggered off back to the UK to sign with a Championship club.

I thought we would be super lucky to sign a guy who is only 27 and comes form Dutch Div1. It didn't look good when he was quoted as saying he "wasn't looking for a big adventure" and "had a family to consider" and "was waiting on a better offer from Aberdeen"

I guess we will have to wait....if he is not playing this weeks game then its all over rover.....and the hunt continues. sure hope Rickie has a plan B

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Shame.

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

zinidane wrote:

james dean wrote:

Rigters deal has fallen over [source, agent quoted on theworldgame.com.au]- back to the drawing board

Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrgggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If this is true than that is a serious setback. Especially as Mehmet has supposedly buggered off back to the UK to sign with a Championship club.

I guess we will have to wait....if he is not playing this weeks game then its all over rover.....and the hunt continues. sure hope Rickie has a plan B

Based on all of the comment in all media sources that we were in negotiations (clearly we were keen to sign) this looks like a big blow I agree.

We can't keep trialling players forever either, at some point we're going to have to get someone in.

Killen?

Normo's coming home

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

It seems a bit strange to me that Rigters should leave so early into a 10 day trial. Either he decided that the standard and/or team were terrible, or that we were miles away when we started to discuss terms. I would have thought that there would have been some initial discussions about the wages etc before he flew 12,000 miles so it appears to be the former.

I suppose the positive is that if we could afford him (and as I say, if he flew 12,000 miles to have a look it suggests we were at least in the same ball park) then it gives us an opportunity to get someone like Killen who would have been on pretty decent money for the last 5 or so years (I am assuming that he went to China for the cash and not the lifestyle)

All I do is make the stuff I would've liked
Reference things I wanna watch, reference girls I wanna bite
Now I'm firefly like a burning kite
And yousa fake fuck like a fleshlight

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Seems like it was all about the dollars and cents - and I agree that is odd, surely we must have has some idea of his demands and he must have had some idea of what we could offer:

Wellington Phoenix has missed out on the signature of former Premier League striker Maceo Rigters after a deal fell through at the final hurdle.

Phoenix tests Rigter scale

The ex-Blackburn Rover joined Wellington for a proposed 10-day trial period on Friday, and scored a consolation goal in Phoenix's 5-1 loss to A-League champion Brisbane Roar, only hours after joining the team after a long-haul flight from Europe.

In a week in which Harry Kewell was finally announced as the marquee player for Melbourne Victory, Rigters, 27, would have been a handy addition to Ricki Herbert's squad but the club and Rigters's player representative James Hardy could not come to terms on a deal.

"Unfortunately the Rigters deal with Wellington has broken down," Hardy told The World Game.

"It was nothing to do with the club or the setup, it was purely to do with the numbers."

Rigters was very keen on joining the A-League but is now looking at a move to Romania or Greece. The former Netherlands U-21 representative has been a free agent since his four-year contract with Blackburn ended on July 1.

"Maceo, would like to thank the Phoenix for their interest and he will be flying back to Europe tomorrow," Hardy said.

"It's disappointing as it's a big loss not only for Wellington but for the A-League in general."

Normo's coming home

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Bugger !!!!!!!!!!!!

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Don't think it was the money because we would have known what ballpark figure his agent was looking for before he flew for 40 hours to get here..

He did the same thing in Russia. Walked out after a day, saying something like....."it has to be right for me and my family"

Both sides will put a positive spin on it with the "purely to do with the numbers" but in reality Mr Rigters did not see himself as part of the Phoenix A-League set up IMO.

Time to move on. Shame about Mehmet. He looked a little out of condition and did not have much go his way in the trials but his pedigree suggests he would have been a useful addition to the team. In some ways he would probably have suited Rickies style of play better than the Dutchman.

So what now? We are fast becoming the Arsenal of the South Pacific. At least we have over a month to recruit someone but the European transfer window shuts soon. Looking forward to hearing what Mr Herbert has to say now( who would want to be a football manager)

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

damn

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

seems to me to be one of three things:

* there was no real discussion of terms before he arrived - seems unlikely, but as long as we didn't pay for him to come out, it is no skin of our ass if he flies out and then realises we can only offer him a monthly bus ticket for zones 1 and 2 and a $5 lunch voucher at Mr Chans everyday during the season.

* he arrived and thought we were mince - a bit of a worry, but f**k him. What does he know about the A League

* he has arrived and received offers (at least for trial) from somewhere else - seems the most likely to me.

All I do is make the stuff I would've liked
Reference things I wanna watch, reference girls I wanna bite
Now I'm firefly like a burning kite
And yousa fake fuck like a fleshlight

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over 14 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Frankie Mac wrote:

seems to me to be one of three things:

* he arrived and thought we were mince - a bit of a worry, but f**k him. What does he know about the A League

* he has arrived and received offers (at least for trial) from somewhere else - seems the most likely to me.

You have to admit..if you flew for 40 hours to play a trial game and your team defended like school girls and got dicked 1-5 and the attack consisted of wacking the ball 50 metres down field and no body moved to pick up your great through balls then would'nt you be on the first plane home.

Got a better offer closer to home IMO. Time to move on!!

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