WPW R14 vs Western Sydney Wanderers | Sun 12th Feb | 5:00pm | SS2

I hope either of you are anywhere need coaching, teaching or managing people with that attitude. 

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Of course you can, you have sick leave, bereavement leave, maternity and paternity leave, and holiday leave. The difference is because you work year round there isn't the same level of impact as someone who has a compacted work schedule of a few months.

....

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Come on mate, the world has changed dramatically in the last decade. The awarness of mental ilness and the impact of professional sport on younger players is now very much in focus. For so many years we have had players suffer from depression/anxiety and it went unnoticed (John Kirwan springs to mind) now mental helath and wellbeing is cared for as well as the physical. 
Saying it's pathetic is hugely insulting and offensive to all those who suffer from anxiety/depression and other such issues.

theprof

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Come on mate, the world has changed dramatically in the last decade. The awarness of mental ilness and the impact of professional sport on younger players is now very much in focus. For so many years we have had players suffer from depression/anxiety and it went unnoticed (John Kirwan springs to mind) now mental helath and wellbeing is cared for as well as the physical. 
Saying it's pathetic is hugely insulting and offensive to all those who suffer from anxiety/depression and other such issues.

Never specified mental illness, you decided that. You can say the world's moved on all you like but come work in the blue collar world and you'd probably be surprised. I've suffered from poor mental health, I've had friends that have too but they still show up to work because they have to. They can't afford to live if they don't. So sorry if I don't spend my days crying that a footballer can't make it to training. 

Ryan

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Of course you can, you have sick leave, bereavement leave, maternity and paternity leave, and holiday leave. The difference is because you work year round there isn't the same level of impact as someone who has a compacted work schedule of a few months.

Must be nice working a job where you get that. Most of the people in my industry don't have that luxury.

It’s unfortunate and I wish her well but this seems an on going issue with Grace so maybe it’s not for her?
it is professional sport and if you can’t handle the heat get out of the kitchen (for your own good)
Also she’s taking up the spot another more mentality consistent player could be occupying.

Monto

Ryan

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Of course you can, you have sick leave, bereavement leave, maternity and paternity leave, and holiday leave. The difference is because you work year round there isn't the same level of impact as someone who has a compacted work schedule of a few months.

Must be nice working a job where you get that. Most of the people in my industry don't have that luxury.

luxury?? it's a legal entitlement. Your employed legally has to provide these things! If you're not getting this you either need to find a better job or raise it as an issue.
"personal reasons" is code for mental illness of some desciption. And if you personally have struggled with such things then you should be well aware of the damage done if you can't deal with it in a safe environment.

Monto

theprof

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Come on mate, the world has changed dramatically in the last decade. The awarness of mental ilness and the impact of professional sport on younger players is now very much in focus. For so many years we have had players suffer from depression/anxiety and it went unnoticed (John Kirwan springs to mind) now mental helath and wellbeing is cared for as well as the physical. 
Saying it's pathetic is hugely insulting and offensive to all those who suffer from anxiety/depression and other such issues.

Never specified mental illness, you decided that. You can say the world's moved on all you like but come work in the blue collar world and you'd probably be surprised. I've suffered from poor mental health, I've had friends that have too but they still show up to work because they have to. They can't afford to live if they don't. So sorry if I don't spend my days crying that a footballer can't make it to training. 

Sadly, I know blue collar workers who decide life is too tough and take their own lives. Devastating for their families. I would rather people take time off work if they need to, when they need to, not when it's too late.

Monto

Ryan

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Of course you can, you have sick leave, bereavement leave, maternity and paternity leave, and holiday leave. The difference is because you work year round there isn't the same level of impact as someone who has a compacted work schedule of a few months.

Must be nice working a job where you get that. Most of the people in my industry don't have that luxury.

It's literally the law that you have that. What's your industry? The only reason you can possibly not have employee benefits is if you're self employed and that doesn't tend to be "blue collar."

Ryan

Monto

Ryan

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Of course you can, you have sick leave, bereavement leave, maternity and paternity leave, and holiday leave. The difference is because you work year round there isn't the same level of impact as someone who has a compacted work schedule of a few months.

Must be nice working a job where you get that. Most of the people in my industry don't have that luxury.

It's literally the law that you have that. What's your industry? The only reason you can possibly not have employee benefits is if you're self employed and that doesn't tend to be "blue collar."

I don't have any of those benefits because I'm self employed.

Self-employed poeple need to give themselves the leave options, if your contracting then the company your contracting to can't decline/deny leave.

The toughest thing is the age of our players.  We don't pay enough for our women to play as late in their career as the men, so lots retire earlier for careers that actually pay well, and so we have very young women in the squad.

I couldn't imagine life with social media when I was that young.  It takes a lot of life to learn how to deflect toxicity without being toxic yourself, and hell many never totally outgrow it.  I still get cut deep at times by shark.

As we saw from that DM from the Kiwi about that red, women get sent some nasty shark and are not paid enough to receive that.

I hope we have the facilities and resources in place to help our young women get through what they are going through and hopefully they come back stronger and have an amazing career.

I would hope for the awful nastiness to not exist but reality gonna reality.

I didn't mean too much by it - i wasn't suggesting it was mental like some one said it could be a variety of things. But i thought we would have professionals in the environment to help people - i dunno - just seems in nz teams we have people coming and going a lot. In sport teams you need sticability and continuity and was suggesting the best way to finish the season is to go with the reliable ones.

We need to finish strong, i think we have a win or two left in us - cant win a game 5-0 and not get another win! lets goooo

no need to guess regarding Grace's abscence - if you check her insta page it's clear as day!

theprof

Ryan

Monto

Ryan

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Of course you can, you have sick leave, bereavement leave, maternity and paternity leave, and holiday leave. The difference is because you work year round there isn't the same level of impact as someone who has a compacted work schedule of a few months.

Must be nice working a job where you get that. Most of the people in my industry don't have that luxury.

It's literally the law that you have that. What's your industry? The only reason you can possibly not have employee benefits is if you're self employed and that doesn't tend to be "blue collar."

I don't have any of those benefits because I'm self employed.

Self-employed poeple need to give themselves the leave options, if your contracting then the company your contracting to can't decline/deny leave.

Good to see that you're completely out of touch with how most people have to operate to survive in the modern world.

Understand your views to a point Monto. Have a brother who is a self employed tradie (works huge hours) and my folks were stoic hard working farmers. For them you only take a day off, if you are near death.

I also worked for many years in both public (3 years at a Council) and private (15 odd years in banking) sectors - and would get really irritated for those small number of work mates who used to treat their sick leave as almost annual leave, and be continously absent. You just knew they were taking the piss, leaving you to work late having to pick up some of their work. Thank fudge those days are over.

But I also have both a close friend and my half sister, with daughters age 17-19 who both suffer from severe anxiety. Absolutely crippling for both the young girls, and their families. Can't go to school (study online), basically barely leave the family homes. Not only them, but their families almost become prisoners. My half sister's daughter will suffer a panic attack, if she is alone in the house. The whole family have to adjust their daily routines to her. It can appear incredibly selfish, but it is a genuine mental illness.

Maybe Wisnewski needs a long break away from the game (seemed to work for Tratt from memory), or just concentrate on WahineNix, and forget about the Ferns for now. There will be other World Cups.

Oh & it's the self employed/blue collar world that needs to change, re the whole mental health awareness concepts - not the other way round. Times have changed.

theprof

Monto

Ryan

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Of course you can, you have sick leave, bereavement leave, maternity and paternity leave, and holiday leave. The difference is because you work year round there isn't the same level of impact as someone who has a compacted work schedule of a few months.

Must be nice working a job where you get that. Most of the people in my industry don't have that luxury.

luxury?? it's a legal entitlement. Your employed legally has to provide these things! If you're not getting this you either need to find a better job or raise it as an issue.
"personal reasons" is code for mental illness of some desciption. And if you personally have struggled with such things then you should be well aware of the damage done if you can't deal with it in a safe environment.

theprof

Monto

Ryan

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Of course you can, you have sick leave, bereavement leave, maternity and paternity leave, and holiday leave. The difference is because you work year round there isn't the same level of impact as someone who has a compacted work schedule of a few months.

Must be nice working a job where you get that. Most of the people in my industry don't have that luxury.

luxury?? it's a legal entitlement. Your employed legally has to provide these things! If you're not getting this you either need to find a better job or raise it as an issue.
"personal reasons" is code for mental illness of some desciption. And if you personally have struggled with such things then you should be well aware of the damage done if you can't deal with it in a safe environment.

Mate you're clearly out of touch with how most people that aren't in the upper middle to upper class have to operate. Its not so pretty.

It's nice, fantastic even, if people can have time off for their mental health, I wish every industry allowed it, but for most of us we have to nut up and take it. So asking everone to care about the mental health if athletes when for most of us football is simply escapism from our own real issues is a bit tone deaf in my opinion.

But hey, that's just my opinion. I'm clearly coming at it from a very different background to most of you.

anyways..at what point do we start discussing end of season awards?

Player of the Year?

Most Improved?

Young Player of the Year?

anything else?

coochiee

Understand your views to a point Monto. Have a brother who is a self employed tradie (works huge hours) and my folks were stoic hard working farmers. For them you only take a day off, if you are near death.

I also worked for many years in both public (3 years at a Council) and private (15 odd years in banking) sectors - and would get really irritated for those small number of work mates who used to treat their sick leave as almost annual leave, and be continously absent. You just knew they were taking the piss, leaving you to work late having to pick up some of their work. Thank fudge those days are over.

But I also have both a close friend and my half sister, with daughters 17-19 who both suffer from severe anxiety. Absolutely crippling for both the young girls, and their families. Can't go to school (study online), basically barely leave the family homes. Not only them, but their families almost become prisoners. My step sister's daughter will suffer a panic attack, if she is alone in the house. The whole family have to adjust their daily routines to her. It can appear incredibly selfish, but it is a genuine mental illness.

Maybe Wisnewski needs a long break away from the game (seemed to work for Tratt from memory), or just concentrate on WahineNix, and forget about the Ferns for now. There will be other World Cups.

Oh & it's the self employed/blue collar world that needs to change, re the whole mental health awareness concepts - not the other way round. Times have changed.

Absolutely, agree with most of your points there. And the trades do need to change but that will never happen unless jobs stop being run on razor thin margins for those at the bottom. It genuinely was better when things were unionized.

Mental health a huge issue, especially for young people, and I don't begrudge anone that needs to leave a roll for that reason, however taking weeks and weeks off over a short season comes across as taking the piss to me. Probably time to say the job is not for you.

I don't know, sports is just a strange one to me. Even if the pays not great being a pro athlete has a lot of perks, I just find it a bit hard to find sympathy for them when I know so many people in far far worse situations. That's probably on me.

On second rhough, thats definitely on me.

Showtime Nixie

anyways..at what point do we start discussing end of season awards?

Player of the Year?

Most Improved?

Young Player of the Year?

anything else?

Player of the year for me is either Barry or Hasset.

Young player has to be Clegg for me.

Most improved so far? I'm not actually sure.

Monto

theprof

Monto

Ryan

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Of course you can, you have sick leave, bereavement leave, maternity and paternity leave, and holiday leave. The difference is because you work year round there isn't the same level of impact as someone who has a compacted work schedule of a few months.

Must be nice working a job where you get that. Most of the people in my industry don't have that luxury.

luxury?? it's a legal entitlement. Your employed legally has to provide these things! If you're not getting this you either need to find a better job or raise it as an issue.
"personal reasons" is code for mental illness of some desciption. And if you personally have struggled with such things then you should be well aware of the damage done if you can't deal with it in a safe environment.

theprof

Monto

Ryan

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Of course you can, you have sick leave, bereavement leave, maternity and paternity leave, and holiday leave. The difference is because you work year round there isn't the same level of impact as someone who has a compacted work schedule of a few months.

Must be nice working a job where you get that. Most of the people in my industry don't have that luxury.

luxury?? it's a legal entitlement. Your employed legally has to provide these things! If you're not getting this you either need to find a better job or raise it as an issue.
"personal reasons" is code for mental illness of some desciption. And if you personally have struggled with such things then you should be well aware of the damage done if you can't deal with it in a safe environment.

Mate you're clearly out of touch with how most people that aren't in the upper middle to upper class have to operate. Its not so pretty.

It's nice, fantastic even, if people can have time off for their mental health, I wish every industry allowed it, but for most of us we have to nut up and take it. So asking everone to care about the mental health if athletes when for most of us football is simply escapism from our own real issues is a bit tone deaf in my opinion.

But hey, that's just my opinion. I'm clearly coming at it from a very different background to most of you.

as mentioned above it's not us that need to change, it's whatever industry you're in that is clearly mistreating it's workers. Right now when every industry is desparate for workers you are in the power position, leave! find a place that values you and your skills. If that's not an option then get the union involved, if you are bluie collar as you say then I'm certain your kindustry is well unionised and can fight for your rights. gone are the days when the mplyer can willfully ignore their workers mental health and basic leave entitlements. nothing I'm saying has anythign to do with being from any class or in a white collar job. It's your basic legal rights in this country.

theprof

Monto

theprof

Monto

Ryan

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Of course you can, you have sick leave, bereavement leave, maternity and paternity leave, and holiday leave. The difference is because you work year round there isn't the same level of impact as someone who has a compacted work schedule of a few months.

Must be nice working a job where you get that. Most of the people in my industry don't have that luxury.

luxury?? it's a legal entitlement. Your employed legally has to provide these things! If you're not getting this you either need to find a better job or raise it as an issue.
"personal reasons" is code for mental illness of some desciption. And if you personally have struggled with such things then you should be well aware of the damage done if you can't deal with it in a safe environment.

theprof

Monto

Ryan

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Of course you can, you have sick leave, bereavement leave, maternity and paternity leave, and holiday leave. The difference is because you work year round there isn't the same level of impact as someone who has a compacted work schedule of a few months.

Must be nice working a job where you get that. Most of the people in my industry don't have that luxury.

luxury?? it's a legal entitlement. Your employed legally has to provide these things! If you're not getting this you either need to find a better job or raise it as an issue.
"personal reasons" is code for mental illness of some desciption. And if you personally have struggled with such things then you should be well aware of the damage done if you can't deal with it in a safe environment.

Mate you're clearly out of touch with how most people that aren't in the upper middle to upper class have to operate. Its not so pretty.

It's nice, fantastic even, if people can have time off for their mental health, I wish every industry allowed it, but for most of us we have to nut up and take it. So asking everone to care about the mental health if athletes when for most of us football is simply escapism from our own real issues is a bit tone deaf in my opinion.

But hey, that's just my opinion. I'm clearly coming at it from a very different background to most of you.

as mentioned above it's not us that need to cahgne, it's whatever industry you're in that is clearly mistreating it's workers. Right now when every industry is desparate for workers you are in the power position, leave! find a place that values you and your skills. If that's not an option then get the union involved, if you are bluie collar as you say then I'm certain your kindustry is well unionised and can fight for your rights. gone are the days when the mplyer can willfully ignore their workers mental health and basic leave entitlements. nothing I'm saying has anythign to do with being from any class or in a white collar job. It's your basic legal rights in this country.

theprof

Monto

theprof

Monto

Ryan

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Of course you can, you have sick leave, bereavement leave, maternity and paternity leave, and holiday leave. The difference is because you work year round there isn't the same level of impact as someone who has a compacted work schedule of a few months.

Must be nice working a job where you get that. Most of the people in my industry don't have that luxury.

luxury?? it's a legal entitlement. Your employed legally has to provide these things! If you're not getting this you either need to find a better job or raise it as an issue.
"personal reasons" is code for mental illness of some desciption. And if you personally have struggled with such things then you should be well aware of the damage done if you can't deal with it in a safe environment.

theprof

Monto

Ryan

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Of course you can, you have sick leave, bereavement leave, maternity and paternity leave, and holiday leave. The difference is because you work year round there isn't the same level of impact as someone who has a compacted work schedule of a few months.

Must be nice working a job where you get that. Most of the people in my industry don't have that luxury.

luxury?? it's a legal entitlement. Your employed legally has to provide these things! If you're not getting this you either need to find a better job or raise it as an issue.
"personal reasons" is code for mental illness of some desciption. And if you personally have struggled with such things then you should be well aware of the damage done if you can't deal with it in a safe environment.

Mate you're clearly out of touch with how most people that aren't in the upper middle to upper class have to operate. Its not so pretty.

It's nice, fantastic even, if people can have time off for their mental health, I wish every industry allowed it, but for most of us we have to nut up and take it. So asking everone to care about the mental health if athletes when for most of us football is simply escapism from our own real issues is a bit tone deaf in my opinion.

But hey, that's just my opinion. I'm clearly coming at it from a very different background to most of you.

as mentioned above it's not us that need to cahgne, it's whatever industry you're in that is clearly mistreating it's workers. Right now when every industry is desparate for workers you are in the power position, leave! find a place that values you and your skills. If that's not an option then get the union involved, if you are bluie collar as you say then I'm certain your kindustry is well unionised and can fight for your rights. gone are the days when the mplyer can willfully ignore their workers mental health and basic leave entitlements. nothing I'm saying has anythign to do with being from any class or in a white collar job. It's your basic legal rights in this country.

And I'm saying you're in bloody dream land. 

It's not an employees dream world out there in trades, the industry is tightening up big time right now. Jobs are starting to become very hard to come by. There's a recession coming.

The mere fact that you mention unions means you know nothing about the industry. They are completely toothless and no one is a part of them any more.

You don't like your pay or work conditions? That's fine, they'll replace you with a Filipino that will do the job for less.

You keep going on about rights but mate I have to tell you, the world isn't what you think it is.

Anyway, back to the football.

Monto

coochiee

Understand your views to a point Monto. Have a brother who is a self employed tradie (works huge hours) and my folks were stoic hard working farmers. For them you only take a day off, if you are near death.

I also worked for many years in both public (3 years at a Council) and private (15 odd years in banking) sectors - and would get really irritated for those small number of work mates who used to treat their sick leave as almost annual leave, and be continously absent. You just knew they were taking the piss, leaving you to work late having to pick up some of their work. Thank fudge those days are over.

But I also have both a close friend and my half sister, with daughters 17-19 who both suffer from severe anxiety. Absolutely crippling for both the young girls, and their families. Can't go to school (study online), basically barely leave the family homes. Not only them, but their families almost become prisoners. My step sister's daughter will suffer a panic attack, if she is alone in the house. The whole family have to adjust their daily routines to her. It can appear incredibly selfish, but it is a genuine mental illness.

Maybe Wisnewski needs a long break away from the game (seemed to work for Tratt from memory), or just concentrate on WahineNix, and forget about the Ferns for now. There will be other World Cups.

Oh & it's the self employed/blue collar world that needs to change, re the whole mental health awareness concepts - not the other way round. Times have changed.

Absolutely, agree with most of your points there. And the trades do need to change but that will never happen unless jobs stop being run on razor thin margins for those at the bottom. It genuinely was better when things were unionized.

Mental health a huge issue, especially for young people, and I don't begrudge anone that needs to leave a roll for that reason, however taking weeks and weeks off over a short season comes across as taking the piss to me. Probably time to say the job is not for you.

I don't know, sports is just a strange one to me. Even if the pays not great being a pro athlete has a lot of perks, I just find it a bit hard to find sympathy for them when I know so many people in far far worse situations. That's probably on me.

On second rhough, thats definitely on me.

You are basically saying same as my brother, tradies working incredibly hard, but operating on small margins, so questioning why do you do it. But what does a 40-50 yr old tradie do next, when you have a mortgage, family, and a body that's starting to feel it? Tough stage of life to make a change. Luckily my builder brother got into skylight installation here in QLD, 2 years ago, is loving it (easier on the body) and has great margins.

But remember the WahineNix girls are being paid bugger all. Almost doing it for the love of the game, and some hope can one day to crack it in the English WSL, American NWSL or wherever. 

Wisnewski has pulled out of the Ferns (where she was only a training player anyway), and done it early in this window. Minimal disruption to the Ferns in reality. Hopefully she is okay to keep playing for the Nix. If not then yes I think she needs a good long spell away, as not fair on the club and her team mates, coming & going. Wish her the best anyways.

Monto

theprof

Monto

Ryan

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Of course you can, you have sick leave, bereavement leave, maternity and paternity leave, and holiday leave. The difference is because you work year round there isn't the same level of impact as someone who has a compacted work schedule of a few months.

Must be nice working a job where you get that. Most of the people in my industry don't have that luxury.

luxury?? it's a legal entitlement. Your employed legally has to provide these things! If you're not getting this you either need to find a better job or raise it as an issue.
"personal reasons" is code for mental illness of some desciption. And if you personally have struggled with such things then you should be well aware of the damage done if you can't deal with it in a safe environment.

theprof

Monto

Ryan

Monto

Personally I find all this dropping in and out of teams, regardless of gender, a bit pathetic.

All of us work jobs here and I'm sure we don't get to just fudge off because we don't like it. I don't know, maybe some of you guys can but I can't. Maybe I'm just too much of a tradie to have sympathy for this shark. You're getting paid to do a job, fudgeing show up.

If they were working a job anywhere else they wouldn't get to just fudge off for a couple of months, they'd be sacked.

Of course you can, you have sick leave, bereavement leave, maternity and paternity leave, and holiday leave. The difference is because you work year round there isn't the same level of impact as someone who has a compacted work schedule of a few months.

Must be nice working a job where you get that. Most of the people in my industry don't have that luxury.

luxury?? it's a legal entitlement. Your employed legally has to provide these things! If you're not getting this you either need to find a better job or raise it as an issue.
"personal reasons" is code for mental illness of some desciption. And if you personally have struggled with such things then you should be well aware of the damage done if you can't deal with it in a safe environment.

Mate you're clearly out of touch with how most people that aren't in the upper middle to upper class have to operate. Its not so pretty.

It's nice, fantastic even, if people can have time off for their mental health, I wish every industry allowed it, but for most of us we have to nut up and take it. So asking everone to care about the mental health if athletes when for most of us football is simply escapism from our own real issues is a bit tone deaf in my opinion.

But hey, that's just my opinion. I'm clearly coming at it from a very different background to most of you.

Yeah, let's just presume what people do. Sounds like you need to grow a pair and assert your rights. If they fire you for doing that then you've got a big pay day coming.

I think Monto is self employed? It's not just blue collar tradies (a huge number of whom are self employed), but most self employed who just can't take a break from their business, even if their mental health is poor. That's their reality.

It's a reality that can be very very different to PAYG.

coochiee

I think Monto is self employed? It's not just blue collar tradies (a huge number of whom are self employed), but most self employed who just can't take a break from their business, even if their mental health is poor. That's their reality

then it's not his employer that's doing anything to him, no the union, it's him!

coochiee

I think Monto is self employed? It's not just blue collar tradies (a huge number of whom are self employed), but most self employed who just can't take a break from their business, even if their mental health is poor. That's their reality

Then he shouldn't be comparing himself to someone who works as an employee.

I'm self employed so I don't take hollidays and work through as much sickness as I can but I don't bitch about the fact that employees are in a different situation. I do worry that I don't have the same safety net that they do if something really bad happpens to me. For instance, I know a guy who got a brain tumor and had to take six months off work but came back to a job. If that happened to me I'd be bankrupt but that's the risk I take and I don't begrudge others for not taking that risk.

Ryan

coochiee

I think Monto is self employed? It's not just blue collar tradies (a huge number of whom are self employed), but most self employed who just can't take a break from their business, even if their mental health is poor. That's their reality

Then he shouldn't be comparing himself to someone who works as an employee.

Yipe but it's also their reality that they see alot of the stuff that the PAYG get up to as 'soft', and very detached from their world. Especially the big city, urban employed. Spend more than 5 mins in the company of a farmer, and you will know all about that. My tradie brother, all his mates are tradies. It's a bit Them & Us.

That's their world, their mates are mostly in that world, they socialise in that world - that's often their viewpoint. I imagine it's world not many Nix supporters (being based in NZ's public service capital), belong to though.  

Showtime Nixie

I didn't mean too much by it - i wasn't suggesting it was mental like some one said it could be a variety of things. But i thought we would have professionals in the environment to help people - i dunno - just seems in nz teams we have people coming and going a lot. In sport teams you need sticability and continuity and was suggesting the best way to finish the season is to go with the reliable ones.

We need to finish strong, i think we have a win or two left in us - cant win a game 5-0 and not get another win! lets goooo

this is actually a fair opinion for you to have

coochiee

Ryan

coochiee

I think Monto is self employed? It's not just blue collar tradies (a huge number of whom are self employed), but most self employed who just can't take a break from their business, even if their mental health is poor. That's their reality

Then he shouldn't be comparing himself to someone who works as an employee.

Yipe but it's also their reality that they see alot of the stuff that the PAYG get up to as 'soft', and very detached from their world. Especially the big city, urban employed. Spend more than 5 mins in the company of a farmer, and you will know all about that.

That's their world, their mates are mostly in that world, they socialise in that world - that's often their viewpoint. I imagine it's world not many Nix supporters (being based in NZ's public service capital), belong to though.  

Even farmers are starting to be more open about their mental health, massive push over the last few years to be mindful of people in that industry and the pressures they face. Yet noones calling them soft for shedding a tear or having a moment when it all gets too much - the whole point that started this is simply that, we all have different levels of what is too much and an 18 year olds capacity is probably less that a 45 year old. There is no excuse no matter what industry you're in to ignore your own well being. If your employer isnt then they should be, if you're self-employed look after yourself first cos when the shark hits the fan you've only got yourself to rely on.

Monto

Showtime Nixie

anyways..at what point do we start discussing end of season awards?

Player of the Year?

Most Improved?

Young Player of the Year?

anything else?

Player of the year for me is either Barry or Hasset.

Young player has to be Clegg for me.

Most improved so far? I'm not actually sure.

Hassett - has carried the team through tough times - busy and had us ticking at times. Brings a level of professionalism to every game.

Clegg - 17 and looks promising and has had moments of quality. Raw talent but theres something there. 

Foster - very slow start but starting to get some output

coochiee

Ryan

coochiee

I think Monto is self employed? It's not just blue collar tradies (a huge number of whom are self employed), but most self employed who just can't take a break from their business, even if their mental health is poor. That's their reality

Then he shouldn't be comparing himself to someone who works as an employee.

Yipe but it's also their reality that they see alot of the stuff that the PAYG get up to as 'soft', and very detached from their world. Especially the big city, urban employed. Spend more than 5 mins in the company of a farmer, and you will know all about that. My tradie brother, all his mates are tradies. It's a bit Them & Us.

That's their world, their mates are mostly in that world, they socialise in that world - that's often their viewpoint. I imagine it's world not many Nix supporters (being based in NZ's public service capital), belong to though.  

My family are farmers, I grew up working on my grandparents farm which is now run by my uncle. My father works in an abattoir, my first job out of school was working in the same abattoir. These are in small Waikato towns.

I'm currently self employed and work my arse off without the above perks, if I don't work I'm not putting food on the table. Doesn't mean I think other people are soft or resent them for my choices. 

Great attitude. I always try to live by the mindset, that wherever you are in life, happy, sad, poor, rich - is the result of a combination of different choices (bad/good/indifferent) you have made as an individual, all adding up. After the age of say 30, it's really all on you. Take ownership. You ain't happy, make some changes - small ones even

Admittedly that's from someone who luckily had mostly a loving, stable upbringing with that strong Provo work ethic. Good on ya Mum

But yeah that's a very different perspective than what say a 19 year old girl in today's world might be struggling with. 

Probably gonna piss everyone off but:

A useful thing to remember is that nobody really knows what life is like in the other shoes.  Whether that is blue collar complaining about white collar, white collar complaining about blue collar, farmers whining about city folk, and city folk whining about farmers.

When it comes to the above post I like most of the sentiment, but if you grew up in poverty, and you have been living hand to mouth for years and can be dealing with the long term consequences of a dumbe decision in your teens well into your 30s or longer.  And once you are in that loop getting out can be much harder.  Maybe you don't have the internet so don't know how to research learning new skills.  There are a substantial number of people that don't know how to help themselves, and don't know how to find out how.

As for mental health, there are a lot more who are embracing understandings of mental health and what not these days, but plenty that still don't.  I really stirggled to get through a whānau dinner recently where some cousins were moking the fact that John Kirwin was being soft about mental health and how he needed to toughen up.  These views will exist for a while.  My brother in law is a farmer and he took far too long to come to terms with his kid being autistic, instead opting to just say he was learning a bit differently and he will catch up.  He came around and has been fantastic with his sons needs for a long time.  He also finally recently admitted he believes in climate change (with the caveat that humans have no impact on it, small steps I guess).  So a lot of that still permeates through.

As for a post above, it really sharks me to say something to the effect of "It would be great if people could take care of their mental health, I wish every industry did it, but I don't get to, so these footballer shouldn't" is terrible.  Especially with so many of them being kids.  They need it more than many of us, and to suggest denying it because you need them playing a game for your escapsim is selfish at best.

And as for the situation of these you women taking time off for their mental health.  Please show a tiny fraction of empathy.  They get paid fudge all and we expect them to perform and train like pro's.  Speaking of making a slim personal profit margin being hard, these players who are your escapism aren't even making enough to survive. 

So show the players we love some support.  If they need more support they should bloody get.  Maybe once we get 10k fans down at the stadium and they make 100k pay cheques we can expect them to act like full time athletes.  But they are paid fudge all and expected to do a lot of work, and pull out a top skill performance every week.  They work their asses off but really we judge everything on 90 minutes, then get paid fudge all, and have to deal with the social media, the criticism (some fair and constrcutive, some nasty awful stuff) and somehow have to justify if they should be our escapsim so we can get away from our sharkty work weeks.

Poorly worded rant over.

Edit: missed a spot: also mental health comes in many flavours with many levels.  2 people can have anxiety and 1 can but up but the other person can be completely debilitated by it, even if they have the same job.  It's a physical condition and they may not have any bloody say.  And in context these players are far too young to have been given the opportunity to overcome it.

Bananas

Probably gonna piss everyone off but:

A useful thing to remember is that nobody really knows what life is like in the other shoes.  Whether that is blue collar complaining about white collar, white collar complaining about blue collar, farmers whining about city folk, and city folk whining about farmers.

When it comes to the above post I like most of the sentiment, but if you grew up in poverty, and you have been living hand to mouth for years and can be dealing with the long term consequences of a dumbe decision in your teens well into your 30s or longer.  And once you are in that loop getting out can be much harder.  Maybe you don't have the internet so don't know how to research learning new skills.  There are a substantial number of people that don't know how to help themselves, and don't know how to find out how.

As for mental health, there are a lot more who are embracing understandings of mental health and what not these days, but plenty that still don't.  I really stirggled to get through a whānau dinner recently where some cousins were moking the fact that John Kirwin was being soft about mental health and how he needed to toughen up.  These views will exist for a while.  My brother in law is a farmer and he took far too long to come to terms with his kid being autistic, instead opting to just say he was learning a bit differently and he will catch up.  He came around and has been fantastic with his sons needs for a long time.  He also finally recently admitted he believes in climate change (with the caveat that humans have no impact on it, small steps I guess).  So a lot of that still permeates through.

As for a post above, it really sharks me to say something to the effect of "It would be great if people could take care of their mental health, I wish every industry did it, but I don't get to, so these footballer shouldn't" is terrible.  Especially with so many of them being kids.  They need it more than many of us, and to suggest denying it because you need them playing a game for your escapsim is selfish at best.

And as for the situation of these you women taking time off for their mental health.  Please show a tiny fraction of empathy.  They get paid fudge all and we expect them to perform and train like pro's.  Speaking of making a slim personal profit margin being hard, these players who are your escapism aren't even making enough to survive. 

So show the players we love some support.  If they need more support they should bloody get.  Maybe once we get 10k fans down at the stadium and they make 100k pay cheques we can expect them to act like full time athletes.  But they are paid fudge all and expected to do a lot of work, and pull out a top skill performance every week.  They work their asses off but really we judge everything on 90 minutes, then get paid fudge all, and have to deal with the social media, the criticism (some fair and constrcutive, some nasty awful stuff) and somehow have to justify if they should be our escapsim so we can get away from our sharkty work weeks.

Poorly worded rant over.

Edit: missed a spot: also mental health comes in many flavours with many levels.  2 people can have anxiety and 1 can but up but the other person can be completely debilitated by it, even if they have the same job.  It's a physical condition and they may not have any bloody say.  And in context these players are far too young to have been given the opportunity to overcome it.

Never said they couldn't take care of their mental health, just said I struggle to sympathize with it. Specifically the way it's done.

And as I said in my first post that everone seems to ignore this was about all footballers regardless of gender. There was a post before mine listing men's personal reasons and my post was definitely more aimed at that.

I've never said people can't take care of their mental health, I just personally think that skipping out of work for a prolonged period of time and then jumping back in when you feel like it looks like poor form. Especially from the outside.

And I don't really give a fudge whether or not you like me just enjoying football as escapism, thats my opinion on it. It's an entertainment product, thats why it's on TV. I don't really give a shark about players personal lives just like I don't give a shark about the lives of actors in movies I watch.

I didn't say you couldn't use it as escapism.  I just thinks it's nasty to say it would be awesome if all industries did allow it...but these players, nope.  They can take care of their mental health as long as it doesn't impact your entertainment.  I just think it's nasty.

If you don't give a shark about their personal lives then don't whinge when they don't play for personal reasons.  The team playing that week is the team playing that week. 

To use your analogy the people in the movie that week are the people in the movie that week.  Actors that took breaks, or pulled out, you aren't interested in.  Which is fine.

The players in the entertainment product this week are the players in the entertainment product this week.

Do the women’s team still have to have 7 or so Aussies in their squad next season? We need to start giving more game time to Cicco and Gomez if we want them to play again next season. I think it’s a hard sell to get them to move the welly for the season, so hopefully they stick around and we get to see them develop. Looked like they could easily head to WSW next season if we don’t value them enough. With Knott being made captain with Taylor and Alfeld being out that makes it harder to change the starting lineup, and I wonder if that is the same for Wisnewski. I 
rate Gomez above them, and feel Wisnewski has a high ceiling- especially if she keeps shooting from around the box, so not concerned if she needs a break from the pressure. No different to someone being injured with a niggly calf strain coming in and out of the squad. Makes for good competition for places which is what will help the squad improve. Tradies are not a good comparison with professional athletes, you can go through the motions as a Tradie and take an extra half hour to install a hot water cylinder Or install a window, but a footballer can’t go through the motions if they are feeling it. Not fair on the team, and will not show their true potential, so best to take a
Break and recharge the batteries and go again when they are ready.