All Whites, Ferns, and other international teams

The Road To Brazil 2014 via Wellington feat. Mexico

4497 replies · 454,612 views
over 12 years ago

Sorry folks, I'm not sure which thread to ask this in, but thought as Durante is now officially one of us and a valid All White, I thought this thread was probably the best one.

[quote] wikipedia: 

Durante was selected in Pim Verbeek's Socceroo squad in February 2010 for Australia's 2011 AFC Asian Cup qualification match againstIndonesia. In 2013 Durante will become eligible to play for the All Whites as he hasn't yet appeared for his country of birth. When asked if he would he said "It isn't something I would push for, but at the same time I would never say no if I've not made the Australian team."[2] In January 2013 Durante pledged his allegiance to New Zealand, he could appear at the earliest in All Whites 2014 FIFA World Cup qualifiers in March subject to his New Zealand citizenship and FIFA approval.[3] Durante became a New Zealand Citizen on 6 March 2013[4] and the next day was named in his first All Whites squad.[5][6] He made his international debut for New Zealand in theirworld cup qualifying game against Solomon Islands in Honiara.

What was FIFA's issue? 

Was it because Durante had been in a Socceroo squad prior to becoming a NZ citizen? 

According to FIFA regulations, a player can't play for another country if they weren't a citizen of that country, prior to playing for their country of birth. I guess technically Durante didn’t play for the socceroos and was only part of the squad - is that why FIFA had to give the ok?

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over 12 years ago
martinb wrote:
austin10 wrote:

I see that Ricki was reported as saying he is still mulling over the 3 at the back set up. It would not be my choice but in reality it might be the best option. I'm saying this because after observing Ricki for years he is very much a one trick pony when it comes to the AW's. At least he understands how to set up a team with 3 at the back...and it served us well last time. He patently has no clues about any other set up and we are running out of time before the playoffs.


IMO Ricki should just go back to what he knows best. 3 at the back is really 5 when you wingbacks tuck back on defense. He has players who know this system very well. He will never coach a team that will get the best out of our small quick young players. He just needs to roll the old dice two more time and hope that his aging guys still have it in them. Watching the UAE game it was obvious that most of the players where confused about positions and tactics. Lots of them understand the simple tactics that got us to the last WC.


The reality is that we can probably trouble a CONCACAF side if we defend with two banks of 5 and 4 and wack any possession high up to Wood/Killen. Its a tactic that they would not have experianced very often. Combined with a rugged 10 men behind the ball defense and using all our tall timber in set pieces we could keep the score down  and possibly nick a goal away, then its game on back in NZ. The only problem would be if too many of the players are now too old for another 2 big performances.


My team for the away leg assuming everyone is fit and available

                    Moss

        Reid     Dura    Smith

Leo                                      Locky

          Ivan   Weemac

Rojas                      Smeltz

           Wood/Killen



We seem to have the players to play some decent football...but we seem to be running out of time.

We looked best with Kosta cutting in, Wood also looks quite good with the ball at his feet...If we're going to play a big 3 up front why not throw Bright in there too...almost put away Kosta's move against UAE


Almost scoring, is that all it takes to get a starting berth these days? In saying that though I liked him. He seemed like a better, more mobile version of Rory Fallon.
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over 12 years ago

Its hard to tell in 20 mins what he has. I'm on record of not being a fan but there is no way I could say he was not worthy on 20mins of doing nothing (or in fact worthy)

 

The curious case of Rory Fallon. Its like everything has stopped working for the guy after 'that header'. He changes clubs, can't score a lick and most of his appearances are as a sub or not at all and Ricki stopped picking him with his only real appearance in Honiara. You have to wonder with the below comment if the cheese has slipped off his cracker or there is something between the two (speculation). If one were to speculate more and based on what others have said here on YF, if Ricki is not a fan of Wynton and Fitzgerald because of a bias around religion, would that be a point of order? It sounds preposterous but I do wonder...

"One club has come in for me, but I don't feel the Lord wants me to go. I will wait on what the Lord says. I don't feel I have got a clear message to leave yet, so I'm staying. I'm instructed by the Lord, and I keep telling people this. They probably think I'm mad, but I know full well that when Paul Sturrock came in and wanted me to go to Southend I had a dream and the Lord told me to stay at Plymouth. I have had no instructions since so I stay at Plymouth"

Grumpy old bastard alert

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over 12 years ago
Jeff Vader wrote:

Its hard to tell in 20 mins what he has. I'm on record of not being a fan but there is no way I could say he was not worthy on 20mins of doing nothing (or in fact worthy)

 

The curious case of Rory Fallon. Its like everything has stopped working for the guy after 'that header'. He changes clubs, can't score a lick and most of his appearances are as a sub or not at all and Ricki stopped picking him with his only real appearance in Honiara. You have to wonder with the below comment if the cheese has slipped off his cracker or there is something between the two (speculation). If one were to speculate more and based on what others have said here on YF, if Ricki is not a fan of Wynton and Fitzgerald because of a bias around religion, would that be a point of order? It sounds preposterous but I do wonder...

"One club has come in for me, but I don't feel the Lord wants me to go. I will wait on what the Lord says. I don't feel I have got a clear message to leave yet, so I'm staying. I'm instructed by the Lord, and I keep telling people this. They probably think I'm mad, but I know full well that when Paul Sturrock came in and wanted me to go to Southend I had a dream and the Lord told me to stay at Plymouth. I have had no instructions since so I stay at Plymouth"

Didn't Fallon make himself unavailable for All Whites selection, so he could focus on his club career?
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over 12 years ago

Not a clue Ryan. I may well have missed that.

Grumpy old bastard alert

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over 12 years ago
Sackofspuds wrote:
martinb wrote:
austin10 wrote:

I see that Ricki was reported as saying he is still mulling over the 3 at the back set up. It would not be my choice but in reality it might be the best option. I'm saying this because after observing Ricki for years he is very much a one trick pony when it comes to the AW's. At least he understands how to set up a team with 3 at the back...and it served us well last time. He patently has no clues about any other set up and we are running out of time before the playoffs.


IMO Ricki should just go back to what he knows best. 3 at the back is really 5 when you wingbacks tuck back on defense. He has players who know this system very well. He will never coach a team that will get the best out of our small quick young players. He just needs to roll the old dice two more time and hope that his aging guys still have it in them. Watching the UAE game it was obvious that most of the players where confused about positions and tactics. Lots of them understand the simple tactics that got us to the last WC.


The reality is that we can probably trouble a CONCACAF side if we defend with two banks of 5 and 4 and wack any possession high up to Wood/Killen. Its a tactic that they would not have experianced very often. Combined with a rugged 10 men behind the ball defense and using all our tall timber in set pieces we could keep the score down  and possibly nick a goal away, then its game on back in NZ. The only problem would be if too many of the players are now too old for another 2 big performances.


My team for the away leg assuming everyone is fit and available

                    Moss

        Reid     Dura    Smith

Leo                                      Locky

          Ivan   Weemac

Rojas                      Smeltz

           Wood/Killen



We seem to have the players to play some decent football...but we seem to be running out of time.

We looked best with Kosta cutting in, Wood also looks quite good with the ball at his feet...If we're going to play a big 3 up front why not throw Bright in there too...almost put away Kosta's move against UAE


Almost scoring, is that all it takes to get a starting berth these days? In saying that though I liked him. He seemed like a better, more mobile version of Rory Fallon.

Well- yes it's sad that's what you used to get when you watched the AWs- you waited for the moments of we almost. We almost looked like pro-footy players...
But with what you are saying with Bright our first 4-5 attacks were crosses from the wings, might as well have a couple of tall trees there to meet them if that's the plan.


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over 12 years ago

How about...

 

            Moss       

Reid     Dura    Smith

            James/Vicelich    

Rojas     Weemac       Barbouroses

 Brockie                      Smeltz

                  Wood

Also can someone provide some commentary on Henderson?

                    

 

 

 

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over 12 years ago

You could convince me on a 3-5-2 and swap out Brockie and play James and Vicelich but Brockie was invisible in his two games...

 

I could bear a 3-5-3 or 4-2-3-1 but not a 3-4-3 (as you know it will involve Bertos and Lochhead)

Grumpy old bastard alert

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over 12 years ago · edited over 12 years ago · History
scc wrote:

How about...

 

            Moss       

Reid     Dura    Smith

            James/Vicelich    

Rojas     Weemac       Barbouroses

 Brockie                      Smeltz

                  Wood

Also can someone provide some commentary on Henderson?

                    

 

 

 

Porbably what id play but swap brockie and rojas around, would much rather have rojas running at players, and he wouldnt get to be forward as much with only a back 3. 
And would put vicelich comfortably ahead of James
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over 12 years ago

Can someone tell me why we are playing 3 at the back when we have the players to play 4 ?

You all saw how lost Reid was for the second goal we conceded tuesday morning.



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over 12 years ago · edited over 12 years ago · History

I still think 4-3-3 is the best formation. 

four at the back is an absolute must. 

Vicelich is still by far the best defensive midfielder we have and he needs to be the anchor man, screening the back four and sitting in the pocket behind the other 2 cental midfielders.

James and Mcglinchy to sit in the middle in front of Ivan

Kosta and Marco on the wings with Wood up top.


                            ---------------------- Moss-------------------------

Bertos/Fenton/Fitzgerald--------Reid-----------Dura--------------Smith

  -------------------------------------------- Vicelich ----------------------------------

------------------------------- James ---------------- Mcglinchy ---------------------

--------- Kosta----------------------------------------------------------------- Marco------------

---------------------------------------- Wood/Smeltz --------------------------------------

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over 12 years ago
nufc_nz wrote:

Can someone tell me why we are playing 3 at the back when we have the players to play 4 ?

You all saw how lost Reid was for the second goal we conceded tuesday morning.


Well we still need full backs. No way Ricki is blooding anyone before Nov. Roux/Fenton are potential national team RB depending on how they go this season. Left back is the new right back. Nobody really putting their hand up (noone with a club anyway)


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over 12 years ago
Seb wrote:

I still think 4-3-3 is the best formation. 

four at the back is an absolute must. 

Vicelich is still by far the best defensive midfielder we have and he needs to be the anchor man, screening the back four and sitting in the pocket behind the other 2 cental midfielders.

James and Mcglinchy to sit in the middle in front of Ivan

Kosta and Marco on the wings with Wood up top.


                            ---------------------- Moss-------------------------

Bertos/Fenton/Fitzgerald--------Reid-----------Dura--------------Smith

  -------------------------------------------- Vicelich ----------------------------------

------------------------------- James ---------------- Mcglinchy ---------------------

--------- Kosta----------------------------------------------------------------- Marco------------

---------------------------------------- Wood/Smeltz --------------------------------------

These players have be touted as well in a 4-2-3-1 so it seems like those are the best 11 from reading the various formations.

Grumpy old bastard alert

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over 12 years ago

Anyone remember how dodgy at the back we were in Honiara with 3 at the back and no Nelsen.

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over 12 years ago
2ndBest wrote:

Anyone remember how dodgy at the back we were in Honiara with 3 at the back and no Nelsen.


The back line that earned Benji Totori a contract with the Nix you mean?

Incredible stamina. No shame. Yellow Fever.

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over 12 years ago
Smithy wrote:
2ndBest wrote:

Anyone remember how dodgy at the back we were in Honiara with 3 at the back and no Nelsen.


The back line that earned Benji Totori a contract with the Nix you mean?



"the Enabler" 
I like tautologies because I like them.
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over 12 years ago

We have appeared dodgy with 4 as well....

Grumpy old bastard alert

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over 12 years ago

Can Roux play left?

Assuming Fenton stands up at RB and so does Roux it could be that both can step up.

I understand that playing left and right RB are still quite different because of angles and also having to be comfortable on the other foot, but it certainly is worth looking at.

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over 12 years ago
Seb wrote:
TV wrote:
Seb wrote:

If New Zealand beat Mexico to qualify for the world cup, it would go down as one the biggest upsets in the history of recorded sport.


Not sure about that. 


Mexico is a country with a population of 120 million people and football is their national sport. New Zealand is a country with a population of 4 million people and football is not our national sport. Mexico's current world ranking is 20 and their lowest ever ranking is 33. In 2006 Mexico were ranked 4th in the world. In 64 years, they have only missed 2 world cups and one of them was due to being banned. 2 years ago they won the Olympics. If the All Whites beat Mexico, it would be the equivalent of us losing to someone like Samoa.

It would be one of the greatest sporting upsets in history. 

Would be one of the major upsets in the history of World Cup play-offs anyway.
Thrashing Mexico 4-0 in an A-international friendly in Auckland in 1980 still stands as one of the All Whites greatest results.
We can also take heart that Mexico has a poor record against our neighbours Australia - W 1  D 2  L 2
To me, a major surprise in World Cup play-offs was when Australia came close against Maradona's Argentina in the October - November 1993 play-offs drawing 1-1 in Sydney and losing narrowly in Buenos Aries 1-0 to an Alex Tobin own-goal...Argentina had appeared in three of the previous four World Cup Finals.
 
Another great giant-killing run we can take inspiration from is tiny Cape Verde Islands' run to the final play-offs of African qualifying this month (and you can really feel for them after being disqualified now due to fielding  a player who got a suspension from a previous game which was annulled due to that team being kicked out for fielding ineligible players - Cape Verde quite reasonably thought any cards from an annulled game wouldn't be valid any more).
Cape Verde also made the quarter-finals at the African Cup of Nations this year (qualified for the finals by beating Cameroon over two legs) .
Cape Verde - population 500,000   Registered players = 11,500  (NZ = 102,257)
FIFA ranking = 44 (higher than us - we're now 67)
FIFA ranking August = 36 (higher than we've ever been)
First ever win in a World Cup qualifier - 2006

Big Pete 65, Christchurch

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over 12 years ago · edited over 12 years ago · History

Mexico name new coach - it's Vicelich - no, sorry Vucetich (Mexican of Croatian descent):

http://www.thenewstribune.com/2013/09/12/2781081/vucetich-will-coach-the-mexican.html

http://www.latimes.com/sports/sportsnow/la-sp-sn-vucetich-mexico-soccer-20130912,0,5110708.story#axzz2ekALXln4

"Vucetich is one of the most successful coaches in the local league, where he´s known as "King Midas" after winning 14 of 15 the finals he has managed in his career."


"The 58-year-old, fired by Monterrey last month after winning three straight CONCACAF Champions League titles..."

(coached Monterrey at last two FIFA Club World Cups - third last time)


"Hopefully this hot potato turns into a gold potato," he said.

"Our situation is like trying to get out of this stupid coat - not so difficult....er, pull harder....just a minute....almost there... we can do this....

won't be long...I'm King Midas ....everything I touch is successful...shit......it's not moving....we're stuck....this coat, it's the colour of a kiwifruit.....who sent this coat?...."Yellow Fever" from New Zealand?....You fool it's lined with superglue..."  


Big Pete 65, Christchurch

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over 12 years ago
MetalLegNZ wrote:

Can Roux play left?

Assuming Fenton stands up at RB and so does Roux it could be that both can step up.

I understand that playing left and right RB are still quite different because of angles and also having to be comfortable on the other foot, but it certainly is worth looking at.


Good point. Yes. Can play both sides


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over 12 years ago · edited over 12 years ago · History

Also can anyone remember how many players we had who took a decent shot in any games. Killen and no one is I think the list.

We started to play a bit of football from the Wales game on with Smeltz...but Wood on his lonesome isn't going to be enough you'd think, and our midfielders while being tricky don't have a Brown like record of bundling the ball in.

Don't think one up front is a good plan.



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over 12 years ago
martinb wrote:

Also can anyone remember how many players we had who took a decent shot in any games. Killen and no one is I think the list.

We started to play a bit of football from the Wales game on with Smeltz...but Wood on his lonesome isn't going to be enough you'd think, and our midfielders while being tricky don't have a Brown like record of bundling the ball in.

Don't think one up front is a good plan.


Again though understanding how a 4-2-3-1 actually works is key. Look at how Ange or Graham Arnold use it


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over 12 years ago

You know Mexican fans don't have much faith in their team when they start facing the inevitable and posting on the All Whites' Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/AllWhites

  

  Please All Whites... DO THE HAKA IF YOU END UP WITH MEXICO!!!   Like ·   · September 11 at 2:49pm

Big Pete 65, Christchurch

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over 12 years ago

MetalLegNZ wrote:

Can Roux play left?

Assuming Fenton stands up at RB and so does Roux it could be that both can step up.

I understand that playing left and right RB are still quite different because of angles and also having to be comfortable on the other foot, but it certainly is worth looking at.

TV wrote:

Good point. Yes. Can play both sides


Great that these kids are both in professional teams. But have you watched them play a whole game against quality opposition? I hope by being comfortable on the other foot you mean the ability to use the correct foot without thinking about it. 

I've seen so many players in the past have to take an extra touch so they can get a cross in with the foot they naturally use or an extra touch to shoot so they can get the ball on the foot they naturally use.



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over 12 years ago
TV wrote:
martinb wrote:

Also can anyone remember how many players we had who took a decent shot in any games. Killen and no one is I think the list.

We started to play a bit of football from the Wales game on with Smeltz...but Wood on his lonesome isn't going to be enough you'd think, and our midfielders while being tricky don't have a Brown like record of bundling the ball in.

Don't think one up front is a good plan.


Again though understanding how a 4-2-3-1 actually works is key. Look at how Ange or Graham Arnold use it


Yes, look at how ANGE AND ARNOLD USE IT. 
NOT RICKI FUCKIN HERBERT !
One up front has never worked the the All Whites. South Africa we had 2 shots at goal. IN 3 WHOLE GAMES.


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over 12 years ago
nufc_nz wrote:
TV wrote:
martinb wrote:

Also can anyone remember how many players we had who took a decent shot in any games. Killen and no one is I think the list.

We started to play a bit of football from the Wales game on with Smeltz...but Wood on his lonesome isn't going to be enough you'd think, and our midfielders while being tricky don't have a Brown like record of bundling the ball in.

Don't think one up front is a good plan.


Again though understanding how a 4-2-3-1 actually works is key. Look at how Ange or Graham Arnold use it


Yes, look at how ANGE AND ARNOLD USE IT. 

NOT RICKI FUCKIN HERBERT !

One up front has never worked the the All Whites. South Africa we had 2 shots at goal. IN 3 WHOLE GAMES.


hey im with you nufc_nz. An Ange or Arnold would thrive we what we have. Ricki has no idea and nothing is gonna change or develop under him.


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over 12 years ago
newbyone wrote:

MetalLegNZ wrote:

Can Roux play left?

Assuming Fenton stands up at RB and so does Roux it could be that both can step up.

I understand that playing left and right RB are still quite different because of angles and also having to be comfortable on the other foot, but it certainly is worth looking at.

TV wrote:

Good point. Yes. Can play both sides


Great that these kids are both in professional teams. But have you watched them play a whole game against quality opposition? I hope by being comfortable on the other foot you mean the ability to use the correct foot without thinking about it. 

I've seen so many players in the past have to take an extra touch so they can get a cross in with the foot they naturally use or an extra touch to shoot so they can get the ball on the foot they naturally use.




He's played both sides for CCM in pre-season. It was mentioned during his debut for Glory that he is comfortable on both sides. Won't see him in an AW shirt before Nov but if we qualify and he does well for the Mariners then we have found our RB


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over 12 years ago
nufc_nz wrote:
TV wrote:
martinb wrote:

Also can anyone remember how many players we had who took a decent shot in any games. Killen and no one is I think the list.

We started to play a bit of football from the Wales game on with Smeltz...but Wood on his lonesome isn't going to be enough you'd think, and our midfielders while being tricky don't have a Brown like record of bundling the ball in.

Don't think one up front is a good plan.


Again though understanding how a 4-2-3-1 actually works is key. Look at how Ange or Graham Arnold use it


Yes, look at how ANGE AND ARNOLD USE IT. 

NOT RICKI FUCKIN HERBERT !

One up front has never worked the the All Whites. South Africa we had 2 shots at goal. IN 3 WHOLE GAMES.

I call BS on that stat - we scored 2 goals and I remember Vicelich and Wood both going close against Italy. That's 4 shots right there, twice as many as you said!

People like Coldplay and voted for the Nazis. You can't trust people.

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over 12 years ago · edited over 12 years ago · History

I believe the stat was '2 shots on target'.



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over 12 years ago · edited over 12 years ago · History
nufc_nz wrote:

I believe the stat was '2 shots on target'.



not correct. 2 goals (Shane and Winston) with shots on target from Chris and Ivan and maybe others do not equal 2.  Its 4 as a minimum, check your facts.
Supporter world's best and worst football teams: Waikato/WaiBop, Kingz, Knights, Phoenix, The Argyle, The Whites & the All Whites

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over 12 years ago
newbyone wrote:

MetalLegNZ wrote:

Can Roux play left?

Assuming Fenton stands up at RB and so does Roux it could be that both can step up.

I understand that playing left and right RB are still quite different because of angles and also having to be comfortable on the other foot, but it certainly is worth looking at.

TV wrote:

Good point. Yes. Can play both sides

Great that these kids are both in professional teams. But have you watched them play a whole game against quality opposition? I hope by being comfortable on the other foot you mean the ability to use the correct foot without thinking about it. 

I've seen so many players in the past have to take an extra touch so they can get a cross in with the foot they naturally use or an extra touch to shoot so they can get the ball on the foot they naturally use.


Not fair... Lochead is a natural left foot and look how well he uses his and the same goes with Bertos and his awesome crossing ability from the right off his good foot.
I'll take a right footed LB who can hit 3 / 10 crosses well than one who can't get 1 / 10
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over 12 years ago

Sticking with the Herbert bashing and expectations he will lose his job and youth will come in I started thinking about our top 11 u21 players and its a pretty decent looking team.

Basalaj

Fenton Adams Tuiloma Roux

Thomas Rufer Howieson Rojas

Wood Payne

Which leaves us with Rhys Jordan, Tyler Boyd, Max Crocombe and Hamish Watson (i expect him to get a contract) on the bench.

All players working within a professional environment. The midfield excites me particularly as they are all passers of the ball and technically very capable.

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over 12 years ago
MetalLegNZ wrote:

Sticking with the Herbert bashing and expectations he will lose his job and youth will come in I started thinking about our top 11 u21 players and its a pretty decent looking team.

Basalaj

Fenton Adams Tuiloma Roux

Thomas Rufer Howieson Rojas

Wood Payne

Which leaves us with Rhys Jordan, Tyler Boyd, Max Crocombe and Hamish Watson (i expect him to get a contract) on the bench.

All players working within a professional environment. The midfield excites me particularly as they are all passers of the ball and technically very capable.

Still lacking a DM.
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over 12 years ago
MetalLegNZ wrote:

Sticking with the Herbert bashing and expectations he will lose his job and youth will come in I started thinking about our top 11 u21 players and its a pretty decent looking team.

Basalaj

Fenton Adams Tuiloma Roux

Thomas Rufer Howieson Rojas

Wood Payne

Which leaves us with Rhys Jordan, Tyler Boyd, Max Crocombe and Hamish Watson (i expect him to get a contract) on the bench.

All players working within a professional environment. The midfield excites me particularly as they are all passers of the ball and technically very capable.


Rufer > Boyd.

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over 12 years ago
Marto wrote:
nufc_nz wrote:

I believe the stat was '2 shots on target'.



not correct. 2 goals (Shane and Winston) with shots on target from Chris and Ivan and maybe others do not equal 2.  Its 4 as a minimum, check your facts.

HA !
"and maybe others" 
You need to check your own facts, mate.


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over 12 years ago · edited over 12 years ago · History

We had 5 shots on target 3 games. I'm trying to find out how many we actually had now.



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over 12 years ago

I was one off. I'll accept your apology though.



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