All Whites, Ferns, and other international teams

Vs Mexico 1st Leg Thurs 14th 9:30am SS2

1684 replies · 195,430 views
over 12 years ago · edited over 12 years ago · History
Bullion wrote:
Spud wrote:
brettdale55 wrote:

So Herbert got us to Bahrain in 2010, apart from the Bahrain game, part of his legacy has to be "He never WON us

a game that was important. Im so pissed off at Ricki right now, if we had of gone forward and lost like this, fair enough

but steve summer got it right, the game was lost because of Herberts tactics in the first half, Possession was 81-19.

How the hell did Herbert expect to hold them. Fire Herbert and Frank Van Hattum, those were shocking tactics, its not

so much the results, that was probably always going to happen, but to let mexico dictate the game, because of your own

ego, well that freakin sucks herbert.  Worst coaching in the history of sport, you cant park the bus against mexico, you

shouldnt have  picked christie, you tell the players theyre allowed to dribble and  you dont kick away the ball as soon as 

they get possession. This is on you Herbert, clear and simple. He should've done the decent thing and quit after new caldeonia.


+1

Don't plus 1 that. Ricki has achieved many firsts for NZ Football. Though someone else will be needed to help us progress past where Ricki has taken us.

 

I'll plus two it then. The only first he has done on his own is to get us 3rd at the Oceania Nations Cup and that was due to a last minute winner.

She wore a yellow ribbon
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over 12 years ago


Sigh

 

People like Coldplay and voted for the Nazis. You can't trust people.

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over 12 years ago

Why don't we look at hiring the New Zealand Women's team coach (Tony Readings..?). If you compare the way the Women's team played 10 years ago to the way they are playing now, the progress that they have made has been incredible. They are competing with the best teams in the world now and often dominating possession against the likes of England, Australia, USA etc. It would not be beyond the realms of possibility to see them reach the semi finals of the world cup in the next couple of tournaments. The transformation has been remarkable. Why not look at this guy? He has played a major role in this transformation and could help do the same with the All Whites. I'm not saying we will ever dominate those teams in the mens games, or even come close, but I believe we have a hell of lot more room to improve. The first step however is to take a serious hard look at the playing squad. Some big questions need to be asked of these players. Lochhead, Bertos, Vicelich, Christie, Fallon and possibly several more players' international careers are probably now over. We need to embrace our youth and give them a shot. I would rather play Roux (a professional footballer) over Lochhead (a guy who wakes up each morning and might go down to the park to kick a ball around by himself), Tuiloma (a player who is standing out in the youth setup of one of the biggest clubs in Europe) over Bertos (a player whose career is probably over under Ernie Merrick) and anyone over Jeremy Christie.

Thank you Ricki for what you have achieved with New Zealand, thank you for helping us get to South Africa in 2010 and letting me witness my country make the world cup for the first time in my life. 

It is time to move forward now. Herbert has to go, De Jong has to go, Van Hattum has to go. NZF is a shambles and we need a new setup with people who have fresh ideas and desire to take NZF in the right direction.   

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over 12 years ago

I think the saddest thing is that when we scored we could barely celebrate it. I mean, had we scored first or sometime early in the game we could have at least had a moment where we went mental.

Three for me, and two for them.

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over 12 years ago

LOL - this has nothing to do with Frank Van Hattum. Overall ,he has done a good job I think. At least NZ Football i run semi competently now.

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over 12 years ago

Dont have to sack fred or fvh just dont play donkeys without clubs


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over 12 years ago

We're better than Jordan!

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over 12 years ago

I've never been one to personally blame management as a direct cause, but holly shit fuck me what the fuck shit was that crap. Don't start playing until 2-0 down, don't take Ivan off despite him being out of place and terrible the whole match. I've also never seen a new zealand defence been out jumped by a bunch of manlets before, until today. This was beyond embarrassing, but the fact im not shocked by it and had all week since the squad announcement to anticipate the possible scenarion is even worse. Bring on wellington! go all out fo da bois and don't pull a david tua what if. or maybe its just too late.

yung thug

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over 12 years ago
Bullion wrote:
Spud wrote:
brettdale55 wrote:

So Herbert got us to Bahrain in 2010, apart from the Bahrain game, part of his legacy has to be "He never WON us

a game that was important. Im so pissed off at Ricki right now, if we had of gone forward and lost like this, fair enough

but steve summer got it right, the game was lost because of Herberts tactics in the first half, Possession was 81-19.

How the hell did Herbert expect to hold them. Fire Herbert and Frank Van Hattum, those were shocking tactics, its not

so much the results, that was probably always going to happen, but to let mexico dictate the game, because of your own

ego, well that freakin sucks herbert.  Worst coaching in the history of sport, you cant park the bus against mexico, you

shouldnt have  picked christie, you tell the players theyre allowed to dribble and  you dont kick away the ball as soon as 

they get possession. This is on you Herbert, clear and simple. He should've done the decent thing and quit after new caldeonia.


+1

Don't plus 1 that. Ricki has achieved many firsts for NZ Football. Though someone else will be needed to help us progress past where Ricki has taken us.

 I'll plus two it then. The only first he has done on his own is to get us 3rd at the Oceania Nations Cup and that was due to a last minute winner.

First point in a FIFA comp and first point at a WC. First win against European opposition in Europe (did it twice). 

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over 12 years ago


so we have to get 5 goals and not concede any next weds plus no wood and no bertos  . can be done

I LOVE LAMP

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over 12 years ago
chefmivec wrote:


so we have to get 5 goals and not concede any next weds plus no wood and no bertos  . can be done


Don't make things out to be more than they are.
We only need to get four and concede none.

"Phoenix till they lose"

Posting 97% bollox, 8% lies and 3.658% genuine opinion. 

Genuine opinion: FTFFA

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over 12 years ago
el grapadura wrote:
reg22 wrote:

our team is very capable of winning this

the problem is that the preparation has been so poor, that we have limited the chance of this team pulling off something special

if i were to measure it, i'd say we have lost 2 goals from poor prep

in other words, no matter how well or badly we do over these two games, NZF need to wear the blame for this team performing beneath itself


I don't really want to make a big thing out of this, but I am genuinely interested in where your belief that our team is 'very capable of winning this' comes from? 


Is this the similar line of argument we heard from some of the Nix fans earlier this year that it was Ricki who was stopping the Phoenix playing a better brand of football (perhaps true) and being more successful (definitely not)? Or is it based on the performances from 2009/2010 when the All Whites stunned the footballing world in firstly, qualifying for the World Cup, and then having an unbeaten campaign at the tournament itself? Or something third?


I've never really bought into the first line of argument. Ricki certainly has his weaknesses as a coach/manager, and some of his selections in this All White squad have been puzzling to say the least. But just like Phoenix under Merrick are struggling to put together good results despite a very different style of football, the All Whites too are suffering from the fact that a certain number of the players in the squad aren't really good enough at that level. Could Ricki have helped the situation with some of his selections? Yes. Will it make a huge difference in the end? I'm pretty sure it won't.


When I think of the All Whites, I can't help but remember a team that struggles to keep possession and attack with good structure against the likes of Tahiti, and requires an injury time goal to win a home game against New Caledonia at home, in a game that frankly could have gone either way. Would the team be better in those areas under a different coach? Perhaps, against that level of opposition. Would the results be significantly different? Sadly, I think not.


While 2009 and 2010 were great times to be an All White fan, I can't help but think that they were a product of a perfect storm that perhaps won't be seen in New Zealand football for another generation (unless we get our shit together here, but I have my doubts there). We had a bunch of All Whites playing and training together in the same, professional club, under the same coach as in the national team. We had three experienced, and quality veteran players in Nelsen, Elliott and Vicelich, who had all performed at very good levels in Europe. And we got four quality players in Reid, Smith, McGlinchey and Fallon (OK, maybe stretching it here, but he did score the most important goal for NZ in the last 30 years). We ended up with a squad of 12-13 players that we could not have dreamed of having only 5 years prior to that.


Fast forward 4 years, and what do we have now? Elliott's never been replaced. Ivan's 37, and very much on his last legs as a serious footballer. Even so, he's head and shoulders above any other options in defensive midfield. Nelsen's gone, and while he's been effectively replaced by Reid, even so the backline is still weaker than it was in 2010, and of course Reid won't be playing in those two games anyway. Smeltz, Bertos, Lochhead are simply older, paler versions of themselves. We argue and discuss here about Roux and Tuiloma, two young kids. About Kosta and Wood, two guys making their way reasonably well as professional footballers. And that's awesome, it's good for those guys, and the All Whites that they're doing a good fist of it. But the brutal reality? Players like that are dime a dozen for countries like Mexico. We have Marco, who's a genuine talent, but is recovering from injury, and is just one player after all, still trying to find his place in the sun at the highest levels of the game.


So when I look at the actual state, I think I've started to understand what Ricki's looking to do. He's going to stick to his tried and tested conservative guns, play guys he knows and believes can perform another miraculous backs to the wall Houdini act. Is this going to be successful? I seriously doubt it. In one game, anything can happen. I've seen and played in enough those to know that. But over two games, we might just be looking at one miracle too many. But that's OK. We are still a growing football nation. We still have a lot of work to do to genuinely and consistently content at the highest levels of the game. As long as we keep striving for that, is all we can ask for. And maybe we'll get ourselves to another situation like in 2009 and 2010, and it will feel good. 



hi mate, just read this

you are bang on.  i would have agreed before this morning's result too btw

i just thought that IF we were well organised we could be in the game.

360footballnews.com

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over 12 years ago

Far too much angst in here. Not sure what people expected. Always going to be a tough battle regardless of the team selection, formation and strategy.

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over 12 years ago

Fallon, Rojas and Babarouses starting upfront would be nice.

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over 12 years ago

Has Herbert spoken in the after match press conference, has any Journo asked him why the fuck he picked christie for.

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over 12 years ago · edited over 12 years ago · History
joshyboy007 wrote:

Fallon, Rojas and Babarouses starting upfront would be nice.

smeltz for fallon. . sub smeltz half way through second for fallon

I LOVE LAMP

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over 12 years ago

I agree, let's get behind the team next week and make it a n occasion to remember!

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over 12 years ago

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11157126

2) What now for the second leg with Wood, Bertos and Vicelich ruled out?

Kris Shannon: The tie over virtually over so why not give New Zealand fans a glimpse of the future? 4-4-2 with Tuiloma and Roux playing fullback. Chris James showed enough to warrant a place in midfield alongside McGlinchey, while Rojas clearly needs to start. Brockie/Barbarouses on the other wing and Smeltz and Fallon up top. Whether Ricki Herbert - a staunch believer in experience - agrees is another question.

Steven Holloway: Ricki's last hoorah. Herbert will lead a young, fresh All Whites side out for his last game in charge with nothing to lose. Herbert will deploy an attacking game plan and try to win back the Wellington crowd. Expect Rojas, Tuiloma, Smeltz and Roux to play major roles.

Daniel Richardson:
There can be a glimpse in to the future. It will go against every coaching grain in Ricki Herbert's body but he needs to employ a young, attacking squad with players like Marco Rojas and Storm Roux starting from the opening kick of the ball. The formation needs work too. A traditional back four would be a better option with Roux on the right, Ben Sigmund and Andrew Durante in the middle and stand-in skipper Tommy Smith at left back.


"Phoenix till they lose"

Posting 97% bollox, 8% lies and 3.658% genuine opinion. 

Genuine opinion: FTFFA

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over 12 years ago
joshyboy007 wrote:

Fallon, Rojas and Babarouses starting upfront would be nice.

Plus the options of Smeltz and Brockie lurking somewhere as well..... Wood is a big loss but we have options.

James should get a start plus some new blood in the back as well.

While a miracle is practically imossible it should at least be interesting..

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over 12 years ago

impossible is nothing

just do it

make. believe.

in the name of the father, son and Rory Fallon* 


*and Marco, Kosta and Smeltz

"Phoenix till they lose"

Posting 97% bollox, 8% lies and 3.658% genuine opinion. 

Genuine opinion: FTFFA

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over 12 years ago
2ndBest wrote:

Far too much angst in here. Not sure what people expected. Always going to be a tough battle regardless of the team selection, formation and strategy.

 

QFT

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over 12 years ago
Junior82 wrote:
chefmivec wrote:


so we have to get 5 goals and not concede any next weds plus no wood and no bertos  . can be done


Don't make things out to be more than they are.

We only need to get four and concede none.



If its 3-0 in Wellington, would our away goal bring us up to 5-5 and take it to penalties?

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over 12 years ago
joshyboy007 wrote:

Fallon, Rojas and Babarouses starting upfront would be nice.

Fallon? Please no

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over 12 years ago

Maybe the mexican cartel, may want to make some money on the return leg?

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over 12 years ago

I don't think too many on here have a problem with the fact that Ricki has done a hell of a lot for our football while coach of the AWs. He's put us on the map and we've gained some of our best ever results. I mean, a 1-1 draw with Italy in a World Cup game? That's fantasy stuff.

Where myself and I'm sure others have an issue is with his reluctance to do the right thing when it was clear that he'd lost the plot. That to most was after the New Caledonia fiasco. His bizarre selections in the squad (and indeed starting eleven) for the game this morning were that of a man with chronic tunnel vision.

I also have a problem with NZFs unwillingness to take action when it was needed and replace him if he wasn't going to go on his own. The old boys club that seems to be operating needs to be dismantled pronto.

Nix, Leyton Orient and Alloa Athletic supporting schmuck.

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over 12 years ago
michaelme wrote:
Junior82 wrote:
chefmivec wrote:


so we have to get 5 goals and not concede any next weds plus no wood and no bertos  . can be done


Don't make things out to be more than they are.

We only need to get four and concede none.



If its 3-0 in Wellington, would our away goal bring us up to 5-5 and take it to penalties?



Only if Ricki had invoked his power play option for one of our goals.

"Phoenix till they lose"

Posting 97% bollox, 8% lies and 3.658% genuine opinion. 

Genuine opinion: FTFFA

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over 12 years ago

Team for the second leg :-)


Proudly "fed up of"         supporting the underdog, Major trophies in my lifetime:

Sunderland = 0
England = 0
Phoenix = 0
New Zealand = 0

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over 12 years ago
michaelme wrote:


If its 3-0 in Wellington, would our away goal bring us up to 5-5 and take it to penalties?



Are you fucking serious?

Three for me, and two for them.

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over 12 years ago
michaelme wrote:
Junior82 wrote:
[quote=chefmivec]


so we have to get 5 goals and not concede any next weds plus no wood and no bertos  . can be done


Don't make things out to be more than they are.

We only need to get four and concede none.



If its 3-0 in Wellington, would our away goal bring us up to 5-5 and take it to penalties?


[/quot

no, we have to win 4-0 to go through, it was 5-1 it will be extra time.
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over 12 years ago

Has Herbet been interviewed yet? cant find anything anywhere?


Worst tactics in the history of sport.

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over 12 years ago
Buffon II wrote:
michaelme wrote:


If its 3-0 in Wellington, would our away goal bring us up to 5-5 and take it to penalties?



Are you fucking serious?

It's a shame that away goals don't count quadruple or we'd only be down 5-4 right now. I blame the OFC.

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over 12 years ago

If we were to win on aggregate after losing 5-1 and go through to Brazil, it would be one of the biggest upsets in sporting history in my opinion.


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over 12 years ago
brettdale55 wrote:

Maybe the mexican cartel, may want to make some money on the return leg?


Or the Asian crime syndicates. They would make a fortune.
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over 12 years ago
AllBlackCats wrote:

Team for the second leg :-)




Michael Boxall (back row, second left) should definitely get a run.
Nix, Leyton Orient and Alloa Athletic supporting schmuck.

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over 12 years ago
brettdale55 wrote:
michaelme wrote:
Junior82 wrote:
[quote=chefmivec]


so we have to get 5 goals and not concede any next weds plus no wood and no bertos  . can be done


Don't make things out to be more than they are.

We only need to get four and concede none.



If its 3-0 in Wellington, would our away goal bring us up to 5-5 and take it to penalties?


[/quot


no, we have to win 4-0 to go through, it was 5-1 it will be extra time.


Right.  
I thought away goals counted for 2?
4-0 win. Fuck that'd be incredible.

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over 12 years ago

I will never fathom how people can not understand the away goals rule.

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over 12 years ago
michaelme wrote:
brettdale55 wrote:
michaelme wrote:
Junior82 wrote:
[quote=chefmivec]


so we have to get 5 goals and not concede any next weds plus no wood and no bertos  . can be done


Don't make things out to be more than they are.

We only need to get four and concede none.



If its 3-0 in Wellington, would our away goal bring us up to 5-5 and take it to penalties?


[/quot


no, we have to win 4-0 to go through, it was 5-1 it will be extra time.


Right.  

I thought away goals counted for 2?

4-0 win. Fuck that'd be incredible.

Away goals are the first tie-breaker if the aggregate score is even over 2 legs, that's all. People make the away.goals thing sound way more complicated than it actually is

 

People like Coldplay and voted for the Nazis. You can't trust people.

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over 12 years ago
DKP22 wrote:

I will never fathom how people can not understand the away goals rule.


He's a Chelsea fan. Sums it all up.

Three for me, and two for them.

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over 12 years ago

Well that escalated quickly....

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