National League / OCL

WOF - Allan Jones

71 replies · 8,411 views
about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Hard News wrote:
I missed it, just going on memories of Auckland City when he coached them... Ball with Ross Nicholson...bang it long to Jordan and Young (repeat ad nauseum)...


As Allan once said to me when I told him his teams just play long ball football

"Its not long ball football. Its direct football. Completely different. If your strikers can't get it from the keeper then you close down the left and right backs and force them to make errors in their half of the field"

I wonder if Alan didn't realise he was subtley referring to himself when he said that old school English coaches are whats wrong with our game..


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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Are we all agreed that NZ Football is not going in the right direction?

Or do some deluded people think its going in the right direction?


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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Well there are a couple of things that seem to be going forward (NZFC, Nix, hosting U-17WC) but the rest has gone so far backwards I can't see it in my rear view mirror.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Not 100% convinced that the NZFC is going forward.

Apparently I'm apathetic, but I couldn't care less.

"Being a Partick Thistle fan sets you apart. It means youre a free thinker. It also means your team has no money." Tim Luckhurst, The Independent, 4th December 2003

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Jag wrote:
Not 100% convinced that the NZFC is going forward.


Maybe because it's not?
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Yup, that's probably why 

Apparently I'm apathetic, but I couldn't care less.

"Being a Partick Thistle fan sets you apart. It means youre a free thinker. It also means your team has no money." Tim Luckhurst, The Independent, 4th December 2003

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
ok Im giving the show a crack.
Immediately met by a Jones pink top and Elrick babble. Then on to Jones saying the club based structure was better than NZFC = bollox.
Hay said the std was higher with clubs - really?
Fred was the voice of reason, commenting how clubs were going bust trying the buy the best players, and not outlaying anything on grounds etc. good one.1-0 Fred
Then he went on to defend Oceania though -saying we were getting great World Cup action. Jones inputs that we are getting bossed on the world stage - thus wasting our time. 1-1 Fred/Jones 

Founder

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

coaching - more Elrick babble. Starts on NZFC but then ends up talking about school girls as per usual. What you on about man?

Jones- massive generalisation about coaching. True on some fronts though. Playing a sub-standard passing game on an international stage does not help the results - though if we did play a lump it game where we turned over possession we would still get spanked.  Pulls out great gag on Hay (nearly a point)

Fred - correct in saying there is no point playing long ball winning football in NZFC - as it will not develop you on a global level. [A mechanical boot isnt gonna get snapped up by Man U]

More Elrick babble..

Founder

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Jones raises the point we need more intensive coaching, which is true, but he is becoming a broken record.
 
Elrick - says that the kids at12/13 dont have much to go to coaching wise - and we are losing them, and again when they leave college. Give him a point E1-J1-F1-H0
 
[INTERUPTION WHILE WE SEE SANTY NAKED IN THE FEVER ZONE]
 
Phoenix banter - suddenly just like Hay, Elrick knows how much Elrich is getting paid.
 
Fred - we need 150 NZers in top Euro leagues - you are having a Turkish
 
Hay mentions YF.1 Point E1-J1-F1-H1

Founder

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Fred defends Oceania again saying that we are qualifying for top comps in OLge/WCC
 
Jones - defends NZFC right to easy WCC route like a true Aklder
 
Fred - rightly says we will get the boot from WCC if we continue to be crap
 
Jones goes on about how the Nix should be used ie developing players for AW/Intl, which is completely redundant unless he is planning to buy them..

Founder

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Oceania or Asia?
 
Jones - O for $ sht term, Asia long term
 
Fred  - O for milking it. Lose a point E1-J1-F0-H1
 
Hay - better for the future if we are in Asia. Too bad about World Cups. 1 point E1-J1-F0-H2
 
Jones - knocks the Nat Lge, but never mentions solutions. What is his "correct" league/coaching method?? No answers
Fred plays devils advocate
Decent banter. Fred 1 point, Jones 1 point E1-J2-F1-H2

Founder

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
how the hell is Danny Hay coming first equal!!, on about 4 occasions i had to look closely to see if he was still alive 
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
2010 WC
Hay says good chance for AWs - good route through Asia playoff. Adds that if we are playing in asia routinely then we would progress more. 1 point  E1-J2-F1-H3
 
Elrick interjects. -1 pt E0-J2-F1-H3
 
Jones ranks the needs of the game (in order to build good players) here as Admin,Facilities, then Coaches. Not sure if I agree - how can coaching quality come third? We would all play like Hard News.
 
Fred - reminds me he works for NZF. -1 point
 
E0-J2-F0-H3
 
HAY TAKES IT FROM JONES IN A TIGHT 5 GOAL THRILLER. FRED AND ELRICK FAIL TO BULGE.
 
 

Founder

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
tigers wrote:
how the hell is Danny Hay coming first equal!!, on about 4 occasions i had to look closely to see if he was still alive 
 
haha true.

Founder

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
i wont be suprised if nzfc dont pay attention to this
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I can't understand Allan Jones talking about intensive training. After all, he is one of that generation of coaches that came to NZ from the UK and preached the long ball game. It's the likes of Jones that prevented many young players from developing ball skills required to foot it with the best over the years, because they were too busy doing shuttles.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

this thread rules. keep going!
I like tautologies because I like them.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
pao1908 wrote:
I can't understand Allan Jones talking about intensive training. After all, he is one of that generation of coaches that came to NZ from the UK and preached the long ball game. It's the likes of Jones that prevented many young players from developing ball skills required to foot it with the best over the years, because they were too busy doing shuttles.


In the three years that Jones was at Auckland City / Central the players didn't do shuttles once.

It is interesting in how perceptions become belief.

If you are playing a high pressuring game as proposed by Jones then how do you get to play long ball. You are winning possession back on half way. A long ball would put you in the carpark of all the gorunds in the NZFC.

Be careful you don't start believing the mantra - English coach = long ball.

The most telling comment from Jones was - don't ask players to do what they are not capable of.

How come we think we can roll it around like Arsenal when even our 12 year olds have been exposed to a football - structured or unstructured less than 50% of the time of kids overseas.

A bit like asking a harrier runner who does 60 ks per week in training to run with the best marathoners and beat them.

Are you interested in the style of play or the results?

If you aren't as good as your opposition in certain aspects don't you try to alter the game? Disrupt their strengths and play to yours?

If sport is the modern day war - even the Brits moved away from the squares of soldiers standing toe to toe with the enemy.

Allan has the answers - up to NZF to find them
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
City Fan wrote:
Be careful you don't start believing the mantra - English coach = long ball.


Forget 'the mantra'... actually watching Auckland City in the first two seasons would tell you that the primary tactic used was a long ball from the keeper or defenders for Jordan or Young (or both) to run on to.  You can't re-write history now becuase Jones has become some sort of messiah for a different style of football.

It's not like he's suddenly appeared here either.  Where has this been in the last 20 years he's been coaching in NZ, where was this when he ran the All Whites and had the ability to set the changes he romantically alludes to in place ?



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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Al last some people who are starting to see through the old school english system which was and is based on the theory of Charles Hughes who showed that 80% of goals came from 2-4 passes.
The English FA at the time developed this theory and thought because they had won the world cup in 66 it must be right. The rest of the world who had not won the cup developed different styles which we refer as trhe European way.
 
Can i make the point that Charles Hughes was right even Brazil goals come from 2-4 passes but the y mix it up with possession and style and elegance, not the english though who decided thatwas the only way and by doing it more they would score more goals.
 
The coach's then who came out in to NZ in the 70, and 80 ie Jones, WILKINSON, Truman, Fallon etc etc have had that system engrained in their DNA and as much as they desire to see things more beautifully under pressure they will revert to type.
 
As i have commented on before the Old School need to create the vacuum before it can be filled.
 
 
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Even Auckland City fans used to use sigs like:

Nicholson.... Jordan.... Goal ... on football forums because they were amused by it.
Hard News2008-02-11 16:02:23

How's my driving? - Whine here

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
because it was true...
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I'll consider myself absolved of simply knocking Allan Jones at this point I think.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Hard News wrote:

Even Auckland City fans used to use sigs like:Nicholson.... Jordan.... Goal ... on football forums because they were amused by it.


Well there are DVD's of all the goals scored by Auckland City in the first two years. They used to be played down at Kiwitea St on the TV - haven't seen them out at the Croatian Club.

Roughly a third of the goals are from set pieces - corners, free kicks, throw in and pens. Of the rest 70% would be winning the ball from the opposition in their half and countering.

The rest are playing balls in behind a flat opposition and either straight on goal or squared for the supporting runs.

Interestingly their is some great interchange - and a lot of goals come from mid fielders - Smith, Seaman, Sykes , Mulrooney.

Must be some very athletic midfielders if they are able to get on the end of long balls.
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Has anyone emailed WOF and aired our frustration at how useless their coverage is???

Queenslander 3x a year.

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Nah, Dennis can't read

Apparently I'm apathetic, but I couldn't care less.

"Being a Partick Thistle fan sets you apart. It means youre a free thinker. It also means your team has no money." Tim Luckhurst, The Independent, 4th December 2003

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Their cameras don't seem to travel south of the Croatian Club.
 
Dennis can read, and he's a fellow Panathinaikos supporter....!  Blame Fred de Jong or someone....!!!
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
pao1908 wrote:
Their cameras don't seem to travel south of the Croatian Club.
 
Dennis can read, and he's a fellow Panathinaikos supporter....!  Blame Fred de Jong or someone....!!!



Apparently I'm apathetic, but I couldn't care less.

"Being a Partick Thistle fan sets you apart. It means youre a free thinker. It also means your team has no money." Tim Luckhurst, The Independent, 4th December 2003

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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
If their coverage is so useless, why has it not been on free to air tv? It doesn't seem to justify being on sky tv otherwise. (Wished I had sky TV tho)AllWhitebelievr2008-02-13 19:04:05
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I believe Kiwitea is south of the Croatian Club... and theyve travelled there
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about 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Wolfben wrote:
I believe Kiwitea is south of the Croatian Club... and theyve travelled there
 
Oh sorry Wolfben, I stand corrected on that....!!
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