Back to Forum

Eduardo Dive

232 replies · 10,716 views

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

steve-o who club and country do you support mate???

I support Hibs and Scotland and I absolutely hate Celtic so this argument has nothing to do with any favourable feelings towards them if that's what you are thinking.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

lads - who gives a flying fk about Eduardo - it's Nix day!!!

Founder

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Feverish wrote:

lads - who gives a flying fk about Eduardo - it's Nix day!!!

Not enough chat on the main board

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Steve-O wrote:

Jag wrote:

Honest view from Scotland 'keeper Craig Gordon, from the Evening Times newspaper in Glasgow:

http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/sport/display.var.2528959.0.eduardos_dive_worth_it_for_16m.php

He's a cheating Hearts bassa as well though.

Apparently I'm apathetic, but I couldn't care less.

"Being a Partick Thistle fan sets you apart. It means youre a free thinker. It also means your team has no money." Tim Luckhurst, The Independent, 4th December 2003

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Steve-O wrote:

Ripthajacka wrote:

steve-o who club and country do you support mate???

I support Hibs and Scotland and I absolutely hate Celtic so this argument has nothing to do with any favourable feelings towards them if that's what you are thinking.

was just wondering mate nothing personal

so a hibs or scotland player has never dived???

go gunners

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Ripthajacka wrote:

Steve-O wrote:

Ripthajacka wrote:

steve-o who club and country do you support mate???

I support Hibs and Scotland and I absolutely hate Celtic so this argument has nothing to do with any favourable feelings towards them if that's what you are thinking.

was just wondering mate nothing personal

so a hibs or scotland player has never dived???

Where have I said that? In fact a few posts back I said the exact opposite and spoke of a time a Hibs player did dive. In fact, most times when us fans have felt a player on our team has gone down too easily we are shouting at them to get back on their feet!

As for Scotland, I can't remember any high profile dives, no?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

turn it up steve-o you may hate celtic but you love scottish football - this whole thing has happened because of the scottish FA's b*tching and whining. On top of that you clearly think the sun shines outta mowbrays arse - you have a personal agenda dont claim that you dont

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

paulm wrote:

Garbage.

I most definitely do NOT think that about Mowbray, particularly after his reaction to his own players diving at the weekend.

This was a UEFA decision, and if you think the SFA hold some massive sway over UEFA, then I think you are mistaken.

The FACT of the matter is that his happened because Eduardo dived.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Steve-O wrote:

paulm wrote:

Garbage.

I most definitely do NOT think that about Mowbray, particularly after his reaction to his own players diving at the weekend.

This was a UEFA decision, and if you think the SFA hold some massive sway over UEFA, then I think you are mistaken.

The FACT of the matter is that his happened because Eduardo dived.

yeah i get that but, ronaldo has been diving all his life and never has been charged

go gunners

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Steve-O wrote:

ï¿½

The FACT of the matter is that his happened because Eduardo dived.

No. This happened because of the sh*tstorm created by the SFA and the media.

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Ripthajacka wrote:

Steve-O wrote:

paulm wrote:

Garbage.

I most definitely do NOT think that about Mowbray, particularly after his reaction to his own players diving at the weekend.

This was a UEFA decision, and if you think the SFA hold some massive sway over UEFA, then I think you are mistaken.

The FACT of the matter is that his happened because Eduardo dived.

yeah i get that but, ronaldo has been diving all his life and never has been charged

Fair enough - complain all you want about the inconsistency in applying the rules, that's fine, but please don't tell me that it wasn't a dive and there was no 'intent' to decieve the referee.

If he hadn't cheated in the first place, there would be no 2 match ban, simple really.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

exactly ripthajacka - and you could've replaced ronaldo with any number of players in that sentence

add your obvious arsenal hatred to your list of reasons too steve-o

this argument is a dead horse flog-a-thon now - we all know the deal, even general football websites like F365 etc are laughing at UEFA for the terrible inconsistency behind their actions

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Steve-O wrote:

Ripthajacka wrote:

Steve-O wrote:

paulm wrote:

Garbage.

I most definitely do NOT think that about Mowbray, particularly after his reaction to his own players diving at the weekend.

This was a UEFA decision, and if you think the SFA hold some massive sway over UEFA, then I think you are mistaken.

The FACT of the matter is that his happened because Eduardo dived.

yeah i get that but, ronaldo has been diving all his life and never has been charged

Fair enough - complain all you want about the inconsistency in applying the rules, that's fine, but please don't tell me that it wasn't a dive and there was no 'intent' to decieve the referee.

If he hadn't cheated in the first place, there would be no 2 match ban, simple really.

mate i think your losing the plot here LOL yeah i agree with the dive part and ban thats all good with all the gunners fans i know but the issue we have is that uefa wont do it to any other team/player. How could there be intent if he didnt appeal for it mate

football is full of "cheats" mate, i dont bother watching spl so cant comment much but i'm there it isnt a dive free league

go gunners

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

el grapadura wrote:

Steve-O wrote:

The FACT of the matter is that his happened because Eduardo dived.

No. This happened because of the sh*tstorm created by the SFA and the media.

Which happened because Eduardo dived.

Eduardo is the one who did wrong here, this is indisputable.

Wenger himself - In November 2006 he said: "Players should get lengthy bans for diving. It is the only way to stop it.We have to stop cheating."

Changed his tune eh?

As for the SFA - they themselves had a Rangers player suspended for 2 games after it was proven he dived in a game last season - the same media condemned this dive as well, so to portray this as some sort of anti-English crusade is wrong.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Ripthajacka wrote:

football is full of "cheats" mate, i dont bother watching spl so cant comment much but i'm there it isnt a dive free league

You are the one who has lost the plot if you truly believe that statement in bold.

Every single time a foul is commited the player appeals for it do they?

Don't talk nonsense.

You're obviously not reading what I am saying either. I am commenting on this specific incident, I am not, and have never, denied there is diving in any other league, including the SPL.

I agree that the rules should be applied consistently, but I don't agree with this persecution complex from Arsenal fans when it was their player who cheated in front of a worldwide audience! He cheated, he's now been punished - fair's fair!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Steve-O wrote:

el grapadura wrote:

Steve-O wrote:

The FACT of the matter is that his happened because Eduardo dived.

No. This happened because of the sh*tstorm created by the SFA and the media.

Which happened because Eduardo dived.

Eduardo is the one who did wrong here, this is indisputable.

Wenger himself - In November 2006 he said: "Players should get lengthy bans for diving. It is the only way to stop it.We have to stop cheating."

Changed his tune eh?

You have missed each and every point that we has been made steve-o.

Firstly, wenger has not changed his tune at all - he said fine, as long as other matches are also reviewed and appropriate punishments carried out. He is angry because it's apparent that no other matches will be reviewed in future.

The SPL has a retrospective panel to check for simulation - it was formulated, announced to all clubs and the media, and is now in force. This is great and i like it. They did it, and they did it right. UEFA did not. They made no plans, no statements, retrospectively banned a player for a yellow card offence, and then said it won't be happening anymore - just a one-off against this one player because of the media storm. How can you not see the ridiculousness in this steve-o? Are you serious?

You said yourself that divers should be punished and hopefully this example is the beginning of it -obviously from uefa's actions and statements this is not true. No one will be discouraged from diving because of this - coz they know it was just for this time, and they are not in danger. You should be as angry as the rest of us because your wishes are not coming true either.

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Steve-O wrote:

But you keep missing the point - it's not fair that he's punished for an offence that hundreds of other players committ daily, and who apparently won't be discouraged from doing so in the future.

In fact, it's the epitome of unfairness.

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

el grapadura wrote:

Steve-O wrote:

I haven't missed the point though - in that very same quote I have stated "I agree the rules should be applied consistently".

My view is that I don't think he should be let off just because others have, and might be in the future. Surely, given that a large number of people seen the incident, and even more since then, if UEFA had done nothing then this would be even MORE of an encouragement for players to dive?

Wenger can't say that this won't happen again to another team unless he is pyschic. UEFA haven't handled the whole thing that well, but I think if something like this comes up again during this Champions League season, then it will be dealt with in the same way.

If it's not, then Arsenal have every right to be angry.

I just don't think Wenger is doing himself any favours by continuing to suggest that it wasn't even a dive. He should focus on the more legitimate point of consistency in the rules.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

paulm wrote:

You have missed each and every point that we has been made steve-o.

Are you sure about this? There is a review panel, but the Rangers incident was the first time it was ever used regarding diving - it has generally been used in the past to deal with off the ball incidents missed by the referee.

I happen to agree that a 2 game ban seems harsh, and simply adding a yellow card to his record would've sufficed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Steve-O wrote:

ï¿½

I haven't missed the point though - in that very same quote I have stated "I agree the rules should be applied consistently".

ï¿½

UEFA bascially state 'this is a one-off, we just caved in under pressure', and you have no problem with it? You have no problem in UEFA stepping in meting out punishments in arbitrary manner and basically admitting the same thing?

Wow. You have strange standards.

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

el grapadura wrote:

Steve-O wrote:

I haven't missed the point though - in that very same quote I have stated "I agree the rules should be applied consistently".

You cannot confirm this to be the case until the end of the Champions League.

Also, they did it with Mikolounis of Lithuania 2 years ago, so this is the 2nd time (off the top of my head) where this has happened so far.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Steve-O wrote:

el grapadura wrote:

Steve-O wrote:

ï¿½

I haven't missed the point though - in that very same quote I have stated "I agree the rules should be applied consistently".

ï¿½

You cannot confirm this to be the case until the end of the Champions League.

ï¿½

Also, they did it with Mikolounis of Lithuania 2 years ago, so this is the 2nd time (off the top of my head) where this has happened so far.

They've basically admitted as much.

And the Lithuania issue just weakens your case further.

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

el grapadura wrote:

They've basically admitted as much.

And the Lithuania issue just weakens your case further.

So what is it UEFA actually said, rather than paraphrasing to "they've basically admitted it"?

You said it was a one-off, I gave a previous example, not sure how this weakens my case?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe_B5CzbTJo - Caceres winning penalty v Perth - footage from the Fever Zone

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

response from Arsenal FC to UEFA's explanation (which hasnt been made public AFAIK)

The Club is in receipt of Uefaï¿½s reasoned decision in relation to the charge against Eduardo.

We strongly believe that the decision taken is deeply flawed and not based on any forensic review of the video evidence available.

There are obvious errors and inconsistencies in Uefaï¿½s judgment and we intend to appeal.

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/opinion/2835730/When-did-the-fair-go-out-of-play

I think it is a good article with some good points

Take the case of Eduardo da Silva.

Fairly or not - and that is a matter for debate - the Arsenal striker is now the poster boy for football's' problem of players seeking to hoodwink referees by pretending to have been fouled. Taking a dive, simulation, call it what you will, it all amounts to the same thing: cheating.

Perhaps, as Arsenal manager Arsene Wenger suggests, Eduardo is still tackle-shy after the horrific leg-break inflicted on him 18 months ago by Birmingham defender Martin Taylor. Taylor's right boot scraped down Eduardo's left shin to his ankle, which dislocated to a sickening right angle. Eduardo was screaming before he hit the ground. Wenger feared that his talented Croatia international might never play again. Broadcaster Sky Sports wouldn't show replays because they were too distressing.

Maybe, just maybe, the subconscious scars left by such a wound help explain why Eduardo hurled himself to the deck when he and Celtic goalkeeper Artur Boruc found themselves on a penalty-box collision course in an August 26 Champions League playoff.

But where Eduardo erred was not leaping straight back to his feet and telling the Spanish referee that Boruc hadn't touched him, that he had fallen and not been deliberately tripped.

Instead, Eduardo allowed Manuel Mejuto Gonzalez to award a penalty against Boruc. It was at that moment, by keeping his mouth shut, that Eduardo crossed the line into deceit and that his tumble, his trip, his effort to escape Boruc, or whatever Wenger says it was, became a dive, pure theatre to con the referee into thinking that he had been intentionally brought down.

Suggesting that Eduardo could have piped up, could have been as honest as he has proved himself brave in recovering from injury, is not as far-fetched as it sounds. Striker Robbie Fowler, then at Liverpool, did exactly that in an almost identical penalty-box situation in 1997.

Fowler won a UEFA Fair Play award for remonstrating with referee Gerald Ashby that Arsenal goalkeeper David Seaman hadn't fouled him.

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

UberGunner wrote:

Steve-O wrote:

UberGunner wrote:

the Scots had a whinge about a Lithuanian player in 2007 and got him banned, now 2 years later they are having a whinge again, but i would really love to know what UEFA have done in the last 2 years to try and stop this and how many bans they have given out for this offence since then?

You're right, we should just accept cheating and say no more about it

Im not saying accept it, im saying don't pick and choose who you want to apply the rules to. It's either everyone or no-one

Try saying that to the Maori party.

On topic, although he blatantly cheated I don't think he should be banned. 'Bringing the game into disrepute' would be a rubbish charge - in all honesty the amount of bans required to be consistent would be what would brings the game into disrepute.

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Steve-O wrote:

You said it was a one-off, I gave a previous example, not sure how this weakens my case?

Because it shows there's no consistent basis for enforcing this - thereby making it arbitrary and unfair.

Meaning that UEFA won't do a zilch about this until something like this happens against another Scottish team and they whine to high heavens about the injustice of it all.

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Slovenia are complaing about Rooney's dive this weekend. what are the odd's anything is done about this offence? (his second in 7 days)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7z_OLfLD1c0&feature=popular

1:38 onwards

UberGunner2009-09-07 12:19:32

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

I've heard (from an unofficial source) that Slovenia won't lay any formal complaint given the 'friendly' status of the match.

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

at the end of the day it is simulation and what if it was your team and it was the last minute 1-1 and a guy took a dive got a penalty and you lost 2-1 in say a cup final would it be ok then ?

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

nobody is arguing that it wasn't a dive, nobody is saying don't punish Eduardo. The point of our argument is, it isn't right to pick one player and punish him, and ignore all the others who do it, and say that you wont bother doing it to anyone else.

this is what UEFA have done

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

UberGunner wrote:

this is what UEFA have done

.....and this is what people have been saying, and others seemingly failing to understand, for 8 pages.

Apparently I'm apathetic, but I couldn't care less.

"Being a Partick Thistle fan sets you apart. It means youre a free thinker. It also means your team has no money." Tim Luckhurst, The Independent, 4th December 2003

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Rooney has categorically stated
he has never dived

as he is English I'm inclined to believe him.

why are fans "treated" to such disrespect?

E's Flat Ah's Flat Too

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

foal30 wrote:

Rooney has categorically stated
he has never dived

as he is English I'm inclined to believe him.

why are fans "treated" to such disrespect?

Apparently I'm apathetic, but I couldn't care less.

"Being a Partick Thistle fan sets you apart. It means youre a free thinker. It also means your team has no money." Tim Luckhurst, The Independent, 4th December 2003

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

UberGunner wrote:

this is what UEFA have done

Exactly the same with Mascherano at Old Trafford.

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

even funnier Jag
is the weekends game was another meaningless friendly
and Rooney is going down faster than a $10 hoar

I'm no diver

E's Flat Ah's Flat Too

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

foal30 wrote:

Rooney has categorically stated
he has never dived

as he is English I'm inclined to believe him.

why are fans "treated" to such disrespect?

I don't reckon he actually 'dived' like Eduardo did, but he played for the penalty sure.

Apparently the rule they have used was instigated in 2006 but this is the first time they have used it. I believe it is fine to target Eduardo as now they have set the standard. Eduardo (an ARSEnal reserve) only misses a couple of nothing ties against 'nobodies'

However they have definately set the standard and they will now be watching games like hawks to see similar instances. I also reckon only the absolutely blatant dives should be punished, exactly like the Eduardo one.

I am a Spurs fan sure and therefore not particularly sympathetic to the 'Woolwich Wanderers' but i do hope now they have made an example of someone they follow through, as diving must be the biggest blight on this beautiful game, and needs to be dealt with.

BTW - i had to laugh, i was listening to the '5 Live' podcast the other week and they had Wenger on talking about the Eduardo 'incident' and he stated 'there was definate contact'. I can only imagine he was watching a different game.

"You can never get a bloody tradesman at Easter, it's a wonder Jesus got crucified" - Karl Pilkington

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Dougie Rydal wrote:

However they have definately set the standard and they will now be watching games like hawks to see similar instances.

Erm, UEFA pretty much said they won't be doing this...

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Dougie Rydal wrote:

foal30 wrote:

Rooney has categorically stated
he has never dived

as he is English I'm inclined to believe him.

why are fans "treated" to such disrespect?

BTW - i had to laugh, i was listening to the '5 Live' podcast the other week and they had Wenger on talking about the Eduardo 'incident' and he stated 'there was definate contact'. I can only imagine he was watching a different game.

His myopia must be getting worse

Permalink

over 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

its all a bit to much

seriously single out eduardo over the likes of c.ronaldo( the biggest diver in history)

uefa seriously gotta get real

Permalink

Back to English (and other British lower league) Football Discussion Forum Home Back to top