English (and other British lower league) Football Discussion

Manchester United

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about 8 years ago

My favourite stat from the game was that there was not a shot on target from either side after the 31st minute. 

It was almost the perfect game for Mourinho. The tactic was to nullify space for Liverpool to attack with and to score using Lukaku and Rashford against a fragile defense. Even name dropped Gary Neville in the post match press conference to distract from any penalty issues. 

Big game midweek, and based on the past few games I am positive. Confident? Maybe the home form warrants it. 

about 8 years ago · edited about 8 years ago · History

Tekkers wrote:

My favourite stat from the game was that there was not a shot on target from either side after the 31st minute. 

It was almost the perfect game for Mourinho. The tactic was to nullify space for Liverpool to attack with and to score using Lukaku and Rashford against a fragile defense. Even name dropped Gary Neville in the post match press conference to distract from any penalty issues. 

Big game midweek, and based on the past few games I am positive. Confident? Maybe the home form warrants it. 

Wow Mourinho has really won you over when your favourite stat is your own team not getting a shot on target for an hour... 

I jest of course ;)

To be fair, if you can't even test De Gea at all then you're blimmin f*cked... you probably need at least 5 on target before you even think about beating that son of a b*tch... he's just so good. 

about 8 years ago

about 8 years ago

I actually cried before the game when I saw Young was still in the squad.

But was quietly astonished at how well he nullified Salah. Really basic too, just kept touch tight to him the whole game and kicked him a few times to make sure he knew he was there. I'd expect other defenders/teams in the league to wise up now and deploy similar tactics.

about 8 years ago

I think Luke Shaw will establish himself as first choice soon, but Ashley Young is a fantastic squad player to have. Decent rotation quality, does his job and a good locker room influence. I'm glad have him.

Valley FC til I die?

about 8 years ago

Oops. 

Takes the shine off the Liverpool win somewhat!

about 8 years ago

How will they defend Mourinho on this one I wonder?

Three for me, and two for them.

about 8 years ago · edited about 8 years ago · History

Pretty much what was expected after the first leg.

Bonkers decision making by Mourinho. Firstly, starting Fellaini. Then, Mata has been the key to our attacks for weeks but we'll leave him on the bench along with Martial. Sanchez hasn't done shark but he is unsubbable and gets another 90 minutes.

The most frustrating thing is that the culture of the club means the players and the fans aren't engaged by grinding out a 1-0 win against Sevilla at home. The only thing we achieved by trying was letting Sevilla play their way into the game. Yet we consistently try over and over again.

To top this off, Mourinho had the whole first half to acknowledge this but he failed to do just that.

I wouldn't complain if he was gone in the morning.

Congratulations to Sevilla.

about 8 years ago · edited about 8 years ago · History

Can't say I didn't see that coming. Jose's hubris bears the brunt of the blame, he was quite happy to sit back and let Sevilla take the initiative. Doing so on the back of being held to 0 away is asking for trouble.

about 8 years ago

Presumably when the draw for the next round takes place social media will be full of memes of someone holding a piece of paper saying "Not Man United" or "Not Spurs" since at each draw so far everyone has been more obsessed with who is not in it this season.

about 8 years ago

ajc28 wrote:

Presumably when the draw for the next round takes place social media will be full of memes of someone holding a piece of paper saying "Not Man United" or "Not Spurs" since at each draw so far everyone has been more obsessed with who is not in it this season.

And of course ' Not Arsenal" 

Not next season either.

If you are old and wise you were probably young and stupid

about 8 years ago

I suppose this is when the "tactics to nullify the opponent" fail - when the opponent also plays the same tactics. 

In any instance you would think United at home should be taking control and running the game. Not with Fellaini trying to get on the end of crosses and Sanchez / Young trying to loop them into him.

While i agree that Jose takes blame for picking the players on the pitch, i would think that all bar Fellaini should be able to do enough to create something more than they did tonight. Lukaku and Bailly were good, Rashford and Lingard alright but faded. 

That was a game for Pogba / Mata / Martial and none started. And they couldnt get going when they came on because there was zero momentum for them to play with. 

I hope games like this Jose learns from. At the same time, for every game like this, there is a game like the Liverpool one. 

about 8 years ago

20 Legend wrote:

Sanchez hasn't done shark but he is unsubbable and gets another 90 minutes.

Watching him for Arsenal prior to the transfer it was pretty much the same, somethings off with him.

about 8 years ago · edited about 8 years ago · History

brumbys wrote:

20 Legend wrote:

Sanchez hasn't done shark but he is unsubbable and gets another 90 minutes.

Watching him for Arsenal prior to the transfer it was pretty much the same, somethings off with him.

I think he's being used wrong at United, but then so is everyone except McTominay.

Just frustrates me to no end that if Mata, Martial or Rashford don't score a double they get dropped and publicly criticised. Yet Sanchez just merries around every week and not a peep from Mourinho.

about 8 years ago

Even Pogba has been getting dropped. It does seem odd. Is he picking him on past (individual) glories?

about 8 years ago · edited about 8 years ago · History

paulm wrote:

Even Pogba has been getting dropped. It does seem odd. Is he picking him on past (individual) glories?

Pogba hasn't been dropped, he's been injured. Was pretty clear today that he wasn't over the injury that kept him out of the Liverpool game.

Valley FC til I die?

about 8 years ago

The post match analysis was interesting, it showed that Fellaini spent the game either passing sideways ot backwards.  

about 8 years ago

whatever wrote:

The post match analysis was interesting, it showed that Fellaini spent the game either passing sideways ot backwards.  

Doesn't he play at the bottom of the midfield? Thus a normal position to find yourself in?

about 8 years ago

brumbys wrote:

whatever wrote:

The post match analysis was interesting, it showed that Fellaini spent the game either passing sideways ot backwards.  

Doesn't he play at the bottom of the midfield? Thus a normal position to find yourself in?

Not when he plays further up the field than both Lingard and Sanchez (he is the number 27). 

Not sure why Jose thought the 4-1-4-1 would be the way to go. But by looking at the pitch map, it turned into a 4-1-5. The width component is a not shown here as both Sanchez and Rashford changed wings a few times. 

about 8 years ago

20 Legend wrote:

Pretty much what was expected after the first leg.

Bonkers decision making by Mourinho. Firstly, starting Fellaini. Then, Mata has been the key to our attacks for weeks but we'll leave him on the bench along with Martial. Sanchez hasn't done shark but he is unsubbable and gets another 90 minutes.

The most frustrating thing is that the culture of the club means the players and the fans aren't engaged by grinding out a 1-0 win against Sevilla at home. The only thing we achieved by trying was letting Sevilla play their way into the game. Yet we consistently try over and over again.

To top this off, Mourinho had the whole first half to acknowledge this but he failed to do just that.

I wouldn't complain if he was gone in the morning.

Congratulations to Sevilla.

Yep, pretty much agree with this. Over the two games Sevilla were the better team so congratulations to them.

Te first leg showed that Sevilla were goingto get chances at OT meaning we'd likely have to score at least 2, which never looked like happening.To try &nullify the opposition when it only takes 1 chance to be taken,which then changes the dynamics of the tie considerably in a "knockout" game is inviting trouble. 

This was our most important game of the season in terms of trying to salvage some success this year but it certainly didnt feel or look like it. I felt an air of inevitability & resignation to the fact that, yep, they've scored(as expected) now what..

about 8 years ago

20 Legend wrote:

Pretty much what was expected after the first leg.

Bonkers decision making by Mourinho. Firstly, starting Fellaini. Then, Mata has been the key to our attacks for weeks but we'll leave him on the bench along with Martial. Sanchez hasn't done shark but he is unsubbable and gets another 90 minutes.

The most frustrating thing is that the culture of the club means the players and the fans aren't engaged by grinding out a 1-0 win against Sevilla at home. The only thing we achieved by trying was letting Sevilla play their way into the game. Yet we consistently try over and over again.

To top this off, Mourinho had the whole first half to acknowledge this but he failed to do just that.

I wouldn't complain if he was gone in the morning.

Congratulations to Sevilla.

Yep, pretty much agree with this. Over the two games Sevilla were the better team so congratulations to them.

Te first leg showed that Sevilla were goingto get chances at OT meaning we'd likely have to score at least 2, which never looked like happening.To try &nullify the opposition when it only takes 1 chance to be taken,which then changes the dynamics of the tie considerably in a "knockout" game is inviting trouble. 

This was our most important game of the season in terms of trying to salvage some success this year but it certainly didnt feel or look like it. I felt an air of inevitability & resignation to the fact that, yep, they've scored(as expected) now what..

Still in the FA Cup which is more than can be said for some other ' top ' clubs. 

There will be a few players gone at the end of the season.

If you are old and wise you were probably young and stupid

about 8 years ago

I'm really struggling to blame players Leggy. They're all playing with shackles on. And any manager than still insists on playing Fellaini in any game where we should be controlling the game is down right daft.

about 8 years ago

Tekkers wrote:

brumbys wrote:

whatever wrote:

The post match analysis was interesting, it showed that Fellaini spent the game either passing sideways ot backwards.  

Doesn't he play at the bottom of the midfield? Thus a normal position to find yourself in?

Not when he plays further up the field than both Lingard and Sanchez (he is the number 27). 

Not sure why Jose thought the 4-1-4-1 would be the way to go. But by looking at the pitch map, it turned into a 4-1-5. The width component is a not shown here as both Sanchez and Rashford changed wings a few times. 

Ah I see, Matic is in that role. Yeah I'm unsure why you'd have him that high.

about 8 years ago

Fellaini played as a 10 at Everton and was most successful in that role for them. He hasn't done shark in that role for United so I have no clue why Jose did that in the biggest game of the season to date.

Valley FC til I die?

about 8 years ago

20 Legend wrote:

I'm really struggling to blame players Leggy. They're all playing with shackles on. And any manager than still insists on playing Fellaini in any game where we should be controlling the game is down right daft.

I think there have been more poot performances which have been down to the players than bad ones due to Jose. Obviously its never only one or the other, but even last nights performance, you could not say that the players executed the tactics employed by the manager. If they had, while it would still have looked bad, we would have won. 

I still agree that playing Fellaini was not a good call, but he is only a player in a team, that should have done better collectively. 

about 8 years ago

“The general opinion of this team that was once respectable and no longer is has plummeted. It’s an unattractive, fearful team, rich in resources but lamentable in its play,” he added. “Mourinho is starting to look like a washed-up rock star, one of those guys that goes around holiday hotels for pensioners playing old hits on an organ with the base and the percussion playing on a tape recorder.”

Brutal.

about 8 years ago · edited about 8 years ago · History

Amazing how quick the knee jerks after completely bossing Liverpool 3 days earlier.

I think Rio said it best - Top teams don't pick and choose when they turn up. If we turn up we are capable of beating almost anyone, but we have to find a way to get that consistency and maintain it. I don't see Jose leaving any time soon nor do I want him to (because we're streets ahead of where we were under Moyes and LVG and I don't think many managers would do any better) - it is up to the players to step up because the level of intensity vs Sevilla was nowhere near what was required and Jose can't really be blamed for that. 

He can be blamed for bizarre selections - Fellaini has been injured and then suddenly starts the biggest game of the season - how is he going to be match fit? Why is Chris Smalling starting over Lindelof? What makes Sanchez undroppable?

Questions to be asked of everyone but its not panic stations yet - gotta get 2nd in the league now though.

Valley FC til I die?

about 8 years ago · edited about 8 years ago · History

Nelfoos wrote:

Amazing how quick the knee jerks after completely bossing Liverpool 3 days earlier.

32% possession and a third of the shots your opponent had is hardly a bossing to be fair. 
Mourinho's usual big game set-up worked for once, is how I would put it. 

The negativity of it means he's very open to criticism when it doesn't work, because it looks so bad. 

What did you guys make of his after-match comments? Seemed a very bizarre way to deal with it. 

about 8 years ago · edited about 8 years ago · History

paulm wrote:

Nelfoos wrote:

Amazing how quick the knee jerks after completely bossing Liverpool 3 days earlier.

32% possession and a third of the shots your opponent had is hardly a bossing to be fair. 
Mourinho's usual big game set-up worked for once, is how I would put it. 

The negativity of it means he's very open to criticism when it doesn't work, because it looks so bad. 

What did you guys make of his after-match comments? Seemed a very bizarre way to deal with it. 

Liverpool had to play one of their worst games of the year to lose 2 - 1 away from home due to two defensive errors from a teenager and Dejan "awareness of a cardboard cutout" Lovren.

You won, fair play - did what you needed to, have the bragging rights...but "bossing?"

Not sure what game you were watching

edit: Rashford was very good though, his touch and finish for the first goal was brilliant

"...sure beats doin' stuff."

about 8 years ago · edited about 8 years ago · History

Nelfoos wrote:

Amazing how quick the knee jerks after completely bossing Liverpool 3 days earlier.

I think Rio said it best - Top teams don't pick and choose when they turn up. If we turn up we are capable of beating almost anyone, but we have to find a way to get that consistency and maintain it. I don't see Jose leaving any time soon nor do I want him to (because we're streets ahead of where we were under Moyes and LVG and I don't think many managers would do any better) - it is up to the players to step up because the level of intensity vs Sevilla was nowhere near what was required and Jose can't really be blamed for that. 

He can be blamed for bizarre selections - Fellaini has been injured and then suddenly starts the biggest game of the season - how is he going to be match fit? Why is Chris Smalling starting over Lindelof? What makes Sanchez undroppable?

Questions to be asked of everyone but its not panic stations yet - gotta get 2nd in the league now though.

Bossing Liverpool was being pragmatic and purposely playing to Liverpool's (Klopp's) weakness. They got completely found out and had no shots on target, well done. Sitting back against Sevilla is not being pragmatic. It's being stupid. Starting Fellaini (and others selections) is not being pragmatic. It's being stupid.

But most importantly, failing to identify this over two leagues is being completely fudgeing daft! It was pretty clear where this game was going at half time.

about 8 years ago · edited about 8 years ago · History

paulm wrote:

Nelfoos wrote:

Amazing how quick the knee jerks after completely bossing Liverpool 3 days earlier.

What did you guys make of his after-match comments? Seemed a very bizarre way to deal with it. 

That he thinks Mourinho is bigger than United... to be fair he's always had this whole "take the conversation off the players thing"... probably what he's doing here too.

about 8 years ago · edited about 8 years ago · History

The thing I love is that when we are not doing the business other supporters are very quick to take the mick or mock.

Most of those would love to be in 2nd place and still in the Cup.

As already mentioned I would rather have JM than Louis or David. There is still some tinkering to do and players to sell. We are still short of 3 quality players and will need them if we are to compete with City next year. As I mentioned 3 games in, that they were miles ahead of any other teams, and they are.

If you are old and wise you were probably young and stupid

about 8 years ago

20 Legend wrote:

paulm wrote:

Nelfoos wrote:

Amazing how quick the knee jerks after completely bossing Liverpool 3 days earlier.

What did you guys make of his after-match comments? Seemed a very bizarre way to deal with it. 

That he thinks Mourinho is bigger than United... to be fair he's always had this whole "take the conversation off the players thing"... probably what he's doing here too.

I would disagree. Throughout his career he's had absolutely no problem throwing his players under the bus when it suits him (excuse the pun!). 

That's why I always wonder when he makes comments like that, what is the motivation? He's very calculated with these things. 

about 8 years ago

LeighboNZ wrote:

paulm wrote:

Nelfoos wrote:

Amazing how quick the knee jerks after completely bossing Liverpool 3 days earlier.

32% possession and a third of the shots your opponent had is hardly a bossing to be fair. 
Mourinho's usual big game set-up worked for once, is how I would put it. 

The negativity of it means he's very open to criticism when it doesn't work, because it looks so bad. 

What did you guys make of his after-match comments? Seemed a very bizarre way to deal with it. 

Liverpool had to play one of their worst games of the year to lose 2 - 1 away from home due to two defensive errors from a teenager and Dejan "awareness of a cardboard cutout" Lovren.

You won, fair play - did what you needed to, have the bragging rights...but "bossing?"

Not sure what game you were watching

edit: Rashford was very good though, his touch and finish for the first goal was brilliant

Liverpool played poorly because United did a great job of shutting down Liverpool's threats. There was only one team in the game and I think "bossing" is the perfect word.

Valley FC til I die?

about 8 years ago

To me, "bossing" means dominating possession and creating far more chances than your opposition.

Each to their own I guess!

about 8 years ago · edited about 8 years ago · History

paulm wrote:

To me, "bossing" means dominating possession and creating far more chances than your opposition.

Each to their own I guess!

To me, "bossing" means being far and away the better team and executing the gameplan to perfection, completely nullifying any threat they may have posed.

Each to their own I guess!

Valley FC til I die?

about 8 years ago

Nelfoos wrote:

paulm wrote:

To me, "bossing" means dominating possession and creating far more chances than your opposition.

Each to their own I guess!

To me, "bossing" means being far and away the better team and executing the gameplan to perfection, completely nullifying any threat they may have posed.

Each to their own I guess!

Far and away the better team? Game plan to perfection?

So the game plan was baff a long ball and hope someone runs onto it?

Fair play if that's the game plan but not sure any team that plays that way should be deemed to be "bossing" the opposition. Sounds more like playing negatively and dragging the opposition down to your level...incoming hate in 3...2...1...

"...sure beats doin' stuff."

about 8 years ago

Nelfoos wrote:

paulm wrote:

To me, "bossing" means dominating possession and creating far more chances than your opposition.

Each to their own I guess!

To me, "bossing" means being far and away the better team and executing the gameplan to perfection, completely nullifying any threat they may have posed.

Each to their own I guess!

I would disagree that that is what happened, but yes each to their own, enjoy the many 32% possession "bossings" that Mourinho delivers, if that's your thing. 

about 8 years ago · edited about 8 years ago · History

paulm wrote:

Nelfoos wrote:

paulm wrote:

To me, "bossing" means dominating possession and creating far more chances than your opposition.

Each to their own I guess!

To me, "bossing" means being far and away the better team and executing the gameplan to perfection, completely nullifying any threat they may have posed.

Each to their own I guess!

I would disagree that that is what happened, but yes each to their own, enjoy the many 32% possession "bossings" that Mourinho delivers, if that's your thing. 

Its far better than the 70% posession "bossing" we did under LVG

Valley FC til I die?