Marquee
380
·
9.6K
·
over 14 years
Really entertaining game to watch. United's team wasn't exactly second string either...
tradition and history
1.3K
·
9.8K
·
about 14 years
Arsenal wrote:
Really entertaining game to watch. United's team wasn't exactly second string either...


Who said they were?
Marquee
380
·
9.6K
·
over 14 years
Leggy wrote:
Arsenal wrote:
Really entertaining game to watch. United's team wasn't exactly second string either...


Who said they were?


No one that I know of? Bit tender there?
tradition and history
1.3K
·
9.8K
·
about 14 years
Arsenal wrote:
Leggy wrote:
Arsenal wrote:
Really entertaining game to watch. United's team wasn't exactly second string either...


Who said they were?


No one that I know of? Bit tender there?


Not at all. The difference between Arsenal supporters and Utd ones is that we don't keep making excuses when we lose.
WeeNix
39
·
670
·
over 11 years
Marquee
1.2K
·
5.5K
·
over 10 years
Very quiet over on the City thread    Stretford End2012-03-12 11:11:51
tradition and history
1.3K
·
9.8K
·
about 14 years
Have not seen the game so can't really make too many comments.Great results all round, but still a long way to go.Have not changed my mind, still reckon City for the league.
Woof Woof
2.7K
·
19K
·
about 14 years
United have a much easier schedule for the rest of the season than City, plus Fergie > Mancini. Think United will take it, although this is probably one of the weakest United sides in recent years.
Marquee
1.2K
·
5.5K
·
over 10 years
Glimpse of future Man Utd midfield back from injury and due for more game time in next few weeks? Cleverly, Anderson, Pogba (staying maybe?) with Carrick & Scholes as steadying influence. Midfield without Giggs really does work better; but what a bench player to bring on when needed!

Add Young, Nani, Valencia out wide and Welbeck, Hernandez, Rooney as strikeforce.
Also, Evans has impressed me lately and Evra & Rio are in good form.

Early days (and injuries can happen anytime) but I'm starting to taste 20.

tradition and history
1.3K
·
9.8K
·
about 14 years
Glimpse of future Man Utd midfield back from injury and due for more game time in next few weeks? Cleverly, Anderson, Pogba (staying maybe?) with Carrick & Scholes as steadying influence. Midfield without Giggs really does work better; but what a bench player to bring on when needed!

Add Young, Nani, Valencia out wide and Welbeck, Hernandez, Rooney as strikeforce.
Also, Evans has impressed me lately and Evra & Rio are in good form.

Early days (and injuries can happen anytime) but I'm starting to taste 20.


I hope you are right, just don't want to get my expectations up just yet.
First Team Squad
0
·
1.4K
·
almost 12 years
el grapadura wrote:
United have a much easier schedule for the rest of the season than City, plus Fergie > Mancini. Think United will take it, although this is probably one of the weakest United sides in recent years.
 
Mostly agreed, though I'm not sure that there's a lot between the managers.  SAF has a stronger relationship with his squad, but Mancini is a better tactician.  If the Italian is allowed to (and is happy to!) settle in Manchester, his quality will show through.
First Team Squad
0
·
1.9K
·
over 13 years
Stripes wrote:
el grapadura wrote:
United have a much easier schedule for the rest of the season than City, plus Fergie > Mancini. Think United will take it, although this is probably one of the weakest United sides in recent years.
 
Mostly agreed, though I'm not sure that there's a lot between the managers.  SAF has a stronger relationship with his squad, but Mancini is a better tactician.  If the Italian is allowed to (and is happy to!) settle in Manchester, his quality will show through.
 
Interesting you say he is a better tactician. This is an interesting piece of analysis I found:
 
First Team Squad
0
·
1.4K
·
almost 12 years
Paulinho wrote:
Stripes wrote:
SAF has a stronger relationship with his squad, but Mancini is a better tactician.  If the Italian is allowed to (and is happy to!) settle in Manchester, his quality will show through.
 
Interesting you say he is a better tactician. This is an interesting piece of analysis I found:
 
 
Not sure what the writer is trying to say.  Is he concerned that Mancini's plan is correct far more often than not?  In terms of the Italian's flexibility, consider Cox's piece on Mancini's tactics in the 2-3
 
This doesn't commit me to saying that Ferguson is tactically unsound (anyone who thinks that is, er, "eccentric" ).  I think his main strength is in managing and motivating his squad.  It's not particularly common to see United's substitions result in a drastic reshape, but the players coming on are almost always up for it.
 
Recall, for instance, the 3-0 at St. James' Park, with Cabaye and Tiote fighting more than playing against Giggs and Carrick, and Krul dropping long kicks into a defence being unsettled by... Shola Ameobi (!).  Ferguson didn't seem to contemplate putting more energy into the midfield, either by dropping Rooney deeper or bringing Anderson on earlier.  To the extent that there were changes, they played into Newcastle's hands: bringing off Berbatov at 2-0 allowed the Toon to safely sit deeper just as they were tiring, which practically nulified the impact of Hernandez.  No shortage of fight or quality from the Red Devils, but Pardew's tactics were not only superior - they were unanswered.
Stripes2012-03-12 18:09:37
Woof Woof
2.7K
·
19K
·
about 14 years
Stripes wrote:
el grapadura wrote:
United have a much easier schedule for the rest of the season than City, plus Fergie > Mancini. Think United will take it, although this is probably one of the weakest United sides in recent years.

�

Mostly agreed, though I'm not sure that there's a lot between the managers.� SAF has a stronger relationship with his squad, but Mancini is a better tactician.� If the Italian is allowed to (and is happy to!) settle in Manchester, his quality will show through.


I don't really rate Mancini as a manager - he seriously underachieved with Inter, and don't think he's done all that well with City either. His record in Europe is particularly bad for someone aspiring to be an upper-tier club manager.

Whether he's a better tactician than Ferguson - well, maybe he is, as that certainly isn't a strong side for Ferguson, but think his other qualities as a manager put him at a much higher level than Mancini.
tradition and history
1.3K
·
9.8K
·
about 14 years
el grapadura wrote:
Stripes wrote:
el grapadura wrote:
United have a much easier schedule for the rest of the season than City, plus Fergie > Mancini. Think United will take it, although this is probably one of the weakest United sides in recent years.

�

Mostly agreed, though I'm not sure that there's a lot between the managers.� SAF has a stronger relationship with his squad, but Mancini is a better tactician.� If the Italian is allowed to (and is happy to!) settle in Manchester, his quality will show through.


I don't really rate Mancini as a manager - he seriously underachieved with Inter, and don't think he's done all that well with City either. His record in Europe is particularly bad for someone aspiring to be an upper-tier club manager.

Whether he's a better tactician than Ferguson - well, maybe he is, as that certainly isn't a strong side for Ferguson, but think his other qualities as a manager put him at a much higher level than Mancini.


Perhaps AF is just a tougher bloke.(a bit of a bully maybe) and takes no crap from anyone.Throws boots at Beckham and biffs out some of the best players Utd have ever had.
If AF had told Tevez that he would never play for the club again, he would have meant it, unlike Mancani who caved in.
Marquee
1.2K
·
5.5K
·
over 10 years
Hmm, team mangers wear a number of hats: man management; tactical nous/timing; buying & selling nous; media relations; fan & board/shareholder relations to name but a few. On man mgt front SAF has no peer after 3+ decades.

We've had our own episodes of madness with Rooney & Giggs in the last 12 months but they are still contributing on the park (as is the formerly retired P Scholes). SAF has played a role in all 3 no doubt. And now we'll judge Mancini on whether or not he can get his costly talent to perform when it matters - the BEOTS (business end of the season). I think Mancini has handled Baolotelli as well as anyone could. Whilst I personally think Tevez should have been sold in January I still fear Tevez may yet play a role this season. Much as City fans would hate it/love it, if Tevez does play a role in a City premiership - would Mancini be judged as brilliant? or weak?

Tactically, well we'll see.

But you know what's better than speculating on Mancini & City's fate? Knowing that now, finally, the premiership is in our own hands again. If we are good enough, City CAN'T overhaul us. Isn't that a great feeling!?

Phoenix Academy
0
·
210
·
almost 14 years
Think its a bit patronising to say Ferguson is no tactician. There seems to be the idea that you need to be a stylish continental to be a tactician rather than a scotsman from the shipyards!!
 
You dont get his level of success without out thinking opponents tactically - his wins over Arsenal especially have been credited to this, especially Uniteds domination of the midfield in those games.
Marquee
1.2K
·
5.5K
·
over 10 years
Seems we might be seriously looking at Lille's Eden Hazard. There are a few good people who rate him. Anyone seen him play much?
Marquee
1.2K
·
5.5K
·
over 10 years
Return leg v Bilbao. Let's hope we score first and keep it alive.
Marquee
1.2K
·
5.5K
·
over 10 years
OUT. Out played, outclassed, out of Europe Div 2.

Humbled over 2 legs by a side that is 7th in La Liga AND only picks local players.

Sitting 1st in EPL is masking just how far off the pace we are. Old and not so old legs & brains are looking like they are playing yesterday's football. Look what Bielsa has done with Argentina (Olympics), Chile and now Bilbao - young, fast, technical.

If we are to seriously be competitive in Europe over the next couple of seasons we need to be planning for regime change - now. Chelsea went down a similar route but put in place a manager who was too inexperienced for the age of his team. With a much younger average team age, AVB would have done ok.

By June the following players need to be thanked for their services and moved on: Giggs, Scholes, Park, Ferdinand, Berbatov, Carrick, Fletcher, Owen.

The regime change can only be planned by a new manager who has the vision of tomorrow's game and the ability to implement it. So SAF has to go too. As fans we also must buy into a regime change plan that might take a season or two to develop; but continue to back the plan.

United in it's current guise has about 10 games left.

The time to change is upon us. Winning the EPL should not obscure the fact that we are way off the pace of modern football.
tradition and history
1.3K
·
9.8K
·
about 14 years
OUT. Out played, outclassed, out of Europe Div 2.

Humbled over 2 legs by a side that is 7th in La Liga AND only picks local players.

Sitting 1st in EPL is masking just how far off the pace we are. Old and not so old legs & brains are looking like they are playing yesterday's football. Look what Bielsa has done with Argentina (Olympics), Chile and now Bilbao - young, fast, technical.

If we are to seriously be competitive in Europe over the next couple of seasons we need to be planning for regime change - now. Chelsea went down a similar route but put in place a manager who was too inexperienced for the age of his team. With a much younger average team age, AVB would have done ok.

By June the following players need to be thanked for their services and moved on: Giggs, Scholes, Park, Ferdinand, Berbatov, Carrick, Fletcher, Owen.

The regime change can only be planned by a new manager who has the vision of tomorrow's game and the ability to implement it. So SAF has to go too. As fans we also must buy into a regime change plan that might take a season or two to develop; but continue to back the plan.

United in it's current guise has about 10 games left.

The time to change is upon us. Winning the EPL should not obscure the fact that we are way off the pace of modern football.


I agree with some of what you mentioned.
Marquee
380
·
9.6K
·
over 14 years
WeeNix
0
·
670
·
over 10 years
tradition and history
1.3K
·
9.8K
·
about 14 years
Mycatiscold wrote:
Mycatiscold wrote:
Manchester United in Europe = sh*t


27 years for you guys.
Phoenix Academy
0
·
210
·
almost 14 years
Wow.... losing In Europe and its sack fergie time again????
 
Welcome back the plastic fans!
Phoenix Academy
20
·
500
·
about 14 years
Edit: Drunken rant steelo2012-03-18 11:22:06
WeeNix
0
·
670
·
over 10 years
steelo wrote:
Blame Fergie for being sh*t in Europe? Where would we be without him? Winning Champions league? Doubt it. Dicks
I don't even support Manchester United, and not once has anyone in the last two pages blamed Fergie for an unsuccessful Europe campaign.
Marquee
1.2K
·
5.5K
·
over 10 years
Reading, can you read?! I'm merely suggesting some succession planning is required to stay competitive in Europe because clearly we are off the pace. Read the post again. If you've got something constructive to contribute to the debate, go right ahead. If not, move along please.
Phoenix Academy
0
·
210
·
almost 14 years
Yes I can read thank you...and you want change that can only be implemented by a new regime? Which is bollocks to be honest as how many great sides has Fergie built? It might have missed you, but arent they already in transition?
 
Smalling, Cleverley, Wellbeck, Jones, De Gea, Hernandez have all come on over the last 18 months while Pogba, Cole and Fryers are waiting in the wings. Add to that any new signings....
 
 
Marquee
5.3K
·
9.5K
·
almost 10 years
How many times have people said Man Utd are in decline only for SAF to win another bunch of trophies? I'm not a MU fan but you have to admire Fergie's ability to constantly refresh his squad and get the best out of players. Sure getting knocked out of Europe this year was unexpected but you are still talking about a team which is top of one of the toughest leagues in the world and has an easier run in than the only team which can challenge them at this point. Not to mention that last season they won the EPL and were runners up in the CL at the hands of Barca who put on one of the greatest team performances I have ever seen on a football pitch.

MU have been so successful for so long that the slightest dip in form has everyone talking about their coming demise but frankly as long as SAF is there I can't see it happening. Once he goes and a new manager has to come in and deal with a club so built around one man's vision, and the Glazer's bullsh*t, then I think MU will decline as a force in football, at least temporarily. Not before though.
Marquee
1.2K
·
5.5K
·
over 10 years
Seriously, where does the EPL sit in the league of leagues at the moment?
Marquee
5.3K
·
9.5K
·
almost 10 years
According to UEFA coefficients, still number 1. Even though this year hasn't been great for English teams in Europe I think it would be premature to read anything into it. After all Spain is the only nation with more teams than England in the CL quarters!

Man Utd have been in 2 of the last 3 CL finals - not exactly an indication of poor league quality. Milan are leading Serie A and they only just beat Arsenal on aggregate to get through to the quarter finals. And financial fairplay will continue to keep England strong because of the massive TV revenue. Personally I would say the EPL is still best in the world for overall quality of players and clubs but there isn't much between the top 4 really. In fact, the rise of super-rich Russian clubs, and the performances of teams like Shaktar Donetsk and APOEL in the CL, all point to a narrowing of the gap between the best leagues in Europe and their smaller cousins, which may have the effect of making the top leagues look they are in decline.
Marquee
900
·
5.1K
·
almost 14 years
According to UEFA coefficients, still number 1. Even though this year hasn't been great for English teams in Europe I think it would be premature to read anything into it. After all Spain is the only nation with more teams than England in the CL quarters!Man Utd have been in 2 of the last 3 CL finals - not exactly an indication of poor league quality. Milan are leading Serie A and they only just beat Arsenal on aggregate to get through to the quarter finals. And financial fairplay will continue to keep England strong because of the massive TV revenue. Personally I would say the EPL is still best in the world for overall quality of players and clubs but there isn't much between the top 4 really. In fact, the rise of super-rich Russian clubs, and the performances of teams like Shaktar Donetsk and APOEL in the CL, all point to a narrowing of the gap between the best leagues in Europe and their smaller cousins, which may have the effect of making the top leagues look they are in decline.

I actually think that the quality of teams in England, especially the top tier teams, are not as strong as a few seasons ago. Man Utd, Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool are all weaker than a few seasons ago. Only 1 team from England has made the quarter finals (and just in Chelsea's case) in Europe. Spain have 5 of their 7 teams in the quarters of Europe and I would imagine La Liga over taking the EPL soon.Bullion2012-03-20 14:50:27
Marquee
1.2K
·
5.5K
·
over 10 years
Opportunity for a 3 point lead with a home win against Fulham tomorrow morning. 9 games and counting. Every game a banana skin; especially against those fighting relegation. Everything crossed. SBT (squeaky...)
First Team Squad
0
·
1.4K
·
almost 12 years
Bullion wrote:
According to UEFA coefficients, still number 1. Even though this year hasn't been great for English teams in Europe I think it would be premature to read anything into it. After all Spain is the only nation with more teams than England in the CL quarters!

I actually think that the quality of teams in England, especially the top tier teams, are not as strong as a few seasons ago. Man Utd, Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool are all weaker than a few seasons ago. Only 1 team from England has made the quarter finals (and just in Chelsea's case) in Europe. Spain have 5 of their 7 teams in the quarters of Europe and I would imagine La Liga over taking the EPL soon.


Running the rule over the UEFA coefficients for the last 3 seasons (by going to this page) puts La Liga ahead. That isn't the sole responsibility of its giants (though Barca & Real are top of the table). Atleti, Valencia and Villareal all score higher than Liverpool over this period. The only significant trend in European football at the moment is the long-term decline of Italy since 2000, when Serie A was ranked the best League in the world.
tradition and history
1.3K
·
9.8K
·
about 14 years
Not the best of games but 3 points. Had so much possession but still did not look like we were going to overrun them.
Of course the smart comments will be about the penalty that Fulham should have had, but the same people conveniently forget that Utd could have had one awarded in the first half.
Marquee
1.2K
·
5.5K
·
over 10 years
We should have put the game to bed properly!Stretford End2012-03-27 12:08:47
Marquee
1.2K
·
5.5K
·
over 10 years
Thought Evans played best game I've seen from him. And pleasing to see De Gea commit to and get a good fist on a couple of punches under the high ball.
Blackburn away next up. How badly do they need points?
tradition and history
1.3K
·
9.8K
·
about 14 years
Thought Evans played best game I've seen from him. And pleasing to see De Gea commit to and get a good fist on a couple of punches under the high ball.
Blackburn away next up. How badly do they need points?


I agree about Evans. Some weeks/months ago I was worried about him but yesterday he was very good. His reckless challenges are still a bit of a concern.
Marquee
810
·
7.3K
·
over 14 years
Man Utd fans already selling/wearing shirts announcing them as champions
 
 
What really annoys me about this is not that there is such a long way to go, but the fact that "Champ20ns" doesn't even make any f**king sense.  What happens if they win again next year?  "Cham21ons"?  "W21nners"?  f**king idiots.

You’ll need an account to join the conversation!

Sign in Sign up