General Football Discussion

England Fans' Thread

448 replies · 53,056 views
almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
tigers wrote:
be interesting to see who the fringe players are in that first cut of 30

not sure about carragher's pace/mobility in the few times i've seen him play this season- but i do think his attitude would be good for the squad


One can never question Carragher's commitment but I would not pick him.

If you are old and wise you were probably young and stupid

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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
to be honest I'm inclined to agree - he's lost that first yard and along with that the extra inch or two in his jump
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
i really hope they pick joe cole, i think he can offer a lot to the team Downey262010-05-11 09:12:27
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
The idea of Carragher makes me shudder quite frankly.

Cole looks on the outer.
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
yea carragher would be a dreadful decision. and im not liking this talk about hargreaves 
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
What's the 'keeper situation like? Seems like a muddle of mediocrity and inexperience.
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
HarryHotspur wrote:
The idea of Carragher makes me shudder quite frankly.

Cole looks on the outer.


re Joe Cole - that seems a shame given his touch and creativity, did he lose a bit of pace following his last injury??
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
never thought J.Cole was that quick before:seemed to beat people through touch and ball skill rather than any pace.I think his problem is that like many other players after a major injury,it takes time to hit your straps.Sad really,as he is genuinely gifted(offers the x factor that Lamps and Gerrard,for all their qualities,don't possess).I'd still pick him in the 30 and assess him over the next month.Hargreaves is different though:a big,big call picking a player who hasn't featured for 18 months(kind of like Mulligan...lol).I reckon he should put his faith in Carrick and either Huddlestone/Parker.
"Always remember lads,one Evertonian is worth 20 Liverpudlians"...Brian Labone
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
from gings post

>>

England's 30-man provisional squad for the World Cup finals:

Keepers: Joe Hart (Manchester City), David James (Portsmouth), Robert Green (West Ham).

Defenders: Leighton Baines (Everton), Jamie Carragher (7th place 7th place Liverpool), Ashley Cole (Chelsea), Michael Dawson (Tottenham), Rio Ferdinand (Manchester United), Glen Johnson (7th place 7th place Liverpool), Ledley King (Tottenham), John Terry (Chelsea), Matthew Upson (West Ham), Stephen Warnock (Aston Villa).

Midfielders: Gareth Barry (Manchester City), Michael Carrick (Manchester United), Joe Cole (Chelsea), Steven Gerrard (England), Tom Huddlestone (Tottenham), Adam Johnson (Manchester City), Frank Lampard (Chelsea), Aaron Lennon (Tottenham), James Milner (Aston Villa), Scott Parker (West Ham), Theo Walcott (Arsenal), Shaun Wright-Phillips (Manchester City).

Strikers: Darren Bent (Sunderland), Peter Crouch (Tottenham), Jermain Defoe (Tottenham), Emile Heskey (Aston Villa), Wayne Rooney (Manchester United).


Read more: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/2968448/England-name-World-Cup-squad.html#ixzz0nd8TJFvo <<

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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
very happy joe cole made it. whilst it was taking him some time to get back to form following his injury i believe hes getting close to that form. definaltly worthy of a spot imo
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Capello's approach to picking the final 23 is to name two players for each position, assuming a 442, and a 3rd keeper. He reiterated that in FourFourTwo last month, noting that he likes to position players into that approach with reference to their primary position - but he was a little coy about "utility" players and compromises he might make.
 
Applying that logic, who's the second right back in the squad? Baines, Cole and Warnock are left backs. Carragher, Dawson, Ferdinand, King, Terry and Upson are centre backs. Carragher offers the option of playing at full back, so he's in to back up Johnson at right back.
 
At left back, Cole is recovered from his injury isn't he? So one of Warnock or Baines will be dropped..
 
At centre back, assuming Carragher is in as a RB, King may be dropped because of injury. Otherwise, I imagine Dawson is left behind unless he wants to retain the option of pairing King/Dawson. I can't really see that pairing being used at the Finals unless there are more injuries.
 
For midfield in general, there are some clear central mids and right mids, but several players can move to the flanks or switch between flanks. However, in overall terms Capello has to drop four midfielders.
 
For the left, Joe Cole can play there and Walcott seems to be able to switch, so I reckon they're in. For the right, Lennon should be in and I think one of Adam Johnson and Shaun Wright-Phillips will be dropped. Barry is unlikely to be recovered, so I reckon he's dropped. In the centre, Gerrard are Lampard are dead certs to stay, plus Carrick and Milner I think, though Milner's ability to cover right might be useful.I believe Huddlestone can play defence as well as midfield and he's done well this season, so perhaps he gets in? However, I think we'll see Parker and Huddlestone as the other mids dropped.  
 
Finally, one of the strikers would be dropped - Bent I reckon. Unless Rooney doesn't recover, in which we're screwed anyway.
 
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
yep ashley is back from his injury and already back in good form. played 3 games (7-0, 2-0, 8-0).

agree with pretty much all youve said, would like to see milner go, very handy and versitile player. can either warnock or baines play at rb? is lennon fit

and yea rooney betta be ready
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
As always SinZ, you string together a good footballing argument.

Th upshot of all of this: is that really a WC team capabale of getting beyond the QF?
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
HarryHotspur wrote:
Th upshot of all of this: is that really a WC team capabale of getting beyond the QF?


Nope.

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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Arsenal wrote:
HarryHotspur wrote:
Th upshot of all of this: is that really a WC team capabale of getting beyond the QF? [/QUOTE]

Nope.
 
Wrong thread Arsenal.
 
[QUOTE=tigers]as SiNZ suggested for some countries it might be a good to have a 'designated' fans of that country topic
......
 
But I will start this one for England
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Downey26 wrote:
yep ashley is back from his injury and already back in good form. played 3 games (7-0, 2-0, 8-0).

agree with pretty much all youve said, would like to see milner go, very handy and versitile player. can either warnock or baines play at rb? is lennon fit

and yea rooney betta be ready
 
I'm not aware of Warnock and Baines ever playing on the right. Good call on Lennon. I'd forgotten he was yet another on the injury list. This season has been very disheartening for that... perhaps Capello should do a Hiddink at South Korea and get his preferred squad extracted from domestic duties from a certain date in the season!
 
No Lennon, would presumably put both Johnson and Wright-Phillips in. Unless Milner is seen as cover for the right, which taken in conjunction with both Joe Cole and Walcott both already in the squad to cover the left anyway, must be a safe bet. Perhaps you stick with just one of Johnson and Wright-Phillips so Huddlestone can be included?
 
Have to say Harry, loving the Tottenham effect this season. English manager, more young English players... good to see a stronger English presence in the top four!
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
HarryHotspur wrote:
As always SinZ, you string together a good footballing argument.

Th upshot of all of this: is that really a WC team capabale of getting beyond the QF?
 
Capable? There's probably 8 to 10 teams capable of getting beyond the QF and we're one. Not one of those teams is a definite, though some are obviously seen as safer bets than others and all will need a little bit of luck.
 
We've got to select 23 players for the squad first... one step at a time!
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
SiNZ wrote:
Arsenal wrote:
HarryHotspur wrote:
Th upshot of all of this: is that really a WC team capabale of getting beyond the QF? [/QUOTE] Nope.

�

Wrong thread Arsenal.

�

[QUOTE=tigers]as SiNZ suggested for some countries it might be a good to have a 'designated' fans of that country topic
......

�

But I will start this one for England


Looks like I took a wrong turn, this must be the thread where every four years English fans pat each other on the back and state how great their team is until getting brutally exposed by a team that is actually good and being unceremoniously dumped out of the World Cup. Again. My bad. Arsenal2010-05-12 12:51:53

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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Don't be a twat. No-one is doing that. And even if they were, the other thread is for trolls.
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Sinz do you think personally Bent should be dropped or that Capello will drop him?

This is definatly a squad that could win, especially with Capello as manager.
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I think it's between Heskey and Bent. Obviously.

On balance I would take Heskey. For the simple reason that it's Rooney's preference. Rooney is our single most important player, so having him perform is paramount.
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
yeah Bent has it all to do I reckon:Why would Capello drop the centre forward who played his part in an impressive qualifying campaign?I'm pleasd Cole is in,but he's still a fifty fifty:barring injuries,Lennon,Walcott,Milner,Lamps,Gerrard and two holding players(Carrick and Barry if fit;if not,either Parker or Huddlestone)will be picked.That probably leaves one midfield place left,and a straight choice between Cole and Johnson.Cole has the "history",but Johnson is really fizzing at present,and could be a relatively unknown "secret weapon".The training camp will be pretty intense I think(as it should be)...
"Always remember lads,one Evertonian is worth 20 Liverpudlians"...Brian Labone
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
SiNZ wrote:
I think it's between Heskey and Bent. Obviously.

On balance I would take Heskey. For the simple reason that it's Rooney's preference. Rooney is our single most important player, so having him perform is paramount.

Rooney did lead the line for Man Utd in a lot of games and most big games. If Capello can find the correct midfield combination this could be an option.

                         Rooney
Johnson                                Lennon
              Milner               Lampard
                     Carrick/Barry (if fit)
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
from memory there is a big statistical difference with England's goals per game ratio with Heskey on the pitch - he doesn't score many himself but he brings the other forwards into the game highly effectively
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
tigers wrote:
from memory there is a big statistical difference with England's goals per game ratio with Heskey on the pitch - he doesn't score many himself but he brings the other forwards into the game highly effectively

Yeah, I have heard that. Just that Rooney has had a season were he has operated as lone striker and been very successful this season. I am sure that in one of the warm up games Capello will give this a run.
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I agree that Heskey does bring the other forwards into the play(especially Rooney), but the season Bent has had he needs to go. If we played sh*t and heskey was useless we would all be saying why didnt we take Bent. I believe that Defoe and Crouch should go too.
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
There is the suspicion that Bent can't cut it at international level(although to be fair,he's only appeared
5 times I think).I'm uneasy about Heskey:I understand that he played a major role in qualifying games,but for an England centre forward to have 7-8 goals is very poor.Many other players over the years have played the "big man" role and still scored at an acceptable rate(Hurst,Chivers,Ferdinand and many more).Problem is,to change now is questionable:is tinkering with a winning formula a good idea this close to the tournament?
I'm not sure which way to flip flop to be honest...
"Always remember lads,one Evertonian is worth 20 Liverpudlians"...Brian Labone
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I think Joe Cole has been excellent since he's been back and he should definitely make the 23. Lennon and Walcott with milner as wide cover as well, therefore no room for wright-p or johnson, though johnson has also been good though maybe not experienced enough.

Bent's form this season has been excellent, though as mentioned above I do think it comes down to him vs heskey and due to Heskey's experience I think he should go.
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
not the most convincing performance from what ive read but a win all the same with a few key guys missing
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
from ESPN

>>
� Man of the match: Glen Johnson: In his first international start for six months, Johnson showed England what they had been missing down the right flank. Solid at the back and silky going forward, Johnson capped a solid performance with a superb goal, as he cut inside and found the top corner.
� England verdict: Perhaps end of season fatigue and a sweltering Wembley night combined to zap the energy from England's players who looked slow and ponderous in the opening half, allowing their slick opponents far too much time on the ball. Once Capello had instructed them to up their own tempo (and aggression), they disrupted Mexico's pattern of play and looked far more composed. A far from fluid outing.
� Mexico verdict: By far the superior side in the opening half, Mexico tailed off after the break once England discovered how to close them down better. But 23 shots on goal at Wembley is no mean feat and Javier Aguirre will take confidence from their dominance in the opening stages. A touch more composure in front of goal and they would have led at the break.
� Could do better: Leighton Baines had a testing night at left-back and was culpable for a string of mistakes that should have been punished by Mexico. Unsure of the bouncing ball and shaky in possession, Baines was thankful to Ledley King more than once to avert the ensuing danger. Johnson's solidity on the opposite flank highlighted the Everton defender's frailties at this level.
� Stat attack: Mexico has 66% of possession and 23 shots on goal, nearly three times more than England. <<


not a great outing - but it does seem Capello is less worried than Verbeek
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
so if Gareth Barry (him with the transparently 'English' name)doesn't amke it who picks up that defensive midfield role??
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
With my rose tinted specs on you may remember that King was outstanding in that role 4/5years ago (but never got to do it in tounament because he got injured i think).

Looking at the Japan game selection maybe Heskey is on the outer? I know it is an experimental side, but for Heskey not to have featured in the first two warmup games is a little weird, unless Capello is so convinced of his ability?HarryHotspur2010-05-30 11:58:19
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
could be a big game for Hud the thud...and Bent.
"Always remember lads,one Evertonian is worth 20 Liverpudlians"...Brian Labone
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Yup - A good performance from either of them could easily sway Capello's thinking for the last 3 unresolved places. Hud is also another contender for defensive Mid should Barry fail to convice the medical staff of his recovery. I'd obviously love to see him spraying 40yard passes from a deep position out to Lennon and/or Walcott.
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Think I'd definitely take Huddlestone over Parker,who despite his cracking season for West Ham,would be punished by world cup refs for his tackling style I reckon.
Carrick's been awful,so it makes it more important Barry is available.Huddlestone and Dawson have the same problem really:their direct competition(Carrick & Upson)have been regulars in the squad,have appeared in qualification games,doing ok,and Capello knows their temperaments,personalties etc.The age old dilemma of form v experience...
"Always remember lads,one Evertonian is worth 20 Liverpudlians"...Brian Labone
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
England V Japan friendly KO 12am NZ time (25mins)
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almost 16 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
22mins 1-0 to Japan. England = Horrible.....
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