Uruguay vs Ghana

I wasn't really saying in here. Hence i said in general. So you condone all diving,Paynes handball,Henrys handball,feigning injury to get a guy sent off,paying off referees? All in the name of doing what you can to win with complete disregard for any spirit of the game? Tegal2010-07-03 16:06:19

Ok i ask you this then. If Ghana had off missed the penalty against Australia where Kewell was sent off for exactly the same thing would there be such an uproar? Also if Ghana had of scored and won 2-1 to go through to the semi finals would there be such an uproar? I think you and i both know the answer to that.

Thats pretty irrelevent. Id still be calling Suarez a cheat,but id be less in an uproar about it as at least it didn't cost them anything in the end i guess,itd be more relieved anger.

So what about when a player is clear through on goal and is scythed down? Should the team who committed the foul there not get the chance to defend the penalty (or free kick if outside the box)? I don't see how this is different.

There's also the debate about just how deliberate it was, given how quick it all happened.

Course not,in that instance the ball wasnt a yard away from going in the goal without any ability of interference except for the hand,like in this instance. But good question,if he were deliberately sythed down,id be pretty angry at the defender and probably call him a cheat,but not as passionately as am calling Suarez one here,because of what i said above.

Loved the game and the result. Loco Abreu is my hero. I even have him in my avatar doing the same style penalty for Botafogo this year to beat Flamengo in the state final. What a legend. Cold as ice. he joked that the internet hadn't arrived in Ghana yet so they hadn't seen his style of penalty.

Yeah your right, spose i should try keep you onside being one of the few forummers who does regularly agree with me haha 

I'll leave it too then, but ponder this, when you watch the replay of the incident from various angles you realise that the ball wasn't actually 100% certain to go in. Suarez's hands were right by his face, so it could of potentially hit that, and there was also another defender in very close proximity.

Anyway, i think it's one of those things that's always going to polarize opinion.

i doubt suarez knew that though. but yea thats another reason that a "penalty goal" is a stupid question. also more a question of intent rather than whether you condone it if it were deliberate. just depends which side of the fence your on really.Tegal2010-07-03 16:53:47

Hope the Dutch put 10 past those Uruguayans. that is all... mumble mumble

Pretty lame, it was on the line and going in. And to question earlier whether it was deliberate... really... youre clutching at straws there

Edit : a quote from Suarez "This was the end of the World Cup. I had no choice. I have the 'Hand of God' now. I did it so that my teammates could win the penalty shoot-out. When I saw Gyan miss the penalty it was a great joy," said Suarez.


Its over and done, Go Holland


hepatitis2010-07-03 18:05:28

This - possibly the best ever earned red card too.

Will also become one of the iconic images/stories of the World Cup for years to come.

The examples you give are ones in which the referee is duped.  I consider this different as the ref rightfully dismissed the Uruguayan player and gave Ghana a penalty.  I still think Suarez could potentially have put his head in the way of the ball - certainly a more honourable approach but with a far higher chance of failure.

I do agree, though, that 'penalty goal' is rubbish.  Where do you draw the line?  What if the keeper's out of the box and there's only a defender and the striker lashes the ball goalward from 25 yards and the defender catches it.  Looks like it may go in but there's a chance the ball would have curled away from the goal so to call 'penalty goal' would be very unwise.

Simple for me..award penalty goal, not penalty shot when it is an obvious stopping of a goal..instinctive or otherwise.  Just liek in rugby.

Ghana were cheated out of the win.  Sure they got a penalty and should have won..but they didnt and were therefore robbed by either a deliberate handball or an action taht gave Uruguay a chance to live on.

I love Suarez. What a hero. What a controversial, dramatic, moment. I loved it all. Absolutely brilliant. Absolutely football.

El-Ni�o2010-07-04 13:16:52

Perhaps the penalty rule could be change so that the kick is taken from the spot where the offence occurs? wolfman2010-07-04 14:51:08

Perhaps not. As per my previous post, the penalty/free-kick situation is not supposed to hand an advantage back to the team committing the foul.

As a sidenote, the penalty kick was introduced precisely because ofan incident like this - where a player handled on the line in the dying minutes of the game, and a free kick was awarded. The defending team simply put the wall on the goal-line with no goal consequently being scored, and the 'injustice' of this led to the introduction of the penalty kick.

You can't argue this - handball which prevents a goal is an automatic red card under the laws of the game.

Kewell handled on the line = red card.

El G - thank you for turning me into a trainspotter

 - denying the opposing team a goal or an obvious goalscoring opportunity

by deliberately handling the ball (this does not apply to a goalkeeper within

his own penalty area)

For me, the key word is "deliberately". I don't think he deliberately used his arm to stop the goal by moving it towards the ball.

I think he did.

He extended his arm away from his body in an attempt to make himself bigger - for referees, that's a clear sign of intent.el grapadura2010-07-04 15:43:40

If you take the word "deliberately" to the letter,then you also think it shouldn't have been a penalty either. You're trying to have your cake and eat it too. The right decision was made with Kewell,as unlucky as it was for him.

Saying it's not handball in this case is like a Simpsons argument: If I put my arms out like this, and you hit it into them, it's not my fault....

  Edit - Have just watched a replay. Point of contact much lower than my recollection and his lower arm is at almost 90 degrees, and he moved after the shot. wolfman2010-07-05 01:15:34

Several lads outside of YF (yes, I talk to the odd person not on this site) have been severely condemning Suarez.  When I raised the possibility of the handball being a non-thought through reflex the general response was 'rubbish - not that it (intent) matters anyway, it still robbed Ghana'.  Yet these same people don't have nearly the same reaction to clearly accidental handballs on the line.  Nor did one of them who supported Australia (and before Ghana started doing well and becoming the last African hope) condemn Kewell's handball which, in his opinion, was unintentional.

I'm thinking a double standard motivated by a desire to see an African side do well.
loyalgunner2010-07-05 07:54:09

wolfman2010-07-05 13:55:10

Yeah thats a double standard for sure. But their original opinion was that he deliberately did it (mine too),so given that,it is completely fair to condemn him the same way you would divers and Payne.

Yeah i think we should condemn him too. After all his handball was pretty much worse than cancer, or has certainly caused it amongst a large number of viewers.