The point is to meet the bullshark metrics first, then worry about promising Kiwis. If we can produce two or three first teamers per season, that will be good but deal with the metrics.
Monty Patterson (Hønefoss BK | Norway)
I'd sign him. He has a lot of promise
sorry but we don't need (or have time for) players with a lot of promise, we need players that can perform straight away
also from what I've seen of him. I don't agree with you
Regardless of whether Patterson is up to the standard or not, the idea that the Nix should not be signing young New Zealanders that have potential/promise is ridiculous.
I agree - if we won't take a chance on young kiwis I don't know what the point of the Phoenix is
The point of the Phoenix is to provide a pathway that promising kiwis aspire to
Exactly, and if we aren't in the A-League then that pathway ceases to exist. Changing our aims in the short term to allow long term viability is pretty bloody important right now. If that involves not signing some Kiwis cos we need "win now" type players than I'm 100% for it.
I'd sign him. He has a lot of promise
sorry but we don't need (or have time for) players with a lot of promise, we need players that can perform straight away
also from what I've seen of him. I don't agree with you
Regardless of whether Patterson is up to the standard or not, the idea that the Nix should not be signing young New Zealanders that have potential/promise is ridiculous.
I agree - if we won't take a chance on young kiwis I don't know what the point of the Phoenix is
The point of the Phoenix is to provide a pathway that promising kiwis aspire to
Exactly, and if we aren't in the A-League then that pathway ceases to exist. Changing our aims in the short term to allow long term viability is pretty bloody important right now. If that involves not signing some Kiwis cos we need "win now" type players than I'm 100% for it.
According to the latest podcast, the club wants a coach that can come in and 'win now'. And to do that he will need to hire some 'win now' talent, wherever he can find them - young, old, Kiwi, Aussie, Other - till we meet the metrics demanded of us for a licence extension, or the league becomes independent.
I'm in agreement, I couldn't care less about signing Kiwis next season if we don't have a good finish. We can worry about that later - FFA doesn't give a shark about it, they want metrics. Metrics will come if we win. We win if we have good enough players. Patterson is not a good enough player.
There are a few Kiwis that would improve the team, and we can focus on signing/playing young Kiwis when our future isn't hanging by a thread, but for now they shouldn't take precedence over Australians - if there's an Aussie CDM better than Payne then sign him up. This sadly isn't a time for affectionate Kiwi sentiment
The problem is, the longer we take to appoint a coach and get a strategy in place, the less players will be available.
This will likely result in us being able to only sign young (possibly unproven) Kiwis (and a few Australian and foreign journeymen).
The two objectives are not mutually exclusive
The squad needs a whole bunch of 'win now' players
But, if you think the Phoenix will have the budget, inclination or ability to fill a squad with 25 'win now' players, you are pretty naive
The squad also needs backups and this is where, IMO Monty Patterson comes in.
PS I respect Journey Fans opinion of Patterson, he watches a lot of football and knows his stuff
The two objectives are not mutually exclusive
The squad needs a whole bunch of 'win now' players
But, if you think the Phoenix will have the budget, inclination or ability to fill a squad with 25 'win now' players, you are pretty naive
The squad also needs backups and this is where, IMO Monty Patterson comes in.
PS I respect Journey Fans opinion of Patterson, he watches a lot of football and knows his stuff
Basically what I was going to post outside of the Patterson piece. You can't fill a squad with 'win now' players in a salary capped league while competing with other leagues and teams for talent. Might as well try and sign promising and up-and-coming kiwis now, otherwise even if metrics are met, in a few years time the team will still be in the same situation with regards to nurturing young kiwis it has always been in.
All for signing kiwis but I just don't think he has shown enough to even be a back up player
Unlike most of our team he actually comes to the ball and wants to play quick interchanges - would like to see a few more players like this. He would do better in a team that tries to play football than just pretend which is what we did for large parts of last year.
ok metalleg, I. have gone back in this thread and seen when he was signed it was in fact you whom drew comparisons with Rojas
At the time I said I didn't see it based upon his all whites performances but I said I hope you are right
His games last year proved he wasn't worthy of a squad place
Cam Lindsay II
I don't know what to make of him. Joined a league he had no prior knowledge of half way through our worst season ever to be part of a dysfunctional side and had some injuries along the way. I'm sure we didn't see the best of him, but I have no idea what level his best might be.
ok metalleg, I. have gone back in this thread and seen when he was signed it was in fact you whom drew comparisons with Rojas
At the time I said I didn't see it based upon his all whites performances but I said I hope you are right
His games last year proved he wasn't worthy of a squad place
Based on last year, very few are. However, I think in his last game he showed a lot of potential value worth exploring, and the reality is we don't have many better options out there banging on the door.
I would like to see more of him personally.
ok metalleg, I. have gone back in this thread and seen when he was signed it was in fact you whom drew comparisons with Rojas
At the time I said I didn't see it based upon his all whites performances but I said I hope you are right
His games last year proved he wasn't worthy of a squad place
Based on last year, very few are. However, I think in his last game he showed a lot of potential value worth exploring, and the reality is we don't have many better options out there banging on the door.
I would like to see more of him personally.
I do remember him being very good just before getting injured; and me being surprised that he was any good because his other performances were terrible. I think there is some potential there with the right coach.
if you think the Phoenix will have the budget, inclination or ability to fill a squad with 25 'win now' players, you are pretty naive
Unrecognised talent is cheap. Cacace, Singh, Rojas, Krishna and Tratt probably didn't cost much when first signed.
This is where a good manager comes in.
if you think the Phoenix will have the budget, inclination or ability to fill a squad with 25 'win now' players, you are pretty naive
Unrecognised talent is cheap. Cacace, Singh, Rojas, Krishna and Tratt probably didn't cost much when first signed.
This is where a good manager comes in.
The trouble is that for every Cacace, Singh, Rojas etc you sign there are 4 or 5 of Gao, Pavlovic, Tsatallios etc
if you think the Phoenix will have the budget, inclination or ability to fill a squad with 25 'win now' players, you are pretty naive
Unrecognised talent is cheap. Cacace, Singh, Rojas, Krishna and Tratt probably didn't cost much when first signed.
This is where a good manager comes in.
The trouble is that for every Cacace, Singh, Rojas etc you sign there are 4 or 5 of Gao, Pavlovic, Tsatallios etc.......
TBH it seems very obvious after a game or three who is talented and who's not (and who's in between).
I don't get how donkeys get signed, let alone a starting spot.
If we start mentioning donkeys... how about Billingsley - has played for NZ at every level... as I type this I am actually almost convulsing at the thought - worse striker to play for NZ... maybe ever?
Not sure you can call a 20 yr old kid a donkey. Highly likely to actually improve as a player, and cup not exactly overflowing with striker options for AWs.
Not saying he is worthy of being in national team now, but you can’t just write off a 20 yr old.
I would normally agree - but I have watched him at every NZ level and I just don't get what the coaches see... and for a striker, he makes Heskey seem prolific!!
His touch is heavy, his passing poor and his decision making seems "juvenile" meaning he doesn't seem to have the maturity I would expect from a player who has had the access to coaching and experience he has.
He has one attibute - pace... but needs quicker acceleration to make it a threat.
I would normally agree - but I have watched him at every NZ level and I just don't get what the coaches see... and for a striker, he makes Heskey seem prolific!!
His touch is heavy, his passing poor and his decision making seems "juvenile" meaning he doesn't seem to have the maturity I would expect from a player who has had the access to coaching and experience he has.
He has one attibute - pace... but needs quicker acceleration to make it a threat.
You just described two former Nix forwards!
I would normally agree - but I have watched him at every NZ level and I just don't get what the coaches see... and for a striker, he makes Heskey seem prolific!!
His touch is heavy, his passing poor and his decision making seems "juvenile" meaning he doesn't seem to have the maturity I would expect from a player who has had the access to coaching and experience he has.
He has one attibute - pace... but needs quicker acceleration to make it a threat.
I'm not sure he even has pace, the Indians and Taiwanese bossed/closed him down/ran him down repeatedly.
I would normally agree - but I have watched him at every NZ level and I just don't get what the coaches see... and for a striker, he makes Heskey seem prolific!!
His touch is heavy, his passing poor and his decision making seems "juvenile" meaning he doesn't seem to have the maturity I would expect from a player who has had the access to coaching and experience he has.
He has one attibute - pace... but needs quicker acceleration to make it a threat.
I'm not sure he even has pace, the Indians and Taiwanese bossed/closed him down/ran him down repeatedly.
Yeah he definitely doesn’t have pace.
I would normally agree - but I have watched him at every NZ level and I just don't get what the coaches see... and for a striker, he makes Heskey seem prolific!!
His touch is heavy, his passing poor and his decision making seems "juvenile" meaning he doesn't seem to have the maturity I would expect from a player who has had the access to coaching and experience he has.
He has one attibute - pace... but needs quicker acceleration to make it a threat.
I'm not sure he even has pace, the Indians and Taiwanese bossed/closed him down/ran him down repeatedly.
Yeah he definitely doesn’t have pace.
Are we talking about Monty Patterson here... or someone else?
I would normally agree - but I have watched him at every NZ level and I just don't get what the coaches see... and for a striker, he makes Heskey seem prolific!!
His touch is heavy, his passing poor and his decision making seems "juvenile" meaning he doesn't seem to have the maturity I would expect from a player who has had the access to coaching and experience he has.
He has one attibute - pace... but needs quicker acceleration to make it a threat.
I'm not sure he even has pace, the Indians and Taiwanese bossed/closed him down/ran him down repeatedly.
Yeah he definitely doesn’t have pace.
Are we talking about Monty Patterson here... or someone else?
I think they are talking about Billingsley
Personally I don't see Monty's career kicking on much more then Old's or Draper's. Same applies to Billingsley.
To be fair to Old, by NZ standards he's actually had quite a successful career, and just got another 2 years on his deal.
Billingsley is quick - doesn't look it, but is!
Good post, got found out a bit in the a league as a youngster but he has remained a pro footballer ever since.
To be fair to Old, by NZ standards he's actually had quite a successful career, and just got another 2 years on his deal.
Billingsley is quick - doesn't look it, but is!
Again with Billingsley he’s only a 20 yr old kid. Way too early to be writing him off.
Who saw coming the emergence of Collier, in the last 6 mths? I’d say no one
To be fair to Old, by NZ standards he's actually had quite a successful career, and just got another 2 years on his deal.
Billingsley is quick - doesn't look it, but is!
Not knocking Steven at all, I agree he's done well for himself although his time at the Nix was probably the highest level he's played at as League 2 and his sides in Scandinavia not up to Nix level.
Patterson has signed with Oklahoma City Energy FC who play in the USL https://www.energyfc.com/news_article/show/935246
Wonder if he'll hang out with Steven Adams.
Debuts as a sub in a 2-0 away loss to Colorado Springs. Was 0-0 when subbed on. No Colvey for Colorado.
Not required off the bench in a 3-0 win over Tulsa.
Comes off the bench for the final 15 minutes and scores the winner for OKC in a 3-2 win over Real Monarchs.
Comes off the bench for the final 15 minutes and scores the winner for OKC in a 3-2 win over Real Monarchs.
“Pick that one out.” - @PattersonMonty, probably#OKCvSLC | 3-2 pic.twitter.com/5AlysgMF6q
— Energy FC (@EnergyFC) August 12, 2018
OKC win 4-2 away at Rio Grande. Patterson and Adams both unused subs for their respective teams.
Unused sub in 3-2 loss to Orange County SC.
OKC concede 2 goals post 90 mins.