Toitū te Tiriti! Kia kaha to all the folk on the hīkoi today.
I'm still trying to fathom out the expense and related costs for a Protest against a bill that 99% of the population know that it isn't getting past this first reading. A whole waste of time and money other than an excuse to cause division, not unity.
The winner out of this is Seymour. Why? Because he wanted people to talk about and address an important issue. He knew his bill would fail, but he has gotten people to talk about it.
The losers are those whom have bought the idea that it is going to become law. IT ISN'T! Now they have joined up with every cause in the country for their annual Parliamentary protest which will achieve an absolute zero.
Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!
Regardless of your political beliefs about the treaty, for a party and coalition which supposedly is all about being productive, efficient and saving the tax payer money, this is just bull shark.
From what I can see taking a bill to select committee costs the tax payer between $4 million (conservatively) to $10 million.
When both National and NZ first said right at the beginning they would not support it further.
Seriously, how can any idiot can justify that?
It’s just bull shark and Seymour grandstanding. Love however how he twitches like a little nervous private school boy away from mummy on his first day at school in front of the haka however.
As far as culture wars go, we're clearly being manipulated. It's the same playbook which has worked throughout history. Culture wars shift the blame on your problems from the people above you to the people below you. It makes zero sense.
In the US people said "I don't care about protecting democracy or a fair and balanced economy, I care about getting rid of immigrants and protecting me from a trans problem that doesn't exist."
But also there would be quite a few people who said their vote was about the economy, when just as much they weren’t keen on a President who was a stroppy woman, black and Indian to boot.
If you look at Trump’s campaigns and Presidency he’s clearly comfortable being the representative for racism and the racist representative. He led the campaign for Obama’s birth certificate to supporting white supremacists to the most recent rally where Puerto Rico was called trash. That other lad on here who was keen on him is a bit (in)famous for dropping the Parrot joke on the forum. I mean there’s still a chunk of NZ who call poorly done work a ‘Maori job.’
That’s not really culture wars, it’s just ol fashioned white supremacy.
There was a poll out that said that 30% believed the last election had been stolen. But was that a factor?
Across the world and history incumbent governments have got smacked with the blame for inflation.
The Democrats would have had to campaign hard and skillfully on having beaten inflation and having a strong plan for everyone else hurting in the pocket. They just talked about Trump and everyone already knows about him.
Culture wars and misinformation are a thing, particularly with RFK Jr, but I don’t think they were really a factor in this race. Perhaps some of the house races.
This bill is more than just grandstanding though. Seymour knows it wont see the light of day this time around. He is playing the long game and this is part one of getting his ideas into the NZ publics' view. He wants this to be a "water cooler" talking point for years to come so he can campaign on it going forward. This protest, select committee is not the last we will hear of this goiung forward.
Grandstanding was the wrong word and you are 100 per cent correct in the above.
I suspect that behind closed doors that Luxon and the national party also support it, but want Seymour to be the initial attack dog.
Then once a few bites have been done they will come in as a pack in the next election cycle
However during the course of this, Seymour has given what he sees is a valid constructive argument for, Not an emotional over the top response.
And no, I don't support him, his bill. I'm just passing a comment on how I see it.
I would be concerned too, if your first sentenced is proved truthful. That's a road we don't need to go down as a country. 1933 saw books burned and it went downhill from there.
Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!
Grandstanding was the wrong word and you are 100 per cent correct in the above.
I suspect that behind closed doors that Luxon and the national party also support it, but want Seymour to be the initial attack dog.
Then once a few bites have been done they will come in as a pack in the next election cycle
However during the course of this, Seymour has given what he sees is a valid constructive argument for, Not an emotional over the top response.
And no, I don't support him, his bill. I'm just passing a comment on how I see it.
I would be concerned too, if your first sentenced is proved truthful. That's a road we don't need to go down as a country. 1933 saw books burned and it went downhill from there.
No you're right, Seymour has played this with a very straight bat. He appears in the media and in parliament as the calm politician, while Te Pati Maori and the Greens appear to be the rabble rousing disruptors.
Regardless of your political beliefs about the treaty, for a party and coalition which supposedly is all about being productive, efficient and saving the tax payer money, this is just bull shark.
From what I can see taking a bill to select committee costs the tax payer between $4 million (conservatively) to $10 million.
When both National and NZ first said right at the beginning they would not support it further.
Seriously, how can any idiot can justify that?
It’s just bull shark and Seymour grandstanding. Love however how he twitches like a little nervous private school boy away from mummy on his first day at school in front of the haka however.
wait until you see how much it costs to run Seymores ministry of regulation
Regardless of your political beliefs about the treaty, for a party and coalition which supposedly is all about being productive, efficient and saving the tax payer money, this is just bull shark.
From what I can see taking a bill to select committee costs the tax payer between $4 million (conservatively) to $10 million.
When both National and NZ first said right at the beginning they would not support it further.
Seriously, how can any idiot can justify that?
It’s just bull shark and Seymour grandstanding. Love however how he twitches like a little nervous private school boy away from mummy on his first day at school in front of the haka however.
wait until you see how much it costs to run Seymores ministry of regulation
But he's doing it to cut red tape and reduce costs! (lol)
I would argue that, while protests tend to be held in the hopes of some sort of practical outcome, they are an inherently emotional exercise.
Hopefully - and regardless of how different parties or politicians appear in the media - it at least serves to demonstrate that there is no appetite for that kind of bs in NZ.
Fun fact: There were more people whom went to see the Coldplay concerts each night in Auckland than there were at Parliament today. NZ population is over 5 Million.
Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!
Fun fact: There were more people whom went to see the Coldplay concerts each night in Auckland than there were at Parliament today. NZ population is over 5 Million.
Fun fact: There were more people whom went to see the Coldplay concerts each night in Auckland than there were at Parliament today. NZ population is over 5 Million.
Being there (at both may I add, I do not agree with the estimations on the crowd. It felt upwards of 60-70k. Having seen the drone footage, my thoughts haven't changed. I was at parliament before the hīkoi arrived, and there were at least 10-15k there alone.
Whilst I agree that this won't achieve much, it was more than that, it was uniting māoridom and arguably, NZers, who don't want to live in an unequal society. And I say this as an immigrant to this country. This most certainly is the first of many fights, but they did it with grace and didn't afford the racists an opportunity to complain.
I think the only ones that complained were Destiny Church whom had their own march up in Auckland.
I just feel it was a waste of time because everyone knows it was a tick box exercise for a bill going now where fast and all it has caused is disruption.
The one thing I really do want to applaud is the fact that in this country we still have the right to protest or argue our various causes. And to this extent, yesterday, New Zealanders exercised that right and made their voices heard. That is a democracy in action.
In places like China or North Korea, the military would've shut it down before the march even started way up north.
Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!
I guarantee that not a single person there yesterday would have felt like it was a waste of time. It was pretty incredible to be part of and it was great to see the YF social media support as well.
I think the only ones that complained were Destiny Church whom had their own march up in Auckland.
I just feel it was a waste of time because everyone knows it was a tick box exercise for a bill going now where fast and all it has caused is disruption.
The one thing I really do want to applaud is the fact that in this country we still have the right to protest or argue our various causes. And to this extent, yesterday, New Zealanders exercised that right and made their voices heard. That is a democracy in action.
In places like China or North Korea, the military would've shut it down before the march even started way up north.
lol- you could be in luck buddy. 😁Snuck into the foreign interference bill, according to NRT:
‘The latter point of course covers a huge swathe of legitimate democratic protest. Occupations and blockades are a normal part of the push and shove of democratic society. This law would define them as "coercive".
But wouldn't they only be illegal if they compromised protected New Zealand interests on behalf of a foreign power? As noted above, those interests include "international relations" and "economic wellbeing", while links to a foreign power can be highly tenuous. We've seen protests blockade streets and buildings, occupy land, ships and oil rigs, and the targets of those protests - the dairy, oil, and weapons industries - have all claimed that it threatens "economc wellbeing" (they've even called it "economic treason"). And the government and SIS of the day have slandered virtually every major protest movement in our history - the union movement, the anti-war movement, the anti-apartheid movement, the anti-nuclear movement - as a tool of foreign interests.
Essentially, this law allows the government to criminalise people based on its own misconceptions, conspiracy theories, and outright fantasies of their motivations (and its belief that we "ought to know" about their weirdo fantasies).’
Looks like we are all going to have to relearn our history about somethings according to the world of Trump. Or the orange muppet whichever you prefer.
Why do you only come out of your cave to make comments like this? But good to know that you identify as a Frump supporter. Did you like Elon Musks nazi salute as well? Don't believe in climate change?
Leggy
DiddumsProcrastinixing
Welcome to the Hand Maid'sTale and dictatorship. 🤢
Leggy
DiddumsProcrastinixing
Welcome to the Hand Maid'sTale and dictatorship. 🤢
Welcome to the Hand Maid'sTale and dictatorship. 🤢
Guess you also have no problem with someone who is sexist, a convicted felon, racist, and buddy buddy with both one of the worst human beings on earth, and that Bolsonaro tw*t who oversaw the worst ever destruction of the Amazon and did fudge all to stop it.
I am not a Trump supporter per se. The other lot were incompetent. Funny how the left always make derogatory remarks when others don't agree with them. Climate change has been happening for millions of years. You are deluded if you believe that Musk did a Nazi salute.Procrastinixing
Why do you only come out of your cave to make comments like this? But good to know that you identify as a Frump supporter. Did you like Elon Musks nazi salute as well? Don't believe in climate change?
Leggy
DiddumsProcrastinixing
Welcome to the Hand Maid'sTale and dictatorship. 🤢
Leggy
DiddumsProcrastinixing
Welcome to the Hand Maid'sTale and dictatorship. 🤢
If you are old and wise you were probably young and stupid
How were they incompetent? By most, if not all, metrics the US improved under them. They definitely outperformed most comparative countries in economic outcomes.
The open boarder agenda and decision to abandon deterrent-focused immigration policies have ignited the worst border crisis in American history.Ryan
How were they incompetent? By most, if not all, metrics the US improved under them. They definitely outperformed most comparative countries in economic outcomes.
If you are old and wise you were probably young and stupid
It's an absolute bin fire over there(or even a climate change heighten wild fire). In real time, we will watch a first world nation turn into a developing one. It's sad and I feel for those who will be hurt from it, because there will be hundreds of thousands, maybe millions.
I have an amazing ability to find my way out of mazes. I'm pathological.
The open boarder agenda and decision to abandon deterrent-focused immigration policies have ignited the worst border crisis in American history.Ryan
How were they incompetent? By most, if not all, metrics the US improved under them. They definitely outperformed most comparative countries in economic outcomes.
there was no open border agenda, in fact they had a bipartisan border bill that Trump instructed the republicans to kaibosh because he wanted it to be a political issue. Saying that, why is it a crisis? The US was literally founded as a refuge for those who were marginalised and persecuted in their home countries with a view of moving for a better life. What does it say on the statue of liberty? "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free"
It's an absolute bin fire over there(or even a climate change heighten wild fire). In real time, we will watch a first world nation turn into a developing one. It's sad and I feel for those who will be hurt from it, because there will be hundreds of thousands, maybe millions.
Problem is if that happens they drag everyone down with them, hopefully the checks and balances are enough to mitigate the worst of it. Regardless, deporting millions of workers and instigating a trade war if they go ahead with it will create a global recession and may shift the balance of power
The open boarder agenda and decision to abandon deterrent-focused immigration policies have ignited the worst border crisis in American history.Ryan
How were they incompetent? By most, if not all, metrics the US improved under them. They definitely outperformed most comparative countries in economic outcomes.
Even that is bullshark, Biden deported more illegal immigrants than at any time when Trump was last president.
"US immigration authorities last year deported the largest number of undocumented immigrants in nearly a decade, surpassing the record of Donald Trump's first term in office. " https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c36e41dx425o
The "boarder crisis" is only a crisis when its an election - a real feelings over facts situation.
While I agree the earth has been warming and cooling since the beginning, it is science telling us that it is being accelerated due to human activity - drilling for fossil fuels, cutting down rainforest for cows etc. Rump doesn't believe in science.
Perhaps half the world is delusional considering I wasn't the only that saw a nazi salute from rumps lap dog.
Leggy
I am not a Trump supporter per se. The other lot were incompetent. Funny how the left always make derogatory remarks when others don't agree with them. Climate change has been happening for millions of years. You are deluded if you believe that Musk did a Nazi salute.Procrastinixing
Why do you only come out of your cave to make comments like this? But good to know that you identify as a Frump supporter. Did you like Elon Musks nazi salute as well? Don't believe in climate change?
Leggy
DiddumsProcrastinixing
Welcome to the Hand Maid'sTale and dictatorship. 🤢
Leggy
DiddumsProcrastinixing
Welcome to the Hand Maid'sTale and dictatorship. 🤢
