Last year good up front, ok mid, sh*t back good goalie.
This year sh*t.sh*t,sh*t Good Goalie.
f**k this for a game of soldiers.
All the new signings wouldnt make a footballer between them.
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5 games, no wins, 3 goals and 2 of them in a loss.
If we was a horse theyd shoot us.
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Our defence isnt that bad with the whole defending thing, its when they get the ball that it all turns to sh*t. Our central midfield doesn't exist and therefore our creative players and striker never get good ball. The hoofing not only makes it hard for Smeltz but plays Daniel and Gao out of the game.
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I always get annoyed when we try to go on the counter a player will run 10 - 20 metres down field and instead of attempting a through ball to our striker or even a ball to someone forward of the ball, we stop and lose a possible attacking opportunity. I also can't stand that we rely so much on playing the ball wide especially after the quality of crosses we are producing.
Why don't we try play narrow and use are full backs for width.
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I always get annoyed when we try to go on the counter a player will run 10 - 20 metres down field and instead of attempting a through ball to our striker or even a ball to someone forward of the ball, we stop and lose a possible attacking opportunity. [/QUOTE]
That's because we don't get numbers in support quickly enough to develop the full counter-attack. Happened about a zillion times tonight.
[QUOTE=chrfit] I also can't stand that we rely so much on playing the ball wide especially after the quality of crosses we are producing.
That's because we don't get numbers in support quickly enough to develop the full counter-attack. Happened about a zillion times tonight.
[QUOTE=chrfit] I also can't stand that we rely so much on playing the ball wide especially after the quality of crosses we are producing.
�
Why don't we try play narrow and use are full backs for width.
We've scored most of our goals from crosses. And the fullbacks are there to produce the width, only Lochy's delivery has been mostly poor this season, and Mulligan's rubbish.
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I always get annoyed when we try to go on the counter a player will run 10 - 20 metres down field and instead of attempting a through ball to our striker or even a ball to someone forward of the ball, we stop and lose a possible attacking opportunity. [/QUOTE]
That's because we don't get numbers in support quickly enough to develop the full counter-attack. Happened about a zillion times tonight.
[QUOTE=chrfit] I also can't stand that we rely so much on playing the ball wide especially after the quality of crosses we are producing.
That's because we don't get numbers in support quickly enough to develop the full counter-attack. Happened about a zillion times tonight.
[QUOTE=chrfit] I also can't stand that we rely so much on playing the ball wide especially after the quality of crosses we are producing.
Why don't we try play narrow and use are full backs for width.
We've scored most of our goals from crosses. And the fullbacks are there to produce the width, only Lochy's delivery has been mostly poor this season, and Mulligan's rubbish.
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I always get annoyed when we try to go on the counter a player will run 10 - 20 metres down field and instead of attempting a through ball to our striker or even a ball to someone forward of the ball, we stop and lose a possible attacking opportunity. [/QUOTE] That's because we don't get numbers in support quickly enough to develop the full counter-attack. Happened about a zillion times tonight. [QUOTE=chrfit] I also can't stand that we rely so much on playing the ball wide especially after the quality of crosses we are producing.
We've scored most of our goals from crosses. And the fullbacks are there to produce the width, only Lochy's delivery has been mostly poor this season, and Mulligan's rubbish.
�
Why don't we try play narrow and use are full backs for width.
The thing is we score most of a goals from crosses because thats all we do, we don't seem to want to play the ball through the middle of the park and makes us too one dimensional. Agree that the full backs have had bad delivery but if we were to play a narrow formation then we would need width as an option at times and it would be up to the fullbacks to produce this.
To play the ball through the middle and score goals you need either
1) pacy forwards who can outrun the defenders if given space, or
2) strong forward who can hold the ball and lay it off to late arriving midfielders for a good shot on goal.
Given our personnel, neither of these two ways of playing is likely to produce a lot of goals for us. We need to use the width, although the attacking approach needs to be more varied than just lumping the ball into the box the moment the wide player gets possession. I hoped Gao and Bertos would be important in that role, and I guess I'll continue to do so.
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I thought (as per most of the match rating thread) that McKain and Durante were good.
I thought Dadi was a handful and they kept him in check most of the game.
I couldn't see the penalty too clearly from the camera angle, but there didn't seem to be too much contact in it. Moss looked like he may well have got there anyway. One of those things that just happen.
Don't worry about it mate!
martinb2008-09-22 00:21:41
I thought Dadi was a handful and they kept him in check most of the game.
I couldn't see the penalty too clearly from the camera angle, but there didn't seem to be too much contact in it. Moss looked like he may well have got there anyway. One of those things that just happen.
Don't worry about it mate!
martinb2008-09-22 00:21:41
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The thing about crosses are that they are two times easlier to defend by intercepting but goal scoring chances are two times better if a central player connects with the cross compare to the same player on a through ball. Therefore it really places more work by the wide player to provide quality crosses on the attack and not just by speed and dribbling.
They need to mix it up a bit and not be predictable for the defence to defend against the wide attack. You need both wide and central attacks, the central-through ball should be the staple diet of the midfielders to exploit any gaps in the defence. The wide or narrow crosses will exploit the tightness of the central defence by going wide and coming in off an angle which also challenges the defensive midfield with late midfield attack. It should be either a simple set-up or an attacking play based on tight decision by the central distributor of the ball. I mainly saw running and vertical passing down the line by both teams with no midfield. Too easy to defend and a waste of space.
For an example, that Durante's midfield dribble for Smeltz worked because their midfield was predicting another flank move and was caught off guard and so Durante naturally took the ball up the guts before passing the ball. It was tactically sound to use at that time.
They need to mix it up a bit and not be predictable for the defence to defend against the wide attack. You need both wide and central attacks, the central-through ball should be the staple diet of the midfielders to exploit any gaps in the defence. The wide or narrow crosses will exploit the tightness of the central defence by going wide and coming in off an angle which also challenges the defensive midfield with late midfield attack. It should be either a simple set-up or an attacking play based on tight decision by the central distributor of the ball. I mainly saw running and vertical passing down the line by both teams with no midfield. Too easy to defend and a waste of space.
For an example, that Durante's midfield dribble for Smeltz worked because their midfield was predicting another flank move and was caught off guard and so Durante naturally took the ball up the guts before passing the ball. It was tactically sound to use at that time.
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With only 1 striker it does make it hard to play through the middle as there is always 2 central defenders on him, one man marking, while the other holds his position, this forces Smeltz wide to receive the ball. Even if the through ball comes off, he must outrun 2 defenders to get a clear shot. I sometimes feel that our biggest fault is our 3 lines in our formation. They need to close up to play the passing game. Too often they are spread and that leaves too much space for the opposition to exploit.
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Sorry Guys, all the defeats have been my fault. Every game we have lost i have been wearing the away top. I have now buried it, so now the results should improve.
My bad
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Quote of the day "....and I missed Doctor Who for that."
Profile pic. Should you be interested. Lakhsen, on the right, lost touch with him.
Mohammed, on the left, I'm still in touch with. He's now living in Agadez, Niger. More focused on his animals now as tourism has dried up. Is active with a co-op promoting local goods, leather work and bijouterie, into Europe.
20/5/20
Mohammed, on the left, I'm still in touch with. He's now living in Agadez, Niger. More focused on his animals now as tourism has dried up. Is active with a co-op promoting local goods, leather work and bijouterie, into Europe.
20/5/20
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Full credit to Glory's subs, they changed the game and we couldn't counter it. Inversely our subs were all pretty much straight swaps which didn't change the flow of our game and two of them were left way too late.
Its a shame Smeltzie was off target with that shot after Durante's great run, and Hearfield just needs to get some composure in front of goal because he got into good positions a couple of times with scoring opportunities. Overall a better effort there was more short passing and our defense was solid we just need more on attack.
I want to see Bertos up front with Smeltz, Bertos has great pace and chases those searching long balls our players are fond of, and Smeltz is great at holding up the ball and slotting away most half chances he gets. I think they could be a good partnership and the last game Bertos played he showed he wasn't scared of taking shots.
Its a shame Smeltzie was off target with that shot after Durante's great run, and Hearfield just needs to get some composure in front of goal because he got into good positions a couple of times with scoring opportunities. Overall a better effort there was more short passing and our defense was solid we just need more on attack.
I want to see Bertos up front with Smeltz, Bertos has great pace and chases those searching long balls our players are fond of, and Smeltz is great at holding up the ball and slotting away most half chances he gets. I think they could be a good partnership and the last game Bertos played he showed he wasn't scared of taking shots.
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Good call on Siggy Wolfie, I thought he showed more as RB in 15 minutes he had last night than Mulligan has in the last two games.
I agree el grapadura........Siggys a great player going fwd on the right side of attack, which would free up an attacking midfielder. I also agree its time to blood Costa or Drapers. We cannot sit back and defend all day hoping to catch the opposition napping to pinch a result at this level. Lets start taking the game to them and have a go!
HN - FIxed Quote tags
Hard News2008-09-22 10:39:31
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It's becoming more and more obvious by the week that the Phoenix squad is not up to the level of ability needed to be competitive in the A-League. Our performances are well below the standard of the other clubs - even Perth outplayed us.
I think there are three major areas where assembly of this season's squad went wrong:
1. Having a single proven out-and-out striker (Smeltz) in a squad of 22 borders on negligence. Leaving aside the fact that we're leaking all over the park (thank God that Moss is in superb form) and not deficient just in the front third, you need to have 2 or 3 very good strikers in a squad. We have Coveny as our most realistic back up to Smeltz and the best that's been said about him is that he "runs and runs all day" or that he "runs himself into the ground". Well, if that's all that's needed to be done, there are a couple of good harrier clubs in Wellington. (However, the service to our strikers is pathetic, so it's not just down to the quality of our strikers.)
2. We needed to build the squad around four very good imports. That is, players who would form the core of the starting 11 week in, week out. We had several months prior to the start of this season to find these players in Britain/Europe/South America. Basing the squad around our Aussie and NZ players was never going to put us in a competitive position. With the exception of Durante and McKain, the Aussie players we have signed up are nothing more than average in terms of the A-League, and would in most cases struggle to be key players or starting players in most of the other A-League sides. As for the NZ players, only Moss and Smeltz would have any chance of starting in one of the other A-League sides, and even Smeltz would struggle for game time in the top 4 or 5 clubs who are well catered in the striker department. Even if they weren't regarded as imports, most of the other NZ players wouldn't even be recruited. In fact, the majority of them are simply not up to A-League standard, and in general are well below par compared to their Aussie counterparts. In a nutshell, unless we're able to recruit the best-of-the best Aussie players, we should focus on recruiting 4 very good imports and building the team around them. And, if we're really serious about competing for a top four spot, we probably need to look at a marquee player (e.g., an Aussie who has played in the top leagues in Britain/Europe, like Melbourne's Thompson or Sydney's Aloisi).
3. There's an expectation that the Phoenix need to have a large number of NZ players. But most of them are not up to playing in the A-League. In fact, even the average Aussie players in the squad start ahead of most of the NZ players week in and week out. This pressure to recruit NZ players leads to silly decisions like signing up Mulligan. And, most recently there have been calls to sign up Elliot and Brockie. Neither of these players would have any major impact on the team in my view, and the only way they would play in the A-League is if the Phoenix signs them.
In an ideal world and with a longer season some tough decisions (and money) would be needed immediately to release under-performing players and to sign up new players from overseas, if the club wants to avoid the wooden spoon. But with a quarter of the season completed and only four months remaining, this is now an unlikely option.
A major problem is that the momentum built last year in terms of support for the Phoenix, and football in general, has been lost and will be very difficult to regain. Until the Phoenix produces a product that is better than watching paint dry, we're in serious trouble and at risk of going the same way as the Knights. I think Ricki has the right philosophy about how the game needs to be played and the type of product that needs to be produced to attract the fans. He just doesn't have the personnel to do the job required. I know he was responsible for this season's recruitment, but I'd still be willing to have faith in him in the longer term to get things right. But times got to be running out.
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Oh FFS.
Our best three players last season were locals. How on earth can you use the Mulligan example as a sign that we have too many NZ players ? By the same token, the fact that Dodd and Johnson have been failures this season is a sign that all Australians are sh*t.
Ridiculous. There is no logic to back it up.
Our best three players last season were locals. How on earth can you use the Mulligan example as a sign that we have too many NZ players ? By the same token, the fact that Dodd and Johnson have been failures this season is a sign that all Australians are sh*t.
Ridiculous. There is no logic to back it up.
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Despite my comments last night (Got a bit angry) I still love the Nix, just want them to stop ripping my heart to bits...
caseym2008-09-22 11:01:06
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Oh FFS.
Our best three players last season were locals. How on earth can you use the Mulligan example as a sign that we have too many NZ players ? By the same token, the fact that Dodd and Johnson have been failures this season is a sign that all Australians are sh*t.
Ridiculous. There is no logic to back it up.
Our best three players last season were locals. How on earth can you use the Mulligan example as a sign that we have too many NZ players ? By the same token, the fact that Dodd and Johnson have been failures this season is a sign that all Australians are sh*t.
Ridiculous. There is no logic to back it up.
HN, I'm assuming that two of the three players you refer to are Moss and Smeltz. If so, I've suggested they're the two NZ players in the squad who would make the other A-League sides in the playing XI.
The fact that even Dodd and Johnson are regulars ahead of the NZ players says something about where the NZ players rank in the pecking order.
However, my overall point is that the squad on the whole (including Aussies and NZers) is well below the standard required in the A-League. I think only Durante, McKain, Moss and Smeltz would be sure picks in the other sides, and, in terms of the rest of them, the Aussie players in the squad are generally better than the NZers, which I presume is why Ricki generally picks in his starting X1 more Aussies than NZers. And, it's not a case of having or not having too many NZ players. The focus needs to be on having a squad that is capable of competing in the A-League
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Last season Daniel was capable of competing in the A-League, Lochhead was capable of competing in the A-League, every club wanted Leo Bertos, every club wanted Leilei Gao after the Knights folded, we had to fight Newcastle for Tim Brown's signature... that's three NZ players... and two others that have played to an A-League standard.
Something is wrong, whether it is the attitude, the coaching, or the mangement I don't know but we have a squad that on paper has as much or more A-League experienced depth than almost any other side in the league.
Something is wrong, whether it is the attitude, the coaching, or the mangement I don't know but we have a squad that on paper has as much or more A-League experienced depth than almost any other side in the league.
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Last season Daniel was capable of competing in the A-League, Lochhead was capable of competing in the A-League, every club wanted Leo Bertos, every club wanted Leilei Gao after the Knights folded, we had to fight Newcastle for Tim Brown's signature... that's three NZ players... and two others that have played to an A-League standard.
Something is wrong, whether it is the attitude, the coaching, or the mangement I don't know but we have a squad that on paper has as much or more A-League experienced depth than almost any other side in the league.
Something is wrong, whether it is the attitude, the coaching, or the mangement I don't know but we have a squad that on paper has as much or more A-League experienced depth than almost any other side in the league.
What he said 
Apparently I'm apathetic, but I couldn't care less.
"Being a Partick Thistle fan sets you apart. It means youre a free thinker. It also means your team has no money." Tim Luckhurst, The Independent, 4th December 2003
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something is wrong when im turning over to watch this is your life while the phoenix are on
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Last season Daniel was capable of competing in the A-League, Lochhead was capable of competing in the A-League, every club wanted Leo Bertos, every club wanted Leilei Gao after the Knights folded, we had to fight Newcastle for Tim Brown's signature... that's three NZ players... and two others that have played to an A-League standard.
Something is wrong, whether it is the attitude, the coaching, or the mangement I don't know but we have a squad that on paper has as much or more A-League experienced depth than almost any other side in the league.
Something is wrong, whether it is the attitude, the coaching, or the mangement I don't know but we have a squad that on paper has as much or more A-League experienced depth than almost any other side in the league.
I don't no anymore either HN. It would just be great to get back what we had last year! It would be a real shame for football fans, Wellington and NZ if we don't. I think Terry S, Tony P, and Ricki are good operators and I'd be very surprised if they don't sort it out.
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...later in the season when we've got into the playoffs it'll be a laugh reviewing some of today's comments.
Profile pic. Should you be interested. Lakhsen, on the right, lost touch with him.
Mohammed, on the left, I'm still in touch with. He's now living in Agadez, Niger. More focused on his animals now as tourism has dried up. Is active with a co-op promoting local goods, leather work and bijouterie, into Europe.
20/5/20
Mohammed, on the left, I'm still in touch with. He's now living in Agadez, Niger. More focused on his animals now as tourism has dried up. Is active with a co-op promoting local goods, leather work and bijouterie, into Europe.
20/5/20
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...later in the season when we've got into the playoffs it'll be a laugh reviewing some of today's comments.
Hear f'kin hear!
E + R + O
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I guess a healthy dose of self-delusion's never harmed anyone...
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It won't happen... until there's change.
We've clearly got the cattle (as HN pointed out) so there's something else that isn't right and it needs to be addressed now - whatever and however that needs to happen.
We've clearly got the cattle (as HN pointed out) so there's something else that isn't right and it needs to be addressed now - whatever and however that needs to happen.
E + R + O
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It won't happen... until there's change.We've clearly got the cattle (as HN pointed out) so there's something else that isn't right and it needs to be addressed now - whatever and however that needs to happen.
We don't have the cattle. We're missing another good forward, the centre midfield is a shambles, and we're still making mistakes at the back like last season.
We only have one spot available, and attracting a top-quality player now is impossible. We can tweak a few things around to make things better, and I hope it'll work, but top 4 is an illusion for this season.
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In the eyes of the mgmnt team... we must have the cattle - or they'd have done something about it, we'd hope lol
And if not, then (again) the changes must be made or people are held accountable... not overly complicated is it?
And if not, then (again) the changes must be made or people are held accountable... not overly complicated is it?
E + R + O
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Top 4 always was an illusion.
Top 6 would have been job well done. Having said that top 4 was always a chance with our squad. The problem was,when you change half the squad,you cant expect them to gel straight away...expectations were raised too high...if we manage to keep the same squad (and coach) next season,i suspect we will be a force
Allegedly
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Top 4 always was an illusion.
Top 6 would have been job well done. Having said that top 4 was always a chance with our squad. The problem was,when you change half the squad,you cant expect them to gel straight away...expectations were raised too high...if we manage to keep the same squad (and coach) next season,i suspect we will be a force
The squad hasn't gelled yet? You're kidding, right?
That same squad gelled enough to almost win the Pre-Season Cup!
They looked a bl**dy sight more gelled then than they do now.
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Maybe they've un-gelled since the PSC 
Apparently I'm apathetic, but I couldn't care less.
"Being a Partick Thistle fan sets you apart. It means youre a free thinker. It also means your team has no money." Tim Luckhurst, The Independent, 4th December 2003
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A cunning plan - tell them it's still the preseason cup.......
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Following on from what HN said about something being wrong. Last season what was Stu Jacobs role??? Perhaps getting rid of Stu was a bad move, because look at things now????? Also is Ricky the coach we think he is and does he need a right hand man such as Stu??? When you look at the PSC, why as we so bad and Melbourne so good. We ran them for 90 minutes in the final!!!!!!! We had 2 good wins!!! What the hell is the diffence???????
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The othere teams were taking it easy!
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'We're not auckland anymore"............ahaha might have to retire that chant.
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Last season Daniel was capable of competing in the A-League, Lochhead was capable of competing in the A-League, every club wanted Leo Bertos, every club wanted Leilei Gao after the Knights folded, we had to fight Newcastle for Tim Brown's signature... that's three NZ players... and two others that have played to an A-League standard.
Something is wrong, whether it is the attitude, the coaching, or the mangement I don't know but we have a squad that on paper has as much or more A-League experienced depth than almost any other side in the league.
Something is wrong, whether it is the attitude, the coaching, or the mangement I don't know but we have a squad that on paper has as much or more A-League experienced depth than almost any other side in the league.
I don't no anymore either HN. It would just be great to get back what we had last year! It would be a real shame for football fans, Wellington and NZ if we don't. I think Terry S, Tony P, and Ricki are good operators and I'd be very surprised if they don't sort it out.
What he said!
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A cunning plan - tell them it's still the preseason cup.......
M'Lord I have a cunning plan
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