Lochhead going

I agree with Dean on not wanting kids to slog it out in the lower leagues for nothing. Look at the recent article on Bertos case in point of how it can be a horrible exixtance.

Fortean, my proposed model is to have the best kiwis on show in FHM (the A-League).  The top top stars will always end up in playboy but it is better to have the rest of our beauties playing at home where we can appreciate them, than sifting round some poor quality overseas magazines (Nuts anyone?).  If models know they can go to playboy from nz, then they stay out of Nuts and we get to see the best of them.  If they don't make it to playboy then they stay in FHM.  If lookers know they can make it in Playboy from FHM they don't have to worry about Nuts.  At the same time, I thinkkwe all agree that the most beautiful girls should always be seen in Playboy, it's Nuts that I have the problem with

Same!

Its great if Lockhead get himself a contract. However its my belief that he is not good enough for Boro but thats hy own belief.
Pogatetz was mental. the only reason to watch Boro last season. Tackles flying in like I hadnt seen since Briley and Hurlock bossed the Millwall midfield ages ago. He was a great reminder of what football used to be all about - Kicking the oppo of the park. I Loved watching him.

Lockhead might do ok in the chamionship though and thats not a bad serie to play in. It also resembles the A league alot mroe than the premiership.

As long as the quality of nationl football is so low in New zealand, kids have no other choice but to leave if they want to make it. However this obsession with England has to stop. Its a lot better to play for a dutch sides junior club than an english side for example. Go where they get a good footballing education rather than to England all the time. England missed the Euro 2008 and with managers like Southgate, Big Sam, Keegan, Curbishley and McClaren as Englands finest its no surprise that few English players have developed during the last 8 years.

him going the the e.p.l is good for everybody Tony,the Nix and the All Whites 

Lochhead was the best player in the worst defence in last season's A-League.  I don't think he will get a Middlesborough contract (though the fact they are trialling him is a great boost for him and the Phoenix).  I'm looking forward to watching him again this year in the A-League. 

With all of this QQing you could swear it was Moss that was heading over for a trial.  Tony is a great player and we love him but this is a great chance to promote football in New Zealand because:

a) A lot of naysayers think the A-League is like watching conference and blindly state that we're never going to be viable as a sport down under.  Players going straight to the premiership might make these idiots actually pay attention.

b) If Tony is accepted and gets game time it raises the profile of NZ defenders across the world - 2 in EPL from a 4 mil pop rugby country ain't no bad feat.  Other clubs may pay attention to NZ players and the Phoenix.

c) If Tony does well he will get valuable experience against some of the world's best players which will help him raise his game and make the All Whites stronger, raising our world ranking and profile and allowing us to do well at World Cup competitions.

d) While I agree this is a blow to the Phoenix defense can you imagine what we might have been saying if Tony was offered this trail mid-late last season?  He was the one good thing in our leaky defensive line and even though we finished last anyway you'd likely have been blaming him for taking the opportunity in our hour of need.  The nix defense is currently the strongest its ever been, is there any better time for him to take this opportunity?

e) This may open the opportunity for loan players to come here from english clubs, I'm not talking youth/journeyman trails I'm talking proper loans that may or may not lead to signings as is quite common in the championship and below.

f) Even if he doesn't get accepted over at Boro this still raises the profile of NZ football, the Phoenix and the A-League.

Its a great opportunity for Tony and as a kiwi I wish him all the best.  As a nix fan I'm understandably a bit worried but have confidence in the club and our new signings that this won't cripple us as it may have last year.
Nickel2008-07-30 08:33:05

Morning after - blood pressure has dropped - calm returned.

How many games would Tony miss on the trial?

Meh, he should been at least available to be away with the Olympic squad anyway.

The challenge is, when else COULD it happen from Boro's view ?



Just Sydney this weekend, which he may have missed anyway with Ricki giving everyone a run.

If we were to win this weekend he would miss the PSC final next Wednesday as well, but he'll be back (if he comes back) in plenty of time for the season opener. Hard News2008-07-30 09:07:28

Nigeria is a very poor comparison to make with the A-League, that article points out it is rife with corruption and plagued by financial woes, neither of which we have in the A-League. In fact we have players returning to Australasia because they realise they can get payed AT LEAST as much as in most of the European leagues and the standard is similar.


They're also not all guys in the twilight of their career like some have aluded to, David Tarka anyone? Jamie Coyne, Hayden Foxe, Nick Rizzo, Hayden Doyle (19 year old who has realised he's better off in PERTH!), Scott Jamieson (another young bloke), Paul Reid, Travis Dodd, Iain Fyfe, Terry McFlynn, Brendon Santalab, Michael Thwaite (even if on loan), Allsopp, Thomspson, Grant Brebner, Nik Mrdja, Dylan Macallister, Adam and Joel Griffiths, Kaz Patafta, our very own Moss, Lochhead, McKain, Dodd, Mulligan, Brown, Bertos, Smeltz and very importantly Nick Ward who went from the A-League to the UK and realised he was better off back here. Don't try to tell me we're losing or are going to lose all of Australasia's best players.

The A-League isn't up to the standard of the EPL and keeping one player who may be good enough doesn't make it up to that standard. We have to let the best players go if they can make it in a better league, think how boring the A-League would have been for Maradona, Pele, Zidane in their prime? If we don't let people like Lochhead go on trial to Premier League/La Liga/Serie A clubs then kids will see the A-League as for people that went overseas and couldn't quite crack those leagues. If we want to be EPL standard we need our kids with EPL potential to see the league as an option for going places.

interesting if its boro, they have just sold cattermole for �3 plus million left sided midfield, thought they were linked with shorey from reading ,go tony! good luck

I'm interested in the size of the transfer fee we would receive...

I haven't said much on this since JD has pretty much made the points I wholheartedly agree with.

The reality is that in modern footballing hierarchy, you have to know your place. The HAL will be a 'selling' league for a long time to come, and consequently all the clubs within it, including us, will be 'selling' clubs. What I mean by this is that the league and the clubs will be selling the best players they have to bigger leagues and clubs, and this will be the pattern of HAL for a wee while to come.
This is not a bad thing though - we want NZ players to play at the highest levels possible, and Phoenix are a long way from that. So when there are opportunities for our players to progress to the Premiership, it is irresponsible of the club to deny them the same. Like many people have said, this will work out for us in the medium and long-term, as NZ and probably Australian players will see Phoenix as a good club from which they can progress to the highest levels of the game, rather than going off to the frozen tundras of Sweden or Finland or lower divisions of England, and even Belgium and Holland in a small hope they'll get noticed by a bigger club in a bigger league.
In many ways, this is one of the reasons why Phoenix exists in the first place - to provide a stepping stone for promising NZ players to progress to the highest levels of the game, which will in turn make NZ football stronger and more visible in the media (a youth team would be good too, but that's a different story...)

lets hope he does well, but not get ahead of ourselves or expect too much, trialling for 10 days wont be easy ,and the pace of their game  is so quick, at least he is left sided always a big thing in your favour  watch this space see boro won 2-1 at carlisle

I suspect there is a good chance he will get signed. He certainly has the fitness, and his crossing is certainly of a high enough standard. Areas of concern might be his technical ability and his positioning and defensive skills. Still though, he could be signed even if he isn't going to make the first team. I doubt the transfer would be too large (from a Boro perspective) and given that Lochhead has the fitness, internatioanl experience (and therefore can get a permit), is left footed and can cross it probably isn't that big of a punt for them to take. From some of the statements made in the various articles I get the vibe that Southgate is pretty happy with what he's seen from Tony thus far and just wants an insight into his fitness/character and whether he has the temperament or mentality to raise his game another level.

If he goes, I like the Daniel to left back, Kwasnik to left wing approach, unless of course we make another good signing.

That's not how it works at this low level my son. If it were an Arsenal or a Man U that question could be asked legitimately. If we were selling him toAdelaide, the same question might be asked. but we hope he will be going to a club in one of the best league sin the world. We replace him with the best we can get for the money we have or are allowed to spend - full stop.

Sounds like from todays Dom Post he's already on the way over.This pre-season gap is the perfect window for Lochie to go.If it works out for him fantastic and good luck to him. if it doesn't work out, he's back with the Phoenix by the 17th for the Roar match...that is of course unless he gets an emergency call-up from the Oly Whites, as they've just beaten Brazil, and Nelsen's gone back to Blackburn...since Tony's already in the northern hemisphere...and the Phoenix management relents to let him go...He'll pick up an olympic medal for his efforts too......just a thought! (yeah right!!!)

From a boro website, Contrasting views...Pogatetz definitely first choice, but he is also cover for CB so may need  extra cover
http://boromania.com/boro-take-lockhead-on-trial/

My point is simply that this hurts the Phoenix's prospects for this season. This may be mitigated by a replacement signing, but a replacement wouldn't be as good as Lochhead. There are obviously positives for Lochhead, and medium to long-term positives for the Phoenix and New Zealand football. I accept both the negatives and the positives. I'm just more concerned right now with the looming season.

[/QUOTE

Agreed, but it's the first signs of whether he has a chance. The mention of 4 players in front of him wouldn't bode well, but the fact that two are inexperienced, one is thought of badly and the No1 is cover for an injury prone Huth, means that there could actually be a real need.

Southgate has obviously done some homework on him before agreeing to a trial, but it is interesting that he wont be playing any games while he is there only training, that in itself provides an indication that he is seen as cover only initially.

Had he been seen more than that I would expect he would be thrown in to see how he fared.

The point I'm trying to make is that they don't care about local football because it's gotten seriously sh*t due to corruption and a lack of finances, something that doesn't look too likely to happen to the A-League. We're seeing people who didn't care about NZ football before suddenly get behind it because of the Phoenix, IMO you are trying to prove the exact opposite of what the evidence suggests, pointing to a situation in another country which has very little to do with our situation. A factor in my previous post that you ignored is that we have quality players coming into the A-League whereas Nigeria just has quality players leaving, and in droves.

Isn't it refreshing to see most of the reaction on this thread as opposed to the similar, Sonny Bill Williams scenario. Football people see the whole picture, whereas the rugby league (and similarly rugby union) just don't get it - and SBW wouldn't have left the way he did if they had. Football players have a very short career in which they have to maximise their earnings. People will still support the A League even though our stars move on - that's just the nature of the beast.

Daniel is actually a defender who was remoulded as an attacker or the remoulding was done a looooong time ago.

He's probably not regretting missing out on the Olympics now ...

As said above, Daniel is actually a converted left back, and I think he could do a pretty solid job for us there. Furthermore, we can't fit Kwasnik into the starting lineup given our current squad unless one of Gao, Daniel or Bertos are left out. Giving Daniel a go at left back would give Kwasnik a proper shot, because I'd say he is too good a player to be left on the bench.

I'd still prefer to see us sign a proper LB, but if we can't find anyone I'd rather see Daniel play there than Siggy (no attacking penetration) or Mully (Right footed and needs to be starting at RB).

well this is all nice, but I'm goinng to miss seeing him in the opening couple of home games this year...

he seemed to be a banker for us and a real positive in terms of our ambitions to be a top a league club. Now the left back is another problem area...

You could sit there and go well this seasons looking sorted 1. Lochy at left, solid centres, now mully at right, brown, johnson, ferrante and dodd potentially fighting for a role in front of them, then hearfield, gao, daniel, kwasnik- bertos on the wing with smeltz up front....costa somewhere too...
(who did I leave out?)..- Covs! sorry- could be in the mix this season more than people expecting, and still have a few suprises...

No kidding it's a blow this close to the start of the season.

I don't want him to miss his opoturnities, but I want us to win the A-league. and look classy doing it. And I want the chance to watch NZ's best at home seeing I didn't get that chance last year...

so...It will be an interesting 10 days...


martinb2008-07-30 19:14:03

Poor Smeltz

welll, if nothing else it has certainly generated a buzz on here