Wynton is rarely wrong, but this time I hope he is. Looking forward to following another league.
Marco Rojas - The return of the Kiwi Messi
Think i'd agree with Wynton on that one - bit of a trial by fire for Marco.
Article on Marco and Wynton from German media - apparently Marco's NZ clubs are in for some big money in development compensation:
VfB Stuttgart: ATTACKING TALENT MARCO ROJAS - TOO DELICATE FOR VfB?
"...the club is very keen on this free jewel - just a training compensation in the amount of 180,000 dollars (140,000 euros) would VfB transfer to New Zealand...
...Rufer feels responsible for him as fatherly friend and protector... For when he talked recently with Fredi Bobic on the phone, he advised the VfB manager to something he repeated in an interview with the Stuttgarter Nachrichten: "Marco is not yet ripe for the Bundesliga. The hardness there is too much for him. It would be better if he stayed another year in Melbourne. "The leagues in Switzerland, the Netherlands or Belgium would also be eligible for Rojas", says the ex-pro who was elected to the turn of the millennium Oceania Player of the Century. Bobic he advised to buy Rojas and borrow immediately for a season at Melbourne Victory. Rojas was "small and dribbling as Marko Marin", but "the mentality here is not really grown up," Rufer says about the striker...
Bobic doesn't agree. He wants Rojas immediately - and is on fire. "
I cannot help but wonder just how up to date old Wynton is with the German League. I know he played there, but that was about 25 years ago, and football (globally) has moved on a lot since that time. I am not sure he is really in a position to say that it will be too physical for Rojas considering that he probably sees only a couple of games per year (I am assuming that a nice christian boy like Wynton would not be involved in the illegal downloading of games on the web).
Who are those ausis linked to?
Sainsbury - Bolton/Southampton
Halloran - Fortuna Dusseldorf
Who are those ausis linked to?
Sainsbury - Bolton/Southampton
Halloran - Fortuna Dusseldorf
Ibini & Ryan to Brugge as well as Lille
Article on Marco and Wynton from German media - apparently Marco's NZ clubs are in for some big money in development compensation:
VfB Stuttgart: ATTACKING TALENT MARCO ROJAS - TOO DELICATE FOR VfB?
"...the club is very keen on this free jewel - just a training compensation in the amount of 180,000 dollars (140,000 euros) would VfB transfer to New Zealand...
...Rufer feels responsible for him as fatherly friend and protector... For when he talked recently with Fredi Bobic on the phone, he advised the VfB manager to something he repeated in an interview with the Stuttgarter Nachrichten: "Marco is not yet ripe for the Bundesliga. The hardness there is too much for him. It would be better if he stayed another year in Melbourne. "The leagues in Switzerland, the Netherlands or Belgium would also be eligible for Rojas", says the ex-pro who was elected to the turn of the millennium Oceania Player of the Century. Bobic he advised to buy Rojas and borrow immediately for a season at Melbourne Victory. Rojas was "small and dribbling as Marko Marin", but "the mentality here is not really grown up," Rufer says about the striker...
Bobic doesn't agree. He wants Rojas immediately - and is on fire. "
I cannot help but wonder just how up to date old Wynton is with the German League. I know he played there, but that was about 25 years ago, and football (globally) has moved on a lot since that time. I am not sure he is really in a position to say that it will be too physical for Rojas considering that he probably sees only a couple of games per year (I am assuming that a nice christian boy like Wynton would not be involved in the illegal downloading of games on the web).
Classic Wynton though. Love to know who initiated that call between him and Bobic.
especially considering Bobic was on fire. I would have thought that he would have had more pressing things on his mind at the time.
If I was Rojas I would not appreciate Rufer interfering and telling the Stuttgart coaching staff that I was a wimp. As has been pointed out its been 25 years since Rufer played in Germany. The game has changed. I have German friends who have watched A-league and say that all though the Bundeslige is tough, they thought that players in the A-League get away with murder compared to Germany. They said that German referees would red card lots of the tackles they see get waved on in the A-League. So I don't think Rojas would struggle physically. Kruse is a scrawny guy and he is doing OK there.
Where Rojas might take time to adjust would be in the pace of the game...but thats up to his new coaches to get him up to speed. Also for me there is a question mark over Rojas's mental strength. He is a very young 21 year old.
Whatever imput Rufer has had I don't think the Germans will take a lot of notice of what he has to say. These top clubs scout their players thoroughly. They will know Rojas's strengths and weaknesses. They will work with him in training to see where he is at. I don't think that the words of some old pro from the 1980's will register much with them. We might not see Marco in the first team for a while but he will go OK in the Bundislige IMO
Yet. Still. No. Announcement.
If I was Rojas I would not appreciate Rufer interfering and telling the Stuttgart coaching staff that I was a wimp. As has been pointed out its been 25 years since Rufer played in Germany. The game has changed. I have German friends who have watched A-league and say that all though the Bundeslige is tough, they thought that players in the A-League get away with murder compared to Germany. They said that German referees would red card lots of the tackles they see get waved on in the A-League. So I don't think Rojas would struggle physically. Kruse is a scrawny guy and he is doing OK there.
this- watching the EPL you see reds for challenges with the studs up that invariably in the A-league become yellows
especially considering Bobic was on fire. I would have thought that he would have had more pressing things on his mind at the time.
But was Bobic on fire when he spoke to Rufer, or when he spoke to the reporter?
My impression is the latter. If so, what the fuck was the reporter doing?
There is one thing that has not been mentioned regarding Marco which is kinda counter to what Wynton has said about not being ready.
Season 1 (Phoenix) - used sparingly, injured
Season 2 (Phoenix) - gets a run at the end of the season and turns in a good hand
Season 3 (Melbourne) - doesn't set the world on fire
Season 4 (Melbourne) - Player of the year
Now if I were to follow on...
Season 5 (Germany) - gets a run, holds his own, nothing spectacular
Season 6 (Germany) - one of the clubs best players.
(the above is hypothetical and wild speculation)
Yet. Still. No. Announcement.
Stuttgart papers say he is coming, but nothing official............ Maybe they want to unveil him in front of 60,000 fans at next weekend game LOL.
Good luck Marco. I hope it goes well for you
I think Billy Harris summed it up pretty well in his article the other day.
If you have been voted by your peers as not only the best young player in the comp, but the best player in the league when if not now will you ever be ready for the step up in competition.
Marco is never going to realise his potential / find out how good he is / can be until he puts himself in a position to test oneself.
Would be pretty cool if he was displayed in front of the fans... 60000 people chanting your name. Immense.
If I was Rojas I would not appreciate Rufer interfering and telling the Stuttgart coaching staff that I was a wimp. As has been pointed out its been 25 years since Rufer played in Germany. The game has changed. I have German friends who have watched A-league and say that all though the Bundeslige is tough, they thought that players in the A-League get away with murder compared to Germany. They said that German referees would red card lots of the tackles they see get waved on in the A-League. So I don't think Rojas would struggle physically. Kruse is a scrawny guy and he is doing OK there.
this- watching the EPL you see reds for challenges with the studs up that invariably in the A-league become yellows
believe me, getting a work visa in Germany is a nightmare...the delay is probably thanks to an enormous process of clinical efficancy.
I think when they are talking about how physical it is, it is not so much the agression/fouls, but more the speed and the amount of effort it takes to be competitive. I am sure that if you looked at someone like Rojas in the A League, he would cover (say) 7 or 8 kms in a game, where the expectation would be in Germany that he would be covering around 10 or 11 kms. There will be less time to recover during games, and there will be a period of adjustment to get to that fitness level.
Having said that, loaning him back to the league he has just come from will not assist him in building to that level in any way.
I think when they are talking about how physical it is, it is not so much the agression/fouls, but more the speed and the amount of effort it takes to be competitive. I am sure that if you looked at someone like Rojas in the A League, he would cover (say) 7 or 8 kms in a game, where the expectation would be in Germany that he would be covering around 10 or 11 kms. There will be less time to recover during games, and there will be a period of adjustment to get to that fitness level.
Having said that, loaning him back to the league he has just come from will not assist him in building to that level in any way.
In a way this is encouraging because improving his fitness is something that I'm sure he would be capable of (as opposed to bulking up to look the hulk, which would be unrealistic, unhelpful and absurd). I don't think anybody is expecting him to tear up the league in his first season, but if the main thing he needs to do is adjust and improve his fitness then over the next couple of seasons he could prove to be very successful imo.
I think when they are talking about how physical it is, it is not so much the agression/fouls, but more the speed and the amount of effort it takes to be competitive. I am sure that if you looked at someone like Rojas in the A League, he would cover (say) 7 or 8 kms in a game, where the expectation would be in Germany that he would be covering around 10 or 11 kms. There will be less time to recover during games, and there will be a period of adjustment to get to that fitness level.
Having said that, loaning him back to the league he has just come from will not assist him in building to that level in any way.
They had gps monitors on one of the games in the a-league a couple of seasons ago (It was Sydney, I think against us). I can't remember the exact figures but some of the players had done about 7 kms by half time.
I think when they are talking about how physical it is, it is not so much the agression/fouls, but more the speed and the amount of effort it takes to be competitive. I am sure that if you looked at someone like Rojas in the A League, he would cover (say) 7 or 8 kms in a game, where the expectation would be in Germany that he would be covering around 10 or 11 kms. There will be less time to recover during games, and there will be a period of adjustment to get to that fitness level.
Having said that, loaning him back to the league he has just come from will not assist him in building to that level in any way.
They had gps monitors on one of the games in the a-league a couple of seasons ago (It was Sydney, I think against us). I can't remember the exact figures but some of the players had done about 7 kms by half time.
The top players in Europe cover on average about 11km a match and thats for centre mids who have the highest numbers
I think when they are talking about how physical it is, it is not so much the agression/fouls, but more the speed and the amount of effort it takes to be competitive. I am sure that if you looked at someone like Rojas in the A League, he would cover (say) 7 or 8 kms in a game, where the expectation would be in Germany that he would be covering around 10 or 11 kms. There will be less time to recover during games, and there will be a period of adjustment to get to that fitness level.
Having said that, loaning him back to the league he has just come from will not assist him in building to that level in any way.
They had gps monitors on one of the games in the a-league a couple of seasons ago (It was Sydney, I think against us). I can't remember the exact figures but some of the players had done about 7 kms by half time.
The top players in Europe cover on average about 11km a match and thats for centre mids who have the highest numbers
I would have thought wingbacks, quite easily, have the highest numbers?
Fairly close your right, gets messy with different formations but traditionally the centre mids do the most. Obviously varies with players a lot. I wouldnt of thought fitness would be the issue holding marco back though. Being able to hold his player off may be an issue but the type of player he is means that he relies on his other strengths.
Article on Marco and Wynton from German media - apparently Marco's NZ clubs are in for some big money in development compensation:
VfB Stuttgart: ATTACKING TALENT MARCO ROJAS - TOO DELICATE FOR VfB?
"...the club is very keen on this free jewel - just a training compensation in the amount of 180,000 dollars (140,000 euros) would VfB transfer to New Zealand...
...Rufer feels responsible for him as fatherly friend and protector... For when he talked recently with Fredi Bobic on the phone, he advised the VfB manager to something he repeated in an interview with the Stuttgarter Nachrichten: "Marco is not yet ripe for the Bundesliga. The hardness there is too much for him. It would be better if he stayed another year in Melbourne. "The leagues in Switzerland, the Netherlands or Belgium would also be eligible for Rojas", says the ex-pro who was elected to the turn of the millennium Oceania Player of the Century. Bobic he advised to buy Rojas and borrow immediately for a season at Melbourne Victory. Rojas was "small and dribbling as Marko Marin", but "the mentality here is not really grown up," Rufer says about the striker...
Bobic doesn't agree. He wants Rojas immediately - and is on fire. "
I cannot help but wonder just how up to date old Wynton is with the German League. I know he played there, but that was about 25 years ago, and football (globally) has moved on a lot since that time. I am not sure he is really in a position to say that it will be too physical for Rojas considering that he probably sees only a couple of games per year (I am assuming that a nice christian boy like Wynton would not be involved in the illegal downloading of games on the web).
Wynton is in Germany every year and is held in very high regard there - I think he knows what he's talking about. Also it's all about mental strength. Marco is a very good young player but has gone nowhere without the whole family packing up and following - I think this is what he was alluding too.
I think when they are talking about how physical it is, it is not so much the agression/fouls, but more the speed and the amount of effort it takes to be competitive. I am sure that if you looked at someone like Rojas in the A League, he would cover (say) 7 or 8 kms in a game, where the expectation would be in Germany that he would be covering around 10 or 11 kms. There will be less time to recover during games, and there will be a period of adjustment to get to that fitness level.
Having said that, loaning him back to the league he has just come from will not assist him in building to that level in any way.
has anyone actually gone straight from the A-League to being a starter in a top 5 European league? I don't think anyone has, and it's probably unrealistic to expect Rojas to either for exactly this reason. It's just a huge step up. I don't think he's a Bundesliga player just yet, but they probably already know that as well
The difference in Europe is all round strength. Some A-League players will be strong but not quick, they might have good straight line speed but not turn quickly - he's been able to target that. You may be able to get away with bad tackles in the A-League but that's not what makes a league tough. It will be a different ball game in Bundesliga - defenders at that level have it all, quick, athletic, technically good and strong. He'll need to adjust his game. It's a really exciting move though!
I think when they are talking about how physical it is, it is not so much the agression/fouls, but more the speed and the amount of effort it takes to be competitive. I am sure that if you looked at someone like Rojas in the A League, he would cover (say) 7 or 8 kms in a game, where the expectation would be in Germany that he would be covering around 10 or 11 kms. There will be less time to recover during games, and there will be a period of adjustment to get to that fitness level.
Having said that, loaning him back to the league he has just come from will not assist him in building to that level in any way.
has anyone actually gone straight from the A-League to being a starter in a top 5 European league? I don't think anyone has, and it's probably unrealistic to expect Rojas to either for exactly this reason. It's just a huge step up. I don't think he's a Bundesliga player just yet, but they probably already know that as well
The difference in Europe is all round strength. Some A-League players will be strong but not quick, they might have good straight line speed but not turn quickly - he's been able to target that. You may be able to get away with bad tackles in the A-League but that's not what makes a league tough. It will be a different ball game in Bundesliga - defenders at that level have it all, quick, athletic, technically good and strong. He'll need to adjust his game. It's a really exciting move though!
Kruse comes pretty close - though his team were in the 2nd tier when he started playing for them.
Sarota, Oar and Zullo in the Netherlands all broke into the first team quite quickly too.
will he be able to see over the steering wheel of his new mercedes? I think daddy Rodi will have to drive.
it puts the lotion in the basket.............
It seems like he is more on trial than anything else at the moment. Does anyone know if he is training with the team?
not a peep out of Germany since 27 April......
I think when they are talking about how physical it is, it is not so much the agression/fouls, but more the speed and the amount of effort it takes to be competitive. I am sure that if you looked at someone like Rojas in the A League, he would cover (say) 7 or 8 kms in a game, where the expectation would be in Germany that he would be covering around 10 or 11 kms. There will be less time to recover during games, and there will be a period of adjustment to get to that fitness level.
Having said that, loaning him back to the league he has just come from will not assist him in building to that level in any way.
has anyone actually gone straight from the A-League to being a starter in a top 5 European league? I don't think anyone has, and it's probably unrealistic to expect Rojas to either for exactly this reason. It's just a huge step up. I don't think he's a Bundesliga player just yet, but they probably already know that as well
The difference in Europe is all round strength. Some A-League players will be strong but not quick, they might have good straight line speed but not turn quickly - he's been able to target that. You may be able to get away with bad tackles in the A-League but that's not what makes a league tough. It will be a different ball game in Bundesliga - defenders at that level have it all, quick, athletic, technically good and strong. He'll need to adjust his game. It's a really exciting move though!
Kruse comes pretty close - though his team were in the 2nd tier when he started playing for them.
Sarota, Oar and Zullo in the Netherlands all broke into the first team quite quickly too.
That's the point though - went into second division.
It's taken 3 years for Oar to become a regular, only 7 matches in his first season, Sarota only played 13 times in his first 2 seasons, Zullo only 21. And that's in the Netherlands which is a lot weaker than Bundesliga.
I guess the point I'm making is he's really unlikely to rip it up in his first season, and I actually think Wynton is right that he needs to develop more but I'm not sure the A-League is the place for that, maybe a season somewhere like Belgium would work, that doesn't make him a failure though or not worth signing. It just shows that the A-League is a long way from top European leagues and inevitably players will find the jump difficult - which isn't news at all.
From espnsoccernet, quoting stuttgart paper on may 2 says club hoping to make announcement next week
http://espnfc.com/news/story/_/id/1433368/stuttgart-hint-rojas-signing?cc=3436
Kruse is about to join Leverkusen. Be interesting to see him and Marco on the same field again
I think when they are talking about how physical it is, it is not so much the agression/fouls, but more the speed and the amount of effort it takes to be competitive. I am sure that if you looked at someone like Rojas in the A League, he would cover (say) 7 or 8 kms in a game, where the expectation would be in Germany that he would be covering around 10 or 11 kms. There will be less time to recover during games, and there will be a period of adjustment to get to that fitness level.
Having said that, loaning him back to the league he has just come from will not assist him in building to that level in any way.
has anyone actually gone straight from the A-League to being a starter in a top 5 European league? I don't think anyone has, and it's probably unrealistic to expect Rojas to either for exactly this reason. It's just a huge step up. I don't think he's a Bundesliga player just yet, but they probably already know that as well
The difference in Europe is all round strength. Some A-League players will be strong but not quick, they might have good straight line speed but not turn quickly - he's been able to target that. You may be able to get away with bad tackles in the A-League but that's not what makes a league tough. It will be a different ball game in Bundesliga - defenders at that level have it all, quick, athletic, technically good and strong. He'll need to adjust his game. It's a really exciting move though!
Kruse comes pretty close - though his team were in the 2nd tier when he started playing for them.
Sarota, Oar and Zullo in the Netherlands all broke into the first team quite quickly too.
That's the point though - went into second division.
It's taken 3 years for Oar to become a regular, only 7 matches in his first season, Sarota only played 13 times in his first 2 seasons, Zullo only 21. And that's in the Netherlands which is a lot weaker than Bundesliga.
I guess the point I'm making is he's really unlikely to rip it up in his first season, and I actually think Wynton is right that he needs to develop more but I'm not sure the A-League is the place for that, maybe a season somewhere like Belgium would work, that doesn't make him a failure though or not worth signing. It just shows that the A-League is a long way from top European leagues and inevitably players will find the jump difficult - which isn't news at all.
Fair points - hard to disagree with any of that.
my only thought in the matter is that kruse, oar, zullo etc all werent judged by their peers as the best player in the A-league - and marco had arguably the strongest competition.
Not really disagreeing with people's points - just throwing it out there.
Playwithfire makes a good point.
The A League has improved since those players left, and he did achieve accolades none of them have before him. Maybe the step up wont be quite as hard for marco.
Also personally, i think Marco is the most talented out of the names mentioned as well.
It is f..kin laughable that TV1 had a story a while ago about Wynton how had so much influence on Marco and the potential signing of him to Germany. TOTAL bollocks, he has never had anything to do with Marco. Now Wynton is saying he isn't good enough. Funny how when it isn't about Wynton he turns into a twat. GOOD CHRISTIAN MY ARSE. Even if he doesn't get much of a look in during his first season, I know I would rather be training day in day out within a "true" professional setup with quality players than be stuck in the A-League. It doesn't matter how much football supports kid themselves the quality of the A-League is rather poor.
Stuttgart sign 23 year old winger
Stuttgart - VfB Stuttgart have announced the signing of Hannover 96 winger Konstantin Rausch on a free transfer. The 23-year-old has put pen to paper on a three-year contract with the club and will arrive at the end of the season.VfB sporting director Fredi Bobic commented: "It's great news that Konstantin has decided to come here, despite a lot of interest from other clubs. We made it very clear to him what we want to achieve. He can play in a variety of positions, plays with passion and has the right mentality.”
Rausch himself was delighted to seal the move to the Mercedes-Benz Arena outfit. "I had some very good conversations with Fredi Bobic and [head coach] Bruno Labbadia," said the eight-time Germany U-21 international. "They gave me a really good feeling and convinced me this was the right decision. Now I'm just looking forward to the new challenge."
Rausch came through the youth ranks at Hannover after joining the club in 2004 and made his Bundesliga debut in March 2008. He has made 148 top-flight appearances for the Lower Saxony side, scoring nine goals.
Doesn't sound good for Marco but doesn't rule him out yet either. Might still get a loan out deal as well plus I'm sure he still has other offers. It's a bit of a pity given the hype that had built up though.
Really weird that we have not heard anything yet... how long ago did he go over now to sort out his playing future?
Marco's Bundesliga looks to be going as well as Leo Bertos' at the current rate.