Marketing / Branding Option for the Phoenix
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The issue about the team playing strip has been debated both pre-season and currently under the forum topic "Yellow".
However, the discussion under "Yellow" has lost traction and I
feel the issue remains weighty because of, firstly, a
potential branding / marketing opportunity for the club and,
secondly, the important principle of whether, as I understand it
from the YF forum, Reebok and/or the FFA should have the right
to regulate playing strips and, thereby, in part, remove an
important option for A-League clubs to brand / market
themselves in a way that is most advantageous and appropriate to
them. For that reason, it would be great, if possible,
to get Tony P's views / comments so that the issue can be put to
rest one way or another.
The Phoenix playing strip (sadly, in my view, not the current
one) has great potential for branding and marketing the
club, both in New Zealand and Australia (and, hopefully, one day,
in Asia), but especially in Wellington where the club is based and
needs to source the majority of the 'bums on seats'.
In my view, this marketing / branding potential is currently
very limited with a home strip that is basically all black and an
away strip that is basically all white. There are a number of
points that can be made.
First, these playing strip designs lack any imagination
and are too boring (no disrespect to those whose tastes on this
differ). They have been done so often in NZ sport that they
no longer have any effect or leave anything to the
imagination. They are not a mark of difference. Even the
Football Kingz and NZ Knights played in all black strips. I'm
sure the club can be more imaginative and independent in building
up its own image, style and culture.
Second, the Wellington colours are black and yellow
(not predominantly black). Importantly, it's the colours
the fans in Wellington and New Zealand identify and associate with
as being "Wellington".
Third, the irony, and a lesson in itself, is
that the vast majority of Phoenix's souvenirs and
promotional material is black and yellow (witness, for
example, the scarf and black and yellow tracksuit top, which,
in my view, look stunning). Additionally, the YF fan club
support is strongly based around the black and yellow
theme. Even some chants (in Aisle 30) incorporate the colours
[Chant leader yells: "I say BLACK, you say Yellow ... BLACK".
Crowd yells (in tune):"YELLOW". Chant leader yells: "BLACK".
Crowd yells: "YELLOW". Chant leader yells (continuing the
same tune): "I say YELLOW, you say black ... YELLOW. Crowd
yells back: BLACK etc.]. In fact, disappointingly, the only
thing that isn't (very) yellow and black is the team playing
strip.
Fourth, when the club was first formed, there were some
marvellous and imaginative designs promoted by some of the YF
lads on the YF forum. To add my vote, my personal
favourite for home strip would be black and yellow
striped-shirt, black shorts (or, as another very good and perhaps
better option, white shorts), and black socks with a yellow trim at
the top (or, black and yellow hooped socks). From memory,
there were two or three black and yellow striped-shirts
designed by YF lads that fitted the bill perfectly. There are
also some good ideas suggested under the current "Yellow"
posting. It should be a concern to the club (and the
FFA) when some YF fans are even contemplating introducing
next season a black and yellow-striped shirt for fans to
wear. I acknowledge there may be many
other preferences regarding the club's playing strip
(including the staus quo), but the issues of options for better
branding / marketing of the club and the principle of whether
Reebok and/or the FFA should dictate in this regard remain relevant
(see the next point).
Fifth, having a common playing strip design for all the clubs
is absolutely boring. What a marketing and branding disaster
by those who decided this and a lost opportunity! Why should,
as I understand it from this forum, Reebok insist on using a
template for all playing strips - it doesn't seem logical?
After all, the strips would still carry the Reebok brand /
logo. If, for example, England's Newcastle United came to
Reebok for a playing strip deal, Reebok wouldn't insist on
Newcastle getting rid of its black and white stripes.
Instead, they would welcome Newcastle with open arms and ask "how
can we please you?".
Sixth, why is it that the club has to play in its away colours
when not playing in Wellington? This is a ridiculous
requirement, unless there is a clash of colours, which I believe
only happens when we play the CCM. Once again, this is a lost
marketing and branding opportunity for the club.
It would be great to hear from Tony P about whether the club
is looking to rebrand itself for next season, or what its views on
this topic are. Perhaps Tony P could also clarify what the
requirements of the FFA and Reebok are and whether, and
to what extent, the club will be mounting any challenge to
these requirements.
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You lost me at "thirdly" but I'm sure it's all good stuff.
Its no longer a problem.
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Have we had a poll to see how strongly the fans feel about getting
more yellow on the jersey? As more teams enter the league there are
going to be clashes so the opportunity could open up to get a
change.
I like the idea of having all teams have white as the
second strip and making sure it doesn't clash with any of the
normal strips. I don't see why it should be mandatory to be worn if
there is no clash with the home strips though.
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In regards to our playing strip FFA guidelines means we have to
wear the strip for two seasons so next season will be the same. All
clubs have commneced talks with Reebok and FFA to introduce a
separate away strip and not white but this will be in 2009/10.
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You lost me at "thirdly" but I'm sure it's all good stuff.
LOL
you must be feeling better this week!
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In regards to our playing strip FFA guidelines means we have to
wear the strip for two seasons so next season will be the same. All
clubs have commneced talks with Reebok and FFA to introduce a
separate away strip and not white but this will be in
2009/10.
Can this be pinned somewhere? Might help us not have to repeat
this thread every couple of weeks, fun though it is!
Apparently I'm apathetic, but I couldn't care less.
"Being a Partick Thistle fan sets you apart. It means youre a free thinker. It also means your team has no money." Tim Luckhurst, The Independent, 4th December 2003
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An excellent post that if you do take the time to read right
through it, makes some valid points. I appreciate the club
basically has it's hands tied.
In short outside forces are telling us what our club should be
have for a Kit, Colours etc. Solely for the purpose of the the
outside force to profit from any revenue. Whoever negotiated the
deal with Reebok must've either had a brilliant performance clause
in their contract or a few palms were greased - allegedly. It just
smells of complicity.
Can you imagine Man U, Liverpool or Arsenal told that this is
how their kits will look for the next two years by the PFL ?
Especially, if say their predominently Red was changed to Blue??
I's never going to happen. It's a shame the FFA have taken this
stance when setting up the A League, it's the one thing that could
help any of the clubs to create their own personality.
If I read Tony's response correctly, Reebok must have some
sort of long term deal with FFA, because if I was in charge at the
Nix, Reebok would be the first to be ditched and a better kit
supplier sought. Adidas, Umbro, Admiral, being the first 3 for
consideration but not the only three of course.
Whoever came up with the design plans & colours for
the kits at Reebok was either taking the piss or is an AFL fan.
I've never seen so many bland kits in any league in the world,
especially the away kits.
Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!
The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!
The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!
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I think that, at the outset of the A League, the FFA probably
jumped through a few hoops to get sponsorship money on board and
I'd imagine that the kit debacle was one of them. With the success,
and exposure,that the league has had I would imagine they'll be in
a far stronger bargaining position next time it comes to any
negotiations and there would be a new kit supplier, if clubs aren't
allowed to negotiate their own, and that the clubs' wishes
regarding kit design would be taken into consideration. Till then
we'll just have to keep on moaning about it 
BTW, don't some AFL teams play in stripes!!
Apparently I'm apathetic, but I couldn't care less.
"Being a Partick Thistle fan sets you apart. It means youre a free thinker. It also means your team has no money." Tim Luckhurst, The Independent, 4th December 2003
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I'm going on the ferry, I'm off to buy a telly la la la la, la la la la
I like the kit, wouldn't change it.
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I like it seeing as i just bought one 
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Great post axmfc, lots of well thought out points.
We really do need to get more yellow on the kit. Our current kit isn't too bad, it's just too black.
We really do need to get more yellow on the kit. Our current kit isn't too bad, it's just too black.
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Lost me way back.
I suggest you go to the A League site and read up on a little
history. The league has rules and sponsorships that it has put in
place. The clubs benefit from these sponsorships. Go have a
read.
A dog with a bone :)
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If I read Tony's response correctly, Reebok must have some
sort of long term deal with FFA, because if I was in charge at the
Nix, Reebok would be the first to be ditched and a better kit
supplier sought. Adidas, Umbro, Admiral, being the first 3 for
consideration but not the only three of course.
I'll take Nike or Adidas thanks.
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this is my view on this, i think the home top is a cracker and i would not change it, the away top has a lot to be desired for however, i think yellow all over would not look good at all.
our current top with sony on it, looks so classy unlike
queenslands who is orange with a big black "coffee club" on it, do
we really want a yellow top with a white sony on it?? looks stupid
i think.
you mentioned that the colours were yellow AND black, well
lets take a look at a team in scotland with similar issues: glasgow
rangers
rangers traditional colours are RED, WHITE AND BLUE, now our
main colour is Blue but you dont hear the fans saying, oh we want
more red and white, coz it looks classy, this season we have a
little bit more of red and white but not too much, so i ask the
poster at the beginning how do rangers conquor the red, white and
blue problem? we are happy to play in blue just like the phoenix
are happy to be in black (there is yellow piping which makes it
look classy), i think changing the phoenix top to mainly yellow
would make us look like clowns..
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it would be great to get adidas as long as we dont end up with a dud brand sponsor like topper or lotto i would like kappa we could then have halves
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our current top with sony on it, looks so classy unlike
queenslands who is orange with a big black "coffee club" on it, do
we really want a yellow top with a white sony on it?? looks stupid
i think.
you mentioned that the colours were yellow AND black, well
lets take a look at a team in scotland with similar issues: glasgow
rangers
rangers traditional colours are RED, WHITE AND BLUE, now our
main colour is Blue but you dont hear the fans saying, oh we want
more red and white, coz it looks classy, this season we have a
little bit more of red and white but not too much, so i ask the
poster at the beginning how do rangers conquor the red, white and
blue problem? we are happy to play in blue just like the phoenix
are happy to be in black (there is yellow piping which makes it
look classy), i think changing the phoenix top to mainly yellow
would make us look like clowns..
Neither Sony nor anyone else would accept that. It'd be a black Sony on yellow if anything.
'
It's not a matter of what looks classy, it's a matter of cultural appropriation - the Phoenix represent Wellington, and Wellington's colours are yellow and black. Hence, we're being misrepresented in terms of team identity.
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The nature of a franchise means that the franchisee (the FFA) make
the rules. If you have a McDonalds and you decide you want to
charge $20 for a big mac, you can't because those are the rules.
Same deal here...we aren't strictly a club and that's the reality.
I will never understand why you have to play in an away strip when
there is no clash though, never.
Normo's coming home
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Neither Sony nor anyone else would accept that. It'd be a
black Sony on yellow if anything.
'
It's not a matter of what looks classy, it's a matter of cultural appropriation - the Phoenix represent Wellington, and Wellington's colours are yellow and black. Hence, we're being misrepresented in terms of team identity.
'
It's not a matter of what looks classy, it's a matter of cultural appropriation - the Phoenix represent Wellington, and Wellington's colours are yellow and black. Hence, we're being misrepresented in terms of team identity.
I'd hardly say we were being misrepresented, a
lot or the teams in Wellington wear a predominatly black shirt
- Wellington lions for one- I know its a rugby team so it hardly
counts but you get that. The Wellington Firebirds (Cricket) last
season's kit was almost entirly black. Team identity is not all
about what they wear on the pitch, I think the fans identify with
the team because they play for us, and our City.
theprof2007-12-20 16:09:33
Queenslander 3x a year.
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Apparently the phoenix have sold the most merchandise in the
league, (see Michael Brown article on the front page). I think that
says we should probably get a bit of perspective here, it's just
the kit...
Normo's coming home
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In regards to our playing strip FFA guidelines means we have to
wear the strip for two seasons so next season will be the same. All
clubs have commneced talks with Reebok and FFA to introduce a
separate away strip and not white but this will be in
2009/10.
Tony P, thanks for your prompt reply.
Thanks also for your comments phoenix07. I still think
my arguments are valid (see also Lonegunmen's post above),
namely, that the A-League clubs should be able to determine
how best to brand themselves in terms of playing strips which,
among other things, might take into account the location of the
club (e.g., Wellington's colours are traditionally strongly yellow
and black). In the case of the Phoenix, I acknowledge that
the status quo is one option (see my fourth point), although my
personal view is that the club could do better if it were free to
do so because all black and all white have been done to death in
this country and are no longer points of difference.
Moreover, Reebok's brand / logo would continue to appear on the
playing strip, whatever colour it happens to be. In the case
of Glasgow Rangers, I presume it is the club that decides its
playing strip, not some third party, and if the club prefers blue
that's fine by me.
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I think our stip is good. Yellow and black stripes could look very gaudy, think of the taranaki rugby jersey. Also there is plenty of talk about yellow and black being wellington colours. The wellington rugby team must be one of the oldest sporting teams in the region, well newflash the main colour of that jersey is black, with yellow trim. it looks a lot better then a striped jersey (taranaki).
apologies for the rugby talk but its the only comparisons i
could think of.
If the yellow and black on the shirts were switched that
would look ok, but not stripes.
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I think our stip is good. Yellow and black stripes could look very gaudy, think of the taranaki rugby jersey. Also there is plenty of talk about yellow and black being wellington colours. The wellington rugby team must be one of the oldest sporting teams in the region, well newflash the main colour of that jersey is black, with yellow trim. it looks a lot better then a striped jersey (taranaki).
apologies for the rugby talk but its the only comparisons i
could think of.
If the yellow and black on the shirts were switched that
would look ok, but not stripes.
Agreed lets leave the current strip alone, we'll see what
happens in the 2009/10 season when the changes start coming
thru!!!
Queenslander 3x a year.
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Why would you change it HK_Keeper2007-12-21 14:57:06
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If it ain't broke, fix it....!!! Isn't that the philosophy
you see so often these days...?
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But y
the sony kit looks mad
+ im getting 1 for xmas :D
the sony kit looks mad
+ im getting 1 for xmas :D
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Ok we are stuck with the black jersey for another season, how about
Yellow shorts as a compromise??
Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!
The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!
The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!
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more f**king yellow please give us the yellow and black stripe
shirts that most of us want to create our own identity. we are not
the allblacks or the warriors or the kiwis of the silver
ferns etc Im sick of all the f**king black!
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more f**king yellow please give us the yellow and black stripe
shirts that most of us want to create our own identity. we are not
the allblacks or the warriors or the kiwis of the silver
ferns etc Im sick of all the f**king black!
Yep, and Black is for losers, the Nix are not losers and need
to adjust quickly and change the dominant colour!
Proud to have attended the first 175 Consecutive "Home" Wellington Phoenix "A League" Games !!
The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!
The Ruf, The Ruf, The Ruf is on Fire!!
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Apparently the phoenix have sold the most merchandise in the
league, (see Michael Brown article on the front page). I think that
says we should probably get a bit of perspective here, it's just
the kit...
I was thinking about that- I think we would have sold a ton of merchandise but seeing as it's the other clubs 3rd year of selling stuff they would have less demand.
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I was thinking about that- I think we would have sold a ton of merchandise but seeing as it's the other clubs 3rd year of selling stuff they would have less demand.
Good point. It'd be interesting to see how we stack up against the other teams in their first year. Though we do have the bonus of the Galaxy match's effect on merchandise sales.
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Yea beckham does sell a ridiculous amount still i suppose Sydney
had the galaxy benefit too.
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Apparently the phoenix have sold the most merchandise in the
league, (see Michael Brown article on the front page). I think that
says we should probably get a bit of perspective here, it's just
the kit...
And if you add the retro-ricki's onto that then we have probably sold more than all the other teams put together (because they probably sold far more in the first season than they would have this season.
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