Wellington Phoenix Men

New A-League teams

134 replies · 3,383 views
over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
now that's something to look forward to a Phoenix vs The ChCh Cyclops derby game  

the game is growing over in Aus and here, I reckon there'll be an NZ derby of some kind in the A-league in the next ten years (you can all give me crap - in 10 years - if I'm wrong )
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
tigers wrote:
now that's something to look forward to a Phoenix vs The ChCh Cyclops derby game �the game is growing over in Aus and here, I reckon there'll be an NZ derby of some kind in the A-league in the next ten years (you can all give me crap - in 10 years - if I'm wrong )


Most of us can't remember stuff after 10 minutes, let alone 10 years. You're pretty safe there.
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Hard News wrote:
Someone in Christchurch has to front up the $$... does anyone really see that as likely ?

Even then, it doesn't help if that person employs the wrong back room to actually run it (see the Knights). 

The Kingz were stuffed by a national corporate just when they were looking positive.  I suspect that history and too many bridges have been burnt for a return there, plus the ridiculous venue situation.


I'm on to it HN. Coastal Spirit by 2012. A league here we come .

What's sight without sound? Love without peace? Copulation without conception?

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Give YF my mate IMO, my mate tells me this.

 

Either 2008/09 season or maybe 2009/102 teams, being Gold Coast & Wollongong (will have a regional name like the Mariners)

 

Why Gold Coast need to plant roots and seed team before AFL do same. Gold Coast have 10 million in bank, sponsors lined up, coach etc.

 

Why Wollongong, Sydney Flying Circus cannot control close to 5 million people so carve up south western Sydney to a long way down the coast. Garry Flowers of Australian Rugby head fame is setting up the bid team.

 

Within four years from expansion to 10, expansion to 12.

 

Team 1, will be from far western Sydney at the foot of the blue mountains were Penerith rugby league play. Why Wollongong region to past Scumcastle is close to or over 6 million people. Scumcastle have Newcastle & Hunter regions, Mariners have central coast and northern parts of Sydney. Flying Circus have inner city to about middle of Sydney, East parts and Southern areas, New Wollongong team as per above and second Sydney team outer western Sydney and blue mountains.

 

Team 2, up for grabs in line are Townsville, Canberra (no hope IMO), second Melbourne team, Darwin, Hobart,  Singapore ( a real good chance), second NZ team, Third Sydney team, regional Victorian team.

 

Midfielder�s  

 

IMO it will be the best of, Townsville, Singapore, Second NZ team, others have to many issues. Also second NZ team will depend on performance of Nix both on field and crowd wise.

Socceroo/ Mariner / Whangarei

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I see that quite a few people have mentioned Singapore as a potential city to have an A-league team. Do we know if FIFA's given any indication they'd allow a team from another foreign country to field a team in Australia's national competition? I would think it extremely unlikely, particularly if Singapore already have a professional league as someone had mentioned earlier.
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Ronaldoknow wrote:
Hard News wrote:
Someone in Christchurch has to front up the $$... does anyone really see that as likely ?

Even then, it doesn't help if that person employs the wrong back room to actually run it (see the Knights). 

The Kingz were stuffed by a national corporate just when they were looking positive.  I suspect that history and too many bridges have been burnt for a return there, plus the ridiculous venue situation.


I'm on to it HN. Coastal Spirit by 2012. A league here we come .


And we will be thefirst genuine club side to make the grade rather than an invented team

What's sight without sound? Love without peace? Copulation without conception?

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Hard News, you say does it seem likely anyone in Christchurch will front up with the money, but it didn't seem likely anyone in Wellington would either. Terry S stepped in at the last minute because he heard what was happening whilst having a trim. He didn't express previous interest, so a similar thing could happen in Christchurch.
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
loyalgunner wrote:
Hard News, you say does it seem likely anyone in Christchurch will front up with the money, but it didn't seem likely anyone in Wellington would either. Terry S stepped in at the last minute because he heard what was happening whilst having a trim. He didn't express previous interest, so a similar thing could happen in Christchurch.


And it will. Believe me .

What's sight without sound? Love without peace? Copulation without conception?

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Ronaldoknow wrote:
loyalgunner wrote:
Hard News, you say does it seem likely anyone in Christchurch will front up with the money, but it didn't seem likely anyone in Wellington would either. Terry S stepped in at the last minute because he heard what was happening whilst having a trim. He didn't express previous interest, so a similar thing could happen in Christchurch.


And it will. Believe me .
 
 
who will fund?
 
you and your crappy car place?

ive got a song that wont take long, Adelaide are rubbish.. the second verse is same as the first.. ADELAIDE ARE RUBBISH

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Scottishbhoy wrote:
Ronaldoknow wrote:
loyalgunner wrote:
Hard News, you say does it seem likely anyone in Christchurch will front up with the money, but it didn't seem likely anyone in Wellington would either. Terry S stepped in at the last minute because he heard what was happening whilst having a trim. He didn't express previous interest, so a similar thing could happen in Christchurch.


And it will. Believe me .
 
 
who will fund?
 
you and your crappy car place?


I've got a cunning plan ......

What's sight without sound? Love without peace? Copulation without conception?

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago

Scottishbhoy wrote:
Ronaldoknow wrote:
loyalgunner wrote:
Hard News, you say does it seem likely anyone in Christchurch will front up with the money, but it didn't seem likely anyone in Wellington would either. Terry S stepped in at the last minute because he heard what was happening whilst having a trim. He didn't express previous interest, so a similar thing could happen in Christchurch.
And it will. Believe me .

�

�

who will fund?

�

you and your crappy car place?


How about the three of us have a sausage sizzle?

Anybody want to join us?

We could also sell those cadbury chocalates!
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I think this might be a little beyond the Mad Butcher sausage sizzle type of fundraiser.
The money needed would be in the vicinity of 5 - 6 million dollars a year, that's a lot of sausages. But I believe it can be done. We will have to wait and see, but initial planning should be underway early next year.

What's sight without sound? Love without peace? Copulation without conception?

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Hey guys I don't like the idea of Townsville or Cairns.  For the boys from Welli that would be a huge shock to the system. 
 
Just like Urugary or Paraguay or who ever it is that plays their home games at like 10,000 feet, gives the home team an unfair advantage
Supporter world's best and worst football teams: Waikato/WaiBop, Kingz, Knights, Phoenix, The Argyle, The Whites & the All Whites

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Ronny.. have you got the inside word u want to spill?
 
Oh i know, ull go back to your fraud..

ive got a song that wont take long, Adelaide are rubbish.. the second verse is same as the first.. ADELAIDE ARE RUBBISH

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Mossman wrote:
I'd like to see another Victorian side.  Problem tho is that unlike NSW melbourne's the only population centre.  The Tards have a sole licence for Melbourne so another team from the city is out.  Geelong's the only real alternative, but driving through it reminds me of the all the old houses from the opening scene from Close to Home (the Kiwi series...yes old enough to just remember that). Besides, its an aerial ping pong town so football might struggle.
 
Sole franchise rights lapse in 2010 - expect to see West Sydney and second Melbourne franchises soon afterwards.  One of the negotiation points on the new stadium in Melbourne was that if Victory didn't take up the tenancy the state government would back a second Melbourne side for 2010 (Melbourne City?).  As it is South Melbourne are very keen for a 2010 bid.
 
So, in a dream scenario we have:
 
Melbourne Victory
Sydney FC
Perth Glory
Wellington Phoenix
Central Coast Mariners
Newcastle Jets
Queensland Roar
Adelaide United
 
then
Townsville
Gold Coast
 
then
South or West Melbourne
West Sydney
 
then
Canberra
Hobart
 
then
Wollongong
Adelaide City
 
then...  then we're struggling.
 
A 16 team A-League, with a 30 game, home and away season, would be pretty cool.
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Benjamin wrote:
Mossman wrote:
I'd like to see another Victorian side.  Problem tho is that unlike NSW melbourne's the only population centre.  The Tards have a sole licence for Melbourne so another team from the city is out.  Geelong's the only real alternative, but driving through it reminds me of the all the old houses from the opening scene from Close to Home (the Kiwi series...yes old enough to just remember that). Besides, its an aerial ping pong town so football might struggle.
 
Sole franchise rights lapse in 2010 - expect to see West Sydney and second Melbourne franchises soon afterwards.  One of the negotiation points on the new stadium in Melbourne was that if Victory didn't take up the tenancy the state government would back a second Melbourne side for 2010 (Melbourne City?).  As it is South Melbourne are very keen for a 2010 bid.
 
 
Victory signed off last year on tenancy agreement, and will share the new ground with Melbourne Storm (RL team)
 
The State government agree to expand the stadium to a 32, 000 from 20, 000 to ensure MV signed. State Gov very happy with MV.
Midfielder2007-11-14 23:46:31

Socceroo/ Mariner / Whangarei

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
South Melbourne will never get in. Too much baggage - administrators will be too scared of the sokkah hoolz

a.haak

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
valeo wrote:
South Melbourne will never get in. Too much baggage - administrators will be too scared of the sokkah hoolz [/QUOTE]
 
I suspect you're right...  But Victory fans did their best at the weekend to demonstrate that there's no need for South for the A-League to have hoolz!!
 
[QUOTE=Midfielder]
 
Victory signed off last year on tenancy agreement, and will share the new ground with Melbourne Storm (RL team)
 
The State government agree to expand the stadium to a 32, 000 from 20, 000 to ensure MV signed. State Gov very happy with MV.
 
I know.  With foundations for 50k.  I was referring to the bargaining tactic used by the State to try and force Victory to sign the tenancy agreement.
 
Long term, if Victory believe they are to be the only team in the city, and if they know that a succesful Victory side can bring in gates over well over 32k on a regular basis, why would they lock themselves into a 32k seater (with the option to switch major games to the Dome)...  I strongly suspect it's because they know they'll lose exclusivity in the city and they want to tie up the tenancy to ensure that the 'second' team are forced to play in a dump like Bob Jane or a predominently empty Telstra Dome.
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Benjamin wrote:
valeo wrote:
South Melbourne will never get in. Too much baggage - administrators will be too scared of the sokkah hoolz [/QUOTE]
 
I suspect you're right...  But Victory fans did their best at the weekend to demonstrate that there's no need for South for the A-League to have hoolz!!
 
[QUOTE=Midfielder]
 
Victory signed off last year on tenancy agreement, and will share the new ground with Melbourne Storm (RL team)
 
The State government agree to expand the stadium to a 32, 000 from 20, 000 to ensure MV signed. State Gov very happy with MV.
 
I know.  With foundations for 50k.  I was referring to the bargaining tactic used by the State to try and force Victory to sign the tenancy agreement.
 
Long term, if Victory believe they are to be the only team in the city, and if they know that a succesful Victory side can bring in gates over well over 32k on a regular basis, why would they lock themselves into a 32k seater (with the option to switch major games to the Dome)...  I strongly suspect it's because they know they'll lose exclusivity in the city and they want to tie up the tenancy to ensure that the 'second' team are forced to play in a dump like Bob Jane or a predominently empty Telstra Dome.
 
Victory have signed to play at least 6 games at new ground leaving open they can play big games at a larger stadium

Socceroo/ Mariner / Whangarei

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I think the league has to expand, if only to be taken a bit more seriously worldwide. Eight teams is about four too few, so starting off by adding a couple more is a logical step.
where might they come from? I'll leave that up to the experts, but I will suggest that a Pacific Islands based side could be a huge success if handled properly.
Nix, Leyton Orient and Alloa Athletic supporting schmuck.

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
TheJam wrote:
I think the league has to expand, if only to be taken a bit more seriously worldwide. Eight teams is about four too few, so starting off by adding a couple more is a logical step.
where might they come from? I'll leave that up to the experts, but I will suggest that a Pacific Islands based side could be a huge success if handled properly.


that seems to be a fairly big "if" at the moment 

edit - but having just been all positive about 2-3 NZ A-league sides in 10-20 years, in the post below - i have to acknowledge that things can change in the Pacific just as they can here in NZ


tigers2007-11-15 08:36:37
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
your 16 team, 30 match league is a great target for FFA to work towards Benjamin- I'd have ChCh in there in the second to last or last expansion

and one day  a team from Auckland might just make it in, they'll have a good model to follow and football in NZ will continue to grow as a result of the Nix

not easy in Aukland historically...  but as much as Auckland got it wrong last time - I do hope that football in NZ grows sufficiently in the next 10-20 years to support 2 or 3 NZ A-league sides
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
It's all well and good to talk about expanding the A league but the FFA have a responsiblity to ensure that the standad of football is high enough and that franchises are financially the case. Currently this is not so on either point. Some setups will be quite nervous about the 2010 deadline already and it is my understanding that the FFA have an unwanted financial stake in 2 clubs at the moment. So I don't see any major increase in the number of teams in the near future. If (and they almost certainly will) they go to 10 teams in 2010 they will need to issue 5 year licences to those teams to give some surety of a possible return to the clubs backers, which is only reasonable, so don't expect to see a 16 team league before 2015. Even if it would be great for the fans there is no point in bankrupting the other clubs. Ronaldoknow2007-11-15 12:33:43

What's sight without sound? Love without peace? Copulation without conception?

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
one in Chch would be great...if i win lotto i'll cough up the coin...

how about Tassie? (ya know, that small mass of land hanging off OZ north west of us?)

i can imagine it now, the Hobart Hoes


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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Sole franchise rights lapse in 2010 - expect to see West Sydney and second Melbourne franchises soon afterwards.  One of the negotiation points on the new stadium in Melbourne was that if Victory didn't take up the tenancy the state government would back a second Melbourne side for 2010 (Melbourne City?).  As it is South Melbourne are very keen for a 2010 bid.
 
So, in a dream scenario we have:
 
Melbourne Victory
Sydney FC
Perth Glory
Wellington Phoenix
Central Coast Mariners
Newcastle Jets
Queensland Roar
Adelaide United
 
then
Townsville
Gold Coast
 
then
South or West Melbourne
West Sydney
 
then
Canberra
Hobart
 
then
Wollongong
Adelaide City
 
then...  then we're struggling.
 
A 16 team A-League, with a 30 game, home and away season, would be pretty cool.
 
This sounds awefully much like the old NSL.  The NZFC cannot support another team and thus I don't see there being a good enough player depth in NZ, the Islands and Austrlia to support a Leauge this large with out a significant drop in quality.
 
Also in reference to out of control Victory fans something tells me that those boys probably support/supported South Melbourne.
disco_mart2007-11-15 22:50:11
Supporter world's best and worst football teams: Waikato/WaiBop, Kingz, Knights, Phoenix, The Argyle, The Whites & the All Whites

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
disco_mart wrote:
Also in reference to out of control Victory fans something tells me that those boys probably support/supported South Melbourne.


Hell no.  Hellas hate the A-League.  No Souths, no A-League.

For once it's not remotely ethnically related.

No, this lot are a whole new generation or retards bought up on Green Street, and media fixation with turning any conflict between football fans in to front page news, and crap like that.

The thing is that they never knew anything but the A-League, they don't know what their elders and betters went through before, yet now they are trying to destroy it for everyone else. 

How's my driving? - Whine here

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
more teams the better, 8 teams is too small
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
disco_mart wrote:
This sounds awefully much like the old NSL.  The NZFC cannot support another team and thus I don't see there being a good enough player depth in NZ, the Islands and Austrlia to support a Leauge this large with out a significant drop in quality.
 
Also in reference to out of control Victory fans something tells me that those boys probably support/supported South Melbourne.
 
First off, nothing wrong with the old NSL if it had been administered and supported properly.  The key is to grow the A-League carefully.  Only let in a couple of franchises at a time and monitor how all the teams go - expand as and when needed.
 
In reference to the South/Victory trouble...  I go to the Victory games with former Hellas fans, didn't see any trouble where I was.  Looking down at where the shouting was going on, it looked like a bunch of t**sers of inditerminate origin - I'm not sure they could be nailed down to being supporters of any previous club...  I think it's fair to say that arseholes will find trouble one way or another.
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
benjamin i think if the a league lets in 2 teams at 2010 and continues to does so every 4 years then that would be great plus all the extra teams mean extra games
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
grumpleweed wrote:
The gold coast has the population @ 500,000 and growing to support a new team. It also has good infrastructure. The main downside is that the Gold Coast came across as a souless place when i was over there on holiday recently so what will the supporters be like - will they have the passion or will they be like those who go to watch state cricket matches?


Plus they have SKILLED PARK (http://www.msfa.qld.gov.au/content/venue.asp?name=GoldCoastStadium) which is the new stadium built for the NRL's Gold Coast Titans - holds 27000 and looks very impressive - they are calling it a mini Suncorp Stadium.
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Hopefully a couple more NZ teams will make it in there in the future. Auckland and maybe a South Island team.

a.haak

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
I can't think of any pro sports teams in Darwin, would be hard work for teams not use to the heat to go but would help make up the numbers.
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Tasmania or STFU!

When Hibs, went up, to win the Scottish Cup - I wisnae there - furfuxake!

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Benjamin wrote:
 
 
Sole franchise rights lapse in 2010 - expect to see West Sydney and second Melbourne franchises soon afterwards.  One of the negotiation points on the new stadium in Melbourne was that if Victory didn't take up the tenancy the state government would back a second Melbourne side for 2010 (Melbourne City?).  As it is South Melbourne are very keen for a 2010 bid.
 
So, in a dream scenario we have:
 
Melbourne Victory
Sydney FC
Perth Glory
Wellington Phoenix
Central Coast Mariners
Newcastle Jets
Queensland Roar
Adelaide United
 
then
Townsville
Gold Coast
 
then
South or West Melbourne
West Sydney
 
then
Canberra
Hobart
 
then
Wollongong
Adelaide City
 
then...  then we're struggling.
 
A 16 team A-League, with a 30 game, home and away season, would be pretty cool.
 
Good in general- but I'd make a few adjustments. I'd suggest a 14 team 26 game season would be ideal, then with finals, a revamped Asian Champions Leage, and an expanded Preseason Cup with state-league teams (in preliminary rounds) and overseas teams (in later rounds) you have a decent length season.
 
Melbourne Victory
Sydney FC
Perth Glory
Wellington Phoenix
Central Coast Mariners
Newcastle Jets
Queensland Roar
Adelaide United
 
Gold Coast
Wollongong
 
Canberra
Townsville
 
Hobart
Geelong
 
Then you still have Christchurch as a replacement team in case any of these other teams collapse.
 
NOT
Auckland- they've tried and failed.
Cairns- There's a great stadium in Townsville already.
Singapore- Apart from the obstacles with FIFA, they have their own league.
Darwin- too small for a team- perhaps link it in with the Townsville bid?
2nd Sydney or Melbourne- Stick to 1 team per city, look at the problems with Sydney v Melbourne crowds last week, it will only be worse with Sydney or Melbourne derbies.
Adelaide City- no way. Adelaide is averaging 12500 or so, they are not even filling their stadium regularly. And when they are the SA govt has said they'll expand it.
 
 
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
Bring back the knights.
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
no            there will not be a christhchurch team new zealand struggles enough having one we will not get the rights for another team from australia either most likely outcome 12 teams one more from qld vic nsw and sa
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
pedersen wrote:
no            there will not be a christhchurch team new zealand struggles enough having one we will not get the rights for another team from australia either most likely outcome 12 teams one more from qld vic nsw and sa


given your obvious access to such a high quality crystal ball, you should perhaps put your confidence in your ability to tell the future to use on the share market
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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
tigers wrote:
pedersen wrote:
no            there will not be a christhchurch team new zealand struggles enough having one we will not get the rights for another team from australia either most likely outcome 12 teams one more from qld vic nsw and sa


given your obvious access to such a high quality crystal ball, you should perhaps put your confidence in your ability to tell the future to use on the share market
 
I agree with Pedersen, NZ simply lacks the depth... look at Aws right now, we have less pros now then in 1999/2000
Supporter world's best and worst football teams: Waikato/WaiBop, Kingz, Knights, Phoenix, The Argyle, The Whites & the All Whites

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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
disco_mart wrote:
tigers wrote:
pedersen wrote:
no            there will not be a christhchurch team new zealand struggles enough having one we will not get the rights for another team from australia either most likely outcome 12 teams one more from qld vic nsw and sa


given your obvious access to such a high quality crystal ball, you should perhaps put your confidence in your ability to tell the future to use on the share market
 
I agree with Pedersen, NZ simply lacks the depth... look at Aws right now, we have less pros now then in 1999/2000


In my opinion, discomart, they key word in your response is the word "now"

The number of fulltime pros in the AWs is an indicator of the health of NZ football as whole, (though not necessarily of domestic football).

But the focus of this thread is the future expansion of the A-League. Your AW pro numbers indicate the state of football in from 99/00 to now; that is it mirrors the situation in NZ prior to the Nix. In 10-20 years time, football could well be the dominant sport in Australia - with flow on effects to our game.

I suppose I just don't accept that we can say "never" particularly in the context of a sport that is experiencing a huge growth phase in Australasia.


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over 18 years ago · edited over 13 years ago
The 9th A-league bid will be announced tomorrow. To be known as the Northern Thunder the Townsville based team will represent the area between Rockhampton and Darwin. Expect investors to be named and a logo to be presented also. They hope to enter the league for 2008/09 season. You heard it here first.
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