. [/quote] The fact that there is even names and positions is better than most posts.
So now you know the gold standard guys.
Phoenix Transfer Speculation 2013/14
Well looks like we have 14 players signed for next year - plus I'd expect 2 of Lochhead, Hogg or Rowe to be picked up.
I guess the new coach has to identify what sort of structure he wants to play, and then pick up players that fit the style. I personally think we have looked best when playing with two up front, and a sort of narrower diamond in midfield. Its odd, but the nix dont have as many wide players as we once had - so Id go for a diamond.
Then you gotta look at what spots need filled and they probably are DM, GK, RB & a wide midfielder
DM is probably where you want to bring in a import player that the coach admires as this position affects how a team moves the ball.
At GK id go for O'Keefe but Scott could also be a fine pickup.
At RB I would approach Roux and Elrich as both will not be seeing many minutes next season.
The other spot could be for Leo or Cernak. I would prefer to keep Cernak as a potential backup for when Carlos gets hurt.
That would then bring up 20 players which is the minimum - the coach could then bring in a few other guys to play he wants - maybe a Jurman or Celeski. Personally think we only need to sign only one more midfielder unless coach wants to play a front 3.
We probably will need a new mid to replace Leo if he doesn't get re-signed. Id be happy with Boyd as backup for the strikers - Ifill also if needed.
An absence of whiskers.
we've mostly been saying that in a roundabout kinda way anyway. not sure why a coach would bring jurman, a centre back in though? i think youve got to re-sign bertos (one of our better players this season) and yes celeski!!!
based on above squad would be
moss, okeefe, roux or elrich, sigmund, durante, boxall, lochhead, hogg or rowe, fenton, muscat, lia, DM (who?), lindsay, hernandez, cernak, ifill, boyd, huysegems, brockie, totori
Yeah I was more trying myself to get an idea of what sort of recruitment would be involved. I personally wouldnt go for Jurman - or Leo for example. Celeski is a nice to have but the key for me is finding a classy DM capable of breaking up play and distributing the ball.
A bit harder to identify the import player than it is to figure out what aussie players may be available.
Is Eric Paartalu worth making a big play for.... I think he would fit the DM role we are looking for quite nicely!
Not sure of his length of contract - but only did move in Jan so not sure how likely he'd want to leave. Could always come in their off season.
Think we could have more luck with Rostyn Griffiths
Yeah I was more trying myself to get an idea of what sort of recruitment would be involved. I personally wouldnt go for Jurman - or Leo for example. Celeski is a nice to have but the key for me is finding a classy DM capable of breaking up play and distributing the ball.
A bit harder to identify the import player than it is to figure out what aussie players may be available.
Celeski has most completed passes in A League this year with 1117
Yeah I was more trying myself to get an idea of what sort of recruitment would be involved. I personally wouldnt go for Jurman - or Leo for example. Celeski is a nice to have but the key for me is finding a classy DM capable of breaking up play and distributing the ball.
A bit harder to identify the import player than it is to figure out what aussie players may be available.
Celeski has most completed passes in A League this year with 1117
Would love to see stats like that removed in some ways, same as "crosses into box" and replaced with effective passes and effective crosses or some such?
Yeah I was more trying myself to get an idea of what sort of recruitment would be involved. I personally wouldnt go for Jurman - or Leo for example. Celeski is a nice to have but the key for me is finding a classy DM capable of breaking up play and distributing the ball.
A bit harder to identify the import player than it is to figure out what aussie players may be available.
Celeski has most completed passes in A League this year with 1117
Would love to see stats like that removed in some ways, same as "crosses into box" and replaced with effective passes and effective crosses or some such?
completed passes in the attacking third, chance creation etc.
Im simply coming from the view that if we play a diamond midfield, and hernandez + ifill are in there, then celeski probably isnt as much of a shilding type player that we would need
However if he was one of the wider men in the diamond, then perhaps it could work.
Im simply coming from the view that if we play a diamond midfield, and hernandez + ifill are in there, then celeski probably isnt as much of a shilding type player that we would need
However if he was one of the wider men in the diamond, then perhaps it could work.
Not overly convinced that a diamond with Hernandez, Ifill, Husygems and Brockie is ideal, could work, but one of the reasons it has been reasonably effective is the work rate of Gameiro and Bertos.
Im simply coming from the view that if we play a diamond midfield, and hernandez + ifill are in there, then celeski probably isnt as much of a shilding type player that we would need
However if he was one of the wider men in the diamond, then perhaps it could work.
Not overly convinced that a diamond with Hernandez, Ifill, Husygems and Brockie is ideal, could work, but one of the reasons it has been reasonably effective is the work rate of Gameiro and Bertos.
Yeah im also a little worried about this - but it was effective with CCM where Rogic offerred little defensively, but all other midfielders and the 2 strikers had a high work rate to win the ball back
I guess i know that if theres only one striker in front of carlos, itll probably be brockie and he'll revert back to doing nothing apart from shoot
Not overly convinced that a diamond with Hernandez, Ifill, Husygems and Brockie is ideal, could work, but one of the reasons it has been reasonably effective is the work rate of Gameiro and Bertos.
Yeah im also a little worried about this - but it was effective with CCM where Rogic offerred little defensively, but all other midfielders and the 2 strikers had a high work rate to win the ball back
I guess i know that if theres only one striker in front of carlos, itll probably be brockie and he'll revert back to doing nothing apart from shoot
I don't know why Bojic doesn't play further up as a winger. That left foot is gold.
Less Kiwis more Aussies for me but as I have queried previously is the desire to create a winning Nix team going to be tempered by the desire to grow kiwi talent locally rather than overseas. To me they are mutually exclusive at A league level (raher than youith team) until Kiwi players have a proven pedigree and we attract them back.
We need hardened proven pros in numbers 1-15 and then mainly potential in the balance 6 or 7 places.
We might not get there till 2014/15...
Is this rugby?
LOL!!!
I was expecting that but couldnt be bothered expressign it as first XI plus subs :>)
I don't know why Bojic doesn't play further up as a winger. That left foot is gold.
Not overly convinced that a diamond with Hernandez, Ifill, Husygems and Brockie is ideal, could work, but one of the reasons it has been reasonably effective is the work rate of Gameiro and Bertos.
Yeah im also a little worried about this - but it was effective with CCM where Rogic offerred little defensively, but all other midfielders and the 2 strikers had a high work rate to win the ball back
I guess i know that if theres only one striker in front of carlos, itll probably be brockie and he'll revert back to doing nothing apart from shoot
I don't know why Bojic doesn't play further up as a winger. That left foot is gold.
Haha
I see Dan Keat has signed for a second division Swedish outfit on a one-year deal - I think the Phoenix missed out there. He could well have developed into a good A League midfielder and he's a Wellington Kiwi to boot.
I see Dan Keat has signed for a second division Swedish outfit on a one-year deal - I think the Phoenix missed out there. He could well have developed into a good A League midfielder and he's a Wellington Kiwi to boot.
I see Dan Keat has signed for a second division Swedish outfit on a one-year deal - I think the Phoenix missed out there. He could well have developed into a good A League midfielder and he's a Wellington Kiwi to boot.
He was on the fringe of Galaxy selection, on the bench I think, and played reserve grade for two seasons. MLS and the Galaxy is a very competitive league now and so he must be reasonably good. Also Ricki plays him in the second string All Whites and what I've seen of him (against Jamaica for instance) he's faster than Killen in midfield with no little skill. My feeling is he could have been a good fit for the Phoenix.
I see Dan Keat has signed for a second division Swedish outfit on a one-year deal - I think the Phoenix missed out there. He could well have developed into a good A League midfielder and he's a Wellington Kiwi to boot.
He was on the fringe of Galaxy selection, on the bench I think, and played reserve grade for two seasons. MLS and the Galaxy is a very competitive league now and so he must be reasonably good. Also Ricki plays him in the second string All Whites and what I've seen of him (against Jamaica for instance) he's faster than Killen in midfield with no little skill. My feeling is he could have been a good fit for the Phoenix.
No offence, but your feeling is that pretty much any NZ player would be a good fit for the Phoenix. I've seen a bit of Keat in the past, and have never been overly impressed with what he brings to the table. And if you're bringing a 25-year old player in the squad, you don't bring him in to 'develop into a decent A-league midfielder', you bring him in to stregthen your team and make it better.
Phoenix should not become a safety net for every Kiwi who fails overseas.
I see Dan Keat has signed for a second division Swedish outfit on a one-year deal - I think the Phoenix missed out there. He could well have developed into a good A League midfielder and he's a Wellington Kiwi to boot.
He was on the fringe of Galaxy selection, on the bench I think, and played reserve grade for two seasons. MLS and the Galaxy is a very competitive league now and so he must be reasonably good. Also Ricki plays him in the second string All Whites and what I've seen of him (against Jamaica for instance) he's faster than Killen in midfield with no little skill. My feeling is he could have been a good fit for the Phoenix.
No offence, but your feeling is that pretty much any NZ player would be a good fit for the Phoenix. I've seen a bit of Keat in the past, and have never been overly impressed with what he brings to the table. And if you're bringing a 25-year old player in the squad, you don't bring him in to 'develop into a decent A-league midfielder', you bring him in to stregthen your team and make it better.
Phoenix should not become a safety net for every Kiwi who fails overseas.
^ This
No offence, but your feeling is that pretty much any NZ player would be a good fit for the Phoenix. I've seen a bit of Keat in the past, and have never been overly impressed with what he brings to the table. And if you're bringing a 25-year old player in the squad, you don't bring him in to 'develop into a decent A-league midfielder', you bring him in to stregthen your team and make it better.
Phoenix should not become a safety net for every Kiwi who fails overseas.
So much this.
I remember Keat as a 16-17 year old for TW and he looked like he was going somewhere. It looks like that somewhere may not be as high as many imagined.
I remember him about to Jet off to Blackburn and then breaking his leg while at HIBs.. coulda gona so differently
I see Dan Keat has signed for a second division Swedish outfit on a one-year deal - I think the Phoenix missed out there. He could well have developed into a good A League midfielder and he's a Wellington Kiwi to boot.
He was on the fringe of Galaxy selection, on the bench I think, and played reserve grade for two seasons. MLS and the Galaxy is a very competitive league now and so he must be reasonably good. Also Ricki plays him in the second string All Whites and what I've seen of him (against Jamaica for instance) he's faster than Killen in midfield with no little skill. My feeling is he could have been a good fit for the Phoenix.
No offence, but your feeling is that pretty much any NZ player would be a good fit for the Phoenix. I've seen a bit of Keat in the past, and have never been overly impressed with what he brings to the table. And if you're bringing a 25-year old player in the squad, you don't bring him in to 'develop into a decent A-league midfielder', you bring him in to stregthen your team and make it better.
Phoenix should not become a safety net for every Kiwi who fails overseas.
He also wanted to go to Europe. Can't sign players who don't want to be here.
Sign up Clapham. He can keep goal, be the physio, drive the team bus, score a hat trick and be home in time to cook a slap up supper for the lads.
Sign up Clapham. He can keep goal, be the physio, drive the team bus, score a hat trick and be home in time to cook a slap up supper for the lads.
Can probably be Head Coach too
Sign up Clapham. He can keep goal, be the physio, drive the team bus, score a hat trick and be home in time to cook a slap up supper for the lads.
Can probably be Head Coach too
Could pick hearfield up again. Just been released by ccm for recreational drugs. Might get 5 year ban. Party all the time Troy!
DISCO!!
Also Ahmen to the above. We should not sign every kiwi player because they are kiwi. We are not WINZ for all whites.
Could pick hearfield up again. Just been released by ccm for recreational drugs. Might get 5 year ban. Party all the time Troy!
DISCO!!
Also Ahmen to the above. We should not sign every kiwi player because they are kiwi. We are not WINZ for all whites.
He could be in charge of matchday entertainment. Maybe a DJ turntable set up behind a goal, trashy IPL girls dancing behind the other.
I remember him about to Jet off to Blackburn and then breaking his leg while at HIBs.. coulda gona so differently
Isn't that the story of every football journeyman? 'Finally got my big break then got injured, if not I would've been in the big leagues.'
I remember him about to Jet off to Blackburn and then breaking his leg while at HIBs.. coulda gona so differently
Isn't that the story of every football journeyman? 'Finally got my big break then got injured, if not I would've been in the big leagues.'
No offence, but your feeling is that pretty much any NZ player would be a good fit for the Phoenix. I've seen a bit of Keat in the past, and have never been overly impressed with what he brings to the table. And if you're bringing a 25-year old player in the squad, you don't bring him in to 'develop into a decent A-league midfielder', you bring him in to stregthen your team and make it better.
Phoenix should not become a safety net for every Kiwi who fails overseas.
So much this.
I remember Keat as a 16-17 year old for TW and he looked like he was going somewhere. It looks like that somewhere may not be as high as many imagined.
I know what you're saying but I still think there's this tendency to think that an existing A league journeyman, and the Phoenix has had a lot of them, is better than a developing NZ player. I'd rather the Nix took a chance on developing more local talent than being a revolving door for so many Australian players. That's why I'm pleased you're giving Hogg a chance. I'd like to see more get it.
Whether you like it or not that was the remit for having a professional NZ team playing in Australia when the Kingz first got licensed. Results matter, but so do what the team is doing for the game in this country. You're not there to just make up the numbers in the A League. Hell, they won't even let you play with all the toys even if you win it.
He also wanted to go to Europe. Can't sign players who don't want to be here.
What was he supposed to do, wait months for the Phoenix to get a new coach in place? He's trying to make a living as a professional player. If he's good enough for Ricki's All Whites then surely he's at least good enough for a trial.
The other issue around signing Kiwis is if we get a foreign coach is his priority going to be growing NZ footballers or getting the best players he can to create the best team he can. I'd say the latter.
You're probably right - but that does beg the question? What is the purpose of having a NZ team playing in the A League if it is not also developing local talent? What does it do for this country to have a team of Aussies/Brits representing Wellington in an Australian league? Great for Australian football but what about us?
I understand that the Canadian teams playing in the MLS (Toronto, Vancouver and Montreal) are putting a lot of emphasis on developing Canadian players.
He also wanted to go to Europe. Can't sign players who don't want to be here.
What was he supposed to do, wait months for the Phoenix to get a new coach in place? He's trying to make a living as a professional player. If he's good enough for Ricki's All Whites then surely he's at least good enough for a trial.
I think you completely missed the point 2B was making.
I can understand the point about it being better to develop a local kid than sign an Aussie hack but lets be honest, when we signed Downey (as the example) we didn't go 'well this guy is shithouse, lets sign him'. It was with an expectation that he would push for a starting spot. Only time will show that they are hacks. Brownlie, played ok for the Roar, comes here and is pants. You just cannot predict that.
I agree you have a point but its always going to be on hindsight otherwise you may as well sign the Aussie fella and say 'Well we think he is a bit shit but we have just bought him in to make up the numbers'
There is also the opposite. Reddy, tagged as a nut bar, comes here and was fantastic for us....